Beginner Questions

[Nukesub]

Hello

I have recently began playing SH3 (56% realism). I have to say I really enjoy it. However, there are a few things I wanted to clear up.

Before I ask, just for reference, I have the following mods installed:
GWX3 Gold
SH3 Commander
Resolution Fix


1). I just wanted to make sure I started my career in the right place. If I understand this correctly, the different flotillas are different campaigns?
Whenever you finish one, do you begin the next with the same captain/career?

2). I picked the 1st Flotilla, 1939 as a starting place. Is this typical/good place to get bearings?

3). By pressing R it takes you to the radio. What can I do there? Does it serve any actual gameplay purpose to change to that view?

4). How do you adjust the "Ambient Volume" button on the hydrophone interface?

5). Any advice on manual targeting? I have been using this video as a reference to learn: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0rTksSnjho

I have seen several websites linked for manual targeting, but they all seem to have been taken down.

6). Best advice on gauging speed? I have been using the a). mark, b). wait 3:15 min, c). mark again, d). measure distance between two marks and multiply by 10

7). I have found that when I miss a ship it will start evasive maneuvering, making it much much harder to hit, or so it seems. Do they ever stop this swerving/evading pattern of motion? Any advice on attacking the same targets more than once?


I appreciate the replies/advice/comments!

[Sailor Steve]

WELCOME ABOARD! :sunny:

Before I ask, just for reference, I have the following mods installed:
GWX3 Gold
SH3 Commander
Resolution Fix
Though I don't have the game installed at the moment, when I do it's usually GWX and Commander, plus a large number of smaller mods and tools. Don't worry, you have plenty of time to learn everything there is to know. SH3 isn't going anywhere and neither are most of us.

1). I just wanted to make sure I started my career in the right place. If I understand this correctly, the different flotillas are different campaigns?
Whenever you finish one, do you begin the next with the same captain/career?
No. Each "campaign" is its own entity. It is the career of your chosen captain and it begins and ends with him. There are mods that let you keep the boat and crew with a new captain, but if you die your crew dies with you, and if you make it to the end of the war your career is over.

That said, the game allows you to run more than one career at a time. I usually have one going from each available command, a habit I picked up playing SH1 all those years ago.

2). I picked the 1st Flotilla, 1939 as a starting place. Is this typical/good place to get bearings?
One is as good as another. The 1st Flot is based out of Kiel, which means that if you're running a Type II you'll almost certainly be operating in the North Sea, and if you choose a Type VII you'll be either there or in the Western Approaches, south of Ireland. Later you'll be transferred to the west coast of France.

3). By pressing R it takes you to the radio. What can I do there? Does it serve any actual gameplay purpose to change to that view?
'R'? I don't remember that. 'M' lets you read your radio messages.

4). How do you adjust the "Ambient Volume" button on the hydrophone interface?
That one I just don't remember. Sorry.

5). Any advice on manual targeting?
Not from me. I've been playing for nine years and my math hasn't improved one bit.

7). I have found that when I miss a ship it will start evasive maneuvering, making it much much harder to hit, or so it seems. Do they ever stop this swerving/evading pattern of motion? Any advice on attacking the same targets more than once?
If they're aware of your presence they'll do that, and keep doing it until they're sure you're gone. Again I have no answer.

[maillemaker]

1). I just wanted to make sure I started my career in the right place. If I understand this correctly, the different flotillas are different campaigns?
Whenever you finish one, do you begin the next with the same captain/career?

Every time you start a career it is the same campaign (i.e., WWII), but you start with a new captain and, depending on what you select, a different port and a different start year.

The primary purpose of selecting a flotilla is to determine what port you will sally forth from, and which uboat types are available at that port.

2). I picked the 1st Flotilla, 1939 as a starting place. Is this typical/good place to get bearings?

I always start 1939 myself. Just be aware with GWX you will start in August and have to wait until September to start sinking things.

3). By pressing R it takes you to the radio. What can I do there? Does it serve any actual gameplay purpose to change to that view?

I don't remember.

4). How do you adjust the "Ambient Volume" button on the hydrophone interface?

It's tricky. If you click at about 2:30 on the dial, it will make it louder. If you click at about 3:30 on the dial, it will make it quieter. There appear to be only 2 volume settings.

5). Any advice on manual targeting? I have been using this video as a reference to learn: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0rTksSnjho

Looks like a good video to me.

6). Best advice on gauging speed? I have been using the a). mark, b). wait 3:15 min, c). mark again, d). measure distance between two marks and multiply by 10

If you have map contacts on, that is the easiest way. Another way is the "fixed wire" method, but you have to know the length of the ship from the recognition manual to use it.

7). I have found that when I miss a ship it will start evasive maneuvering, making it much much harder to hit, or so it seems. Do they ever stop this swerving/evading pattern of motion? Any advice on attacking the same targets more than once?

Once they figure out they are under attack, they will keep zig-zagging until they think you are gone.

Typically, when I know the speed of a target and it starts to zig-zag, I will reduce the target speed by 1 knot to help insure a hit.

Steve

[Nukesub]

Thank both of you for your replies.

@Maillemaker

What exactly are map contacts? Are those when blips show up on nav. map saying "Unknown, N NE, Slow" ?

Also, in the campaign I mentioned earlier, I am in one of the coastal craft, the small U-boats. I find that the only way I can make my patrols is going the whole way at 1/3 or less speed. Is this unusual? Time-wise it really isn't so bad with TC, but I am just wondering in general.

As a quick aside, there IS the Kiel Canal (possible shortcut?), but I find you cannot use TC in it and so it would take an inordinately long amount to travel it!

Also, if I run out of torpedo's it seems that if I dock in a friendly port (to resupply) and have NOT completed or arrived at my patrol grid, upon leaving the friendly dock I am told to just return home to my original beginning port (Kiel in this case). So, don't dock until you have completed patrol I guess, if you want to keep hunting?

Will they ever radio you to come home if you stay out hunting and just keep resupplying at friendly ports?

Also, if anyone cares to, are there any highly recommended mods that come with the GWX3 Gold install but are not enabled by default? (e.g. 16km atomsphere)

Thank you all in advance! I am excited to learn as much as I can :know:

Haha, the acronyms! They are taking hold!:huh:

[insidious]

Hi Nukesub :salute:
I also use GWX3\Commander\Res.Fix.There are many more you can check Downloads section.

5)Any advice on manual targeting?
You can look at this http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1080Just download it and opened in Word.
This is a very simple and effective method for attacking single ships and convoys.
After making several attacks you will remember the sequence of actions.

7). I have found that when I miss a ship it will start evasive maneuvering, making it much much harder to hit, or so it seems. Do they ever stop this swerving/evading pattern of motion? Any advice on attacking the same targets more than once?
The ship will stop after 40 or 50 minutes after it started evasive maneuvers.After the successful attack if the ship continues to move set parallel course and wait for the ship to get away from you.Surface and follow him after that you decide how you will finish him :arrgh!:

I hope this will help you
Good luck

[I use google translator :haha: so there may be grammatical errors]


:Kaleun_Cheers:

[Nukesub]

Hi Nukesub :salute:
I also use GWX3\Commander\Res.Fix.There are many more you can check Downloads section.


You can look at this http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1080Just download it and opened in Word.
This is a very simple and effective method for attacking single ships and convoys.
After making several attacks you will remember the sequence of actions.


The ship will stop after 40 or 50 minutes after it started evasive maneuvers.After the successful attack if the ship continues to move set parallel course and wait for the ship to get away from you.Surface and follow him after that you decide how you will finish him :arrgh!:

I hope this will help you
Good luck

[I use google translator :haha: so there may be grammatical errors]


:Kaleun_Cheers:

Google translator worked fine, no problems

Thank you for pointing out that targeting guide. I didn't realize there was a version of it saved on the website. I always clicked the links that let me to the downed website.

On that note, there are some mods listed in it that I cannot find!

Etchasketch’s BRILLIANT AoB finder wheel
Devnull's EXCELLENT 1 degree scope marking Mod

Does anyone know where I can find these?

Many thanks!

Oh, another note, I noticed there is an anchor on the side of the U-boats. Is it possible to drop anchor in SH3?

[Sailor Steve]

Also, in the campaign I mentioned earlier, I am in one of the coastal craft, the small U-boats. I find that the only way I can make my patrols is going the whole way at 1/3 or less speed. Is this unusual? Time-wise it really isn't so bad with TC, but I am just wondering in general.
The Type VII u-boat had a listed range of 8500 nautical miles at 10 knots. This varied from type to type, and the Silent Hunter world is flat, not round. The major supermods have changed things to account for the extra distance that needs to be travelled, but your best speed will almost always be the second setting, or 1/3. Between 7 and 10 knots is also a good guideline.

As a quick aside, there IS the Kiel Canal (possible shortcut?), but I find you cannot use TC in it and so it would take an inordinately long amount to travel it!
One of the cool functions of SH3 Commander is to allow you to easily chance time compression limits. 'When Near Shore' (or 'Land') is one of them. You can set the TC for any speed you want. Just be careful when you do so - you can run yourself aground if you're not.

Also, if I run out of torpedo's it seems that if I dock in a friendly port (to resupply) and have NOT completed or arrived at my patrol grid, upon leaving the friendly dock I am told to just return home to my original beginning port (Kiel in this case). So, don't dock until you have completed patrol I guess, if you want to keep hunting?
Technically the only port you should be able to resupply at is a dedicated u-boat base. GWX adds in supply ships docked at neutral ports and later milk cows - u-boats that meet you mid-ocean with supplies. Realistically a patrol in a Type VII shouldn't last longer than a month.

Will they ever radio you to come home if you stay out hunting and just keep resupplying at friendly ports?
No, you're on your own. Also not realistic, but every game has its limitations.

Also, if anyone cares to, are there any highly recommended mods that come with the GWX3 Gold install but are not enabled by default? (e.g. 16km atomsphere)
I use a 20km environment mod that also changes the water quite a bit. I also us several dozen other mods, and everyone has a setup they like best. Rather than give you a rundown myself, I'll refer you to a good thread on the subject.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=170090

[Aktungbby]

Nukesub!:Kaleun_Salute:

[Jimbuna]

Welcome to SubSim and the GWXperience Nuke http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/9628/rlw.gif (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/9/rlw.gif/)

[maillemaker]

@Maillemaker

What exactly are map contacts? Are those when blips show up on nav. map saying "Unknown, N NE, Slow" ?

Those are contacts that are reported to you via radio for you to go investigate (or not).

What I am talking about is if you have Map Contacts turned on, as soon as you raise your periscope, or if you are surfaced and your deck crew has spotted them, little ship icons will appear on your nav and attack maps. If you zoom in on the map you can even tell what kind of ship they are by the size and shape of the icon. And of course you can determine exactly their heading and speed. It is basically a "God's Eye" view of the battlefield. The 3:15 method works perfectly to determine speed when you have Map Contacts turned on.

Also, in the campaign I mentioned earlier, I am in one of the coastal craft, the small U-boats. I find that the only way I can make my patrols is going the whole way at 1/3 or less speed. Is this unusual? Time-wise it really isn't so bad with TC, but I am just wondering in general.

As a quick aside, there IS the Kiel Canal (possible shortcut?), but I find you cannot use TC in it and so it would take an inordinately long amount to travel it!

I avoid Kiel and I avoid those kinky Type II boats. :)

I start from Wilhelmshaven with a Type VII, and upgrade to a Type IX as soon as possible. I want a big deck gun and lots of torpedoes! :D

Also, if I run out of torpedo's it seems that if I dock in a friendly port (to resupply) and have NOT completed or arrived at my patrol grid, upon leaving the friendly dock I am told to just return home to my original beginning port (Kiel in this case). So, don't dock until you have completed patrol I guess, if you want to keep hunting?

There are a few drawbacks to ending the mission anywhere other than your home port. You will be given a default torpedo loadout that you cannot change, and you will lose any awards or promotions that you earned as you cannot issue them if you are not in your home port. Also you cannot qualify a petty officer or officer. Generally, unless it is an emergency, it is best to go home.

Will they ever radio you to come home if you stay out hunting and just keep resupplying at friendly ports?

No, but you will never be able to promote/award your crew or pick custom torpedo loadouts, as above. You can get around the promotion/award problem by using SH Commander.

[quote[Also, if anyone cares to, are there any highly recommended mods that come with the GWX3 Gold install but are not enabled by default? (e.g. 16km atomsphere)[/quote]

I like the long-range atmosphere mods. You'll also want the late-war sensor mods in late war, so you get the radar detector on your snorkle.

Steve

[captgeo]

Just got my copy of SH3 today, got it installed and it is 1.4, so.....

should I mess with the stock version or dive right into the MOD's ?:hmmm:

[Pisces]

Personally I would only start with stock to be able to experience the difference (in praise of the mod-creators). If you don't care (you are in appraisal anyway :) ) , then go right ahead with mods.

But do realise, some bugs and quirks originated or happened in stock too. So be careful if you come up against something weird and you attribute them to any mod you are using. There is a good chance the mod-creators know about it but can't do anything about it.

[captgeo]

Personally I would only start with stock to be able to experience the difference (in praise of the mod-creators). If you don't care (you are in appraisal anyway :) ) , then go right ahead with mods.

But do realise, some bugs and quirks originated or happened in stock too. So be careful if you come up against something weird and you attribute them to any mod you are using. There is a good chance the mod-creators know about it but can't do anything about it.

thanks mate, I ran SH4 stock for a few months also before I switched to Mod's, great advice.

the only reason I asked was all the things I heard about the great Mod's for 3, figured being an "old timer " here might affect what players would suggest for me.

[maillemaker]

Yeah I'm torn. On one hand, the GWX and other mods are so great, it's sad to think of missing out on them. On the other hand, you'll never appreciate how great the mods are until you play stock.

Something as simple as the Torpedo Damage Final and Lifeboats and Debris mods are huge game enhancers beyond stock.

Steve

[Nukesub]

Ahoy fellow Kaleun's!

Got a few new questions here. My busy schedule hasn't allowed me much time to enjoy this awesome game but in the moments I have had I have been experimenting with several different aspects of it!

New questions! :know:

1). How long do torpedo tubes stay open? And how can I confirm they are open other than a visual inspection with the camera? I ask because I swear there have been times when I know I hit open, TCed a bit, and then fired and had the delay of the tubes opening

2). What is the destroyers behavior? Do they always actively ping beneath them or do they only do it when they suspect a sub?

3). Is the games pinging/sonar based on movement? Say I hit 120m and stay still, will they move off looking for me or constantly depth charge the last spot they heard me?

4). Are sub nets physical objects that can be seen in the game? Any advice or spotting/avoiding them?

5). I've noticed sometimes when I am being depth charged that the depth charges "seem" to make my sub drop quickly when they explode next to it, even if I am trying to rise. Is this an effect of them? Or am I just crazy?

Thanks in advance! :D

[Aras]

1. I am not sure how long they stay open, I generally open them just before firing the torpedo. You can check if they are open or not from 3 places.
a. Go to the conning tower from Command Rooms. Turn around you will see switches representing torpedo tubes.
b. Right click Weapon Officers face from left bottom, you will teleport to his station. Turn around, again there are switches representing torpedo tubes.
c. Visually:) By the way, for way 1 and 2 you may interact with the switches.

2. They will start to ping if they suspect your presence. That may be caused by propeller sound or just a crew dropping his wrench etc... Remember the scene from Das Boot where Number 2 makes a joke about silent running. :)

3. First they will depth charge the last place they heard you. Eventually they will try to depth charge blind some other locations around to find you.

4. Yes, you may see them in game however I think you may not destroy it (Remember the scene from Run Silent Run Deep where US submarine destroys the net to escape Japanese harbour). Stay away from them. They are located on harbours. Stay away from port raiding until you really know what you are doing. If you hit one, DO NOT change your heading. Run your propellers backwards (Back Emergency)

5. I have experienced the same thing as well. I presume it’s the consequence of the blast. Do not forget that a depth charge may cause some damage via Shock Wave.

[Raptor]

Once opened, your torpedo tubes will stay open indefinitely until one of 2 things happens:

1 - you manually close them, or.....

2 - you dive below 20 meters


On the way back up to periscope depth or to the surface, you will get a verbal message "We're too deep to launch torpedoes" if you try to open them below 20 meters.

[Aras]

On the way back up to periscope depth or to the surface, you will get a verbal message "We're too deep to launch torpedoes" if you try to open them below 20 meters.

Does someone know, what is the max depth a WWII u-boot can launch torpedoes in real life. I remember a scene from The Enemy Below where they fire torpedoes deeper than 20m.

[ReallyDedPoet]

Later versions could be launched at a depth of 50 metres.
http://www.uboataces.com/weapon-torpedo.shtml

Torpedoes had to be launched on the surface or at periscope depth. But later versions of German torpedoes such as the TV (Zaunkonig II) could be launched from up to a depth of 50 meters.

[Nukesub]

Once opened, your torpedo tubes will stay open indefinitely until one of 2 things happens:

1 - you manually close them, or.....


On the way back up to periscope depth or to the surface, you will get a verbal message "We're too deep to launch torpedoes" if you try to open them below 20 meters.

How do you manually close them? I thought I read somewhere that it is the "w" key, but every time I've done it I have never received any kind of confirmation that they actually have indeed closed

[ReallyDedPoet]

Q to open, Q to close, at least on my install.

[Jimbuna]

Q to open, E to close.

[Mittelwaechter]

Q to open, W to close (no confirmation - just some noise from closing the hatch).
E is for blowing air into the tanks (emergency surface)

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193887 #4

[Nukesub]

Q to open, W to close (no confirmation - just some noise from closing the hatch).
E is for blowing air into the tanks (emergency surface)

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193887 #4

Nice little modification there. Though I enjoy the language in German and the text in English. Still fixes the problem though b/c now it says "WE:" whenever I close them and I don't remember it doing that before so now I have at least some kind of indicator :)

[captgeo]

as a "new " player of SH3, can I instal GWX gold after I have played the stock game, or do I have to re install the sim again if I play for a bit with the original version.

[ReallyDedPoet]

To be safe I would install over a clean patched SH3.

[ReallyDedPoet]

If you want you can have 2-3 installs, and use Multi SH3 to have separate saved games for each. I think at one time I had 3-4, and one was a clean install so I could compare modded files.

I understand this cannot be done with Windows 8, perhaps in the future.

[Mittelwaechter]

Nice little modification there. Though I enjoy the language in German and the text in English. Still fixes the problem though b/c now it says "WE:" whenever I close them and I don't remember it doing that before so now I have at least some kind of indicator :)

Modify de_menu.txt and commands_de.cfg accordingly and you'll be fine.

Muendungsklappe wird geschlossen, Herr Kaleun!

The C gives you the spoken crew response "Jawohl, Herr Kaleun!" or "Aye, Sir! (or whatever they say in English) in English or German - matching your settings.

[Nukesub]

Thank you all for the replies so far :)

Also I will adjust that menu and command files accordingly.


Got a bit of an issue now though. I just REMOVED FM_NewInterior_V.10 and replaced it with version 2.1D and now my career's won't load. Even a brand new one crashes when the red loading bar is almost full. Curiously, the training missions seem to load fine.

Also, SH3 Commander doesn't seem to wanna update its list of careers with those added/deleted in-game at the profiles screen.

[Nukesub]

Modify de_menu.txt and commands_de.cfg accordingly and you'll be fine.

Muendungsklappe wird geschlossen, Herr Kaleun!

The C gives you the spoken crew response "Jawohl, Herr Kaleun!" or "Aye, Sir! (or whatever they say in English) in English or German - matching your settings.

Hmmm, tried this. Nothing happens however, not even a "WE:" in the dialog box. Oh well, can't say we didn't try! :)

Also, I am a bit confused about neutral targets in this sim. Twice now I "thought" I read Norway was an enemy starting 4 of Sept. 1940 (according to the flag chart "flaggen"). In October of 1940 I sink a Norweigen cargo and I see a neutral ship wreck.

Is there a well known torpedo range chart everyone uses?

How far under the keel do magnetic torps have to be? Is 1 meter below too far?


Thanks again in advance for everyones input, it IS appreciated and good hunting o7

[banryu79]

How far under the keel do magnetic torps have to be? Is 1 meter below too far?

It depends. Mainly by the weather, 'cause with heavy sea your target will roll and pitch more, and its keel depth will change constanly by a large amount.

So, it could be that your mag torpedo will run well under your target keel at the intersect point... All in all with very bad sea/weather it is safer to opt. for impact and forget magnetic at all.

In any case my rule of thumb is (W stand for Wind):
W < 7 = 0.5 meter under the keel
7 < W > 12 = 1 meter under the keel
W > 12 = 2 meters if you feel lucky, or forget it at all.

[BigWalleye]

It depends. Mainly by the weather, 'cause with heavy sea your target will roll and pitch more, and its keel depth will change constanly by a large amount.

So, it could be that your mag torpedo will run well under your target keel at the intersect point... All in all with very bad sea/weather it is safer to opt. for impact and forget magnetic at all.

In any case my rule of thumb is (W stand for Wind):
W < 7 = 0.5 meter under the keel
7 < W > 12 = 1 meter under the keel
W > 12 = 2 meters if you feel lucky, or forget it at all.

If you are using h.sie's V16B1 patches, the Torpedo Failure Fix will cause your torps to run at max depth (25m) if torp depth setting <= 0.4 W. So using a shallow setting with the impact pistol won't alleviate the problem in heavy weather. Better to use magnetic in high winds. I can't say for sure, but I really doubt that keel depth changes due to sea state are modeled in SH3. I'd bet that 6m draft means 6m, period.

[Aras]

If you are using h.sie's V16B1 patches, the Torpedo Failure Fix will cause your torps to run at max depth (25m) if torp depth setting <= 0.4 W. So using a shallow setting with the impact pistol won't alleviate the problem in heavy weather. Better to use magnetic in high winds.

I agree, however the problem is Magnetic Pistols are known to have pre detonation problems in heavy weather / rough seas. Better fire them on short range (<= 1000m)

[Mittelwaechter]

Hmmm, tried this. Nothing happens however, not even a "WE:" in the dialog box. Oh well, can't say we didn't try! :)

I assure you this little mod works perfectly. :yep:
Did you roll back the SH3 Commander before modifying the files?
Maybe you run some mod in JSGME that uses it's own menu/command files?


Torpedo ranges are easy:
G7a (T1/FAT/LUT) has a speed setting. Slow30kts/medium40kts/fast44kts goes 12.5/7.5/5 km.

Electric eels (TII/TIII/FAT/LUT) have only one speed - 30kts and go ~ 5 km (GWX).
In Stock SH3 there was a difference in range between TII and TIII versions. You can redo and use this to simulate preheating conditions.

The homing torpedos are different:
Falke 20kts - 7.5km
Zaunkoenig 24kts - 5.7 km

The keel is dancing up and down. With H.Sie's patch it may be impossible to hit your target with impact fuse in high seas.
If you have to use a magnetic, it is a good idea to shoot along the keel line - from the back. It doubles (at least) your chances to ignite the fuse as the keel may come down into the correct distance or the eel hits the stern section directly (if the keel is down right then and the torpedo doesn't bounce off).

[Jimbuna]

I can't say for sure, but I really doubt that keel depth changes due to sea state are modeled in SH3. I'd bet that 6m draft means 6m, period.

Use external camera view in rough weather and look at the different depths the keel goes through as the ship pitches.

[BigWalleye]

Use external camera view in rough weather and look at the different depths the keel goes through as the ship pitches.

I'm afraid that up-and-down motion of the image doesn't tell me anything about the modeling of the hull-torpedo interaction. Have you actually seen a magnetic run under a hull in heavy weather? IMO, direct visual observation of a torp running straight and true (with no porpoising to track the surface wave action) and the target hull moving up out of the detonation zone would be the only positive confirmation. I never use an external cam, so I've never looked for it it.

[Mittelwaechter]

^^

It works exactly like that.

And you can observe the perfect set mag-torpedo bouncing off, with the hull dunking deep.

[BigWalleye]

^^

It works exactly like that.

And you can observe the perfect set mag-torpedo bouncing off, with the hull dunking deep.

Doesn't the hull proximity cause detonation as the torp approaches the side of the hull when it is running above keel depth? Also, I thought the choices were "Impact Only" and "Impact + Magnetic". If so, then a shallow runner shouldn't bounce off, but should detonate when it smacks the side. Shouldn't it? Is it even possible to set the Pistol to "Magnetic Only"? No GUI I use shows that option.

[Jimbuna]

I'm afraid that up-and-down motion of the image doesn't tell me anything about the modeling of the hull-torpedo interaction. Have you actually seen a magnetic run under a hull in heavy weather? IMO, direct visual observation of a torp running straight and true (with no porpoising to track the surface wave action) and the target hull moving up out of the detonation zone would be the only positive confirmation. I never use an external cam, so I've never looked for it it.

Fair enough but I've seen many an eel porpoising as well as striking the side of the hull as the vessel pitches into the sea.

^^

It works exactly like that.

And you can observe the perfect set mag-torpedo bouncing off, with the hull dunking deep.

Rgr that.

[BigWalleye]

OK, I'm convinced.

What about the pistol switch? Impact vs Magnetic? Or Impact vs Impact + Magnetic. The original Ubimanual says the latter. But GWX and NYGM don't. Was gibt?

[BigWalleye]

Exactly! Never mess that up in range of the enemy...

Silent Service I says it this way: Mister Jimbuna is being re-assigned for training :)

Anyone remember that game?

'Course! It was the first, but it couldn't touch the original (and still great) Silent Hunter!

[Mittelwaechter]

The impact pistol was a mechanical device senitive to a direct push from the gear at the tip of the torpedo. If this push wasn't hard enough the pistol didn't ignite the payload and the torpedo bounced off.

The magnetic pistol was/is an electrical device (on by default) and easily to be switched off (disconnect a cable). It was/is sensitive to the change of the earths magnetic field - altered under a ships keel as by i.e. ore veins in the sea bed or by leaving the tube. The last fact made them arm the torpedo after a certain distance from the tube.

[ReallyDedPoet]

If that is not an addiction, tell me what it is :ping:

Fast Attack was my first subsim, SHII brought me here though :yep:

http://www.subsim.com/ssr/fastattack/Snarf007.gif

[BigWalleye]

I just went downstairs and had a look into my shelf - and yes! I still own that original box of a 1985-Silent-Service-C64 !!!

Man, I am addicted to playing Subsims since almost 30 years now!

If that is not an addiction, tell me what it is :ping:

My copy (on a mini-flop IIRC) got tossed with my PCAT long, long ago!

[flag4]

5). Any advice on manual targeting? I have been using this video as a reference to learn: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0rTksSnjho


...what a crackin' vid, many thanks Nukesub:up:

[banryu79]

If you are using h.sie's V16B1 patches, the Torpedo Failure Fix will cause your torps to run at max depth (25m) if torp depth setting <= 0.4 W.
Thanks, I didn't know it. But I do not use said patch (btw, I know about it, I have seen it been mentioned many time in many threads).


So using a shallow setting with the impact pistol won't alleviate the problem in heavy weather. Better to use magnetic in high winds.

As I said, I do not use h.sie patch, no have used it (I'm a newbie kaleun).


I can't say for sure, but I really doubt that keel depth changes due to sea state are modeled in SH3. I'd bet that 6m draft means 6m, period.

Mmmm :hmmm:
I can see that weather dependant roll & pitch is modeled for "ownship" (the sub we command), and that has an effect on your sub draft!
I thought that this behaviour was modeled for any vessel in the game! :-?

[Nukesub]

...what a crackin' vid, many thanks Nukesub:up:

No problem :)

Just an FYI I did NOT make it, simply found it through google searches

[flag4]

5). Any advice on manual targeting? I have been using this video as a reference to learn: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0rTksSnjho



Not from me. I've been playing for nine years and my math hasn't improved one bit.



Steve, if I may. I, like you, can not grasp the maths. I shy away from it all the time, and I feel a little sad that I cant do those sums to get the torps to hit. but I just watched the above video and I was mightily impressed at potentially how easy it seemed. have a go and watch it. it runs for nine minutes and I reckon there aint maths to it except multiplying the time travelled by 10 to get the speed.
id be interested to hear your response...once you've watched it...?:yeah:

[Sailor Steve]

I watched it, and I'm disappointed. I find it no more realistic than using Auto Targeting. First, there is no way you can use the periscope for a few seconds and have the exact bearing and range of every ship in the convoy. On the other hand, getting the speed of one ship will give you the speed of the entire convoy. Second, the stated goal is to keep the periscope above water for as short a time as possible. In real life they had to keep it up long enough to gather the correct information. They also had to recheck several times, which meant raising the scope for as long as was necessary. This means that the goal of keeping the scope underwater is contrary to what they actually had to do.

I technically use Manual Targeting, but I use WE Assistance to get the information, but because it's perfect I use it once every two minutes, and I leave the scope up for as long as seems reasonable to me. I use the Assisted Plotting Mod, which only allows you to mark the position of one ship at a time, not the entire convoy. Despite the "perfection" of the WE, I still manage to miss on a fairly regular basis. My way may not be as realistic as full manual targeting, but it feels right to me.

[Aras]

For manual targeting I can recommend to check this post : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=88961

I use Manual Targeting as well however I leave Auto Map Contacts on to measure the distance. I really love to gather all the information including range manually however the stadimeter and the recognition manual are not handy in this subject.

Values in Recognition manual are generally false, even the highest mast in given picture does not match with highest mast value :hmmm: Which makes stadimeter useless in my opinion. Did i miss something about it?

I know that in real life everything was not perfect including recognition manual. My nerves can take being depth charged for hours but I can't handle wasting Third Reich's precious torpedoes just because I wasn't qualified enough to calculate a range correctly.

[BigWalleye]

For manual targeting I can recommend to check this post : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=88961

I use Manual Targeting as well however I leave Auto Map Contacts on to measure the distance. I really love to gather all the information including range manually however the stadimeter and the recognition manual are not handy in this subject.

Values in Recognition manual are generally false, even the highest mast in given picture does not match with highest mast value :hmmm: Which makes stadimeter useless in my opinion. Did i miss something about it?

I know that in real life everything was not perfect including recognition manual. My nerves can take being depth charged for hours but I can't handle wasting Third Reich's precious torpedoes just because I wasn't qualified enough to calculate a range correctly.

I use basically the same options. Have you tried Hitman's Optics? No stadimeter, but FoV and scaling are adjusted to give accurate estimates of range and AoB with the graticles. As I understand it (based on Cap'n Scurvy's work on SH4) It's not the rec manual that is wrong, but the image scaling. AAR, I've done quite a bit of static testing, and range and AoB can both be determined pretty accurately.

Couple of other advantages: You don't need to make a positive ID before attacking - many similar classes had similar mast heights. And you don't need to use that thin whisp if a mast. The rec manual also gives you funnel and superstructure heights, A nice fat funnel can be easier to measure than a skinny mast.

Hitman says that these graticles are based on actual surviving Uboat periscopes. He tweaked the camera values to make the measurements work. And they seem to work. My tonnage scores are up, anyway.

[banryu79]

My nerves can take being depth charged for hours but I can't handle wasting Third Reich's precious torpedoes just because I wasn't qualified enough to calculate a range correctly.

I have little esxperience (still on the course of my first patrol) but 'till now I'm doing well with "The Straight Shot" and "The Perfect Shot" methods described in the document section shipped with a GUI Mod [hsGUI]

Both methods make use of your torpedo speed and target speed/course to give you a reference bearing to aim to -- no need to calculate target range at all! --

Both methods rely on precompiled tables you use to index 'target speed' on one axis and 'LB angle' (explained in the document, and to calculate it you need to know target course) on the other axis to find the 'shoting bearing'.

Each specific table is build for a specific torped speed settting: I'm using [MaGui F], a Gui Mod, that provides me with three in-game precompiled tables: 30/40/44 knot (plus other useful tools, but these tables are what I was looking for).

If you do not want to use the [MaGui F] mod you can still use the above described methods: just download the [hsGUI] mod for the explanations, then write down the tables on paper (I can provide you with a txt version of the tables if you are intrested, I do not remeber if they come with the documents in [hsGUI] mod folders).

[Nukesub]

Got another quick question.

I noticed in this thread, http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=166320, that there is a screenshot listed with torpedo bearing tables.

Can anyone explain how to read these? In the top left corner there is a lb/u symbol. What does this denote?

Thank you in advance!

[Pisces]

U (vertical) is target speed in knots

lb (horizontal) is AOB in degrees.

At least then all the values make sense as degrees of lead angle. Lead angle is the angle between periscope view at firing, and bearing to impact straight ahead (0). Note the table says straight shot. So the torpedoes make no turn.

If you set these values (target speed and AOB) into the TDC-dials, then this adjusts the gyro angle appropriately anyway. So I don't really understand the need of these tables if one does manual targeting. I guess you would need this if the TDC is somehow non-functional.

And no, I don't know why it is abreviated that way.

[Nukesub]

U (vertical) is target speed in knots

lb (horizontal) is AOB in degrees.

At least then all the values make sense as degrees of lead angle. Lead angle is the angle between periscope view at firing, and bearing to impact straight ahead (0). Note the table says straight shot. So the torpedoes make no turn.

If you set these values (target speed and AOB) into the TDC-dials, then this adjusts the gyro angle appropriately anyway. So I don't really understand the need of these tables if one does manual targeting. I guess you would need this if the TDC is somehow non-functional.

And no, I don't know why it is abreviated that way.

Okay that makes much more sense, thank you.

Something else I have been a bit curious about. I realize that Silent hunter 3 is a bit dated (not that it has suffered thanks to this community!) so perhaps this just comes with the territory, but does anyone have issues with screen tearing? And if so, had any luck fixing them?

I have tried to force Vsync with an Nvidia Control Panel but it hasn't seemed to have changed anything.

[Pisces]

If I ever had such tearing in my view then I forgot about it. I can't remember any solution.

But maybe that your settings have antialiasing and anisotropic filtering enabled with negative effect. Double/tripple buffering usually helps with framerate and Vsync issues. I have tripple buffering enabled in my settings. I'm just guessing here for clues though. No idea if it really helps.

[HerrWilkus]

I just went downstairs and had a look into my shelf - and yes! I still own that original box of a 1985-Silent-Service-C64 !!!

Man, I am addicted to playing Subsims since almost 30 years now!

If that is not an addiction, tell me what it is :ping:

Haha. I remember Silent Service when I was a kid. Dad worked for IBM, so we were early IBM PC adopters. Everything was light blue and pink, gotta love those CGA colors. But by the time I picked up Silent Service, was already a 'highly experienced' Skipper.

Because it wasn't my first subsim - that would be GATO.
I was in 3rd grade and the Challenger hadn't blown up yet, so that would be around fall 1985. I still have the 5 1/4" floppy in a box somewhere, probably right next to the original King's Quest. :haha:
Badass box art too.

Even as an 8 year old, I don't think I ever had to dive - you could just blow everyone away on the surface. Ah yeah, see-through ships on that lovely pink ocean.

Sank every single 'Maru' there was in the database many times over.