German allies in WWII

[Rammstein0991]

You know, I was playing UBMAO the other night and it hit me, if the situation was reversed and Germany was allied to the US in WWII (nazi's not existing) Where do you think the Kriegsmarine pacific U-boot base would be if the "Monsun Gruppe" had still been created, what level of co-operation would they have with the USN, etc.

Personally I'm thinking they would be based at either Brisbane or Freemantle, but thats just me. Any ideas?

[Dread Knot]

The Dutch subs that escaped the fall of the Netherland East Indies ended up based in Trincomalee, Ceylon (a British base) due to their short range. That might be one possibility.

You could also ask if a non-Nazi Germany would even have a large U-boat fleet to send abroad. You don't build what you don't need.

[Admiral Halsey]

The Dutch subs that escaped the fall of the Netherland East Indies ended up based in Trincomalee, Ceylon (a British base) due to their short range. That might be one possibility.Maybe. Then again the Type IX's had ridiculously long range so they could have done patrols from Wilhelmshaven.

You could also ask if a non-Nazi Germany would even have a large U-boat fleet to send abroad. You don't build what you don't need.They'd still probably have a decent size fleet since the U-Boats were the only thing they had that could really take the fight to the enemy.

[Rammstein0991]

Yeah, alot of people don't even know the Dutch HAD submarines, they only seem to remember Germany Britain Japan and America

[merc4ulfate]

The base would have been in Exmouth, Australia.

It is about 1000 KM North of Perth(Fremantle).

[Snarf]

Yeah, alot of people don't even know the Dutch HAD submarines, they only seem to remember Germany Britain Japan and America
There's a lot people don't know about the Dutch, we are a secretive and/or forgotten about people.

[Rammstein0991]

The base would have been in Exmouth, Australia.

It is about 1000 KM North of Perth(Fremantle).

idk, from what I read Exmouth was a bit of a shantytown in WWII... :06:

[Dread Knot]

There's a lot people don't know about the Dutch, we are a secretive and/or forgotten about people.

The first Japanese destroyer lost to an Allied sub was the Sagiri to the Dutch K-16 off Miri in Sarawak.

[Dread Knot]

idk, from what I read Exmouth was a bit of a shantytown in WWII... :06:

It was okay for a refueling station but as a sub base it would have been vulnerable to tropical cyclones, heavy surf, Japanese bombers and recon planes.

[Aktungbby]

Yeah, alot of people don't even know the Dutch HAD submarines, they only seem to remember Germany Britain Japan and America
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2511249/Nazi-U-boat-sunk-Second-World-War-discovered-divers-Indonesia--complete-skeletons-doomed-crew.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2511249/Nazi-U-boat-sunk-Second-World-War-discovered-divers-Indonesia--complete-skeletons-doomed-crew.html) How fast we forget at :subsim:! U-168 type IX (subject of recent thread) ran into the Dutch sub Zwaardvisch and paid the price in the Indonesian waters...they didn't call it the Dutch East Indies fer nuthin'!:yeah: http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/11/21/article-2511249-1990C09800000578-529_634x474.jpg This poor U-bootwafer never forgot!

[Rammstein0991]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2511249/Nazi-U-boat-sunk-Second-World-War-discovered-divers-Indonesia--complete-skeletons-doomed-crew.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2511249/Nazi-U-boat-sunk-Second-World-War-discovered-divers-Indonesia--complete-skeletons-doomed-crew.html) How fast we forget at :subsim:! U-168 type IX (subject of recent thread) ran into the Dutch sub Zwaardvisch and paid the price in the Indonesian waters...they didn't call it the Dutch East Indies fer nuthin'!:yeah: http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/11/21/article-2511249-1990C09800000578-529_634x474.jpg This poor U-bootwafer never forgot!

Aye, but I was also referring to the world at large (shrug), you always hear of the exploits of the American sub fleet, of course the Kriegsmarine and sometimes the RN...but you never really seem to hear the hero stories of the RNN

[Aktungbby]

Why do you think I post in the color of the "House of Orange?":D also: 1977's http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/SoldierOfOrange.jpg/220px-SoldierOfOrange.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SoldierOfOrange.jpg) starring Rutger Hauer-good WWII flick. Golden Globe winner.

[Jimbuna]

There's a lot people don't know about the Dutch, we are a secretive and/or forgotten about people.

I'd agree with you there and I also wonder how commonly known is the fact the Dutch were the early forerunners in putting the snorkel into operational use.

[Rammstein0991]

I'd agree with you there and I also wonder how commonly known is the fact the Dutch were the early forerunners in putting the snorkel into operational use.

General belief puts it on the Germans I'm afraid

[Jimbuna]

General belief puts it on the Germans I'm afraid

Germany defeated the Netherlands in 1940; their capture of O-25 and O-26 was a stroke of luck for the German Kriegsmarine. The Dutch O-21 series was operating a device named a snuiver (sniffer). The Dutch navy had been experimenting as early as 1938 with a simple pipe system on the submarines O-19 and O-20 that enabled them to travel at periscope depth operating on its diesels with almost unlimited underwater range while charging the propulsion batteries. The system was designed by the Dutchman Jan Jacob Wichers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine_snorkel

[Rammstein0991]

Thanks for the info, sadly most folks think the Germans invented the "schnorchel", so its up to us to get the record straight aye?

[TorpX]

Yeah, alot of people don't even know the Dutch HAD submarines, they only seem to remember Germany Britain Japan and America

The Dutch (and their subs) figure prominently in WitP-AE. Early in the war, those subs represent a substantial part of Allied striking power.

[Dread Knot]

The Dutch (and their subs) figure prominently in WitP-AE. Early in the war, those subs represent a substantial part of Allied striking power.




Indeed. Their torpedoes actually do what they were designed to do. :D

[Rammstein0991]

More or less, lol

[Jimbuna]

Indeed. Their torpedoes actually do what they were designed to do. :D

Dutch Submarine attacks in/post World War II

http://www.dutchsubmarines.com/specials/special_attacks_wwii.htm

From the site below

http://www.dutchsubmarines.com/world_war_two/world_war_two.htm

[Rammstein0991]

Thanks for the links :up:

[Aktungbby]

What is also interesting about the original concept of the 'snuivver' (Schnorkel) was that it was originally only intended for the crews' comfort and not for air to drive the diesel engines; that became a necessary German adaptation as the war forced Uboots from preferred night surface attacks to becoming 'true' submarines as Direction Finding, ASDIC and high-centimetric radar took their toll in the 'wizard war' at sea...

[Jimbuna]

Thanks for the links :up:

Your welcome http://s24.postimg.org/c148rgoj5/thumbsup_1.gif (http://postimage.org/)

[Rammstein0991]

You think its possible that the Germans may have also used some older US subs (like Salmon, Sargo, etc) since the US was switching more and more to Gato's and Balao's as the war went on?

[Jimbuna]

You think its possible that the Germans may have also used some older US subs (like Salmon, Sargo, etc) since the US was switching more and more to Gato's and Balao's as the war went on?

Highly unlikely but a link to any possible source would help.

[Rammstein0991]

(shrug) just speculation, idle fan chatter you know? :hmmm: