S-Class skippers unite!

[Rammstein0991]

Allright folks and fogies, Lets hear your thoughts on the unsung little underdog of SH IV, the dinky little sub who putters along at 11 knots (on a good day), It may not be the prettiest boat, or the best armed, but some of us love that ancient hunk of rust and bolts.

Lets hear what you like about the S-Class, your fondest memories, best patrol, best sinking, etc. Have at it.

[fireftr18]

I love starting with an s-boat. It's really a challenge just to get lined up for a decent shot. It's almost pure luck to get in position.

[Sailor Steve]

Anyone who loves the sugar boat might get a kick out of this old thread too. :sunny:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=156682&highlight=s-class

[Dread Knot]

It may not be the prettiest boat, or the best armed, but some of us love that ancient hunk of rust and bolts.




Admiral Hart, who was in command of the US Asiatic Fleet would have agreed with you. He was a strong proponent of the small coastal defense submarine instead of the large fleet submarines which had begun to appear. Hart felt that the fleet submarines had performed poorly during the Japanese conquest of the Philippines and Dutch East Indies. (they had) and that the smaller, simpler submarines he preferred would have done better (which is probably untrue.) He also felt modern subs were too complex and loaded with fragile gizmos. ( like radar and air conditioning)

The deployment of large number of S-boats out of reserve to the Southwest Pacific in 1942 may have been influenced by Hart's attitude.

[Rammstein0991]

I seem to recall they had so many problems with the S boats during the war, everything from leaking pressure hulls to ballast tank compressor's failing, in fact if memory serves some of them hadnt been properly maintained since the mid 20's.

[fireftr18]

Admiral Hart, who was in command of the US Asiatic Fleet would have agreed with you. He was a strong proponent of the small coastal defense submarine instead of the large fleet submarines which had begun to appear. Hart felt that the fleet submarines had performed poorly during the Japanese conquest of the Philippines and Dutch East Indies. (they had) and that the smaller, simpler submarines he preferred would have done better (which is probably untrue.) He also felt modern subs were too complex and loaded with fragile gizmos. ( like radar and air conditioning)

The deployment of large number of S-boats out of reserve to the Southwest Pacific in 1942 may have been influenced by Hart's attitude.

I can see the logic in a small coastal defense boat. You deploy, patrol for say 10 hours, and return. The crew sleeps on land. Two hour change-over so another crew can patrol with the same boat. Short range, don't need as large of crew, no sleeping quarters, no need to store large amounts of food. Makes for a smaller, faster, more agile boat over all. It could even have been used in conjuction with aircraft patrol to intercept enemy ships. :hmm2:

[Cybermat47]

It may not be the prettiest boat,

:hmmm: What do you mean? I only tried it out because I liked the look of it.

[Red October1984]

I've always been successful with the ol' Sugar.

Sank a cruiser and two destroyers on my first ever patrol with it. :yeah:

[Rammstein0991]

Lucky you, Most I've sank in it is big fat tankers.

[U505995]

I never commanded an S-boat myself but with the way those blasted mk14's are acting I just might start a new career in one myself.

[Rammstein0991]

Word of advice, it can take you up to 3 or more torpedos to sink ships that the MK XIV sinks with 1-2, but beyond that its a good boat.

[TorpX]

I always liked the S-boats; mainly because I had good experiences with them in SHCE. Learning how to manually calculate firing solutions (without using the TDC), riding out depth charge attacks by angry destroyers, battling stormy seas; it was a rich learning experience.



from Sailor Steve:
Anyone who loves the sugar boat might get a kick out of this old thread too.

I'm glad you posted that, it kind of took me back.

[Rammstein0991]

I always liked the S-boats; mainly because I had good experiences with them in SHCE. Learning how to manually calculate firing solutions (without using the TDC), riding out depth charge attacks by angry destroyers, battling stormy seas; it was a rich learning experience.



from Sailor Steve:

I'm glad you posted that, it kind of took me back.


What Kind of experiences?:06:

[Sniper297]

Everything I've read about them:

1. They were copied from the worst U-boat design of world war 1 - a 1915 model that was designed to be cheap and quick to build because of wartime shortages. It was so bad the German Navy never deployed them, used only for training in the Baltic.

2. All the seals - diving planes, periscope, prop shafts etc. - leaked so badly you couldn't dive below 150 feet. The hull was okay with the pressure, but the pumps could barely keep up with the leaks at 150. Below that the pumps couldn't keep up with the flooding, so if you went to 200 feet you were committed to going all the way down.

Some interesting reading written by the wife of an S boat sailor;

http://www.amazon.com/Pigboat-39-American-Sub-Goes/dp/081310985X

[TorpX]

What Kind of experiences?:06:


For me, SHCE and the S-class were very worthwhile because I was just developing an interest in submarines, and as I was playing a first career, I was reading CLEAR THE BRIDGE!, and I could think about, learn, and incorporate the tactics used by O'Kane. To put it another way, I learned more in this way, than I would have by just reading books. Some of it I learned in the game, some I figured out by myself, outside the game, and some I learned by reading about it.

I consider the S-class very interesting, partly because they have limited fuel/range, limited battery capacity, and limited number of tubes/torpedoes, so you must make wise use of these resources, if you are to do well.

[Rammstein0991]

Tell me about it, Its lucky I have unlimited fuel turned on because on my second mission I got sent up way north of manila and as I was returning home they decided theyd all pack up and move to freakin Java -.-

[Dread Knot]

I got sent up way north of manila and as I was returning home they decided theyd all pack up and move to freakin Java -.-

Well, the Japanese eviction notice stuck to the door with a bayonet was a little difficult to ignore. :D

http://www.ww2incolor.com/d/375186-4/10243872

[aanker]

I too have always liked the "sugar boats" since SHCE, in fact 'my boat' is S-39 (SS-144).

I thank Hawk and Kim Rønhof for that. Frank Kulick and Hondo too.
http://www.valoratsea.com/notdc.htm

Happy Hunting!

[TorpX]

Well, the Japanese eviction notice stuck to the door with a bayonet was a little difficult to ignore. :D



:haha:

Yup, that's one way to put it.

[Lazarus1395]

I have only been playing SH4 for a few hours now but I have to say, the S-Boat is by far my favourite boat in game.

[Tombomsee]

After returning to Subsim after a couple of years with SH4 and searching for mods best suiting my way to play, I decided to start with S-Class in 1941 and stick to it as long as possible :arrgh!:

[Rammstein0991]

^ this

[Webster]

just wanted to mention to those who love the pig boats that I have an s-boat mod to make them as fragile as they should be so its more realistic to be in one.

but be warned, this will greatly increase the difficulty because the boat wont be unrealisticly strong as it is with the stock game.

[les green01]

I also love starting with a sugarboat for the challence and dont have the tcd to use

[aanker]

just wanted to mention to those who love the pig boats that I have an s-boat mod to make them as fragile as they should be so its more realistic to be in one.

but be warned, this will greatly increase the difficulty because the boat wont be unrealisticly strong as it is with the stock game.
Cool Webster!
- Since going deep is not a realistic option, and I figure that a S-Boat couldn't withstand a DC attack during ASW anyway, I stay away from DD's & PC, and don't engage in a surface gunfire attack against any Maru that outguns me.

It is nice of you to make your fragile S-Boat mod for realism. Thanks.

Happy Hunting!

[Webster]

in case anyone didn't realize to use the link in my sig, here is the link to it: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=157608

[Rammstein0991]

Tough to play with that mod :P

[Dux Ducis Hodiernus]

Can't find the S Class sub anywhere? Selected start date was 1941, but I can't see any option to choose this "S-Sub"?

Playing with GFO mod btw.

[Dux Ducis Hodiernus]

Also, I just noticed that many mods talk about JSGME? I installed GMO via drag and drop instead of this thing, will it still work? You don't have too many proper mod installation sticky help threads, sadly, hence why things may become quite confusing for the uninitated.

[Dux Ducis Hodiernus]

Errr... Now I reinstalled the game, and installed mods via the JGME, and the game crashes on startup :'(

[aanker]

I keep a clean install that I don't play and make copies of it. On the copies I install Multi-SH4 to rename the save game folder, and I have used the drop and install method. On this modded install I do add JSGME for any additional mods.

I have a clean install I don't play - saved games go to SH4.

A personal modded install - saved games go to SHM
A RFB install - saved games go to SHR
A TMO install - saved games go to SHT

If anything ever gets corrupt I delete the Data folder & MODS folder from that install, also JSGME & JSGME.ini, and replace the Data folder with a new copy from the clean install, and reinstall JSGME in that install, and add my mods again.

I start every install using a shortcut from that installs SH4.exe file - not the GU.exe.

That is my convoluted method.... lol

Happy Hunting!

[Dux Ducis Hodiernus]

NVM managed to fix it, seems the way they added the expanison is that it replaces the files in the default game in steam. meaning you have to begin the download/install of the expanison after the install of the default game. When I reinstalled I downloaded/installed both via steam at the same time, so the default game replaced the expanison files, hence why the mod requring the expanison crashed.

Anyways I still can't find this S-Class?

Also does anyone else have the issue in the museum, that makes the game crash if you switch trough the boats too fast?

[Dux Ducis Hodiernus]

I seriously can't find this S class, is it in a mod? I've installed TMO 2.5, but can't see it there either.

[Dux Ducis Hodiernus]

Oh I'm dumb. It's the S-18 and S-42? I was confused because since it was "the' S Class" It thought it was a seperate sub that was just called the S class, not the S classes. Right?

[Rammstein0991]

Yeah, its the S-(number) but pretty much we just call it the S class

[Webster]

Oh I'm dumb. It's the S-18 and S-42? I was confused because since it was "the' S Class" It thought it was a seperate sub that was just called the S class, not the S classes. Right?

well it is just one "class" of sub, its more like the s18 is the first "plain" version being made and s42 is the second version made with a slight changes to it to make the design better but that's about it I think.

[TorpX]

Oh I'm dumb. It's the S-18 and S-42? I was confused because since it was "the' S Class" It thought it was a seperate sub that was just called the S class, not the S classes. Right?


Yeah, we pretty much stick to calling them 'S class'. Some sources will split hairs and refer to them differently, but in this game at least, there isn't that much of a difference. Don't confuse them with the Salmon/Sargo classes though, as those came along later.

[aanker]

Side note...
Another confusing class for some is the TAMBOR class also called the T-class, not to be confused with another T-class developed after WWI, however the Brits also had a class of submarine - yes, the T-class - Triton class that served in WWII.

The TAMBOR class is the only one represented in the stock game but I think someone made a Royal Navy T-class mod.

Happy Hunting!

[Rammstein0991]

Military designations can be so overly complicated sometimes.

[HerbertMcCheese-Wang]

Why on earth did Ubisoft put them in, and not, develop any Japanese subs!

[aanker]

Why on earth did Ubisoft put them in, and not, develop any Japanese subs!
That would be a funny statement if it wasn't so sad... If it wasn't for an outcry from the community there wouldn't have been a S-class Boat in SH4.... seriously!

The community complained about the absence of S-Boats and the three NARWHAL boats. Ubisoft added the S-class as an afterthought.

There is a wonderful NARWHAL added by Keltos and friends, I think it is available for a donation to Subsim, not sure, but it's here.

I thought modders built a couple playable Japanese boats(??).... there are target boats in the game.

Happy Hunting!

[TorpX]

Why on earth did Ubisoft ..., and not ... !

How many times have uttered such words?? Many times, I assure you!

I guess the answer is that Ubisoft decided there is more money to be made with "Assassin's Creed", than with Silent Hunter.

:/\\!!

[in_vino_vomitus]

I have to confess I'd always ducked the S class option when starting a game, but I've also been curious to read the comments by people who love them so. Also, since I have Websters S class mod I really ought to use it. Anyway, I started a TMO career in the Philippines, with an S class, and on my first mission, a resupply drop in Formosa, I heard a large group of ships to my Northeast. Assuming they were hostile and Southbound, I immediately surfaced and went to flank speed, thinking to get into an attack position ahead of them. Smoke was duly spotted, and even a couple of masts, but that was as close as I got, plodding along at 13 kts as they raced south four or five miles to my front. So now I'm heading north again and I have another contact due West. I'm thinking that if it's a target it will be heading South and I won't be able to catch it, so I'm not even going to alter course for this one. I can see that playing with this boat is going to require some careful thought....

[Rammstein0991]

Thats the thing about the old piggy, you have to plan ahead since you wont really be outrunning ANYTHING you encounter.

[in_vino_vomitus]

Yes, there's that, but on the other hand, I'm looking forward to at least seeing some detonations following the torpedoes I do manage to fire. I guess we'll see...

[captgeo]

with as slow as the S class, is, I always start my career with them, they are great boats in shallow water, but if you get hit, most of the times you die.

I play hit and run with them, and I have heard of player's playing a whole career with them, I have never tried that.

[in_vino_vomitus]

I was agreeably surprised last night to get the opportunity to unload into the side of a Fuso BB. I submerged for a hydrophone check, picked up a convoy, another check twenty minutes later put them on pretty much a collision course. I submerged as soon as I saw them and they just steamed on past me. There were no escorts on my side of the convoy, which was making around ten knots. I calculated a straight fire solution and fired all four tubes for three detonations and one miss.

Long story short. The Fuso didn't sink. It picked up a twenty degree list - possibly a fourth hit might have done the trick. I went to flank and ran north for six minutes or so, but neglected to go silent gambling on a second shot on the BB - Gamble didn't pay off and I was detected about fifteen minutes later. Dived to 190 feet and fairly heavily depth charged - picked up 30% hull damage, but managed to evade.

All in all I'm not displeased with the boat or its armament. Better to hit the thing and damage it, than listen to duds bouncing off the armour plate, and all things being equal, she stood up well to the escorts. I must learn not to be so greedy next time - Especially in a flat calm....

[HerbertMcCheese-Wang]

That would be a funny statement if it wasn't so sad... If it wasn't for an outcry from the community there wouldn't have been a S-class Boat in SH4.... seriously!

Wow, way to go to influence the Devs like that; people power!

Anyway, I do like the S-Class, something about their WW1 looks just does it for me.

[Rammstein0991]

Well thats because they are sorta WWI boats, they were built in the 1920's and iirc they went without any sort of sustainability maintenance since the early 30's.

[Woxor]

Hey guys! I just recently decided I'd try RFB to experience something new, and since I have not done a single patrol in the S-class I thought it would be a smashing opportunity to do it now!

So, it's mid-June, 1942, and I'm heading back to Dutch Harbor after a quite succesful patrol in the sea of Okhotsk. 7 fishing boats (I was bored), 3 merchants and I'm about to unload my last two fish in another 6k freighter as I'm writing this. I'm very pleased with the S-class and RFB as well, so far. However, I'm surprised that I have not yet run into any kind of resistance. No warships, no air patrols, nothing. I guess it's normal considering the date and my patrol area, but am I being "unlucky"? I would really like to test my S-class in a depth charge situation (I'll most definitely regret saying that).

So, to sum it up, what are your experiences with this boat, and this particular patrol area (Sea of Okhotsk)? I'd love to hear about it!

Cheers, Melvin

Ps. I'm impressed by the underwater speed; 14kts at flank. That's impressive!

[les green01]

14 knots under water in a sugar boat something not right somewhere

[aanker]

14 kts on the (calm) surface Flank I'd believe, maybe 7 kts submerged, and no, the S-class won't withstand any ASW unless you're very lucky and they are dropping their DC's where you aren't.

After firing I try to move far away from where I attacked as fast as conditions permit, because going deep in a Sugar Boat isn't an option I like.

Anyway have fun and Happy Hunting!

CO S-39 (SS-144 :)