How will historian see USA today in 200 years from now?

[mapuc]

A friend asked this question about Denmark,
So I thought how would a historian see USA today, when he or she write about it about 200 years from now.

I know it is a widespread question. USA is so much more than just a country with a president and a senat a.s.o

Markus

[Catfish]

It was a time before we found ourselves being tracked, analyzed, profiled, and flagged in our daily lives to a degree we could scarcely imagine.

We were forced into an impossible struggle to conform to the letter of every rule, law, and guideline, lest we create ammunition for enemies in the government or elsewhere.

Our transgressions became permanent Scarlet Letters that followed us throughout our lives, visible to all and used by the government, landlords, employers, insurance companies and other powerful parties to increase their leverage over average people.

Americans were no longer able to engage in political protest or go about their daily lives without the constant awareness that they were - or could be - under surveillance.
They were forced to constantly ask of even the smallest action taken in public, like
"Will this make me look suspicious?
Will this hurt my chances for future employment?
Will this reduce my ability to get insurance?"

The exercise of free speech was chilled as Americans became conscious that their every word might be reported to the government by FBI or NSA infiltrators, suspicious fellow citizens or an Internet Service Provider.

This was before the revolution.

[Sailor Steve]

It's a question that cannot be answered today. On the one hand no one can say what people in the future will think. On the other hand future historians will only know what we today have written, which is always blinded by bias. We don't know what happened in ancient Rome, only what Romans had to say about it. The American Revolution is closer to home in both time and place. We know what people at that time wrote. We know what the next generation wrote, and the one after that. We can read the precise records concerning the outcomes of different battles and the outcome of the war itself. We can read the treaty that formally ended the war. We can read the writings of the time and get a pretty good idea of what happened, but there is no way they could know then what we would think of them now. What "we" think of them now is widely varied, because every history that is written is written by someone with an agenda. That agenda may be a serious attempt to get at the truth, but in fact the people who wrote about it then and the ones who write about it now all have their own biases.

We have widely varied opinions about what we see going on around us today. Current writers are all biased for or against any topic you can name. Mostly all we do here is complain about one side or the other's bias and agendas and try to slant things to suit our own bias. Any future writers will have to sort through everybody's writing today and try to pick which is closer to the truth, which will inevitably mean which is closer to their own opinion of what went on today. That means future writers will be trying to sort through today's opinions while looking at them through their own opinions.

Whatever anyone says to that question, it will be guesswork and nothing more.

[August]

Americans were no longer able to engage in political protest or go about their daily lives without the constant awareness that they were - or could be - under surveillance.
They were forced to constantly ask of even the smallest action taken in public, like
"Will this make me look suspicious?
Will this hurt my chances for future employment?
Will this reduce my ability to get insurance?"

My guess is that there will be no doubt about being under surveillance. It will be constant and unrelenting from conception to the grave. I also believe there will be no such thing as a "job" either as all work will be done by robots.

This was before the revolution.Not likely to happen either i'm afraid. Revolutions require secrecy to get going and flourish. That will just not be possible in the glare of constant surveillance.

[Buddahaid]

One vast difference in comparison to how we view 200 years ago today and what will be viewed 200 years from now is the shear amount of data to sift through.

[mapuc]

Thank you for your answer. I think Steve said perfectly.

Markus

[Armistead]

Oh, we'll evolve, probably lose world power for several decades, but no telling how we'll end up after several crisis, maybe better, maybe worse.

[Platapus]

200 years from now, only academics and unfortunate college students will be studying US in history. The average person in the year 2214 will have as much knowledge and interest as the average person in 2014 has over stuff that happened in the late 1700's and early 1800's.

Only the "big" things will be covered and big will be defined by the culture of 2214.

With the ever increasing amount of data (not necessarily information) that is and will be available to people, people won't have much time to ponder history. There will always be a sub group people with an interest in history. But for the people in 2214, what happened way back in 2014 will be ancient history.

They will only know the big stuff but, like many students of history, may not have a full appreciation of the contemporary context. Much of what happens around 2014 won't be understood by historians of 2214. As such, there will probably be a lot of jokes about 21st century Americans.

[TarJak]

As opposed to the ones going around these days? :O:

[Wolferz]

I won't be here, so no reason to speculate within the realm of the oracles.:)

[nikimcbee]

That's easy, they made a movie about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBvIweCIgwk

[Wolferz]

That's easy, they made a movie about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBvIweCIgwk

Stranger fiction has come true.
Reference: George Orwell...

[Tchocky]

Yeah I saw a few pigs chatting to each other the other day. Didn't think much of it but I suppose Orwell was right on the money there.

[August]

Orwell was wrong. No pig will ever be in charge of anything as long as bacon remains so tasty.

[Buddahaid]

Orwell was wrong. No pig will ever be in charge of anything as long as bacon remains so tasty.

LOL :haha:

[Stealhead]

Not likely to happen either i'm afraid. Revolutions require secrecy to get going and flourish. That will just not be possible in the glare of constant surveillance.


A revolution that remains secret will never last all successful revolutions worked out because they gained popular support of the people.Without popular support a revolution is nothing.Remaining hidden would deny a revolution its most vital asset.

Many revolutions have occurred to say that none will ever happen again in the future simply because of surveillance I disagree with.In the past strict control has caused revolutions and it will do so in the future.

When they read about this time they will probably wonder why we waited so long to rise up.

[Jimbuna]

Orwell was wrong. No pig will ever be in charge of anything as long as bacon remains so tasty.

LOL :)

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/6193/pigman.jpg

[Aktungbby]

Yeah I saw a few pigs chatting to each other the other day. Didn't think much of it but I suppose Orwell was right on the money there.

Orwell was wrong. No pig will ever be in charge of anything as long as bacon remains so tasty.

ANIMAL FARM: A Fairy Story- George "Donkey" Orwell 1945.... "All animals are equal but some animals(pigs) are more equal than others"- Napoleon( A Berkshire Pig) ..."life will go on as it always has gone on---badly" Benjamin, a wise donkey:nope: As with the seven animal commandments of the anti-communist novel: political dogma, reduced to malleable propaganda...

[Armistead]

I wonder what Subsim will look like in 200 years from now...

[Wolferz]

Historians will call it the beginning of the end.:-?

[mapuc]

It was a tough one i admit that.

No one will know.

In the danish version, people wrote, from their political standpoint, what they thought a historian would write about Denmark 200 years from now.

Markus

[Oberon]

Depends which way we slide really. If we're able to fix some of the problems we face, then we'll probably look on this era in a manner in which we look upon the Victorians. People will laugh at the fears of homosexuality, be confused at how big an issue it was, ponder just how people got on without a certain gadget that makes life really easy that exists in the future but doesn't now, and shake their heads at the consumption of non-renewable resources.

On the other hand, and sadly the more likely option, is that people will look at this as the last time of plenty, when fuel was still cheap enough for most people to buy, when there was a choice in food supplies, when the poor could still walk through the streets of the rich if they so wanted, when people had enough free time that they were able to ponder these questions instead of having to work constantly to provide food for their family. They may wish desperately for the current political system, having overthrown it and unwittingly sleepwalked into a military dictatorship.
They may compare it, those who have the knowledge to, to the last hurrahs of Rome before its decline and destruction.

Either way they will likely wonder why we cared so little for them.

[August]

If we don't get our population explosion under control 200 years from now will probably more closely resemble the dark ages than anything else.

7 billion and climbing.

[Oberon]

It depends, there is talk of 'Peak Child' and that the fast population growth that we are experiencing at the moment is starting to come to an end. Certainly in comparison to fifty years ago, the average number of children per family in the world has halved from 5 to 2.5 and fertility is trending downwards.

Hans Rosling does some good talks on the subject, worth a look at, not so long ago he did a piece for the BBCs website:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-24835822

So it's not all bad news, but it's what we do with it that could make bad news.

[KrazyDimondRX]

i believe, globally anyway, these times will be remembered for :
Terrorism. sure terrorism has being around for awhile under diffrent names etc. but i think 9/11 really redefined it. It was a game changer.

Also, these times will be remembered for digital technology. While not the birth of digital tech. it surely is "post pubesecent", where the understanding and use of it has/is growing exponentially. Remember that cell phone you had 10 years ago?

But like steve said, its all just speculaton really,
whats important now, maybe not so later on...

KDRX

[GoldenRivet]

How will historian see USA today in 200 years from now?

Its really hard to say whether or not USA Today (http://www.usatoday.com) will still be a news source in 200 years

[Hinrich Schwab]

As a historian, I can state with complete confidence that all conjecture is irrelevant. When one looks at the United States 200 years ago, there was no indication at all that the nation would become as powerful as it is today. 200 years ago, the United States was still in the middle of the extremely foolish War of 1812, which it would have most assuredly lost had it not been for the fact that Britain was distracted with Napoleon.

I also disagree vehemently with Sailor Steve's allegation that all historians are propagandists and liars. Unfortunately, his argument is not without some merit due to previous definitions of history throughout the ages. Likewise, with negative revisionists twisting things for their own personal and political benefit, American liberal academia warping things to their own bizarre form of social engineering and the British school of Historiography bringing the Whigs vs Tories argument into everything, it is very easy to mistake history as being all lies all the time. I have been fighting very hard over the past decade to try and establish a new objectivism to the subject to dispel the hostility towards history. It is very difficult to make progress when the general public hates your guts on principle while fighting the legitimately biased sources. If anyone wants to see a blatant example of bias, read the works of James Stokesbury. However, such bad apples are not indicative of the whole of historical academia.

All of the other posts I am seeing are simply expressions of fears over the current crises of our age. The loss of privacy, overpopulation and growing concerns of government oppression are obviously dominant. However, the same thing occurred during the 1950's during the McCarthy era and the infamous Red Scare. America survived it. I am concerned, but not worried.

The only thing that I can suppose is that the United States will still be around in 200 years. Any other suppositions would be pure fantasy.

[Catfish]

[...] I also disagree vehemently with Sailor Steve's allegation that all historians are propagandists and liars.


Maybe not the historians, but the people who wrote their stuff down and called it history. The 'history' and reasons for WW1, as it is still taught in school still is, basically, a lie.
But don't sweat it, i bet the archives will not be opened and all history will remain the same as it was.

[Ducimus]

I won't conjecture what history books will say about the US in the future, but I will conjecture that these are historic times in which we live. It's my belief that we are at the precipice of major precipice events that have yet to transpire. I will further conjecture that these series of events, within the era of study in future history books, will probably start with Sept 11, 2001.

[Mr Quatro]

Two hundred (200) years from now?

There will still be 800 years left, give or take a few years, of peace subtracted from the promised 1,000 years of peace in the Book of Revelations.

I suspect any historian of the USA would say, "Blame it on the Jews" :haha:

Just kidding ... well lets look back at what the USA and the world for that matter had for tools.

The year is 1814, right?

War between the states had not occurred yet
Slaves were in vogue
Horses and wagons were still being used to go west
Trains were the main transportation of goods and people
Sailing ships had to go around the Horn
No automobiles or trucks were available yet
People were farmers

http://www.historyorb.com/events/date/1814

March 27th
Battle at Horseshoe Bend: General Andrew Jackson defeats the Red Sticks, part of the Creek Indian tribe near Dadeville, Alabama

May 5th
British attack Ft Ontario, Oswego, NY

May 11th
Americans defeat British at Battle of Plattsburgh

July 3rd
Americans capture Fort Erie Canada

July 5th
Americans defeat British & Canadians at Chippewa, Ontario

July 18th
British capture Prairie du Chien (Wisc)

July25th
Battle of Niagara Falls (Lundy's Lane); Americans defeat British

July 25th
George Stephenson introduced the 1st steam locomotive (according to this USA didn't have trains yet)

September 11th
Battle of Lake Champlain, NY; American Navy defeats British

September 12th
Battle of North Point fought near Baltimore during War of 1812

September 14th
Francis Scott Key inspired to write "Star-Spangled Banner"

December 24th
Treaty of Ghent (end of US-Britain War of 1812) signed

December 27th
Destruction of schooner Carolina, the last of Commodore Daniel Patterson's make-shift fleet that fought a series of delaying actions that contributed to Andrew Jackson's victory at the Battle of New Orleans.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I think two hundred (200) years from now the USA will have learned how to vote by then and we will have a better society of politicians that are really for the people.

ACA will have saved many lives and people born in 2114 will still be alive in 2214 on life support of course lol

The food chain will have to improve or selective breeding will have already occurred.

The president will be Hispanic and the vice president will be oriental with 100 billion/trillion owed on the national debt to China or we could have a war over what we owe with the results of no more nuclear weapons being allowed in any country of the world with the new ISS safe guarding the USA from any quick launch by zapping the offending party with the new death ray that is only allowed to be in outer space.

Mars will have been colonized with children that have never even seen earth yet and may never see earth.

Bottom line: I like to think positive and that the good ole USA will be a better place ... remember it's up to your children's, children, children, to vote properly in a free society in order for their children to benefit from a better world. :know:

[Oberon]

July 25th
George Stephenson introduced the 1st steam locomotive (according to this USA didn't have trains yet)

Trevithick overlooked again. :wah: Stephenson may have built his first steam locomotive in 1814, but it wasn't the first, Trevithick beat him by a decade.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m52dnkOTGO1qf44ulo1_500.jpg

First US railroad opened in 1830 between Baltimore and a point on the Ohio river, at around the same time in the UK the first inter-city railway was opened between Liverpool and Manchester. :up:

[Sailor Steve]

Trevithick overlooked again. :wah: Stephenson may have built his first steam locomotive in 1814, but it wasn't the first, Trevithick beat him by a decade.
Nor the second nor the third. Stephenson's real fame came from building the first inter-city railway line, the Liverpool & Manchester, which opened in 1830.

[Jimbuna]

Nor the second nor the third. Stephenson's real fame came from building the first inter-city railway line, the Liverpool & Manchester, which opened in 1830.

He already stated that over 1 1/2 hours ago :O:

[STEED]

How will historian see USA today in 200 years from now?


As to date no one from the future has come back in time to tell us. I am forced to conclude the human race has come to the end or gone back to being cave men or apes.

[Sailor Steve]

He already stated that over 1 1/2 hours ago :O:
Where?

[Jimbuna]

Where?



First US railroad opened in 1830 between Baltimore and a point on the Ohio river, at around the same time in the UK the first inter-city railway was opened between Liverpool and Manchester. :up:

Right there :)

[August]

As to date no one from the future has come back in time to tell us. I am forced to conclude the human race has come to the end or gone back to being cave men or apes.


On the other hand if we had the power to go back into the past now would we go back and tell the cave men of ancient times how much better we have it today?

[Catfish]

On the other hand if we had the power to go back into the past now would we go back and tell the cave men of ancient times how much better we have it today?

While showing off we'd probably wonder why our marvelous iPhone gets no connection.
In the meantime the caveman would make fire, and kill a mammoth.
:03:

[Sailor Steve]

Right there :)
Quite vague. I gave specifics. :O:

[August]

While showing off we'd probably wonder why our marvelous iPhone gets no connection.
In the meantime the caveman would make fire, and kill a mammoth.
:03:


LOL, we're in the throes of Nomophobia and fail to notice the saber toothed cat creeping closer... :)

[Jimbuna]

LOL, we're in the throes of Nomophobia and fail to notice the saber toothed cat creeping closer... :)

MOM!! :o