Lost at Sea

[Harmsway!]

One of the mega mods for SH5 has a sub mod I enjoy a lot known as Real Navigation. It removes the sub indicator from the chart so you have to use some skills to get where your going. At anytime when the weather is clear you can call upon your navigator to blot a plot on the chart. I like this since I don't have to play everyone on crew or have a continuous dot showing where I'm at.

Now I'm playing the US side in a fleet sub with SH4. So I decided to remove the sub dot from the chart. Hey RSRD sent me up to the Aleutian Islands and I haven't seen a soul outside of my mangy crew for weeks. I'm bored.

Anyway with no sub indicator maneuvering around the islands is a challenge. I use dead reckoning to make my way. Once in a while I'll call on my navigator to mark where we are. I do this by using the waypoint marker. I no longer use way points since that defeats the purpose of self navigating. But I pretend that the waypoint is my navigator so I can find where to X and time stamp my current position then removing the waypoint.

Things went well until the storm hit. For days on end it didn't let up. The thing is I shouldn't use my pretend navigator under cloud cover. So I can only guess where I'm at. Using my skills I know I should be coming close to the next island but fog and rain keep it hidden until I'm right upon it.

Lost at sea. This is where you use everything at your disposal. I know I am no where close if there are no birds. Once I hear and spot birds land is out there somewhere. Usually withing five or ten miles. Then I start taken soundings. Between dead reckoning, my watch, birds, soundings and charts I find my way through the fog and rain.

Now if only another ship would show up on sonar.

[fireftr18]

I still get May-Ann.

[Armistead]

You can run a mod/program to do celestial navigation. It removes you sub and you have to use a program outside the game to navigate by the stars. It's fun, but time consuming.....

[Loganrocks7]

That actually sound like a lot of fun, although I don't typically like it when massive piles of cliffy dirt randomly appear out of no where in the fog and then I hear the loud sound of submarine being grounded. I'm not so good at the whole navigation thing unless I have a constant update of my location, but I will admit that just reading what you wrote is very interesting and I liked the idea of being lost at sea. Sounds kinda fun, at least getting unlost does anyways.

[TorpX]

Lost at sea. This is where you use everything at your disposal. I know I am no where close if there are no birds. Once I hear and spot birds land is out there somewhere.


That's a good idea there.

I used the Celestial Nav / no sub marker thing for a little while, but the effort to do the calculations and constant dead reckoning was too much work. When I was doing it, my SOP was to make frequent passes by islands and mountains, to supplement by fixes.

I'm sorta thinking about putting together a new method along this line.

[Harmsway!]

I suppose my method is to let my crew do the Celestial Nav a few times a day and not have it continuously marked on the chart. This way I'm setting my own way points without using the auto way point tool. I just have to mark the chart myself. I then use chart tools to plot my heading then actual turn my sub on that course keeping an eye on the compass. It adds a lot to the game even though I'm not going all out with a sextant.

Try charting your own position as well as the targets during a battle and see what a real skipper had to contend with. You find out real quick how much we take that sub marker for granted.

[Harmsway!]

1) Remove sub marker by editing these two dds files.

\data\Menu\Gui\Units\

UnitSub.dds
UnitSubL.dds

Make each file a blank by select all in dds editor and delete. Then save file.

2) Your sub will no longer be marked except when you zoom in for an attack. But you have to know where your sub is to do so. To get a nav fix simple place your mouse pointer on the chart and Ctr+left click. The chart will move to place the sub at pointer. You can then pencil X the spot or use a ruler to set the next way point.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/picture.php?albumid=833&pictureid=7110

3) In my case, pictured above, I marked it with the ruler and plotted a course for 100.

4) I usually take nav reading close to the hour and use the compass tool to time stamp. See how I match my hour to my watch.

5) Use nomograph on right hand of chart to determine distance/time travel with current speed.

6) Watch for thin water!

[JoeCorrado]

The ships navigators supplemented their DR (dead reckoning) position with the actual star and sun readings daily and expected the two methods to return positions that would be pretty close.

Closing land was not done with a "casual" attitude and never at all when visibility was limited and doubt of true location was present. Depth soundings were definitely an important tool here.

The value of determining exact "known" position by making a visual sighting of any land mark, cannot be over stated as errors in location would compound over time on the open ocean.

Sofu-Gan was a favorite land mark during submarine deployment across the Pacific into Japanese waters. I would certainly advise using it to set your known position and thereby eliminate any errors to your position that had accumulated during the initial crossing.

I, on the other hand have no problems leaving the navigation to the game- or to the professionals assigned that task... as most commanders did in real life. He had enough to worry about anyway. :cool:

[TorpX]

I, on the other hand have no problems leaving the navigation to the game- or to the professionals assigned that task... as most commanders did in real life. He had enough to worry about anyway. :cool:
I reluctantly came to the same place. I like the concept, and am willing to deal with a reasonable degree of navigational error, but having to do the actual computations, over and over again, was too much. After a few days of Celestial computations, and fussing over every course or speed change in between, I felt worn down and had little energy left for making an attack.

Harmsway!'s method eliminates most of the math chores, but also, many of the navigational errors. The game doesn't provide us with good options here.

[Harmsway!]

In a way my method does leave options. Since the waypoint tool is left intact, you can always chart your course and let the crew take it from there.

Even though the position "dot" marker is removed the zoomed in sub icon is always there for making an attack.

[TorpX]

Since the waypoint tool is left intact, you can always chart your course and let the crew take it from there.

What I mean is that, while you can easily obtain a position fix that way, it provides your exact position, when you should only know your estimated position.


Even though the position "dot" marker is removed the zoomed in sub icon is always there for making an attack.
Yes, I understand what you're saying there. When I was still playing SHCE, I was doing plots on paper, where I had to estimate how far my sub went since the last point. It was a real joy when I had to make a course change; estimating the subs turning circle was something I found to be very tricky. It would mess up the next point for sure, and generally require at least a couple more points to get good estimates afterwards. I can't see myself ever going back to a paper and pencil method again. I found it to be very laborious.

I thought someone came up with a way to eliminate both the large sub marker and the boat icon, so you would not be able to see the sub even zoomed in. He had a different system he used.

[Luno]

The ships navigators supplemented their DR (dead reckoning) position with the actual star and sun readings daily and expected the two methods to return positions that would be pretty close.

Closing land was not done with a "casual" attitude and never at all when visibility was limited and doubt of true location was present. Depth soundings were definitely an important tool here.

The value of determining exact "known" position by making a visual sighting of any land mark, cannot be over stated as errors in location would compound over time on the open ocean.

Sofu-Gan was a favorite land mark during submarine deployment across the Pacific into Japanese waters. I would certainly advise using it to set your known position and thereby eliminate any errors to your position that had accumulated during the initial crossing.

I, on the other hand have no problems leaving the navigation to the game- or to the professionals assigned that task... as most commanders did in real life. He had enough to worry about anyway. :cool:

Very useful, thanks!

Did RFB include Sofu-Gan, or is that a standalone?

[Harmsway!]

I have RFB and I can't find anything on Sofu-Gan being included. Looking through the data folder of the mod I see it added some icebergs. You can download Sofu-Gan from the downloads page as a standalone.

[Admiral Halsey]

There is also the Nav Map Makeover mod which not only added it but made the Nav map a whole lot better.

[JoeCorrado]

There is also the Nav Map Makeover mod which not only added it but made the Nav map a whole lot better.

/\ Yes sir! A mod which I cannot recommend enough. A fantastic piece of work. /\ :up:

[Harmsway!]

Thanks for the recommendation;

Nav Map Makeover mod (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=166264&highlight=)

I'm trying it out now.