Luftwaffe

[jreid666]

That damned Goering. Just as i launch eels at the nelson in the channel (sep 1940) those air jockeys turn up and ruin my convoy :/\\!!. http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae262/jreid666/Silent%20Hunter%203/luftwaffe_zps49afc24e.jpg (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/jreid666/media/Silent%20Hunter%203/luftwaffe_zps49afc24e.jpg.html)

They should just stick to flying there pretty planes around France and stopping the RAF bombing Berlin.

[Herr-Berbunch]

Aside from leaving port and having a couple of their birds follow me out I've never seen the Luftwaffe try to steal any of my targets, or even show up. Lazy gits.

[VONHARRIS]

Nice shot jreid666.

I have also lost a target to the Luftwaffe but it was a small merchant!

[sublynx]

Incredible picture :arrgh!:

[Hinrich Schwab]

Proof positive that Murphy's Law is not limited to the Allies. Then again, showing up when not wanted and not appearing when needed was one of Goering's more infamous traits.:doh:

[Dread Knot]

Too bad for the Kriegsmarine that they had no naval aviation of their own. All aircraft - coastal based and ship based - were under command of the Luftwaffe and flown by Luftwaffe officers, following the Göring's order that, "everything that flies belongs to me".

Who knows what devastating results could have been obtained on convoys by dedicated naval attack aircraft in concert with the U-Boats.

[Rammstein0991]

They sorta DID have that, iirc the Heinkel HE-111 was outfitted with torpedos in coastal torpedo bomber duty and was somewhat successful :hmmm:

[the dark knight]

They sorta DID have that, iirc the Heinkel HE-111 was outfitted with torpedos in coastal torpedo bomber duty and was somewhat successful :hmmm:

This is true, and the HE 111 could also carry the remote controlled anti-shipping missile that was in development at the end of the war. The FW 200 Condor also carried bombs and attacked shipping as well. Although after a few Condor's were shot down, that practice stopped (but they did sink 331,122 tonnes of shipping first). It was rare for luftwaffe to attack shipping, but it happened far more often than most people think.

For instance, July 4, 1942 an arctic convoy PQ17 was attacked by U-boats and HE 111's. The U-boats attacked and lured the escorts away and the HE 111H-6 (torpedo variant) and Ju 88 level bombers sank 23 merchants out of 33 that sailed from Ireland.

[Rammstein0991]

the Fritz-X yeah, I recall it

[Marcello]

Too bad for the Kriegsmarine that they had no naval aviation of their own. All aircraft - coastal based and ship based - were under command of the Luftwaffe and flown by Luftwaffe officers, following the Göring's order that, "everything that flies belongs to me".

Who knows what devastating results could have been obtained on convoys by dedicated naval attack aircraft in concert with the U-Boats.

The biggest issue was reconnaissance: some reasonable four engine bomber, built instead of the Condor and the He-177 and fitted with an adequate electronic suite would have been very helpful for finding convoys, something that submarines were relatively poorly suited for.
As it was it sometimes happened that it was the U-boats that had to locate targets for the Luftwaffe.
It is doubtful however that they could have produced and earmarked for such tasks enough airframes to make a really big difference.

[Dread Knot]

It is doubtful however that they could have produced and earmarked for such tasks enough airframes to make a really big difference.

True. Especially after Operation Barbarossa began and around the clock bombing of industry followed. The Luftwaffe found itself spread pretty thin by mid war. About 5% was devoted to coastal operations and it was never enough.

[aj906]

Too bad for the Kriegsmarine that they had no naval aviation of their own. All aircraft - coastal based and ship based - were under command of the Luftwaffe and flown by Luftwaffe officers, following the Göring's order that, "everything that flies belongs to me".

Who knows what devastating results could have been obtained on convoys by dedicated naval attack aircraft in concert with the U-Boats.


Actually, this is not quite true. Elements of the Küstenflieger, while poor in quality and numbers, remained under Kriegsmarine control well into the war. While individual Staffeln were handed over to Luftwaffe control throughout the war in the time frame this thread deals with, most units were still subordinate to ObdM. True, they were transferred to Luftwaffe control but only in a piecemeal fashion. There is a new book that deals with these units called - yep, you guessed it - Küstenflieger.

As for Luftwaffe encounters, I play with the option to have updates turned on so when I see a lone ship in the vicinity I assume that this is a Luftwaffe report. However - I turn this option off from 1943 onwards as the chance of getting useful info from that source is rather dubious. Also, any report beyond the western approaches I discard because no aircraft could that far out into the Atlantic, right? That is my sum total of Luftwaffe experience!

[Tupolev]

I use single map contacts in a similar manner. But outside possible Luftwaffe coverage, I treat them like a Radio Direction contact (the purpose of the RDF loop).

I don't get speed or course info from that, so I'll just plot a course in the direction of the contact and run it down. If I happen to gain a visual contact from it, great. If not, oh well. I feel like it keeps the amount of single ship sinkings under control.

Just a thought.

T

[the dark knight]

Actually, this is not quite true. Elements of the Küstenflieger, while poor in quality and numbers, remained under Kriegsmarine control well into the war. While individual Staffeln were handed over to Luftwaffe control throughout the war in the time frame this thread deals with, most units were still subordinate to ObdM. True, they were transferred to Luftwaffe control but only in a piecemeal fashion. There is a new book that deals with these units called - yep, you guessed it - Küstenflieger.

As for Luftwaffe encounters, I play with the option to have updates turned on so when I see a lone ship in the vicinity I assume that this is a Luftwaffe report. However - I turn this option off from 1943 onwards as the chance of getting useful info from that source is rather dubious. Also, any report beyond the western approaches I discard because no aircraft could that far out into the Atlantic, right? That is my sum total of Luftwaffe experience!

The only aircraft I know of that might is the Condor. It could fly Berlin to New York non stop. But I do not know how far west they flew as convoy spotters before having to fly back home.

[Marcello]

There are others possible sources though, such as the submarine own direction finding equipment. The loop antenna on the conning tower was there precisely for this reason.

[SnipersHunter]

How can you call in planes with gwx?

[aj906]

The only aircraft I know of that might is the Condor. It could fly Berlin to New York non stop. But I do not know how far west they flew as convoy spotters before having to fly back home.

44 degrees West. But that relied upon the aircraft taking off from Bordeaux and flying out over the Bay of Biscay and then north up to Trondheim. That was a single flight that was then returned a few days later. It was also something that really only happened in 1940/41.

As for Berlin - New York, really?! That is a long way, I never knew the aircraft could do that? That is fantastic!!! Might just get me to reassess my assumptions about contacts in the mid Atlantic a little bit

[Marcello]

As for Berlin - New York, really?! That is a long way, I never knew the aircraft could do that? That is fantastic!!! Might just get me to reassess my assumptions about contacts in the mid Atlantic a little bit

Not to cool your enthusiasm but that was a one way trip. Assuming a relistic combat load, an useful amount of time spent on station (who would run an air search by flying to the max range and then heading immediately back?), a crew that maybe was not the best of the best etc etc. performance would probably be less impressive.

[Jimbuna]

How can you call in planes with gwx?

You need to be within viewing distance of the target when you make your report....the game engine will then roll an imaginary dice taking into account the proximity and aircraft type at the nearest airfield and decide whether any assistance is given.

[SnipersHunter]

Okay i wikl try this :arrgh!:

[Jimbuna]

Another possible condition IIRC is for there to be at least three or more targets in sight.

[jreid666]

Hey folks,

Glad my pic caused some debate :). Learned a few things i didn't know about the Luftwaffe and kreigsmarine. The beauty of being on the best board on the net.

[fildaskirk]

First off, let me say Ahoy to all ya skippers, this is my first post in there

Now then, as I've just found, be extremely cautious when you see Luftwaffe, nevermind that you are on the same team.
Just sailing between Jutland peninsula and Norway, when I spotted Norweigean Small Merchant. Since the weather was good, I went flank with deck gun manned. Just as I was broadside with the merchant, some 20m close (minding their crisscrossing of course) I got an aircraft sighted. Since it was late Sept 1940, I was curious and it turned out to be two FW200s. Ok, no more attention on them. WRONG. They attacked the merchant without care that I was alongside it. Got a direct hit on my conning tower and went under in less than a minute.
At least it was a start of patrol, which is autosaved. Hope they at least got court-martialed.

[Onkel Neal]

Welcome to the Site, so glad new members join to be part of the community as well as download. You rock.:rock:

[sublynx]

I never realised I have to be aware of friendly fire as well :)

Welcome aboard!

[Jimbuna]

First off, let me say Ahoy to all ya skippers, this is my first post in there

Now then, as I've just found, be extremely cautious when you see Luftwaffe, nevermind that you are on the same team.
Just sailing between Jutland peninsula and Norway, when I spotted Norweigean Small Merchant. Since the weather was good, I went flank with deck gun manned. Just as I was broadside with the merchant, some 20m close (minding their crisscrossing of course) I got an aircraft sighted. Since it was late Sept 1940, I was curious and it turned out to be two FW200s. Ok, no more attention on them. WRONG. They attacked the merchant without care that I was alongside it. Got a direct hit on my conning tower and went under in less than a minute.
At least it was a start of patrol, which is autosaved. Hope they at least got court-martialed.

Welcome Aboard Kaleun :salute:

Never place yourself between one of your surface units and an enemy vessel....the AI will see through you and fire regardless...the same applies for land masses 'magic radar'.

[the dark knight]

Welcome Aboard Kaleun :salute:

Never place yourself between one of your surface units and an enemy vessel....the AI will see through you and fire regardless...the same applies for land masses 'magic radar'.

That is no lie! I tend to avoid the German surface units for that very reason. :cool:

[Rammstein0991]

To expand on the issue with fildaskirk (and satisfy my curiosity) what exactly would be done for his crew if they were damage by friendly fire, awards? apologies?, etc?

[Gustav Schiebert]

What's this thread? Luft... waffe?

Never heard of them. I suspect that if I ever met any of them they'd be like Lord Flashart in Blackadder. 5 mins work then three weeks off in French brothels.

"Where are our planes, Herr Goring? The British have hundreds of them! Fat pig!"

[sublynx]

Well the Luftwaffe might have their French Champagne etc. but when I'm smoking a cigar in summer sunshine off the Canaries while listening to Ilse Werner's latest hit:

http://ww2total.com/WW2/Weapons/Warships/Submarines/German/U-boats/images-Type-IX/U-Boote-Suedsee-px800.jpg

I think of the infantry in the Eastern Front:

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Observer/Pix/pictures/2009/9/4/1252079739928/Three-German-soldiers-cov-001.jpg

and am quite happy about the golden cage I'm commanding :D even if it would turn out to be an iron coffin in the end...

[desirableroasted]

Anything had to have been better than the Eastern Front.... whoa, Daddy.

[sublynx]

I thought I just said all that!:-?:hmph:

Just a pictorial confirmation of what you said :salute:

[Sailor Steve]

When quoting someone just to make a short comment, please don't repost all the pictures, especially when it's on the same page. It's a huge space-waster.

[Jimbuna]

Crossing the bar/line/equator

http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/5263/ogdd.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/845/ogdd.jpg/)

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/6946/qj3a.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/132/qj3a.jpg/)

[Rammstein0991]

I'm actually thankful for the Luftwaffe, occasionally.

I remember one time in the "med" when I got a hare up my aft tube and decided to raid Malta to sink some destroyers, I almost got caught but as I was starting to leave lo' and behold here comes a flight of flying pencils who managed to distract all the harbor guards and even though they were all shot down they bought me enough time to escape untouched. :har:

It was one of those times where I just had to come to the surface and sail away while playing "Heimkehr" from the Das Boot ost, :D

[Rammstein0991]

Regardless, if they are willing to take shots and die so that I may live, more power to them :haha: