View Full Version : Amend This (politics threads merged)
that are not looking for work http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-05/people-not-labor-force-soar-663000-90-million-labor-force-participation-rate-1979-le wow, no wonder there is 50 million on foodstamps, that means they don't make enough to eat, if they don't make enough for that, then they don't have enough for a place to live,,, some where I heard that there is 50,000 homeless in New York City,,,NEW YORK CITY !!!!!!!! While we are banning stuff why don't we ban homelessness,,,,you know what we tried that,,oooh people have the right to a home, remeber that,, so we pressured banks to give home loans to people that couldn't pay them back, and we see how well that went. And now we want to grant millions of illegal immigrants, ooooh the news won't use that wording now,, so I guess we call them icecream or undocumented democrats
Buddahaid
04-05-13, 06:30 PM
I see the Yubba blunderbuss still fires.
Platapus
04-05-13, 06:39 PM
Have to check what the phase of the moon is tonight
I see the Yubba blunderbuss still fires.
Randomly, at anything, but usually hitting nothing.
Randomly, at anything, but usually hitting nothing. OOOOooh contrare I seem to hit a nerve, every now and then, I got the yellow cards to prove it.
It's called fire for affect, I see the United Kingdoms debt is 90% of gdp, so are we shooting to be like the old country or are you shootin to be like the colonies.??? Well Cyprus went over like a turd in a punch bowl so who'ssss next ????????:haha: It's a shame these facts and figures will not be seen on any national network media,,so why are they censor-ing the news ????? What do they got to hide.????
Madox58
04-05-13, 07:03 PM
Let's play a Game, Shall we?
I'm gonna take that 90 Million number and go nuts on it!
:haha:
Only 50,000+- in NY?
:hmmm:
OK. I sent kill teams and they are gone.
Who else will reduce the number?
It's called fire for affect, I see the United Kingdoms debt is 90% of gdp, so are we shooting to be like the old country or are you shootin to be like the colonies.??? Well Cyprus went over like a turd in a punch bowl so who'ssss next ????????:haha:
90 % of debt-to-GDP ratio.
What does that mean? I have built a house which will be paid off in 40 years if I manage to live that long which would make my two daughters happy because they would own a debt-free house?
What is my dept-to-GDP ratio if I have to spend 40 years of my life to pay back my debts?
Does that mean that compared to government's finances I am broke and better kill myself now?
I am not good at maths and economics. Help me.
Madox58
04-05-13, 08:01 PM
You will own your home free and clear one day.
:up:
I just paid off my home after 15 years and it is a WONDERFUL feeling!
Father Goose
04-05-13, 10:20 PM
undocumented democrats
Best one I've heard all year!
em2nought
04-05-13, 11:50 PM
Best one I've heard all year!
Yeah, I like that one too! :D
Tribesman
04-06-13, 03:02 AM
It's a shame these facts and figures will not be seen on any national network media,,so why are they censor-ing the news ????? What do they got to hide.????
Yes dear:doh:
So this secret news which you can't find anywhere links to news articles it has taken them from and public documents the government has issued.
Stick to rantring about the secret planet Nibiru or FEMA death camps, you have more credibility in that field.:rotfl2:
OOOOooh contrare I seem to hit a nerve, every now and then, I got the yellow cards to prove it.
I thought you got your infractions for spamming equally nonsensical threads on the same subjects one after the other.
Spamming really you give me to much credit I barelly know what that is,, let alone do it. Well Tribes, if people don't have enough money to buy food they don't have enough money to have the internet like you and I, so they have to rely on free TV that broadcasts ABC, NBC, and CBS which are in bed with this administration,,to get their news,...So tell me what sweet nothings has this government whispered in your ear ?????? if you want to get all the news go see drudge report,,,Ridacule,, flag on the play must be I won, and wipe the droole from your chin you don't want to short out your keyboard
Buddahaid
04-06-13, 10:48 AM
You won the game only because you were the only one playing.
Tribesman
04-06-13, 11:06 AM
wipe the droole from your chin you don't want to short out your keyboard
Thank you for sharing your personal experience, but I think you will find most people don't have your problem.
AndyJWest
04-06-13, 12:08 PM
why are they censor-ing the news ????? What do they got to hide.????
Judging by this thread, an appalling level of illiteracy.
Yubba you're not alone.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/02/americans-obama-anti-christ-conspiracy-theories
Markus
:hmmm:
http://troll.me/images/ancient-aliens-guy/united-states-of-america.jpg
mookiemookie
04-06-13, 03:32 PM
It makes perfect sense that yubba would be a Zerohedge reader.
u crank
04-06-13, 03:44 PM
Yubba you're not alone.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/02/americans-obama-anti-christ-conspiracy-theories
Markus
:har:
only 7% of Americans in the survey believed the moon landing was faked, 14% believed in Bigfoot and 4% accepted that "shape-shifting alien reptilian people control our world by taking on human form".
I have always been suspicious of those shape-shifting alien reptiles.:yep:
http://shechive.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/032.gif?w=353&h=199
Madox58
04-06-13, 07:24 PM
I just want to know if any of this is true?
:hmmm:
1. The Lincoln Memorial is really made out of solid gold painted white. Should the deficit hit $400 trillion dollars then it will be melted down to pay off debts.
2. Should the Supreme Court ever become deadlocked, perhaps by a 4-4 vote with one justice abstaining, then the President can take down the Great Seal of the White House, which is four feet in diameter, and flip it while the vice president calls heads or tails to decide the case.
3. The missing 8 minutes on the Watergate tapes reveals then President Nixon talking about what to do with aliens being held at a secret military base in Iowa.
4. There is a secret deal between the United States and Canada where participants in the witness protection program, and certain celebrities gone bad such as Lindsay Lohan, can live anonymously in Quebec as long as they promise to speak French.
5. Hidden inside the Hoover Dam is the nation's secret stockpile of Spam, which is stored at -236 degrees, which would be used only in the event of World War 3.
6. Secret documents show that for the past two decades, British royalty such as Prince Charles and Queen Elizabeth, have been held in secret at Gitmo while clones of them perform their official duties.
7. Photographs of a mysterious device discovered on the Moon during the 1970's Apollo program have been re-analyzed lately, and scientists are shocked to discover that it appears to be a fourth generation iPhone.
8. A summary of underwater video footage taken by a navy submarine of the BP oil leak reveals that the bottom of the ocean is inhabited by "Mer-people" and King Triton. Apparently, they worship oil rigs floating in the Gulf of Mexico, and believe that the oil leak is a sign that one of their gods has become hurt.
9. White House documents reveal that due to Bill Clinton's drinking habit, Hillary Clinton had to serve as the De Facto President of the United States for a total of 102 days during his two terms in office.
10. Contrary to popular opinion, America does have a royal family which secretly influences politics behind the scenes. Furthermore, should Congress or the White House ever come to a constitutional impasse the American monarchy, either through the king or queen, could take control of the country. Currently, it is rumored that the monarch in exile is the comedian Julia Louise Dreyfus, who starred as "Elaine" on Seinfeld.
Buddahaid
04-06-13, 07:34 PM
I just want to know if any of this is true?
:hmmm:
1. The Lincoln Memorial is really made out of solid gold painted white. Should the deficit hit $400 trillion dollars then it will be melted down to pay off debts.
2. Should the Supreme Court ever become deadlocked, perhaps by a 4-4 vote with one justice abstaining, then the President can take down the Great Seal of the White House, which is four feet in diameter, and flip it while the vice president calls heads or tails to decide the case.
3. The missing 8 minutes on the Watergate tapes reveals then President Nixon talking about what to do with aliens being held at a secret military base in Iowa.
4. There is a secret deal between the United States and Canada where participants in the witness protection program, and certain celebrities gone bad such as Lindsay Lohan, can live anonymously in Quebec as long as a promise to speak French.
5. Hidden inside the Hoover Dam is the nation's secret stockpile of Spam, which is stored at -236 degrees, which would be used only in the event of World War 3.
6. Secret documents show that for the past two decades, British royalty such as Prince Charles and Queen Elizabeth's have been held in secret at Gitmo while clones of them perform their official duties.
7. Photographs of a mysterious device discovered on the Moon during the 1970s Apollo program has been reanalyzed lately, and scientists are shocked to discover that it appears to be a fourth generation iPhone.
8. A summary of underwater video footage taken by a navy submarine of the BP oil leak reveals that the bottom of the ocean is inhabited by "Mer-people" and King Triton. Apparently, they worship oil rigs floating in the Gulf of Mexico, and believe that the oil leak is a sign that one of their gods has become hurt.
9. White House documents reveal that due to Bill Clinton's drinking habit, Hillary Clinton had to serve as the De Facto President of the United States for a total of 102 days during his two terms in office.
10. Contrary to popular opinion, America does have a royal family which secretly influence is politics behind the scenes. Furthermore, should Congress or the White House has ever come to a constitutional impasse the American monarchy, either through the king or queen, could take control of the country. Currently, it is rumored that the monarch in exile is the comedian Julia Louise Dreyfus, who starred as "Elaine" on Seinfeld.
Yes, all of it. It's all speld out as part of the "Unified Conspiracy Theory" that Yubba will publish in the next issue of "Scientific Merican".
Jimbuna
04-07-13, 11:42 AM
No 6 certainly looks believable :hmmm:
Sailor Steve
04-07-13, 03:06 PM
No 6 certainly looks believable :hmmm:
Well, any follower of Doctor Who knows that the entire family are alien werewolves anyway. :p2:
Jimbuna
04-07-13, 03:18 PM
Well, any follower of Doctor Who knows that the entire family are alien werewolves anyway. :p2:
http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/1014/animatedwerewolf.gif
Apparently in world banking and finance. http://www.wnd.com/2013/04/biden-calls-for-new-world-order/
I'll ask our freinds again,, from the other side of the pond what they called it, that happened in Cyprus, the last answer was that it didn't apply in a gun thread, it can apply here, I won't tell anybody. Me I call it theft. Since we were having so much fun calling stuff what, it isn't, like terrorist are really freedom fighters take note that I didn't say islamist oops.
And just the other day at the gun shop I, said " I wonder who is going to say something stupid to make another run on guns".
Probably not only will there be a run on guns but a run on the banks too.
Madox58
04-07-13, 07:30 PM
HORRAY!!
Another fun thread!!!
:rock:
(In first!:D)
Red October1984
04-07-13, 07:33 PM
Damn. I have to settle for second.
Joe Biden is just that worthless piece of crap that was attached to the Obama Campaign. I seriously don't think anyone likes Joe Biden.
AndyJWest
04-07-13, 07:45 PM
Old news. Heard it before: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byxeOG_pZ1o
donna52522
04-07-13, 07:51 PM
Who's Joe Biden anyways?
Is he the guy that got first choice at Hillary's V.P. job?
In before guns!
EDIT: Wait...*re-readings OP* DAMN! :nope::/\\!!
Errr...in before Obama?
In before FEMA death camps? :hmmm:
TLAM Strike
04-07-13, 08:06 PM
I really don't see anyone making another NWO since Hollywood Hulk Hogan is getting to old for the ring... :O:
In before guns!
EDIT: Wait...*re-readings OP* DAMN! :nope::/\\!!
Errr...in before Obama?
In before FEMA death camps? :hmmm:
Me too I always get that mixed up time for bath and another flight in Il-2 in the hyperlobby I'm around battlefield 1 or skies of valor servers look me up
Cybermat47
04-07-13, 09:03 PM
I'm Jesse Ventura, and this is Conspiracy Theory.
That explains so much!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beK7sHSlXK4
Buddahaid
04-07-13, 09:26 PM
It's a Yubba nation! No disrespect intended however you might work your logic, but you are the Dr. Smith of SubSim. Your not my favorite character but you keep the plot line moving. :woot:
Me too I always get that mixed up time for bath and another flight in Il-2 in the hyperlobby I'm around battlefield 1 or skies of valor servers look me up
You fly vanilla or HSFX? If vanilla you should give HSFX a try, adds a whole load of new aircraft, new cockpits, new theatres. It's definitely worth a shot. :yep:
I really must rewire up hyperlobby, been ages since I used the thing last. :doh:
Tribesman
04-08-13, 02:41 AM
BUT WHAT,, ABOUT THE SECRET REPTIL,,LIAN CHEMT,,RAILS!!!!???
Wolferz
04-08-13, 07:16 AM
BUT WHAT,, ABOUT THE SECRET REPTIL,,LIAN CHEMT,,RAILS!!!!???
Shhh Nobody is supposed to know about the terraforming. Lizards like it hot and they're impatient. People have been way too slow in warming the planet for them.:03:
Red October1984
04-08-13, 07:20 AM
VIVA LA CAPS LOCK
gimpy117
04-08-13, 08:27 AM
now the trolls have 1801 posts...:shifty:
My friends I beg you do not mock of make fun of Yubba's believes.
I should have written this in his other thread, when I posted the link telling him his not alone.
Even I think that most of his believes, mostly conspiracy stuff are so hilarious I can't get the breath of all the laughing, but I DO NOT mock him.
We do all have our believes
about 80-90 % of the world population do believe in a certain conspiracy(Some say it ain't a conspiracy, some say it is) I'm talking about believing in (a) God/s
Do not hang me upon that, I can't say if it is or not. If it is...
Markus
now the trolls have 1801 posts...:shifty:
Naw you look like you have upwards of 3000. :yep:
gimpy117
04-08-13, 08:55 AM
Naw you look like you have upwards of 3000. :yep:
3,220 actually...
3,220 actually...
And they all said you'd never amount to anything. :)
frau kaleun
04-08-13, 10:54 AM
Complain all you like but I for one am really looking forward to seeing New World Order back in the headlines again.
They always were my favorite boy band.
What a wonderful world it would beeeeeeeeeee, I could just amagine a whole world out of work with these chuckle heads, :har::har::har::har::har::har::har::har::har::har: masterminds they are,, spend more money than we make,,those darn loopholes,,I ain't got a spending problem,,shoot two shots in the air,,ooooh let's pass it so we can see what's in it, tax the rich, let's call islamic terrorist freedom fighters, let's suspend our children from school for nibbling a poptart into the shape of a gun or march them around in a half time show with hammers and sickles celebrating communism, let's stomp on a piece of paper with Jesus's name on it, or better yet let's boo him. And even better yet there are people who believe that your kids don't belong to you,, don't take my word for it, ask her>>>>>brought to you by the progressive left https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s480x480/543991_464171740331729_416017023_n.png (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=464171740331729&set=a.362561847159386.84375.361783440570560&type=1&relevant_count=1&ref=nf)sickening
soopaman2
04-08-13, 08:33 PM
Not the first time!!:woot::woot:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc7i0wCFf8g
Won't be the last either...
Not until, "We the People" manage to figure out how to take back our government from multinational corporations, without having to fight tanks and air strikes like the Syrians.
Aramike
04-08-13, 11:31 PM
Maybe I'm missing something, but Holy Ad-Hominem Attacks, Batman!
Buddahaid
04-09-13, 12:36 AM
Maybe I'm missing something, but Holy Ad-Hominem Attacks, Batman!
I don't think it is and I think he knows it's in fun. He even joins in and new words have been created. :arrgh!:
It's not a personal attack to say you think someones ideas are balogna. I'm sure he thinks mine are as much and more so. Nobodies getting mad and talkin' about yo' mamma.
Aramike
04-10-13, 03:58 AM
I don't think it is and I think he knows it's in fun. He even joins in and new words have been created. :arrgh!:
It's not a personal attack to say you think someones ideas are balogna. I'm sure he thinks mine are as much and more so. Nobodies getting mad and talkin' about yo' mamma.Ad hominem responses are aimed at the source of an argument, and not the argument itself. All that aside, this thread is devoid of legitimate discussion about the topic in favor of attacking the source.
It's a case in point, actually.
mookiemookie
04-10-13, 06:28 AM
Because yubba has shown and proven and even admitted that he's not interested in legitimate discussion. You're wasting your time here.
Tribesman
04-10-13, 09:47 AM
Ad hominem responses are aimed at the source of an argument, and not the argument itself.
What arguement?
This week, maybe tomorrow they are going to bring provisions up for debate and vote on the senate floor {14 republican senators are threating to fillilibuster} on the second amendment that means change or amending and I believe is in clear violation of article V of the constitution http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_Five_of_the_United_States_Constitution I believe their right by calling this democratic tyranny, got do this quickly before someone finds out what's going on like the gun confiscation that is going on in New York State right now...
GoldenRivet
04-10-13, 10:34 PM
I agree, the people have the right to bear arms, the purpose of this 2nd amendment is clear. and i shall not be giving mine up
Red October1984
04-10-13, 10:51 PM
I agree, the people have the right to bear arms, the purpose of this 2nd amendment is clear. and i shall not be giving mine up
+1
This is the reason we have the 2nd Amendment. To protect ourselves against an opressive government.
I will not give mine up.
You have the right to bear arm(s)
But it doesn't say wich kind of arm(s) it is.
So Obama could easy say that from now you are only allowed to bear a hammer as your personal weapon.
Markus
You have the right to bear arm(s)
But it doesn't say wich kind of arm(s) it is.
So Obama could easy say that from now you are only allowed to bear a hammer as your personal weapon.
Markus
The first Amendment says, amongst other things, that we have the right to free speech. Now by your logic Obama could easily say that free speech is limited to non political topics. After all it doesn't say what kind of speech is free right?
Wolferz
04-11-13, 08:02 AM
We also have the right to peaceful assembly which is anything but peaceful when the jackbooted thugs wade into a crowd wearing their riot gear where there is no riot.
Feuer Frei!
04-11-13, 08:06 AM
We also have the right to peaceful assembly
Depends on how you define peaceful assembly.
I doubt very much a riot squad would make a bee-line through a crowd of Daffodil Day Organisers, who are ever-so-peacefully telling onlookers to buy Daffodil merchandise.
The first Amendment says, amongst other things, that we have the right to free speech. Now by your logic Obama could easily say that free speech is limited to non political topics. After all it doesn't say what kind of speech is free right?
He could. However it's not the first Amendment that's on the table it's the 2nd amendment that is the big issue here.
And from what I have learned from it. is that the 2nd amendment gives every American the right to bear arms. BUT it doesn't say wich kind it is and how many(Arms is plural so it most be more than 1)
Markus
Kptlt. Neuerburg
04-11-13, 01:05 PM
Heller v. District of Columbia, Civil Action No. 08-1289 (RMU), No. 23., 25 On March 26, 2010, the D.C. Circuit denied the follow up appeal of Dick Heller who requested the court to overturn the new District of Columbia gun control ordinances newly enacted after the 2008 Heller ruling. The court refused to do so, stating that the firearms registration procedures; the prohibition on assault weapons; and the prohibition on large capacity ammunition feeding devices were found to not violate the Second Amendment.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2nd_Amendment_USA
Its interesting how in the US the population seems to always contradict itself, we throw a person in prison because of a crime, we let them out on "good behavior", and yet certain persons are apposed to making it more difficult for said criminal to get a weapon so they can commit further crimes and how members of a "certain political party" complains that we can or can't enforce the rules and laws concerning firearms when a "certain organization" has told that "certain political party" to defund the departments and/or organizations tasked with enforcing said rules and laws concerning firearms. Also could someone please explain to me how any of the gun control measures that have been brought up in the past few months, A) Have anything what-so-ever to do with changing any part the Constitution of the United States and/or it violates Article V of the Constitution. B) How exactly do these gun controlling measures violate the 2nd Amendment of the Constitution when the courts have ruled otherwise? C) When has any person who has and/or currently supports gun control measures has said "The government is going to take away your guns!", or has said anything similar?
Just some food for thought, though I doubt it will change anyone's mind on what they believe on this particular subject.
He could. However it's not the first Amendment that's on the table it's the 2nd amendment that is the big issue here.
Every constitutional right is jeopardized when you start redefining one of them. I could easily see a lawyer in some future courtroom using successful infringements upon the 2nd as a justification for infringements on the 1st or any other one.
You have to understand why the Bill of Rights was enacted and why there was resistance to the whole idea of quantifying them.
Ducimus
04-11-13, 01:12 PM
http://images.sodahead.com/profiles/0/0/2/0/1/4/2/4/9/4-boxes-95813812740.png
Every constitutional right is jeopardized when you start redefining one of them. I could easily see a lawyer in some future courtroom using successful infringements upon the ND as a justification for infringements on the 1st or any other one.
You have to understand why the Bill of Rights was enacted and why there was resistance to the whole idea of quantifying them.
Let me first make something clear, so you don't misunderstand me.
This arms, weapons problem is an all American domestics issue
And it's not my intention to get involved into this
And it is not my intention to "scrabble" the word in your 2nd Amendment
From my knowledge about this issue, there are two major point in this 2nd Amendment
1. Doesn't say what kind of weapon it have to be
2. It says that every American has the right to defend he/her self. And an assault weapon is not a weapon to defend, but use to..mainly... assault.
If the writer of 2nd Amendment could see USA today, do you think, they would have written it in a different way?
I hope that you government will come up with a solution that's a win win for both side.
Markus
Stealhead
04-11-13, 02:28 PM
http://images.sodahead.com/profiles/0/0/2/0/1/4/2/4/9/4-boxes-95813812740.png
This true in every nation of course the fairness and availability of each option varies.
Let me first make something clear, so you don't misunderstand me.
This arms, weapons problem is an all American domestics issue
And it's not my intention to get involved into this
And it is not my intention to "scrabble" the word in your 2nd Amendment
Understood and please let me make clear that if I use the word "you" in the context that I did:
when you start redefining one of them...I did not mean you personally.
From my knowledge about this issue, there are two major point in this 2nd Amendment
1. Doesn't say what kind of weapon it have to be
2. It says that every American has the right to defend he/her self. And an assault weapon is not a weapon to defend, but use to..mainly... assault.A couple notes about that:
1. No it doesn't specify the specific type of weapon although "arms" has always meant the arms and equipment which would be useful to the militia. I would submit that one would be hard pressed to find a firearm more suited to that particular role than an AR-15.
2. "Assault weapon" as used in American gun debates is a politically made up name having no real definition. Guns on the AW ban list are functionally the same as ones that are not. The only real identifiable difference seems to be that an assault weapon looks scarier than other firearms. This is on purpose IMO because once this banned list is passed into law just about any weapon can be added to it without futher legislation.
If the writer of 2nd Amendment could see USA today, do you think, they would have written it in a different way? Fair question. Yes, I believe they would have significantly strengthened the language to prevent the kind of infringements that we're seeing today, not only regarding the 2A but the others as well.
Like Ducimus points out you can't look at the gun debate as a stand alone issue. In the past 20 years or so in particular all civil liberties have been significantly limited by a national government that has grown huge and increasingly oppressive.
I hope that you government will come up with a solution that's a win win for both side.
MarkusThank you for your sentiment and I would share your hope except that I know the anti-gun side will never be satisfied with an AW or magazine ban. It would just become the new starting point for further restrictions and infringements until the RKBA is totally eliminated and/or it causes the country to fragment into warring states. Some say (not me) that we're at this point already.
Bilge_Rat
04-11-13, 03:19 PM
In Canada, we had a centralized national gun registration until last year, have background checks, have firearm acquisition permits, limits on magazines (5 rounds max.), prohibited weapons (mainly fully auto weapons), you may buy AR-15s, but it is a restricted weapon (so limits on how it is transported and where it may be used).
However, this baby is fully legal and I was thinking of buying one a few years back:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruger_Mini-14
I have 8 firearms, 6 functioning: bolt-action .303, Winchester rifle, 2 shot guns, 2 .22 semi auto rifles; The government has not tried to take any away.
And this is in socialist, liberal, nanny state Canada, where most people do not own firearms.
How anyone could view the current mild senate weapons bill as an attack on the constitutional right of americans to carry machine guns is beyond me. :ping:
Ducimus
04-11-13, 03:37 PM
In Canada, we had a centralized national gun registration until last year,
Which was ceased, because, as i heard it - it was too costly and it didn't really work.
How anyone could view the current mild senate weapons bill as an attack on the constitutional right of americans to carry machine guns is beyond me. :ping:
Do you even know what a machine gun is?
Understood and please let me make clear that if I use the word "you" in the context that I did:
...I did not mean you personally.
A couple notes about that:
1. No it doesn't specify the specific type of weapon although "arms" has always meant the arms and equipment which would be useful to the militia. I would submit that one would be hard pressed to find a firearm more suited to that particular role than an AR-15.
2. "Assault weapon" as used in American gun debates is a politically made up name having no real definition. Guns on the AW ban list are functionally the same as ones that are not. The only real identifiable difference seems to be that an assault weapon looks scarier than other firearms. This is on purpose IMO because once this banned list is passed into law just about any weapon can be added to it without futher legislation.
Fair question. Yes, I believe they would have significantly strengthened the language to prevent the kind of infringements that we're seeing today, not only regarding the 2A but the others as well.
Like Ducimus points out you can't look at the gun debate as a stand alone issue. In the past 20 years or so in particular all civil liberties have been significantly limited by a national government that has grown huge and increasingly oppressive.
Thank you for your sentiment and I would share your hope except that I know the anti-gun side will never be satisfied with an AW or magazine ban. It would just become the new starting point for further restrictions and infringements until the RKBA is totally eliminated and/or it causes the country to fragment into warring states. Some say (not me) that we're at this point already.
Thank you for the lesson August. I wasn't that deep into the 2nd Amendment. My statement came from what I have heard and seen on our danish and swedish tv-channel.
If I understand you right, you are one of them who fight for the right to bear arms. But even you must somehow be tired of hearing about all those masskilling, that seems to happens almost 1-2 days per week.
I do understand that a ban of some kind would not prevent those killings, ´cause it's not the weapon that kill, it's the person behind it.
By reading some of yours posting and others I can say this:
I'm glad I'm not the president of USA.
Markus
Ducimus
04-11-13, 04:13 PM
In my opinion, the subject of the second amendment, and gun legislation, as it exists today, right now, is a very deep running, and complex issue. While it may sound simple to those across the Atlantic ocean, i would assure you it is far from simple. It's a mix of factors ranging from social/cultural, historical, and political. I think it also highlights the division and polarization between Americans today.
One other thought I maintain, is that Osama Bin Ladin did far more damage to our country then what occurred in 911. The longer running "fallout" of that day, is much greater then what he must had hoped for.
EDIT:
If I understand you right, you are one of them who fight for the right to bear arms. But even you must somehow be tired of hearing about all those masskilling, that seems to happens almost 1-2 days per week.
Mass shootings really don't happen "1 to 2 days" per week. You can probably still count the number of mass shootings in the last 10 years on one hand. Every time they occur however, the media is on it, milking it for all its worth. Which i think is one reason (of many) on why they occur.
I happen to agree with the view expressed in this video:
MrColionNoir: How to Stop MASS SHOOTINGS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hR3t7j2tUec)
edit: Above linked video is in a way, related to your topic of people taking responsibility for their own life.
Thank you for the lesson August. I wasn't that deep into the 2nd Amendment. My statement came from what I have heard and seen on our danish and swedish tv-channel.
If I understand you right, you are one of them who fight for the right to bear arms. But even you must somehow be tired of hearing about all those masskilling, that seems to happens almost 1-2 days per week.
I do understand that a ban of some kind would not prevent those killings, ´cause it's not the weapon that kill, it's the person behind it.
By reading some of yours posting and others I can say this:
I'm glad I'm not the president of USA.
Markus
I heard an interesting observation today on NPR radio as I was driving home. A fellow gun owner noted that a majority of the impetus for the gun control movement, these mass killings and other gun violence, both criminal and accidental, could be prevented if we gun owners would just practice what we preach and keep our guns secured or under our direct control at all times when they are not.
Bilge_Rat
04-11-13, 05:25 PM
Which was ceased, because, as i heard it - it was too costly and it didn't really work.
That is debatable and depends what political party you listen too. The Conservatives wanted to get rid of it more for ideological reasons. Once it had been setup, the costs of running it were actually quite minimal, $8-10 million a year as I recall.
It was actually very easy to do. I inherited all the firearms and registered them all over the phone in 1 hour. They just keep track of the serial numbers.
All Canadian police forces wanted to keep it.
Ducimus
04-11-13, 05:44 PM
The problem with that in the US is that, registration does indeed lead to confiscation as has been proven several times. Most recently in New York. I don't know how you canuck's feel about your government, but the general consensus with ours is it can't be trusted.
Mass shootings really don't happen "1 to 2 days" per week. You can probably still count the number of mass shootings in the last 10 years on one hand.
Only if one of your hands have 29 fingers: http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-data
7 in 2012 alone. Agreed not one every 1 to 2 days, but certainly more than a handful.
Ducimus
04-11-13, 07:07 PM
Meh. I knew when i said that, somebody would look it up and say otherwise. The thing is, not all shootings make the news. So the rest you don't really hear about. Sadly, the only thing that makes the news around here, is when it serves a political agenda somehow.
There is no such thing as unbiased news reporting. Over the last 4 months I've been looking at CNN and Foxnews with a critical eye on what they report, when they report it, their choice of words, and what they focus on. They are polar opposite's, and It's rather sickening.
For example If a shooting occured that was stopped by a Concealed carry permit holder, it will make news on Fox. It will not make news on CNN. If said shooting couldn't be used as an advocacy for gun rights, then CNN will be all over it. A recent stabbing in texas, was proclaimed as a "mass stabbing" on fox news, but was downplayed on CNN because it played into the pro gun crowd's arguments.
Glad to be that somebody. :) No doubt the media serves its master and each outlet's master will drive the news agenda.
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s480x480/44825_466338080115095_1452610128_n.jpgturncoats
Cybermat47
04-11-13, 08:47 PM
turncoats
No, just people doing what they think is right.
Buddahaid
04-11-13, 08:50 PM
I notice that too. When the two police officers were shot in Santa Cruz recently, the first reports made no mention of what they were shot with and just a brief mention in followup. I do believe if the gun had been of the evil black ilk it would have been elaborated on from the start.
Tribesman
04-12-13, 01:44 AM
The problem with that in the US is that, registration does indeed lead to confiscation as has been proven several times. Most recently in New York
By proven you mean the story about the wrong person getting a letter about mental health problems and the story of the child that was caught at school planning an armed violent crime.
The thing is, not all shootings make the news. So the rest you don't really hear about.
The thing is, not all shootings make the national news, because they are just so common they are simply not national news.
But if you go to State news or local news you will find the shootings news on a daily basis.
Ducimus
04-12-13, 08:51 AM
Speaking of amendments.....
The government wants your gun rights
By Rand Paul, Special to CNN (http://us.cnn.com/2013/04/10/opinion/paul-gun-control)
(I am amazed this was found on CNN)
(CNN) -- Congress is debating legislation that will limit Americans' right to keep and bear arms and infringe on the right to privacy. The Bill of Rights was made part of our Constitution explicitly to protect freedoms: the freedom of speech, protection against searches without a warrant, the right to trial by jury and the right to protect oneself with a firearm.
I am compelled to stand up for every amendment and right enumerated in the Constitution.
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is attempting to push forward with gun control legislation. The chief problem I have is that nothing in this legislation would have prevented the terrible massacre in Newtown, Connecticut. I am open to ideas that would help prevent tragedies, but this legislation would not have saved us from the national heartbreak of the December school shooting.
I oppose legislation that undermines Americans' constitutional right to bear arms. I worry that legislation mandating more regulations on law-abiding citizens will lead to an infringement on the ability to exercise constitutional rights without being subject to government surveillance. I also worry that these efforts will merely disarm the people who follow the law and empower those who ignore it.
Along with Sens. Mike Lee of Utah and Ted Cruz of Texas, I circulated a letter promising to "oppose any legislation that would infringe on the American people's constitutional right to bear arms, or on their ability to exercise this right without being subjected to government surveillance." We have been joined by Sens. Marco Rubio, Jim Inhofe, Jerry Moran, Richard Burr, Ron Johnson, Mike Enzi, James Risch, Mike Crapo, Dan Coats and Pat Roberts. But more senators need to stand up for our Second Amendment rights or the rights will be lost.
Both the left-leaning American Civil Liberties Union and the right-leaning Heritage Foundation have raised privacy concerns about the legislation pending before Congress.
Chris Calabrese of the ACLU was quoted recently saying that he worries about submitted gun control legislation that may lead to the "creation of government databases and collections of personal information on all of us."
David Addington of the Heritage Foundation worries that "loose language" in the submitted legislation may lead to the government keeping "centralized records of who received what guns and where." These are privacy concerns that I share.
Potentially on the table are new laws that would outlaw firearms and magazines that hold more than 10 rounds as well as require universal background checks, which effectively restrict the right of law-abiding citizens to buy guns at gun shows and give or sell them to friends and family without having to get the government's permission. One version of the legislation pending before the Senate goes so far as to empower the attorney general to tax gun transactions and creates a new felony crime for knowingly failing to report for more than 24 hours that a gun has been lost or stolen.
Legislation being pushed by Sen. Dianne Feinstein of California arbitrarily bans certain weapons. President Barack Obama has conceded that this idea may not pass during a comprehensive gun debate, yet I worry that the idea may come up again once Congress passes the first round of gun control.
Americans exercise their right every day to protect themselves and their families.
Recently, a 14-year-old Phoenix boy shot an armed intruder who broke into his home while he was baby-sitting his three younger siblings. The children were home alone on a Saturday afternoon when an unrecognized woman rang their doorbell.
After the teenager refused to open the door, he heard someone trying to break into the house. The boy hurried his younger siblings upstairs and collected a handgun from his parents' room. When the boy rounded the top of the stairs, a man was standing in the doorway with a gun pointed at him. The boy shot the intruder and possibly saved the lives of his three siblings.
It is terrible that a young boy had to go through this experience, but it is just one example among many of armed citizens protecting themselves and the public from very bad people.
I stood up for the Fourth and Fifth amendments during a filibuster a few weeks ago to address the president's constitutional authority to use drones against American citizens and the limits of executive power.
Now I am prepared to protect the Second Amendment "right of the people to keep and bear arms." I stand ready to stand up for the Sixth Amendment right to a trial by jury, as I will stand up for any other infringement of our Bill of Rights.
Our rights are not subjected to polls. Whether it is popular or not popular, I took an oath to the Constitution, and I am prepared to stand with other senators or alone to protect the freedoms that our Founding Fathers fought to preserve.
Tribesman
04-12-13, 09:25 AM
I am amazed this was found on CNN
Is that because you have been reading so much Alex Jones and Glenn Beck that you started to believe their media conspiracies?
AVGWarhawk
04-12-13, 09:32 AM
Is that because you have been reading so much Alex Jones and Glenn Beck that you started to believe their media conspiracies?
CNN(affectionately known as the Clinton News Network) usually do not air dissertations like this. Chris Matthews of MSNBC, now that is shivers up my leg. :o
mookiemookie
04-12-13, 09:48 AM
CNN(affectionately known as the Clinton News Network) usually do not air dissertations like this.
CNN? The network where Tucker Carlson and Glenn Beck got their start? What CNN are you watching?
AVGWarhawk
04-12-13, 10:02 AM
CNN? The network where Tucker Carlson and Glenn Beck got their start? What CNN are you watching?
Not the CNN with Tucker Carlson or Glenn Beck. What's the difference? They are no longer there. It is of little consequence these two got their start at CNN.
Tribesman
04-12-13, 10:08 AM
CNN(affectionately known as the Clinton News Network) usually do not air dissertations like this.
Really?
Yet their current edition has pro, anti and neutral commentators on the issue and some of those writers from each camp are regular commentators on CNN.
AVGWarhawk
04-12-13, 10:13 AM
Really?
Yet their current edition has pro, anti and neutral commentators on the issue and some of those writers from each camp are regular commentators on CNN.
Having pro, anti and neutral commentators are highly unusual, but something relatively new(past few years). Specifically when news outfits(you know, the fair and balanced ones) are not so fair and balanced as claimed in the past. MSNBC Morning Joe has both sides of the isle at the opinion desk. Only recently have I noticed the news media(CNN, FOX, MSNBC) hosting pro, anti and neutral commentators. It is about time.
Bilge_Rat
04-12-13, 10:40 AM
interesting article in the Washington Post theorizing that the divide over gun control is no longer Republican-Democrat, but Urban-rural:
Pennsylvania, Georgia and Virginia have long been bastions of gun-rights supporters, with vast rural areas and strong hunting traditions. But in recent days, lawmakers from those states have demonstrated a new willingness to back stricter firearms regulations, setting the stage for what could be the first major gun-control legislation to pass Congress in two decades.
The shift underscores a new reality of gun politics in America: The rapid growth of suburbs in historically gun-friendly states is forcing politicians to cater to the more centrist and pragmatic views of voters in subdivisions and cul-de-sacs as well as to constituents in shrinking rural hamlets where gun ownership is more of a way of life.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/growth-of-suburbs-in-pro-gun-states-changing-the-political-calculus-in-congress/2013/04/11/e2ba79b6-a2bf-11e2-9c03-6952ff305f35_story.html?hpid=z2
interestingly, you saw the same thing in Canada in the debate to abolish the long-gun registry.
Ducimus
04-12-13, 11:20 AM
Regarding CNN vs Foxnews.
My suggestion is to watch both of them, closely. I think you'll find if you watch them long enough, you'll find the bias evident, and really bad. I used to think that CNN was the least bias and more fair and middle of the road then other news sources. I also, used to NEVER watch foxnews.
Over the last couple months, my opinion has changed drastically. They are both, quite frankly.... crap, and equally so. What they choose to report, their choice of words, what makes the "front page", what they focus on, even how certain select pieces are presented, are all very telling.
As an aside, I try and stay away from Glen Beck, and anything coming from Infowars. Their just "shock jocks".
interesting article in the Washington Post theorizing that the divide over gun control is no longer Republican-Democrat, but Urban-rural:
It's a culture war really. Which is why i think things like gun laws are best left to the state and local levels. What's good for California, is not good for Utah and vice versa. Gun Laws, isn't one of those things that should be laid upon the countries populace with a singular wide brush. Regardless, I don't think any level of government has the right or edict to dictate what they think our constitutional rights are. The constitution is the supreme law in the land, higher then congress or the white house, and is not to be trifled with.
Tribesman
04-12-13, 11:47 AM
As an aside, I try and stay away from Glen Beck, and anything coming from Infowars. Their just "shock jocks".
Fair point, but when you link to an article that contains as sources
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013...during-recess/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01/16/its-ridiculous-three-6-year-olds-suspended-for-making-gun-signs-with-hands-during-recess/)
http://www.infowars.com/arizona-stud...-screen-saver/ (http://www.infowars.com/arizona-student-suspended-for-having-gun-screen-saver/)
http://www.prisonplanet.com/elementa...paper-gun.html (http://www.prisonplanet.com/elementary-school-girl-threatened-with-arrest-over-paper-gun.html)
http://www.prisonplanet.com/five-yea...-lego-gun.html
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2012...mbles-weapons/
It is bound to raise some eyebrows.
AVGWarhawk
04-12-13, 11:54 AM
FOX, MSNBC, CNN are more opinion news. I think all host hard news about 2 hours out of the day.
Ducimus
04-12-13, 12:03 PM
Here's one example of what I'm talking about.
As of right now, here's what's on the front page of
CNN (http://www.ducimus.net/temp/cnn.jpg) and Foxnews (http://www.ducimus.net/temp/foxnews.jpg)
What i note is,
- What is making the front page?
- Of what is on the front page, where is the main focus?
- What is the context of what is being presented?
- What choice of words are they using on their presentation?
- Accessibility of sub articles. In other words, where are they directing your attention?
- What is present on one, but not on the other?
There's a whole slew of things to note here. There are times where the bias is less obvious on one then the other. Right now, the bias on the surface, is more evident on CNN then on foxnews. Dig deep into both, and you'll find a deeply imbedded progressive agenda on CNN and conservative agenda on fox news.
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