The victim is guilty

[Skybird]

http://www.thefrisky.com/2013-04-09/rehtaeh-parsons-17-committed-suicide-after-photo-of-her-rape-was-distributed-around-school/

Teenager or not - when I was at that age, I already had a well-developed sense for what is right and what is wrong. I do not know what leaves me more speechless: the photo being circulated, or the offendings and verbal attacks she was exposed to afterwards.

It makes me sick and enraged to read stories like this. I do not wish to stay calm and civilised over such stories. Because our many laws serve lawyers, and protect offenders far too much. Offenders get away with no or too little penalty, over "social concerns" and endless understanding for how very much they are the victims of circumstances themselves, and all the reasons why they are not responsible. But the real victims of crime all too often are left behind.

I have had quite some experiences with courts in my life. One was positive, five were negative. One lie was exposed as being a lie, and the liar sentenced. But five offenders escaped with funny jokes of penalties, or not penalties at all. In their wake, they left four victims dead, their deaths unatoned. 800,000 Euros in total value was stolen by cheating and betrayal, ruining my parents practically, and eroding my finances to threatening levels as well in supporting their court battle. And I almost got punished for having defended my life, once, against unprovoked assault-to-kill. "Justice system"? Maybe when I'm stoned, then I may believe it, then it may appear as a luminiscent cloud in my imagination, drifting slowly through my viewing field. But when I'm sober, the saying that all in all the system serves justice, not in every case, but all in all, I no longer buy, since years. I spit on this "legal" system. It is hopelessly perverted.

[Buddahaid]

I know how you feel but there is only one side of the story in that article.

[u crank]

I listened to a phone interview on CBC Maritime Noon today with this girls mother. Sad. I was upset. Sometimes there is no justice.

http://www.cbc.ca/video/news/audioplayer.html?clipid=2374479671

[Nippelspanner]

Oh dear, sometimes I hate people...

Poor girl, I hope her family is strong enough to go through this and, someday, find a way back into a somewhat normal life... :-?

[Feuer Frei!]

Simply tragic.
Suicidal people indicate one thing to me: crying out for help.
To others it indicates other things. I used to think that suicidal persons were selfish, in the fact that they take their own life, leaving behind their loved ones to grieve for them. 'Taking the easy way out', when there are no other ways out of a miserable, depressing and unsupportive life.
This case certainly is the opposite. Calling out for help, not being able to deal with what life is offering.

A question i have though is this: after reading the article, it states that the girl admitted herself after entertaining suicidal thoughts.
that was in March. I would think that alarm bells would be ringing loud and clear at this stage for her family and friends. Once a person is entertaining or attempting suicide, even more care needs to be taken to watch and observe and to monitor her condition continuously.
Once a person has decided that suicide is the only way out, there needs to be clear and decisive action taken.
I know that if my daughter took it upon herself to consider suicide or self-admit to a hospital after thinking about suicide, then i would do whatever it takes to monitor the situation around the clock.

I'm not sitting back here and judging the parents, i don't think that's my job nor appropriate in this thread, but, this is a tragic case and i think lessons can and need to be learnt from this.
Other parents who are in a similar predicament, please take note!

[Karle94]

She was raped and bullied. You don´t need to hear the other side of the story. If I am to witness a rape then I would take the raper and beat him within an inch of his life, hoping he would never recover from his injuries. Afterwards, I could say I am proud of doing so.

[Feuer Frei!]

You don´t need to hear the other side of the story. Unfortunately the law is such that you do. Whether you or i agree with the law is another matter entirely.If I am to witness a rape then I would take the raper and beat him within an inch of his life, hoping he would never recover from his injuries.All 4 of them? A noble gesture, i don't think anyone would argue with you, least not me, however taking the law into your own hands will have consequences, moreso if you yourself are a father, husband etc.

[Mork_417]

Sad, very sad indeed. :down:


A question though... What was a 15 year old doing at a party drinking vodka? :hmmm:

[AVGWarhawk]

I know how you feel but there is only one side of the story in that article.


There is only one story....a person has taken their life. End of story.

[Skybird]

Simply tragic.
Suicidal people indicate one thing to me: crying out for help.
Probably a majorty of suicide events is what psychiatrists and psychologists call "appellativer Selbstmord". But psychologists tend to think all suicides are just calls for help, and that is wrong. Sometimes, it is a decision for death, and as such: a decision meant for real.

And who am I and who are we to judge and argue with somebody making that decision? We have no right at all to sentence people to life that for a reason valid to them they do not want anymore. We just should make sure that it indeed is not just a call for help, and his/her reasons are not just a temporary mood that comes and goes occasionally. How to achieve that? Can only be something done by closest friends and family. To catch failing suicide candidates and put them into psychiatry until they have convinced a doctor that now they want to live, like it is done in Germany, to me is not the right way.

In case of this girl, it obviously was a collapse of defenses against a social environment mocking about her victimhood and turning against her instead of giving her support. That is what makes it so tragic, and enraging.

[Feuer Frei!]

How to achieve that? Can only be something done by closest friends and family. To catch failing suicide candidates and put them into psychiatry until they have convinced a doctor that now they want to live, like it is done in Germany, to me is not the right way.
In case of this girl, it obviously was a collapse of defenses against a social environment mocking about her victimhood and turning against her instead of giving her support. That is what makes it so tragic, and enraging.

Indeed, and as my previous post asked, where was her support base? Her pillars of strength?
Alarm bells were tolling loud enough for everyone to hear. The signs were there, victimization, bullying, harrassment, both of a sexual nature and also of a physical nature. Hell, they moved away, the self-admitting to a hospital.
Surely the outward signs were there: depression, reclusive, uncertain, introvert behaviour, who knows what else.
Maybe the alarm bells were faulty.
I just cannot fathom that her support base was, not necessarily oblivious to het state of despair, but not at the very least monitoring, supporting with constant supervision.

[Skybird]

She was raped and bullied. You don´t need to hear the other side of the story. If I am to witness a rape then I would take the raper and beat him within an inch of his life, hoping he would never recover from his injuries. Afterwards, I could say I am proud of doing so.
And you would pay for the thugs for the rest of your life. Such are the laws at least over here. One must not like it, but that is how it is.

However, in Saudi-Arabia a 24 year old is to be artifically paralysed because as a 14 year old he hit a buddy and broke his spine. An eye for an eye - this is the result.

What I do niot like is that even where an offender needs to pay penalties, all too often it is the state picking up the penalties to pay. What financial interest has the state in this? None. The offender should pay for his victim, and where it is possible, he should also give full compensation. where an additional prison penalty is given, he should work in prison also to pay for the costs of his food and lodging. It is a scandal that the public that gets protected from the offender by locking him away, nevertheless takes damage be having to pay for him. Sentenced criminals should work for their food and clothing. If they do not comply, do not make a big issue of it - let them starve themselves to death if that is what they want.

In an ideal world, the girl here would have to be heard on the penalty she imagines for those who raped her. The four would be sentenced also to later work in their lives and pay her a yearly compensation that covers all costs for therapy and other consequences of the rape, plus some additional "penalty fee". The false friends mocking her and turning away, would be sued for mobbing and character assassination, and also need to pay a one-time compensation to the girl. Whether the raping boys would additionally serve prison time or would undergo a corporal public punishement I would decide on grounds of what the girl says on that option.

In an ideal world. [sigh]

[raymond6751]

I know how you feel but there is only one side of the story in that article.

Wrong is wrong. When this type of thing happens (the bullying ) the guilty have NO 'side' or rights. I hope that each one of them seriously considers suicide also.

[August]

Wrong is wrong. When this type of thing happens (the bullying ) the guilty have NO 'side' or rights. I hope that each one of them seriously considers suicide also.

Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Guilt has not been determined and the defendants have and should have all the rights they are entitled to have.

[Jimbuna]

A terribly tragic story...I hope her family and loved ones can come to terms with it all :nope:

[AVGWarhawk]

In an ideal world, the girl here would have to be heard on the penalty she imagines for those who raped her. The four would be sentenced also to later work in their lives and pay her a yearly compensation that covers all costs for therapy and other consequences of the rape, plus some additional "penalty fee". The false friends mocking her and turning away, would be sued for mobbing and character assassination, and also need to pay a one-time compensation to the girl. Whether the raping boys would additionally serve prison time or would undergo a corporal public punishement I would decide on grounds of what the girl says on that option.

In an ideal world. [sigh]

Those involved from the beginning, bullied and participated in the ultimate demise of this young lady will have that on their conscience for the rest of their lives. It provides some solace. These young kids my not think about it now but later in life...this will haunt them.

[Feuer Frei!]

this will haunt them.
One can only hope.

[frau kaleun]

One can only hope.

Agreed. Sadly I think there are some people who can do stuff like that and never feel a shred of conscious remorse over it.

[AVGWarhawk]

Agreed. Sadly I think there are some people who can do stuff like that and never feel a shred of conscious remorse over it.

Yes, those that are less than human. These type do exist. Most find themselves in trouble with the law at some point in their lives. People like this spurn programs such as NCI, Criminal Minds and the like.

[Wolferz]

Here where I live the incarcerated DO pay for their room and board, either while incarcerated or after release. Do the crime, serve the time but no free ride. That's the way it should be.

Also in this neighborhood suicidal thoughts are treated very seriously. If the individual doesn't voluntarily seek help they can be forced into treatment by filling out a 302 form at any local hospital. Once the county official signs off on the form it is taken to the nearest LEO to be enacted.
The wife and I were forced to do this with her son. I'm still not sure if he was actually contemplating ending himself or was just terrorizing his mother with claims to do so for whatever twisted reason.
He spent a whole day mimicking slashing his wrists with a guitar pick to the point of creating closed cuts across both wrists. He wasn't happy when the officer arrived and he discovered that he wasn't going to get what he really wanted, which is still a mystery to us. Instead he got ten days in a psyche ward for his trouble and nearly wore out his welcome in our home. It was the threat of putting him in the street to fend for himself after the hospital stay that finally snapped him out of what was eating at him.

This young lady succeeded where she shouldn't have and somebody definitely dropped the ball. As for the circumstances that lead to this tragedy I won't comment on because you can't confirm or deny actions you didn't witness.
Hindsight solves nothing but can be a preventative endeavor in the future.

[Tribesman]

Women who go out and get drunk then get raped must undertand that they are responsible for their actions and it is they who have put themselves in that situation....Sorry to bring up the opinions the OP has previously stated on this forum regarding this subject but it strikes me as highly hypocritical.
If I recall correctly it also covers women who walk into a bar wearing a "sexy" dress:down:

[AVGWarhawk]

Women who go out and get drunk then get raped must undertand that they are responsible for their actions and it is they who have put themselves in that situation....Sorry to bring up the opinions the OP has previously stated on this forum regarding this subject but it strikes me as highly hypocritical.
If I recall correctly it also covers women who walk into a bar wearing a "sexy" dress:down:


I don't follow. Woman gets drunk. Her fault. She is fair game for whatever then?

Or, this was the OP opinion in another thread?

[Tribesman]

Or, this was the OP opinion in another thread?
Indeed, that was the opinion he has previously stated on the matter.

[AVGWarhawk]

Odd outlook on the situation if so. Was something missed in translation?

[Buddahaid]

Don't get me wrong it's a tragic story, if true and if the whole story. So far that is all it is and a lot of you are letting your emotions fill in all the gaps that have no factual basis.

I do not agree with Tribesman over her being fair game for getting drunk in the first place but none of us were there, none of us have seen the photo, none of us have interviewed the witnesses, and therefore none of us can make any valid judgement.

[Platapus]

A politically incorrect observation not necessarily associated with this thread's topic

It is interesting that if a women gets drunk, has sexual activity and later objects, the law presumes that if she had sexual activity, she is not responsible (did not give consent) due to impairment (being drunk) and therefore is not responsible. i.e. she was raped.

But at the same time, if a man gets drunk, and has sexual activity, but the woman objects afterward, the law presumes that if he had sex, that he IS responsible and his impairment (being drunk) is not valid and he is therefore accountable. i.e. he is a rapist.

So if two people get drunk and have sex, excusing accountability due to impairment of judgement (being drunk) only applies to the woman and not the man.

That's a little one sided.

Rape, like other violent crimes, is a horrible thing and no victim ever deserves it. But when alcohol (or drugs) becomes involved, the rules seem to change and not change equally.

In the eyes of the law, a drunk woman does not give consent but a drunk man does. :timeout:

I don't know what the answer is, or should be other than people should not get drunk (that's pretty realistic).

[AVGWarhawk]

Don't get me wrong it's a tragic story, if true and if the whole story. So far that is all it is and a lot of you are letting your emotions fill in all the gaps that have no factual basis.

What gaps sir? This is not the first or last we will see a young person taking their life over demeaning photos posted on the internet and bullying. It is the same story every time. We have see both sides in similar instances. We are not missing any side of the story here. How many stories of humiliated kids who commit suicide do we need to read to ascertain this story is not different?

I do not agree with Tribesman over her being fair game for getting drunk in the first place but none of us were there, none of us have seen the photo, none of us have interviewed the witnesses, and therefore none of us can make any valid judgement.

That is not Tribeman's thoughts on the issue.

[Safe-Keeper]

I know how you feel but there is only one side of the story in that article. Every time rape and SA in general is the topic at least one answer always begin with "but":shifty:, usually continuing with an attempt to derail the discussion into how rape is the victim's fault/responsibility. I see this thread has both already.

As another poster pointed out, though, I don't know what looking at this from "both sides" would achieve. Sure there's always a deeper layer of circumstances and human psyche and anecdotes, but a girl was raped, and then had her photo spread, and then committed suicide.

This is tragic and disgusting. Whatever the "other side" might be, it's guaranteed not to be sufficient to mitigate anything. It's like asking for the "other side" of a story about a suicide bomber blowing up a school bus full of elementary school children.

Women who go out and get drunk then get raped must undertand that they are responsible for their actions and it is they who have put themselves in that situation....Sorry to bring up the opinions the OP has previously stated on this forum regarding this subject but it strikes me as highly hypocritical.Does this apply to everyone who is drunk, or just women who are raped? If I see you in a bar drunk, am I allowed to beat you up, pickpocket you or wreck your car?

If I recall correctly it also covers women who walk into a bar wearing a "sexy" dress:down:Fail, both on a moral and factual (http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/776945.html) basis. Go sit in the naughty corner until you're sorry:down:.

[Buddahaid]

Every time rape and SA in general is the topic at least one answer always begin with "but":shifty:.

As another poster pointed out, though, I don't know what looking at this from "both sides" would achieve. Sure there's always a deeper layer of circumstances and human psyche and anecdotes, but a girl was raped, and then had her photo spread, and then committed suicide.

This is tragic and disgusting. Whatever the "other side" might be, it's guaranteed not to be sufficient to mitigate anything. It's like asking for the "other side" of a story about a suicide bomber blowing up a school bus full of elementary school children.

You accept that she was raped with no evidence as if that is a given. Is it? Then prove it the authorities couldn't.

[AVGWarhawk]

You accept that she was raped with no evidence as if that is a given. Is it? Then prove it the authorities couldn't.

, a photograph of Rehtaeh being raped was taken during the night and circulated around Cole Harbour District High School three days later.

Anything else? :hmmm:

[Platapus]

You accept that she was raped with no evidence as if that is a given. Is it? Then prove it the authorities couldn't.


That is one of the horrible aspects of rape -- often there is no evidence.

A man and a women meet. They engage in sexual activity. Was it lust or rape?

The physical evidence may be identical (especially when many rapes do not involve violence but the threat of violence).

What is the difference between lust and rape? Consent. Lust involves consent and rape does not (at least not on the part of both partners).

How do you prove no consent other than asking both parties? What if they disagree?

Unfortunately, a lot of rape cases are a "he said, she said" case and those are hard to judge fairly... unless there is bias.

[Buddahaid]

Anything else? :hmmm:


Have you seen it and does it prove rape? Apparently not. Anything else?

[AVGWarhawk]

That is one of the horrible aspects of rape -- often there is no evidence.

A man and a women meet. They engage in sexual activity. Was it lust or rape?

The physical evidence may be identical (especially when many rapes do not involve violence but the threat of violence).

What is the difference between lust and rape? Consent. Lust involves consent and rape does not (at least not on the part of both partners).

How do you prove no consent other than asking both parties? What if they disagree?

Unfortunately, a lot of rape cases are a "he said, she said" case and those are hard to judge fairly... unless there is bias.

In this instance the article states the photo's show the act being perpetrated. But I agree, many cases are a slipper slope "he said, she said." More often these days we are finding the activity on video or pictured. Then posted for the world to see.

[AVGWarhawk]

Have you seen it and does it prove rape? Apparently not. Anything else?

I do not need to see it. That is up to our judicial system. The article states pictures of the act were posted. The act and aftermath were enough for a person to take their life. In your minds eye there is more to the story? :hmmm:

[Buddahaid]

Of course as the article is only one persons tragic story. It is even likely true however it's still just part of the whole picture. And no you don't need to see it, but you do to say it proves rape. The authorities deemed it was not conclusive enough to press charges. Don't think I'm unsympathetic, I'm being pragmatic for the sake of argument.

[AVGWarhawk]

Of course as the article is only one persons tragic story. It is even likely true however it's still just part of the whole picture. And no you don't need to see it, but you do to say it proves rape. The authorities deemed it was not conclusive enough to press charges. Don't think I'm unsympathetic, I'm being pragmatic for the sake of argument.

I understand Buddahaid. :up: :)

[Safe-Keeper]

You accept that she was raped with no evidence as if that is a given. Is it? Then prove it the authorities couldn't. I'm not a police investigator. It's not for me to say. Either way, authorities have a much higher treshold for declaring rapes have happened, simply because they

a. don't want to jail innocent people, or
b. don't do their jobs right.

Seems in this case, it could be a bit of both:
Leah Parsons is now criticizing police for how they handled the investigation, accusing them of not interviewing the four boys who were involved in the rape of her daughter until “much, much later.”

[Buddahaid]

Does she have proof or is that her emotional story? There is a lot of story here and very few facts to discuss. One of which is the rape getting reported very late as well.

[AVGWarhawk]

Does she have proof

The article states there are pictures of the act that were posted.

[Skybird]

I discovered the story in German news first, and when searching an English link found many German blogs and news sources reporting it. The German news was more frank in describing what happened, and more explicit on the reaction by her "friends" when they started to mob her. I did not find equivalent English sources to that.

For the time being, lets take the article the way it has been written, instead of assuming what alternatively happened. Lets take the rape as a rape and the mobbing as a mobbing.

[Tribesman]

Does this apply to everyone who is drunk, or just women who are raped? If I see you in a bar drunk, am I allowed to beat you up, pickpocket you or wreck your car?


Ask someone who has expressed those views which I mentioned.

Fail, both on a moral and factual (http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/776945.html) basis. Go sit in the naughty corner until you're sorry:down:
Read what was written.
If you want to put someone in the naughty corner for those obnoxious views then do it to the person who held them.

[Skybird]

Indeed, and as my previous post asked, where was her support base? Her pillars of strength?
Alarm bells were tolling loud enough for everyone to hear. The signs were there, victimization, bullying, harrassment, both of a sexual nature and also of a physical nature. Hell, they moved away, the self-admitting to a hospital.
Surely the outward signs were there: depression, reclusive, uncertain, introvert behaviour, who knows what else.
Maybe the alarm bells were faulty.
I just cannot fathom that her support base was, not necessarily oblivious to het state of despair, but not at the very least monitoring, supporting with constant supervision.
Depressions are extremely malicious, like an anaconda growing inside you and strangling you from within, slowly, silently. And even beyond that, not everybody can bear everything forever. While supporters not necessarily always can save everybody. Sometimes too much is just too much. Everybody has his/her breaking point.

[u crank]

Apparently the public outrage has caused Nova Scotia's Justice Minister Ross Landry to look further into the case. It's a little late. I doubt if anything will come of it now, but I hope something will get done.

My opinion. One of these boys has a parent who has friends in high places. It happens.:nope:

The girls funeral is on Saturday.

[NeonSamurai]

Some of you may already know this. I have been working in a locked adolescent inpatient (psychiatric) unit at a hospital for the past several months. Many of the kids I work with are actively suicidal, or have tried to kill themselves. I actually have a patient right now who's story is not too different to the girl in this article.

I thought I might address a few of the posts from a professional standpoint. Before I do I want to say this... If there is someone you know, who you think might be suicidal, the best thing you can do is ask them directly and bluntly about it. "Are you thinking about killing yourself?" If they answer yes, tell them you are going to get them help, and dial 911.

Simply tragic.
Suicidal people indicate one thing to me: crying out for help.
To others it indicates other things. I used to think that suicidal persons were selfish, in the fact that they take their own life, leaving behind their loved ones to grieve for them. 'Taking the easy way out', when there are no other ways out of a miserable, depressing and unsupportive life.
This case certainly is the opposite. Calling out for help, not being able to deal with what life is offering.

That is true and untrue. Indirectly it is a call for help, but directly it isn't really. Most of the time they want to die because they either can't take their situation any more and want an escape, or their clinical depression has gotten too severe to manage, or they are psychotic and there is some command hallucination or paranoia directing them to kill themselves.

The causes are diverse, from trauma and bad situations,to neurotransmitter deficiencies in the brain or genetics, or some combination of the above (the most frequent of the two). The are often ambivalent towards living or dying, and a depressed person is highly egocentric, and frequently have a flattened range of emotion where nothing matters any more, and they feel nothing but numbness (many intentionally self harm just to feel something... anything).

A question i have though is this: after reading the article, it states that the girl admitted herself after entertaining suicidal thoughts.
that was in March. I would think that alarm bells would be ringing loud and clear at this stage for her family and friends. Once a person is entertaining or attempting suicide, even more care needs to be taken to watch and observe and to monitor her condition continuously.
Once a person has decided that suicide is the only way out, there needs to be clear and decisive action taken.
I know that if my daughter took it upon herself to consider suicide or self-admit to a hospital after thinking about suicide, then i would do whatever it takes to monitor the situation around the clock.

It is hard to say what happened in this case, the parents may have had the impression she was over the hump and ok again. Many kids pretend they are ok, or will deny in the hospital what they told others. The kids that come to the hospital frequently have over exaggerated stories from schools and parents, and the signs can be subtle. You can't monitor someone continuously, and it is impossible to make them entirely safe anywhere. If someone is determined enough, they will do it. If you think you can monitor a suicidal kid 24/7 as a parent, you are deluding yourself when even we can hardly do that at the hospital level (with cameras, and multiple shifts). Also with kids, suicide attempts are almost always highly impulsive acts, with no real planning or foresight.

Indeed, and as my previous post asked, where was her support base? Her pillars of strength?
Alarm bells were tolling loud enough for everyone to hear. The signs were there, victimization, bullying, harrassment, both of a sexual nature and also of a physical nature. Hell, they moved away, the self-admitting to a hospital.
Surely the outward signs were there: depression, reclusive, uncertain, introvert behaviour, who knows what else.
Maybe the alarm bells were faulty.
I just cannot fathom that her support base was, not necessarily oblivious to het state of despair, but not at the very least monitoring, supporting with constant supervision.

Caring active parents miss signs all the time. The alarm bells were not actively ringing, that much is obvious. I am also not sure what exactly you would expect from the parents. Signs of suicidal are not cut and dry and not obvious and frequently run along side other issues like depression. Some kids also endure better than others, and many mask things really well, particularly if there was trauma.

All that event took was a brief period of time to happen. I knew a kid we lost last winter, she had been hospitalized many times, overdosing was an escape method for her, one time her parents found her half an hour too late and that was it.

A politically incorrect observation not necessarily associated with this thread's topic

It is interesting that if a women gets drunk, has sexual activity and later objects, the law presumes that if she had sexual activity, she is not responsible (did not give consent) due to impairment (being drunk) and therefore is not responsible. i.e. she was raped.

But at the same time, if a man gets drunk, and has sexual activity, but the woman objects afterward, the law presumes that if he had sex, that he IS responsible and his impairment (being drunk) is not valid and he is therefore accountable. i.e. he is a rapist.

So if two people get drunk and have sex, excusing accountability due to impairment of judgement (being drunk) only applies to the woman and not the man.

That's a little one sided.

Rape, like other violent crimes, is a horrible thing and no victim ever deserves it. But when alcohol (or drugs) becomes involved, the rules seem to change and not change equally.

In the eyes of the law, a drunk woman does not give consent but a drunk man does. :timeout:

I don't know what the answer is, or should be other than people should not get drunk (that's pretty realistic).


Well lets face it, there are lots of predatory males out there (how many guys do you know that will hang out late at bars hoping to pick up the drunk chick and you know...). Many will take advantages of moments of weakness. Generally in most cases there has to be compelling evidence to get a rape conviction as otherwise it is still he said/she said, like if their are witnesses to say that she was too drunk to legally consent.

As for men getting drunk, that generally isn't an acceptable excuse for committing any kind of crime. It is also pretty unusual for a conviction (or even a court case to happen) if both parties are drunk. Plus also don't forget how many men tend to act when drunk.

Lastly, how often does it happen when a woman rapes a man? It is extremely rare by most statistics, even factoring in huge levels of non reporting. Lets face facts, probably over 99% of rapes are committed by males.



Anyhow, if any of you have any questions about suicide, depression, warning signs, and what to do, feel free to ask here and I will do my best to answer as I have time.

[Feuer Frei!]

Thanks for some valuable inside information on this Neon :salute:

[Skybird]

As far as alcohol is concerned: everybody is responsible for how much he drinks. Is anyone forced to drink more than he can bear? No. There may be group dynamics. There may be anonymous "pressure" to just fit in and do like all others. And still: the decision is yours, you can chose to resist and say No.

I do not accept alcohol as a reason for lower sentences or suspended sentences. People should face responsibility for their decisions, and actions - and the consequences.

[Penguin]

Indeed, that was the opinion he has previously stated on the matter.

link, please, in a similar thread with nearly the same title from a year ago, he didn't state anything like this.

[Tribesman]

in a similar thread with nearly the same title from a year ago
Same title?
Wasn't it a wikileaks topic

[Penguin]

ahh, found it!
hmmm... :hmmm:

[Skybird]

Just read in German news that there is another case almost identical to the first one in this thread. Audrey Potts, said to be a gifted piano player, 15 years, raped while unconsciousness, taken nudity pictures of, distributed at school, committed suicide in shame.

First English link I found: https://www.facebook.com/AudriePottFoundation

I assume somewhere is more English news to be found, this facebook site just as an entry. Heck, I am not even subscribed to FB.

Stories like this make me sick and enraged.

[Jimbuna]

Shocking :nope:

[u crank]

Update. Police to reopen investigation.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/police-reopen-investigation-of-rehtaeh-parsons-case/article11160563/