Your Ideal Doomsday Survival Situation/Prepper Thread [Archive]

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Red October1984

01-16-13, 09:37 PM

Cybermat47

01-16-13, 09:41 PM

I would probably run around with a zombie biting my neck for a bit, then try to eat you. That's my best case scenario.

Sailor Steve

01-16-13, 09:47 PM

My ideal scenario isn't to survive. I'd rather die right off the bat. I'm too comfortably ingrained in my life to want to live another way.

Stealhead

01-16-13, 09:51 PM

Takeda Shingen

01-16-13, 10:48 PM

What are you guys' perfect survival scenario?

If the zombies come, nuclear war, whatever, etc...I want to be in a Nuclear Submarine. I would only have to dock for food. I have water and I have power. I have safety.

I am, however, allergic to seafood....that could be problematic. :hmmm:

Another one would be to build tunnels like the Japanese through the hill that I live on and find a way to keep the zombies/mutants/radiation/plague outside and me safely inside. This plan has more flaws but it is more realistic. I don't think they will just invite people aboard submarines when the world ends. Diesel boats require gas....Nuclear boats provide all the power they need with the only downside being that somebody in your survivor party needs to be experienced with nuclear reactors.

Food isn't likely going to be your problem, rather parts. While the reactor will theoretically give you around 50 years of power, other parts of the boat are going to break or wear out; they do all the time under normal conditions. In the event of apocalyptic proportions, when society has completely broken down, people aren't going to be making those parts anymore. This will be compounded by the fact that the boat will be at sea continuously, and will not be getting the type of maintainence from base personnel between patrols. Furthermore, military installations will be among the first places picked over by survivors. Bases hold all kinds of goodies -- weapons, ammunition, supplies and mechanical parts. Unfortunately, this means that they will likely be picked clean by the time you need them.

August

01-16-13, 11:00 PM

If it is gonna be a massive tsunami well surfs up baby I'll try to ride the wave but get squashed.

There's a great scene in the book "Lucifer's Hammer" by Larry Niven of just that situation. When the comet hit this guy was out on the bay on his surfboard and he caught a 1000ft tall tidal wave. As he rode the face he could see houses and trees disappearing beneath him but ahead was the 50 story (crs) building coming at him like a giant flyswatter. :o

Cool...

Stealhead

01-16-13, 11:00 PM

You would also need a crew that can actually maintain a nuclear submarine as well and even if you did these complex vessels receive months of maintenance between patrols something that would not be possible in a total collapse.Sure in a time of duress a sub can stay out for longer but the ship itself and crew would wear out in a year or so.

Hiding seems like a good idea but it is no guarantee of safety things can go wrong that force you to move like a hostile group finding your hiding spot people are going to be really looking because their survival depends on finding what is hidden.Long term survival a person or group of people would have to be nomadic.

I get a kick out of the people on these dooms day shows who have all these plans about having their little fort that they plan to defend well guess what they will get to do that only thing is sooner of later they are going to get over run and die.Better to be mobile because as I said people will be looking for permanent locations because they know that what they need is in them.

Of course not matter what you do it is going to very hard it is going to be very harsh and possibly only a very small number would survive and it might be close like that for generations.Think of your worst experience and multiply it about 1 billion then you have an inkling of how hard making it in a total collapse post apocalyptic world will be.

Red October1984

01-16-13, 11:18 PM

My ideal scenario isn't to survive. I'd rather die right off the bat. I'm too comfortably ingrained in my life to want to live another way.

I would want to die too. Make it quick. I started this thread because i find it amusing to think about what I could/would do if i survived. There is a point where surviving is worse than death. After the apocalypse, the line has been crossed.

Thinking about different things helps pass time when you are bored. When you're sick of your iPod and when you're out of books to read on a long car/plane/train drive, just write up a doomsday plan.

EDIT: I also realize the many flaws of my submarine plan. That's why if I could support the plan with parts/supplies/maintenance/crew like you people suggested it could work. It would be my IDEAL plan. Most likely, I'd either die or fight in the woods of Southeast Missouri.

Stealhead

01-16-13, 11:37 PM

Why not make a plan that involves an extensive spider hole/tunnel system like the Viet Kong had in Vietnam then? That would be ideal in Missouri.

That way your passing time and who knows if something does happen you could actually use it.

When I was a kid I used to take graph paper and draw up these blueprints for VC style tunnel systems it was a pretty fun way to pass time the Florida sand would make
actually digging and constructing a real tunnel system very costly though.

Sailor Steve

01-16-13, 11:49 PM

I second that opinion I want to right under the epicenter if it is a nuke or a giant meteorite if it is a volcano I want to stand right on the edge as it goes.If it is gonna be a massive tsunami well surfs up baby I'll try to ride the wave but get squashed.

There's a great scene in the book "Lucifer's Hammer" by Larry Niven of just that situation. When the comet hit this guy was out on the bay on his surfboard and he caught a 1000ft tall tidal wave. As he rode the face he could see houses and trees disappearing beneath him but ahead was the 50 story (crs) building coming at him like a giant flyswatter. :o

Cool...
Dark Star.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0069945/

A great little indie sci-fi spoof. At the end a guy is about to fall into the Earth's atmosphere, so he grabs a piece of space debris and surfs to his death.

Stealhead

01-16-13, 11:55 PM

Honestly if it was something sudden I'd try to survive I recon.But if was something huge likely to kill 99% of life and the time and place was known I'd be waiting for it and just accept my fate and maybe see something interesting my last few seconds.

I think riding a tsunami would realistically be near impossible a massive one in particular they travel at high speed so what i might do is have one of those old time tubs they used to sit and bathe in(I mean the poor man kind not the fancy kind) take one of those and fill it with warm water and take a bath and have one last blast of water cleanse me.

It might be pretty righteous to watch a pyroclastic flow from a volcano come at you knowing that your about to become the dust coming at you.Some people where fairly close to Mount St. Helens when she went off back in 1980.

Armistead

01-17-13, 02:19 AM

I think we would all try to live if possible if that day comes, but why I'll prepare for a storm, I'm not concerned about the end of the world. I know many do prepare, but my money is better spent living than worrying about dying should nukes fly or zombies roam. History has taught us things can get bad, even wipe out most of mankind, but I imagine we'll survive as long as our planet is here.

Onkel Neal

01-17-13, 05:00 AM

troopie

01-17-13, 05:09 AM

I'm thinking Mad Max scenarios, better have plenty of gas stashed away. And my first priority will be finding a prepper's compound and taking it down. Always nice to have someone do the legwork for you. :arrgh!:

^Aww, you beat me to it!

Rilder

01-17-13, 05:09 AM

Gather group of people, have some of them be devoted to farming, others devoted to defending the farmers, go from there. I've played Dwarf fortress enough to know 7 people should be enough to start with. :O:

BossMark

01-17-13, 05:24 AM

Make sure that I have plenty of beer and ammo.

Jimbuna

01-17-13, 07:14 AM

Red October1984

01-17-13, 07:16 AM

Make sure that I have plenty of beer and ammo.

:D

I see....Your plan is flawed.

Beer-You would have enough of, but it could run out.

Ammo-In a shortage atm. At least in USA it is.

mapuc

01-17-13, 09:23 AM

As a dreamer of taking over the world. I would put my plans into action

Markus

mookiemookie

01-17-13, 09:36 AM

If the zombies roamed, I'd probably break into a police station to arm myself, find a horse to ride into a major city, and once my horse was eaten I'd hook up with a group of survivors only to find my wife and my best friend with them. We'd make it to the CDC in Atlanta, blow the place up, then find a cozy little farm in the outskirts of the country. A simmering resntment towards my best friend would lead to me killing him, and roving herds of zombies would force us to flee and take shelter in a prison near a cult-ish survivor camp.

That's probably how it'd go down. :03:

AVGWarhawk

01-17-13, 02:30 PM

I start conquering with this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q62/avgwarhawk/408627_512452498795634_1409613285_n.jpg

Stealhead

01-17-13, 03:04 PM

:D

I see....Your plan is flawed.

Beer-You would have enough of, but it could run out.

Ammo-In a shortage atm. At least in USA it is.

There is a supplier generated shortage right now many people want guns and ammo so they are going to produce less and send less out to the market supply and demand.The ammo makers in the business of making money always remember that.That means when ammo is in high demand they sell less of it to sellers and charge a higher price which in turn means a higher price to the consumer and a "shortage".

Also If you used a shotgun you can easily produce more shot shells you can use wax to make a new sabot and make your own pellets out many different things.

Armistead

01-17-13, 04:09 PM

Hopefully Neal would be able to keep Subsim up from his cave or basement.

AVGWarhawk

01-17-13, 04:12 PM

Hopefully Neal would be able to keep Subsim up from his cave or basement.

:haha:

Betonov

01-17-13, 05:03 PM

All I need is this

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6g4urhE5U1rvkl1co1_400.jpg

this

http://www.guiaderivera.com/images/varios/swiss-champ-victorinox-02.jpg

and lots of this

http://www.themightyrenegade.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Forrest.png

Cybermat47

01-17-13, 05:06 PM

All I need is this

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6g4urhE5U1rvkl1co1_400.jpg

Nothing better than a small towel.

mapuc

01-17-13, 05:11 PM

Do not forget the tinfoil on your head, to protect your from the brain signal the government are going to send around the world to make us being vegetable

Hehe

Markus

Betonov

01-17-13, 05:20 PM

Nothing better than a small towel.

"A towel, it says, is about the most massively useful thing an interstellar hitchhiker can have. Partly it has great practical value - you can wrap it around you for warmth as you bound across the cold moons of Jaglan Beta; you can lie on it on the brilliant marble-sanded beaches of Santraginus V, inhaling the heady sea vapours; you can sleep under it beneath the stars which shine so redly on the desert world of Kakrafoon; use it to sail a mini raft down the slow heavy river Moth; wet it for use in hand-to- hand-combat; wrap it round your head to ward off noxious fumes or to avoid the gaze of the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal (a mindboggingly stupid animal, it assumes that if you can't see it, it can't see you - daft as a bush, but very ravenous); you can wave your towel in emergencies as a distress signal, and of course dry yourself off with it if it still seems to be clean enough.

More importantly, a towel has immense psychological value. For some reason, if a strag (strag: non-hitch hiker) discovers that a hitch hiker has his towel with him, he will automatically assume that he is also in possession of a toothbrush, face flannel, soap, tin of biscuits, flask, compass, map, ball of string, gnat spray, wet weather gear, space suit etc., etc. Furthermore, the strag will then happily lend the hitch hiker any of these or a dozen other items that the hitch hiker might accidentally have "lost". What the strag will think is that any man who can hitch the length and breadth of the galaxy, rough it, slum it, struggle against terrible odds, win through, and still knows where his towel is is clearly a man to be reckoned with."

August

01-17-13, 05:20 PM

Hopefully Neal would be able to keep Subsim up from his cave or basement.

I'd say that depends on what his target Prepper had set up... :)

Armistead

01-17-13, 06:10 PM

I'd say that depends on what his target Prepper had set up... :)

Subsim is the only place I trust for news.....fair and balanced.:D

Jimbuna

01-17-13, 06:30 PM

Subsim is the only place I trust for news.....fair and balanced.:D

LOL :)

Red October1984

01-17-13, 09:16 PM

I think that if the zombies came, I'd take a boat up or down the Mississippi River to a larger body of water. Zombies cannot swim! And i would establish a supply point that is well defended along the banks of wherever I'd go. Then, I could live on the bank and have a speedy getaway from zombies. :hmmm:

Cybermat47

01-17-13, 09:19 PM

^^^
What if there are zombie sharks, hmm?

Raptor1

01-17-13, 09:20 PM

^^^
What if there are zombie sharks, hmm?

Then you are probably in the sort of bad movie you'd rather die than continue to live in anyway.

August

01-17-13, 10:26 PM

http://www.geekologie.com/2010/06/25/zombie-apocalypse-chart.jpghttp://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/What_ad2a4e_721259.jpg

Cybermat47

01-18-13, 01:27 AM

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/What_ad2a4e_721259.jpg

Nice question mark bro.

Penguin

01-18-13, 02:34 AM

A M60 on a tripod, several cases of beer, a ghettoblaster and enough music tapes.

Then party like it's the apocalypse!:rock:

I think that if the zombies came, I'd take a boat up or down the Mississippi River to a larger body of water. Zombies cannot swim! And i would establish a supply point that is well defended along the banks of wherever I'd go. Then, I could live on the bank and have a speedy getaway from zombies

The fact that zombies can't swim leads to a dangerous sense of safety on the water. As Brooks pointed out in his Zombie Survival Guide, they are able to walk under water. No air in the body = specific gravity less than water. Also the speed of decompostion is much slower than abvove water, they can literally walk for years. So as soon as you set anchor, a zombie walking in the riverbed could grab the chain and climb onto your boat.
Same goes for your supply point idea on a bank. If you don't also put up defensive parameters towards the river, you are in danger.

Stay safe!

Cybermat47

01-18-13, 02:37 AM

A M60 on a tripod, several cases of beer, a ghettoblaster and enough music tapes.

Then party like it's the apocalypse!:rock:

Sounds like a plan.

Red October1984

01-18-13, 08:23 AM

A M60 on a tripod, several cases of beer, a ghettoblaster and enough music tapes.

Then party like it's the apocalypse!:rock:

The fact that zombies can't swim leads to a dangerous sense of safety on the water. As Brooks pointed out in his Zombie Survival Guide, they are able to walk under water. No air in the body = specific gravity less than water. Also the speed of decompostion is much slower than abvove water, they can literally walk for years. So as soon as you set anchor, a zombie walking in the riverbed could grab the chain and climb onto your boat.
Same goes for your supply point idea on a bank. If you don't also put up defensive parameters towards the river, you are in danger.

Stay safe!

I need to read that book. I didn't know about zombies walking underwater but I knew that I would have to defend the bank very well.

Armistead

01-18-13, 11:54 AM

I think we have many past Left4Dead gamers here.

Dammit_Carl!

01-18-13, 12:36 PM

Go read the book now, Red; its one of the only books I've read that I immediately started to re-read once I finished it the first time.

My Stepfather works for these 2 doctors, both marred to each other (male & female although that shouldn't matter) who have bought wholesale into the "survivalist," claptrap. Guns, gear, panic-room, etc. The male doctor even has gotten to where he's packing heat every day-granted, I can see that for the doctor/drugs/theft reason, so no snark on my part for that.

But, and this is what I told my Stepfather to mention to this guy, he lives several miles from his house. If the big-one goes up, then how in the hell is he going to get to the safety of his home as they'll be plenty of crap to deal with between the front door of his office and the front door of his house?

For myself, I hope I die quick; I like my internet too much.

August

01-18-13, 02:06 PM

mapuc

01-18-13, 02:09 PM

I use this thread

I've been thinking about this doomsdays prophecies dec 21Th 2012 phenomenon

What if we aren't in the year 2013, what if we are in reality in some other years

Our counting is build on that Jesus was born year "0" but what if he was born earlier or later??

Markus

Jimbuna

01-18-13, 02:14 PM

Easy solution to keeping Zombies from climbing your anchor chain:

http://www.foothillsproducts.com/siteart/RatGuard1.jpg

Normally it's used on dock mooring lines to keep rats from getting aboard but it should work great against dumb zombies... :up:

It all comes back now....during my time at sea we said it was to stop rats coming aboard and the port authorities would say it was to prevent rats coming ashore :)

Armistead

01-18-13, 02:15 PM

THe Mayan calendar doesn't work off out system, plus Jesus was born probably 4 BCE, fact is no one really knows.

Sailor Steve

01-18-13, 02:21 PM

Jesus was born probably 4 BCE
And probably sometime in the spring.

ice_the_dice

01-18-13, 02:28 PM

Survival

Stealhead

01-18-13, 02:28 PM

Zombies don't care about the Myan calendar or when Jesus was born they just want to eat brains.Therefore the best solution to counter the zombie threat would be to develop an advanced form of AI equal to the human brain.Then take your brain or rather what is in it and store it in the AI which would be store on some device embedded deep in your body to protect it from harm.Once you have no organic brain the zombies will not have any interest in you and survival will be much easier.

soopaman2

01-18-13, 03:28 PM

This thread makes me want to play Fallout New Vegas.

Better yet Fallout 3, and nuke Megaton, and giggle.

Platapus

01-18-13, 05:01 PM

That was the comforting idea about working at SAC HQ. We knew that there were at least a few SS-18's with our address.

Nice and quick. :yep:

Like Steve, I would rather be in the first group of casualties.

Now if there were a mine shaft....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iesXUFOlWC0

Stealhead

01-18-13, 06:58 PM

The SAC HQ at Offutt? That would be the ideal place if WWIII had kicked off during the Cold War.Or any SAC base for that matter just stand outside while Buffs where are lifting of
you'd be done in about 15 minutes or so.

I love that ending scene of Dr. Strangelove mein fuhrer.Dr. Strangelove is obviously supposed to be Edward Teller.

Onkel Neal

09-23-17, 11:16 AM

Seeing how our old prepper thread got nuked (ironic, isn't it? :haha:), I thought it would be approp[riuate in these times to resurrect this one, have fun.

Prepping doesn't always mean for the end of the world or collapse of society, anyone who lives on the Gulf Coast should be a little bit prepper for hurricanes.

And yeah, there is a wide range of preppers, so ymmv, some may seem irrational to you, get over it.

How to Survive the Apocalypse (https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/09/23/style/how-to-survive-the-apocalypse.html?referer=http://idrudgereport.com/) - in tha New York Times, so you know it's getting serious :o

President Trump threatens to “totally destroy North Korea.” Another hurricane lashes out. A second monster earthquake jolts Mexico. Terrorists strike in London. And that’s just this past week or so.

Yes, the world is clearly coming to an end. But is there anything you can do to prepare?

That is not a philosophical question, or a theological one. And if it is a question that seems to beg any explication, you may stop reading now.

But if you are among the swelling class of weekend paranoiacs of affluent means who are starting to mull fantasies of urban escape following the endless headlines about disasters, both natural and manufactured, you may be starting to see a different image in your mind when think “survivalist.” You may no longer see the wild-eyed cave dweller in camouflage fatigues, hoarding canned goods. You may even see one in the mirror.

https://tpc.googlesyndication.com/simgad/4605602894304971751?w=600&h=314

blackswan40

09-23-17, 01:09 PM

Were use to in Limey Ville when the natives are restless in Bradford West Yorkshire you don't call 999 for the police you ring India and ask for the Bengal Lancers

Kaptlt.Endrass

09-23-17, 06:44 PM

My ideal post-apocalyptic survival situation? If you have ever played 'The Long Dark' that's it.

I can easily become an arctic nomad, living off the land with only a hatchet, knife, and rifle. In addition, few people in a post-apocalyptic world are going to think 'Let's leave this sunny land with lots of food and water that we barely have to work for and go where every aspect of Mother Nature is trying to kill us.'

The Inuits and Siberians have been doing it for centuries. No reason why I can't, especially trained in that sort of situation.

STEED

09-23-17, 07:18 PM

I like the idea the Triffid's have taken over, blasting away with a pump action shot gun and a flame gun with a bloody great big knife for some one to one action. :)

Onkel Neal

09-23-17, 07:55 PM

Kaptlt.Endrass

09-23-17, 09:43 PM

You're trained in living off the land? True about relocating to frozen wastelands, not very many people will opt for that.

Aye sir! Had a thing for a while, in fact, where my friends and I would head up to BC and spend some time in the wilderness, see who could last the longest.

Of course, the permits and all required, as well as tickets, got to be a little expensive.

Jimbuna

09-24-17, 05:46 AM

Were use to in Limey Ville when the natives are restless in Bradford West Yorkshire you don't call 999 for the police you ring India and ask for the Bengal Lancers

What?....only in Bradford?

em2nought

09-26-17, 11:41 AM

Learned that for hurricanes I had water well covered, gasoline not so much. ...and that's without even bothering to break out a generator. Next time I intend to have at least sixty gallons on hand.

Aktungbby

09-26-17, 01:46 PM

You're trained in living off the land? True about relocating to frozen wastelands, not very many people will opt for that.
HEY THERE'S ALWAYS ICE FISHING... WITH A SIX PACK OF HAMM'S BEER TO WARM U UP! https://dsx.weather.com//util/image/w/006_icefisher_01.jpg?v=ap&w=980&h=551&api=7db9fe61-7414-47b5-9871-e17d87b8b6a0

Tango589

09-28-17, 02:15 PM

If the smelly brown stuff really is going to hit the fan in a MAJOR way, I'd rather park myself out in a deck chair with my wife next to me, music playing loud, plenty of wine and beer on hand and wait for the hammer to fall.:Kaleun_Cheers:

Onkel Neal

04-14-18, 04:34 PM

So, it's really interesting to have conversations about what "might" happen if the US fires cruise missiles at targets in Syria and Russian says they will target American ships, which could lead to further escalation... People who laugh at preppers start rubbing their chins. When things started getting hairy, people start making plans.

les green01

04-14-18, 11:52 PM

well if the big one happens im too old and sit in my ways to change and the doctor told me I have to quit smoking and anyway I live though the cold war once

August

04-15-18, 11:25 AM

If life was a Hollywood movie I've reached the age where my characters bloody death is what the hero in the story uses to generate the outrage and motivation he needs to defeat the bad guys. The best that I can hope for is for him to say "well at least he took a bunch of them with him". :)

mapuc

04-15-18, 12:22 PM

Have only this to say

If and if I get enough time before the nuclear holocaust begins I will take the trip to our Capital-And to be sure to be in the A-area or the B-area of where the blast is.

´Cause I live far away from where they expect the nukes will hit here in Denmark, and in Germany and Poland.

Markus

Onkel Neal

04-15-18, 01:12 PM

Who can say what things would be like after a limited nuclear war. It's very likely that life would go on but there would be super shortages and breakdowns in Services, that's what I prepare for, 6 months without food or water supplies coming in so I don't have to wait in epic lines at the Walmart for 12 hours. And of course, crime would be increased but I think people could still cope with it if they're ready. I really don't see the Mad Max scenario being very likely.

em2nought

04-15-18, 02:38 PM

Fuel was my limiting factor after Hurricane Irma. I've got at least a dozen five gallon cans waiting to be filled for the next disaster.

Publix was really good, they were up and running in just a couple days, even before power was restored. Banks and credit unions just said f' it and didn't bother to open or have ATMs for two weeks, so cash would be something to have on hand to. I already had that covered.

Having an older person to take care of can really reduce your chances too. If we get another hurricane I'd really consider putting my mom on a plane to my sister. She really worked against me during Irma.

Mr Quatro

04-15-18, 03:02 PM

Don't forget your Jalapeno Pepper Jack, beef patty MRE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEpwphgCM3g

em2nought

04-15-18, 04:48 PM

Don't forget your Jalapeno Pepper Jack, beef patty MRE

Everything looks disgusting save for the cookie, maybe they should let the Girl Scouts make MREs. :03:

Onkel Neal

12-16-18, 09:15 AM

During our latest secret society meeting at our secret underground bunker, the Z-Team and I were discussing the pros/cons of MREs and other stored food supplies.

"MREs are 'specially engineered to last years, supply nutrition, and work in SHTF situations."

"Yeah, but they're damned expensive."

"So? MRE's can withstand parachute drops of 1200 feet."

"......"

My proposal is to keep a few large caches of food supplies that are simply cans and sealed dry food goods in a few (2~5) storage totes.

https://images.homedepot-static.com/productImages/f57ce13d-da15-490f-b7bb-2c8ee8655896/svn/lapis-blue-sterilite-storage-bins-19451004-64_145.jpg

Simply fill the containers with canned food, such as
Spam.
Ready-to-eat canned meats, fruits, vegetables.
Protein or fruit bars.
Dry cereal or granola.
Peanut butter.
Dried fruit.
Canned juices.
Non-perishable pasteurized milk.
High energy foods.

Then use the food from one of the containers as everyday stores. When the container is empty, buy supplies and fill it back up, move it to the end, and start pulling supplies from the next container. This way you would use them gradually so they don't get old and keep an emergency supply at the same time. This would be way cheapers than MREs, and tastier, and you would always have a fresh supply of grub in case of hurricane, power grid failure, or alien invasion.

Don't forget to include a can opener.

em2nought

12-16-18, 01:37 PM

MREs can be found for reasonable prices occasionally. I've also got some Mountain House and Patriot Pantry freeze dried meals. My stash is only designed with a hurricane in mind at the moment. I may alter that come 2020, or I may get out of dodge. I should probably work on planting the seed of a move overseas with my mother. My mother could live like a queen overseas, and have much better doctors than she does currently too. I always imagined someone who worries about EVERYTHING so much wouldn't be so likely to live so long. :hmmm: I guess I could benefit from the Maduro diet if the SHTF. :03:

Brownells is now selling 7.62x51 and 5.56x45 by the barrel. LMAO
https://www.brownells.com/ammunition/rifle-ammo/lake-city-5-56mm-nato-xm855-bulk-barrel-prod124685.aspx

ikalugin

12-16-18, 06:03 PM

The question is, for how long do you expect your food supply to last?

Mr Quatro

12-16-18, 06:34 PM

I like your plan to rotate the food by using it and then replacing it, but can food isn't always the best choice, especially if the are not lined (Campbell Soup is not a lined can) plus the dented cans are never safe.

Your storage plan is for short term ... long term storage like beans, rice, oats etc need to be stored in double barrels and never on a concrete floor. Why double lined? Rats will eat through the first layer, but give up when faced with a second layer.

https://thesurvivalmom.com/the-top-10-foods-to-not-store/

Foods to not store, long-term
1. Any canned vegetable or fruit that you do not like

2. Tuna
I know that canned tuna is a staple in many food pantries. However, I’ve discovered that after a couple of years, canned tuna becomes mushy.

3. Flour
As flour ages, it can develop a stale, rancid smell. Additionally, it likely contains the microscopic eggs of flour weevils, which will hatch at some point.

4. Saltine crackers
Just for fun, take a sleeve of saltine crackers out of the box and set them aside, at room temperature, for 3 or 4 months. You’ll never get over the stench of rancid saltines!

5. Graham crackers
I didn’t think our family favorite, graham crackers, could go bad, but they do go rancid with time.

6. Breakfast cereals
These are not packaged for long-term storage, likely contain GMO ingredients, and probably contain a lot of additives

7. Canned tomato products
Personally, I have always stored a number of canned tomatoes, tomato sauce, and tomato paste, but then, we use those products often in our meals.

8. Home-dehydrated foods
Again, these aren’t bad, but for long-term storage, they won’t last nearly as long, mold-free, as commercially dehydrated foods.

9. Brown sugar
There really is no need to store brown sugar if you have granulated sugar and molasses on hand. Molasses has an extremely long shelf life, as does sugar

10. Bottled salad dressing
When a bottle of Kraft ranch salad dressing is the same color as Thousand Island, you know something went very, very wrong on your pantry shelf!

again your plan to rotate food you eat regularly seems like a good plan. :yep:

Don't forget to purchase those big number ten size of nuts (Costco has them) you can buy one every month for sure, but grown men have been known to cry when they run out of them up in Idaho in the winter months,

Red October1984

12-18-18, 06:34 PM

MRE's are great unless you have to live on a steady diet of them. After a while they all start to taste the same with the exception of Chicken Pesto Pasta. :doh:

Onkel Neal

01-26-20, 09:21 PM

Moving all the Wuhan virus posts to its own thread.

Mr Quatro

01-26-20, 09:49 PM

Two years later I needed my own advice: 12-16-2018 03:34 PM

I like your plan to rotate the food by using it and then replacing it, but can food isn't always the best choice, especially if the are not lined (Campbell Soup is not a lined can) plus the dented cans are never safe.

Your storage plan is for short term ... long term storage like beans, rice, oats etc need to be stored in double barrels and never on a concrete floor. Why double lined? Rats will eat through the first layer, but give up when faced with a second layer.

https://thesurvivalmom.com/the-top-10-foods-to-not-store/

Foods to not store, long-term
1. Any canned vegetable or fruit that you do not like

2. Tuna
I know that canned tuna is a staple in many food pantries. However, I’ve discovered that after a couple of years, canned tuna becomes mushy.

3. Flour
As flour ages, it can develop a stale, rancid smell. Additionally, it likely contains the microscopic eggs of flour weevils, which will hatch at some point.

4. Saltine crackers
Just for fun, take a sleeve of saltine crackers out of the box and set them aside, at room temperature, for 3 or 4 months. You’ll never get over the stench of rancid saltines!

5. Graham crackers
I didn’t think our family favorite, graham crackers, could go bad, but they do go rancid with time.

6. Breakfast cereals
These are not packaged for long-term storage, likely contain GMO ingredients, and probably contain a lot of additives

7. Canned tomato products
Personally, I have always stored a number of canned tomatoes, tomato sauce, and tomato paste, but then, we use those products often in our meals.

8. Home-dehydrated foods
Again, these aren’t bad, but for long-term storage, they won’t last nearly as long, mold-free, as commercially dehydrated foods.

9. Brown sugar
There really is no need to store brown sugar if you have granulated sugar and molasses on hand. Molasses has an extremely long shelf life, as does sugar

10. Bottled salad dressing
When a bottle of Kraft ranch salad dressing is the same color as Thousand Island, you know something went very, very wrong on your pantry shelf!

again your plan to rotate food you eat regularly seems like a good plan. :yep:

Don't forget to purchase those big number ten size of nuts (Costco has them) you can buy one every month for sure, but grown men have been known to cry when they run out of them up in Idaho in the winter months,

Onkel Neal

01-26-20, 11:56 PM

You needed it? Why'd you need it? What's going on over there?

Mr Quatro

03-12-20, 12:40 PM

I'm tired of buying bottled water :yep:

Now that it is even harder to purchase at local stores and will be almost impossible to find in a panic situation.

I've decided to purchase a water filter pitcher to filter my local water from the faucet, which I would not even make coffee with.

I just saw an ad on TV for Zero Water filtered pitchers, but after checking it out seems the filters are expensive and only last two and half weeks.

So I then went to Amazon and found this one, plus you only need to replace the filters every 6 months :

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B079DDN98K/ref=sspa_dk_detail_1?pd_rd_i=B079DDN98K&pd_rd_w=rWmsd&pf_rd_p=c83c55b0-5d97-454a-a592-a891098a9709&pd_rd_wg=coXMC&pf_rd_r=T9PJBH7DHG2NF0GMTNQ0&pd_rd_r=d3032e7e-e4a6-46d0-949c-ab8ee01cebfa&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUEyN0xFUVJESkFIMFFEJ mVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwMzE3ODU2R0ZBTU03WDFRNERKJmVuY3J 5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA2OTE2OTcyN0lSMDFVNzlTTlRQJndpZGdld E5hbWU9c3BfZGV0YWlsX3RoZW1hdGljJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1J lZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ&th=1

Ultra Max with 1 Longlast Filter, Extra Large 18 Cup, Black
by Brita

4.5 out of 5 stars 2,484 ratings

for "brita extra large 18 cup filtered water dispenser"

Price:$44.96 & FREE Shipping

Rockstar

03-12-20, 01:57 PM

I got an undersink R/O with U/V and reservoir tank from H2o Splash. I've had it for about 10 years now works like a champ.

August

03-12-20, 05:06 PM

We have a dual filter system coming from our Arteisan well. A custom rube goldberg contraption installed by the previous owner when they switched from the 1970's vintage surface well. It costs me about 10 bucks a month to replace the filters which come conveniently in a two piece set. I can sometimes go two months before changing them if we don't use a lot of water but during the second month you really start to notice the restricted flow.

https://i.imgur.com/TbuR01o.jpg

Onkel Neal

03-12-20, 05:08 PM

Very nice. How deep is the well? Do you have a solar backup? :Kaleun_Wink: If so, you are set, sir.

mapuc

03-12-20, 05:16 PM

The Danes went berserk after Danish prime minister gave order to shut down the official Denmark-Closing school, university and so on.

The news showed people going berserk in our supermarket.

They bought as you may have guessed - Toilet paper and other stuff like Pasta, canned tomatoes.

A majority of the thing they had bought was thing who need electricity to be cooked.

If our health authorities prediction comes true-about 10-15 of the Danish population will be infected by this virus.

This mean there is a very high chance for power cut for a shorter or longer period throughout or in parts of Denmark.
(Those who works at these powerplant can get infected too)

As I mentioned to some of my friend on FB.
They are for sure not genuin Preppers.

Markus

Skybird

03-12-20, 05:42 PM

If our health authorities prediction comes true-about 10-15 of the Danish population will be infected by this virus.

10 of 15 (=2/3s od the people), or 10-15%? No way you can get away with just 15% infection rate. No way.

mapuc

03-12-20, 05:50 PM

10 of 15 (=2/3s od the people), or 10-15%? No way you can get away with just 15% infection rate. No way.

can only reproduce what our health experts said on the news yesterday.
That they expect up to 10-15% of the Danish population to be infected with corona. based on the worst case scenario.
They also mentioned the figure 500,000 Danes in the same interview

Markus

nikimcbee

03-16-20, 12:20 AM

Two years later I needed my own advice: 12-16-2018 03:34 PM

Wut? No TP and hand sanitizer?:k_confused:

nikimcbee

03-16-20, 12:21 AM

nikimcbee

03-16-20, 12:25 AM

Onkel Neal

03-16-20, 09:54 AM

How much hard tack do you have on hand right now?:03:

Aktungbby

03-16-20, 11:03 AM

/\ HARDTACK!:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:was a staple of my civil-war re-enacting existance. 1 cup sugar, 3 cups flour, 4" squares, properly decorated with 9 skewer holes... bake at 400 degrees for 20 minutes. 10 in the haversack with wife's fabulous three bean stew in a castiron iron pot-enough for the squad- was enough for a long weekend backcountry engagement!:yep:

Rockstar

03-16-20, 11:16 AM

Red beans and rice with peppers, spices and sausage goes a long way. I got lots of dry beans (great northern, red, and navy beans), rice and grains. Still canning chuck roast, beef stew, chicken soup, asparagus, celery, beans, carrots, oh and my favorite pickled beets baby! One plus to canning is you dont have to go to a crowded grocery store often. Just find a less traveled farmers market and pick up a crap ton of fresh fruit and veggies to preserve.

Get several pounds of your favorite flour and a bread maker, or not, and make your own bread instead going every week to the store.

Red October1984

03-16-20, 12:22 PM

Onkel Neal

03-16-20, 01:36 PM

Welcome back just in time for the Apocalypse (just kidding).

I doubt it will come to having to bug out, it's not that kind of apocalypse.

One thing no one ever mentions is having some emergency funds set aside for bills in these situations. Everyone is screaming "who is going to pay my bills if everything shuts down!"

I guess they can change it to Coronavirus...?

Skybird

03-16-20, 02:41 PM

Well I can see this thread has revived quite nicely.

Recently set up my grocery stockpile for two weeks of groceries and have another week's worth of food packed up in a "bugout bag" of sorts. From where I live now, I can make a walk to the family home in 3-4 days at the most if I absolutely had to.

Hoping it doesn't come to that, but I've got food, water, medical supplies, VHF/UHF radio, propane stove, tent, etc all packed up with my plate carrier and rifle. I'm not going to be caught out if I do have to skip town for whatever reason. :ping:

Damn, how much I wish I had that rifle. :D My bugout pack contains two NRG-5 packs, however. Lacks fantasy, but keeps your engine running.

I assume once things have degenerated to a level where they declared 24/7 curfew for the next 6 months, we will see videos in this thread popping up like mushrooms where lethaly bored people film and photograph their bugout packs and explain them and present the content in detail. :D

Mr Quatro

03-16-20, 03:42 PM

Just tried this one minute mac and cheese not bad a little thick on the sauce
but you can add beans or something to it.
Don't use it in the little container it comes in put it in a bowl.

https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/8311cdd7-78a6-43ec-b52f-05b106e4005e_1.02174308cb761004064486efe7d1273a.jp eg?odnWidth=100&odnHeight=100&odnBg=ffffff

The nice thing I like is the expiration date of 9-8-21

(6 pack) Hormel Compleats Macaroni & Cheese, 7.5 Ounce

Hormel

$11.88

Out of stock

ET2SN

03-16-20, 03:59 PM

I told you they were painless. :yep:
Not the world's greatest meal but the shelf life is impressive for what they are, factor in cost and minimal prep time/hassles and they start to make sense.

Try the chili with beans. :yeah: Throw in some hot sauce (Tabasco and/or Pick-a-pepper) and some corn chips and that's basically dinner. :D

The only meals I would avoid are anything with mashed potatoes. :timeout:

August

03-16-20, 04:08 PM

I love mashed potatoes, with garlic and butter. Mmmm mmmm!

mapuc

03-16-20, 04:15 PM

It could be I really do not exactly understand the fully meaning of Preppers

This is because I read stuff like I/we have enough food and water for x years.

If I was a Prepper I would do it as I was expecting the worse =nuclear holocaust.

Which mean there will never be any society after and no supply of food the rest of my or our life.

But what do I know.

Markus

em2nought

03-16-20, 04:22 PM

If I was a Prepper I would do it as I was expecting the worse =nuclear holocaust.

Which mean there will never be any society after and no supply of food the rest of my or our life.

But what do I know.

Markus

There are some people who have purchased old missile silos and are ready for that, but I just prep for hurricane season, and now "this". LOL

So Tylenol has gone on the prepper list, it's going to be the next hoarded item after TP and hand sanitizer.

My favorite prepper meal would be a can of Campbell's Chili Mac Chunky Soup mixed with two cans of no salt dark red kidney beans, and some sriracha ketchup.

Red October1984

03-16-20, 04:33 PM

Welcome back just in time for the Apocalypse (just kidding).

I doubt it will come to having to bug out, it's not that kind of apocalypse.

It's certainly not that sort of situation. The chance is extremely low, however, it is never zero.

I've been involved in First Responder/SAR/CERT type stuff for several years so it's kind of a fun exercise to get my stuff together and pack the bags should they ever be needed.

Damn, how much I wish I had that rifle. :D My bugout pack contains two NRG-5 packs, however. Lacks fantasy, but keeps your engine running.

Well, if you can get your hands on the forbidden East German MPi-AK-74N kits and mail it to me piece by piece...let me know and you can take my Romanian 74 in a trade lol.

I had to google what the NRG-5's are, and, I gotta say.....If those are anything like the vacuum sealed "emergency ration" blocks that are available in the states....may God have mercy on your soul. You might enjoy eating chalk more. :haha: But man, it's certainly got everything you'll need.

I assume once things have degenerated to a level where they declared 24/7 curfew for the next 6 months, we will see videos in this thread popping up like mushrooms where lethaly bored people film and photograph their bugout packs and explain them and present the content in detail. :DI mean.....if.....you want me to..... :03:

EDIT for Skybird: https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2654912&postcount=377

em2nought

03-16-20, 04:46 PM

I should probably buy some 450 bushmaster ammo to deal with any big suckers, I'm good on 7.62x39 and .45 ACP. :03:

Jeff-Groves

03-16-20, 04:54 PM

I'm set up with High powered Air Guns.
Also have the molds to cast my own bullets and pellets.
I can charge the Guns with a hand pump if electricity is gone.
Living in the boonies like I do? There's lots of Turkey and Deer.

IF it gets that bad? I'd have no issue dropping others that invade my area.
My Air Guns are silent and deadly out to 100 yards easy!

Red October1984

03-16-20, 04:55 PM

I should probably buy some 450 bushmaster ammo to deal with any big suckers, I'm good on 7.62x39 and .45 ACP. :03:

You may be able to cast bullets for .450, but I'm pretty sure .450BM is loaded pretty hot and might move too fast.

A few buddies of mine did cast bullets for .30-30, .45 and custom shotgun slugs, but I've never fiddled with it myself.

ET2SN

03-16-20, 05:14 PM

I love mashed potatoes, with garlic and butter. Mmmm mmmm!

I was talking about the Hormel Compleats. :doh:
They might say it has mashed potatoes, but they ain't taters. :o

The Compleats with sliced potatoes are OK, just keep in mind they are calorie and salt heavy. Not so great for staying fit, but very handy when bugging out. :yeah:

August

03-16-20, 05:50 PM

I was talking about the Hormel Compleats. :doh:
They might say it has mashed potatoes, but they ain't taters. :o

The Compleats with sliced potatoes are OK, just keep in mind they are calorie and salt heavy. Not so great for staying fit, but very handy when bugging out. :yeah:

We'd be amazed at how good bad food tastes if we're hungry enough.

ET2SN

03-16-20, 07:05 PM

We'd be amazed at how good canned ravioli tastes if we're hungry enough and the freeze and chill boxes are empty.

At least we didn't run out of coffee. :up:

August

03-16-20, 07:11 PM

At least we didn't run out of coffee. :up:

Pro tip. Depending on ambient temperature and amount of clothing insulation, cans of ravioli can be thawed by placing them in the crotch or under the arm for an hour or two. :salute:

ET2SN

03-16-20, 08:34 PM

These were #10 (industrial sized) cans of ravioli for a crew of 85.
Your arm pits may be bigger than mine. :hmmm:

August

03-16-20, 08:43 PM

Very nice. How deep is the well? Do you have a solar backup? :Kaleun_Wink: If so, you are set, sir.

150ft and no but that is a fine idea. The pump is 220V but it doesn't run that much and might just be able to run on on a solar battery system if the tank is big enough.

Onkel Neal

03-16-20, 10:56 PM

150 ft would be a good fit for solar, but you can probably get by with a propane generator too.

THE_MASK

03-17-20, 12:37 AM

I have a lifestraw for outback travel , prepping etc .
https://www.lifestraw.com/

August

03-17-20, 05:29 PM

150 ft would be a good fit for solar, but you can probably get by with a propane generator too.

Well thanks, I will look into it.

Onkel Neal

03-18-20, 11:17 PM

Holy hell, who's buying up all the ammo?!:o

https://www.midwayusa.com/556x45mm-nato/br?cid=21887

Buddahaid

03-18-20, 11:43 PM

No kidding. :o

blackswan40

03-19-20, 11:43 AM

NHS Public Health England what to do if someone sneezes in your household https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mkYGBLPJX0

mapuc

03-19-20, 12:11 PM

I haven't read every post in this thread, I therefore used our search function and added those 3 words. Those words have been mentioned in other threads, but not here in this thread.

What I'm talking about and is of same importance like fresh water and electricity

1. Personal Hygiene
2. Sanitation
3. Discipline

Some of you could have used other words than those I have mentioned.

Markus

Onkel Neal

03-19-20, 01:33 PM

Mr Quatro

03-19-20, 02:12 PM

AT this stage in prepping, you should be planting you garden and getting your fishing tackle ready. In the really small but possible chance that the current economic disruption caused by this pandemic turns into a large, lasting economic disruption (followed by collapse), you want to have fresh produce ready at hand in 2 ~3 months to augment your pantry supplies.

Fresh eggs are no problem as long as the gals stay happy.

Oranges, figs, plums, and grapefruit are 1~2 weeks away from being picked.

Likewise, you can give your firearms a quick check. Hunting and deterring roving bands of starving city dwellers.

Milk, bread and cheese would be in short supply.

Do you really think it will get that bad?
That we would have to resort to fishing and hunting for our daily needs?

You live in a blessed area with fish and game and trees, but what about the people that live in the big cities, in the tall buildings?

By May they will be out of hope for paying the rent, paying the utilities, keeping the cell phone on, finding food, using what ever they can for TP (it's no joke).

PS May 1st is only 40 days away :o

California preparing for worst case scenarios

https://www.fox32chicago.com/news/california-preparing-for-worst-case-scenarios?fbclid=IwAR1--pFtJV4ordr8sdIhmLGvv98jAycLD6B9hFx3RxfMY7wR0ZCaR54 3XaI

While urging Californians to stay united and promising “we will get back to the life that we have lived,” Newsom also acknowledged much is unknown and so the state is preparing for frightening worst-case scenarios. He put the California National Guard on alert for duties that include humanitarian missions like ensuring proper food distribution and public safety as some grocery stores resorted to rationing to control panic buying.

Catfish

03-19-20, 02:30 PM

Holy hell, who's buying up all the ammo?!:o
https://www.midwayusa.com/556x45mm-nato/br?cid=21887
Preppers, people wanting to defend their home, Angst that no ammo will be available in the next time..
At worst groups who think their time has come - from looters to queers thinking of an overthrow :hmmm:

https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2020/03/19/gun-ammo-sales-spike-coronavirus-outbreak/

“When everything around you is uncertain, having a supply of ammunition can make our customers feel safer.”

mapuc

03-19-20, 02:32 PM

^^ The motto would be
Prepare for the worst and hope for the best

Markus

Onkel Neal

03-19-20, 04:28 PM

Do you really think it will get that bad?
That we would have to resort to fishing and hunting for our daily needs?

You live in a blessed area with fish and game and trees, but what about the people that live in the big cities, in the tall buildings?

By May they will be out of hope for paying the rent, paying the utilities, keeping the cell phone on, finding food, using what ever they can for TP (it's no joke).

I don't think it will get that bad, it never has. Even during the Great Depression and Civil War, we had law and order, for the most part. But nothing is impossible. People who think it cannot happen are the ones roaming the empty store aisles today. The prepping rules simply call for the next step, which is setting up sources of food independent of stores. I hope it doesn't come to that, it's a lot of work!

People in the cities ... well, that's long been a staple of prepper lore. It's gonna be messy! If you want to see what it could be like, check out The Modern Survival Manual: Surviving the Economic Collapse (https://www.amazon.com/dp/9870563457?tag=surviinargen-20&camp=14573&creative=327641&linkCode=as1&creativeASIN=9870563457&adid=0YS947GSKAMG2T1ARMC6&). This happened in Argentina and it is happening today in Venezuela. It's not likely but it could happen here.

The vast majority of people in this country cannot survive without the underlying infrastructure, and they are not very rational about necessities and luxuries. People think they should have whatever they decide they want.

Here's a pair of hypotheticals: Joe works at an art supply store. He makes a little more than min wage, let's say $14 an hour. He has a gal who live with him, and two kids. The kids get free breakfast and lunch at school. Even though his company has insurance available Joe doesn't elect to have coverage, he saves $380 a month. They get state care for the kids and they head to the emergency room if someone gets sick. The birth of both his kids were covered under a state low income program. Joe has an Infiniti car (not new), high-end sport motorcycle, an X-Box and a ton of Steam games in his library. Everyone in his family has a cell phone, his kids have a Nitendo Wii. His gal doesn't work, she is on FB all day while the kids are in school. Joe has next to nothing set aside for emergencies.

Dave has a job as a longshoreman at the ship channel. He makes $30+ and hour and gets quite a bit of OT. Dave has a $50,000 truck, a motorcycle, some kind of high end table saw/router that he claims cost $10,000. Dave has a LOT of tools and toys. Dave has paid his rent on time only twice in the last year. Even when his landlord set up an account in Dave's bank so the rent could be paid automatically by transfer, Dave does not allow the money to transfer. Dave has next to nothing set aside for emergencies.

So, the names were changed but I was the co-worker and the landlord in these scenarios, and I am not embellishing them one bit. The question is: should people be responsible for their own existence, should they have an emergency fund before they buy luxuries and toys?

Preppers, people wanting to defend their home, Angst that no ammo will be available in the next time..
At worst groups who think their time has come - from looters to queers thinking of an overthrow :hmmm:

https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2020/03/19/gun-ammo-sales-spike-coronavirus-outbreak/

“When everything around you is uncertain, having a supply of ammunition can make our customers feel safer.”

Good answers.

Any way, I guess the overlying concern is that massive numbers of people are questioning the stability of our society.... This is kind of like when a natural disaster is about to unfold, all the birds and animals can sense it. Worrying.

August

03-19-20, 04:55 PM

Holy hell, who's buying up all the ammo?!:o

https://www.midwayusa.com/556x45mm-nato/br?cid=21887

Same folks who bought up all the toilet paper probably.

mapuc

03-19-20, 05:09 PM

Mr Quatro

03-31-20, 11:42 AM

Good advice about can food, "When in doubt throw it out"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvyIWok0-2k

ET2SN

03-31-20, 12:50 PM

Another thing which could be good to have is those old fashion kerosene lamp.

Some of these and some gallon kerosene.

Give light and heat nearby.

Remember them from when I was a little boy-2-4 years old.

Markus

Just an FYI, be careful if you plan to light one in a modern house or structure. :up:

If the house was built to reduce drafts or save heat (tight closing doors and windows), you'll need to open a window for ventilation.

Jeff-Groves

03-31-20, 12:57 PM

Another thing which could be good to have is those old fashion kerosene lamp.

Some of these and some gallon kerosene.

Give light and heat nearby.

Remember them from when I was a little boy-2-4 years old.

Markus
I bought glow in the dark pearl additive.
Added to a clear base paint and sprayed some things.
Exposed to sunlight? They glow for up to 7 hours!
No fuel needed. No fumes during use.

Mr Quatro

05-13-20, 11:41 AM

What's in your pantry?

I decided to look in an old microwave that I had hidden some Campbell soup cans in for the terrible day that never came.
I have no idea how long ago maybe three years ago.

Here's the results: :up:

Campbells Chucky Baked Potato with cheddar & bacon bits Feb 2020 :hmmm:

Campbells Chucky Baked Potato with cheddar & bacon bits May 2020

Campbells Chucky Chicken Noodle March 2020

Campbells Chucky Chicken Noodle April 2020

Campbells Chucky Philly-Style Cheesesteak Feb 2020 :hmmm:

Old El Paso Green Chilles refried beans times 2 June 2020

Onkel Neal

12-10-20, 09:45 AM

Why 'preppers' are going mainstream
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-55249590

It must be really hard to prep living in an apartment in a big city. Good luck.

Skybird

12-10-20, 09:56 AM

Good advice from a secret squirrel: squirrels (European ones at least) have always several drays, and mother squirrels separate their kindergarden drays from their others, and always have at least one secondary so-called shadow dray beside the kindergarden dray.

Being prepared and later finding one had not to be, does not hurt. Not being prepared and then getting hit - that does hurt.

And all the money paid for insurrances will not bail you out right in the middle of an emergency. And if you never have an emergency, you never see that money back. Is that really the best of possible investements?

Do like the squirrels. Prepare. Get this just-in-time-delivery thing out of your life.

Skybird

12-16-20, 07:16 PM

This is the prepper thread, but what is a prepper thread without a Bagout Bag thread? :03: Because even if you prepped, things can always get much worse :D, forcing you to get out, and quickly.

Last week, temps between 0 and 5 degrees over night, some moisture, I ran my yearly "exercise" of setting up an emergency camp and sleeping outside. I am co-owner of the property and garden, it was in the garden, so why not (formally, wild camping is forbidden in germany). Tarp, Bivvybag, thermo-pad and sleeping bag in action. I hate Bivvy Bags, but in case of an emergency I would not have none, they are practical. Just, please, not in warm temperatures, and not if you need to get inside in an already moist condition... In the desert (temp-wise), I would not use it, and never have done so when havign been there. The guys would have sent me queer views for using one anyway... The photos unfortunately did not go well, I am not aware of what the problem was with the camera, the display looked sharp, the image in the SD card was just blur.

However, today followed the yearly checkup of my Bagout Bag, which i use to maintain since severla years already. Thought I post it in this thread, maybe others have their little bagout hobby too and have either tips or their own photos and reports!?

Why I do this? First, its an eccentric hobby of a big boy who at heart stayed a young boy. :) Second, for some serious concerns. My scenarios on mind why I would maybe need to move out quickly, are several, and each of them is possible, absolutely realistic and reasonable.

There could be a temporary or longer evacuation by the authorities, so bagging out actually is an organised evacuation into an urban environment. An industrial accident. An air traffic desaster. A regional pandemic (hear, hear...). In these scenarios, one would expect to get evacuated into an urban environment, possiblly with a roof over the head, warmth and shelter, supplies, sleeping places.

What I worry much more over, is a serious, days-lasting power blackout, and if that lasts for lets say 3-4 days and is covering major parts of Europe (its an integrated powergrid), them bringing power back would not be a thing of just days, BUT WEEKS. And no water in the kitchen or bath room for that time. ;) I take civil unrest, riots, violence, crime as granted in such a scenario. Its difficult to foresee whether closing up the bunker and hunkering down, or getting out and to somewhere else would be the better option, but once somebody realises I have stockpiled reserves, my place is just a target for predators. Police or military would not be there to help me. Too many dogs are even the fastest rabbid's death.

A third concern is a nuclear accident in one of those old French or Belgian nuclear powerplants. In my region, the wind mostly is from there to here, so there is a real risk, since they run some very old and quite lousy reactors. Since huge masses need to be evacuated, I would not bet all my money on the authorities to get me out. I always base on that I would be on my own. Anything better than that is just an unexpected bonus.

These are my prime reasons.

My bagout bag weighs 15.5 kg, of which 3 kg are 3l of water, so without that, its 12.5 kg. Not as low as I would want it, but I am getting rusty and old, and routines in handling a scenario with me staying in open nature somewhere are fading, are almost gone by now, its over twenty years ago that I did such stuff in reality. The lack of routine (or experience, for that matter) better is compensated for then by having a bit more of techncial aids with you: leave the puristic approach with ultralight bagout bags of less than 10 kg to people who really know what they are doing with minimalistic supplies). 10-12 kg is ideal to have essentials with you, but still being not overloaded and so being fast, endurable and mobile; 12-18 kg I would consider to be acceptable still as long as you are sure you have the stamina for it, but as long as you are not really in good physical shape: avoid having your Rucksack being filled beyond 18-20 kg - you get slow, your legs have less reach, you get tired easier, drinking water becomes more a concern the more you sweat. The weight you pull must equal your physical abilities - and do not overestimate yourself. We all get older.

My readied bag is a mix of meeting both urban and natural destinations. If I would have time in an emergency, obviously I would spend it to make choices for the included equipment, make minor adjustments on the fly, take out this and instead put in that. However, in its ready-state it includes items useful for both scenario types.

In Germany, firearms are almost impossible to legally own and open carry is a no go anyway. However, if you have a big pack and the world has turned into an emergency zone, you must think about arming yourself, being capable of using what you choose as your arms. The stuff you own make you prey for predators. And there will be predators. Survival always means: fighting off others who want what is yours. And that is no metaphor, that is real! Just saying. Get armed. Survival scenarios in the vicinity of othe people always means: combat, defending yourself, fighting attackers off. You must be prepared for that - physically, and psychologically.

Choose items and tools that have more than one power source if they are electric, can run on different battery types, for example, and tools that can be used in dual or more purposes/functions. Hint: some of these tools make good weapons, too - if you know how to utilise them. The radio and the lamps I use, all cna be run at least on two different battery types thnat are pretty common: AA, and CR123. Plus a small solar polanel. Plus cable and charger. Plus rechargable batteries. Diversify your options.

If you end up in a scenario of military conflict or civil war of any means, running around with a blackened knife, binoculars and map and compass can get you easily hanged up for "spying for the enemy." Worth to keep that on mind.

Choose good clothing, but if your destination is unclear or urban, avoid hunter or military camouflage - you attract unwanted attention that way if you are in an urban environment.

For the same reason, avoid military-camouflaged Rucksacks. It looks cool when being in the wilderness, but in a city? My Rucksack I have choosen with a dark, but non-military colour: medium and dark blue. Neutral, that is. However, my rain-cover for it has BW camouflage - that way I can always opt to hide it this way.

A word on rucksacks. Dont save money there. Test them with carrying-weights put in, equalling the weight you expect to carry in it. Good sellers of these offer that in their shops. If you are male but by your figure, skeleton is slim, especially around your shoulderss and chest, do not be shy to check out models designed for females. The geometry of belts and strips for the shoulders is slightly different, and small or slim males may find them to fit them better than all male Rucksacks. I know what I tell you there - I have chosen a women Rucksack for myself, too, the belts simply match my shoulder better, I may have a belly from too much good food, but my shoulders nevertheless are relatively narrow, by skeleton I am a slim man. Remember, you will maybe carry that thing with weight for hours and hours. take your time when buying it, choose wisely, and forget the difference between male and female Rucksack models. What matches you best, is what you should choose, no matter what they name it as. And no bright colours, no hunter camouflage. Neutral dark colours. Dont attract attention - deflect attention.

And now, the full display.

Yes, it all fits in. With 3l of water, Rucksack and equipment, its all around 15.5 kg. Some of the items are high quality and rated as ultralight, not cheap, but effective. In case of need, I could live from this autark for 4 days, and a bit longer if need arises. May not be the most pleasant of times, however. Emergency ratios are formally for two days, but you do not really need 2300 calories per day, I can halve that, even triple, I even eat occassionally nothing for a day throughout the year. Water however is a critical supply.

All pictures can be clicked (twice) to zoom in.

https://i.postimg.cc/8c6XMPtQ/Bagout-Bag-1.jpg (https://postimg.cc/D47cKh9B)

In the top bag, there are two bags, one can be accessed from the outside, the other only when opening the lid. The outside bag has this:

https://i.postimg.cc/Mpd5cQqf/Bagout-Bag-4.jpg (https://postimg.cc/RWJKyq3v)
A good knife (the most important and diverse tool you should always have with you, should be of very good quality), First aid and "Israeli bandages" for general purpose (civilian needs, not military, when expecting the use of firearms, I would pack very different stuff for first aid, and would need three times as much room), waterkey (urban scenarios: just think a while on how often you meet public doors and gates and locks with simple waterkey locks of any geometery, or hydrants), map, compass (please, a good one!), and for quick access one of several packs with some leafs of toilet paper. Cellphone and money purse with papers and such also would go in there. The medikit you should always fill yourself, never go with the prepacked ones, their choice of items almost always is poor.

The outside top bag also includes my firebag, giving me several options to make fire: a lighter (as long as it works, why not?), firesteel, sealed waterproof matches that can get lit on any surface, a fresnell lense (the most difficult thing for me to make fire with, it drove me crazy when learning it, but it works once you know how to start it, its a two-phased process with fresnel lenses at least: first you just make coal, and then you ignite the coaled parts of the wood, trying to ignite tinder with it directly never worked for me), a box hand-made tinder (cotton balls with vaseline, burns great), and a simple credit card-sized metal sheet with various fishing hooks and such on it.

Accessible from the opened lid, there is a sealed pack of money in small notes (all bags shown are water-sealed), pencil, paper, Steripen (later on that), and sealed USB sticks with digital copies of all personal documents and important papers: insurrances, ID papers, money things etc.). Last, a pack with cables and adapters and a charger (for smartphone, and the electric devices, saving the batteries where possible).

Tools obviously depend on what you expect to end up with. In an urban scenario you may want to prioritize others than if you expect to head for a natural destination, lets say a forest. In multi role ready state, I always have the cable cutter (wire fences are quite common obstacles in cities) , the water key, the small shovel and the foldable saw packed. Axe, bigger shovel, machete, chainsaw I would consider for an expected nature destination, and the machete as obviously a weapon, but that thing attracts attention that might not be wanted. Choices, choices... Ironcially, the multi function tool, in this case by Victorinox and not by Leatherman, is the most useless. In the forest it is of almost no use, and in an urban area only slightly more, but it comes at a hefty weight, so I would most likely not bother to pick it, the load is heavy enough already, and the small swiss army knife on my belt is MUCH lighter and almost as useful.

https://i.postimg.cc/fWVYCPZL/Bagout-Bag-5.jpg (https://postimg.cc/4nTKNBYk)

Water cleaning, well, that is not much a concern for me, in my part of the world practically all surface water like lakes and rivers are to be considerd as chemically intoxicated to the level of grey water. Indutry, agriculture, sewers, traffic - do not even think about trying to make drinking water of that! The mobile tools I have to clean water, all are just helping against biological threats: viruses, bacteria, protozoons. I thus only have the electrical UVC-lamp with me, its light, small and has little weight costs attached to, considering that I most likely would never use it anyway. I have some bigger kit not on the picture, for the kitchen sink, it is uselfull if after weeks of blackout one day the water is back but the pipes are polluted by germs due to the long dryness.

In my part of the world, better chase after bottled water. In more natural countries like Sweden or who knows where, it might be different - but not in mid-Germany. This is no wilderness, here, this all is just an urban park in factories' backyards.

Only the Steripen is in the Bag, the rest stays at home.

https://i.postimg.cc/C1zJjLmM/Bagout-Bag-6.jpg (https://postimg.cc/njfvxxyN)

The main bag holds inside, or clamped on top: a bivvy bag, an ultralight high quality isolation pad, one fo two ultralight high quality sleeping bags (one for winter, one for spring/autumn, in the picture it is non-compressed, you can squeeze it to a third of the shown size), a camouflaged tarp 3x3 meters, snaplights, special paracord (I think over 340 kg) with inbuild fibres for cable slings, fishing lines and tinder), a second set of underwear, socks and T-shirt,

https://i.postimg.cc/fb2QzyVM/Bagout-Bag-9.jpg (https://postimg.cc/hJd5MS8Y)

then there is the electronics pack: replacement batteries CR123 and AA, a universal camping lantern, a headlight (usually stored in the Rucksack's right belt pocket), a dynamo or battery-driven radio (now replaced with a newer one that has both FM and DAB), and a Geiger counter. Obviously, when those Belgian and French nuclear plants are not in the game of the scenario, I would leave the Geiger behind.

https://i.postimg.cc/VNMX1rGC/Bagout-Bag-8.jpg (https://postimg.cc/v1Y4tBdY)
(now better radio than the one in the pic)

Finally, there is the personal hygienics pack: hygienic hand swipes, swipes for my glasses, a second set of glasses, soap, razor, sunblocker, several packs with toilet paper, salt, foldable tooth brush and tooth creme, ear plugs, not shown: a sleeping mask. Do not underestmante earplugs: heavy rain on a tarp or bivvy bag or tent can make real NOISE. Same for the sleeping bag, imagine you are evacuated and with dozens and hundreds sleep in a sports hall of a school, lights on, action all around, constant come and go, around the clock. Switch off the light, switch of the noise- wonderful! Use your bag as a pillow so that you cannot become victim of thieves.

https://i.postimg.cc/ZqK0s9km/Bagout-Bag-7.jpg (https://postimg.cc/K1wZR8vp)

What else is there? A fishmoul spreader, which I do not take for fish, but is a great multi-purpose tool. Cotton handkerchiefs, and one use-handkerchiefs, two packs. Water-desinfecting pills, and water-preserving pills. A tin cup with lid, a spoon-fork combo, a bowl, all ultralight, titan. Three packs of dextrose. 2 bottles of 1.5 l water each. 2 packs of NRG-5 emergency ratios, 2300 calories each. Desinfecting Iodine. Pain killers. Tabletts against diarrhea. Small pocket spotting scope (Spektiv) since it has almost no weight. Additional sticking plaster. Cable binders of two kinds. Walking sticks that also can serve as masts if utilizing the Tarp accordingly. Obviously herrings for the tarp and bivvy bag, lines. So called elephant skin, a robust plastic foil to be used as the first layer in the groudn where you build your sleeping place on (isolates against moisture from the ground). Rain-proof gaiters. A rainshield for the rucksack in Bundeswehr Flecktarn (works great for hiding the poack away in natural places, Flecktarn is really stunning in most typical German landscapes, but the Finnish colour schemes match German forests at spring and summer perfectly, too).

Heck - I missed to add a candle stump. Did not relaise it before now, for years--- Very recommended, as a fallback option for light, also to preserve fire once you made one - or try to make a fire. Slow flame in the tinder - immediately use the tiny flame to lit a candle, and you are safe for the moment even if the small flame in your tinder goes off again. Also, obviously a light source.

Do yourself a favour: PRACTICE making fire in several ways. Its good fun, and it may pay off. Doing it the first time, unprepared, with nothing but theoretic knowledge, can prove more tricky and difficult than you imagined before. I could even make fire with nothing but wooden sticks - if I have the right wood, that is. A lighter brought from civilization however is always preferred. :) Unfortunately it tends to have run out of gas when you need it most. If you are in a scenario of conflict, try to get along WITHOUT making fires. Fires, smoke can be smelled at very great distances, not to mention the shine at night. If you must fear other people, making a fire is simply stupid. If you have canned food, eat it cold, its not about taste, its not about longterm health effects - its about calories, and nothing else.

The bag is packed ready-to-leave, with the only exception of the sleeping bag. Since I would need to choose due to the temperature zones of them being 15° apart, and their filling not liking to stay squeezed together all year long, they are placed nearby, open, and loose. Its the only item that I would need to add to the pack, plus my smartphone, purse and maybe some more money, if time allows. If there is time, I can tailor especially the tools according to what I think I can expect. But I could get moving within five minutes - so dont even think about trying to spend me a surprise visit. :D

This is it, my escape capsule without warp drive, no phasers, and not romulan camouflage field.

Have you helpful tips, comments, or want to present your own set?

Now that I think of it, a roll of heavy duty duct tape might be usefull, too. Depends on the weight calculation. But "Panzerband" is extremely versatile.

Rockstar

12-17-20, 04:12 PM

We have what are called Dude Wipes personal hygene is important they're good to clean up with when there is no water. Also its always good to have spare athletic underwear. They're very light weight they have an elastic waistband and thighs which help keeps ticks and other creepy crawlies from climbing up you pant leg and latching on to the family jewels. Spare socks too, polyester or merino wool. Both are easy to wash and dry fairly fast.

Nothing like a fresh pair of underwear and socks at the end of the day. Big moral boaster.

Id take a picture of the rest of my tent and sleeping gear but im using it right now. I try later my connection not very good

Mr Quatro

12-17-20, 08:36 PM

Nothing like a fresh pair of underwear and socks at the end of the day. Big moral boaster.

And how would you know that Rockstar :D

Looking forward to your picts ... :up:

Good posting sky ... you definitely are ready :yep:

Skybird

12-18-20, 07:53 AM

On Batteries, I recently found out about Energizer Lithium AA batteries.

My trail cam that I set up in Septembreto minitor the red squirrels at my nut feeder, originally were equipped with really good Varta alkaline batteries, the best alkalines you can get in Germany. They lasted for almost eexatly four weeks, at the night temperatures that we had in that month, around 10°C or so. They have a shelf life of 3-5 years (reading "best before 2025" currently).
I next tried Energizer Lithium batteries. They are now enetering their seventh week, with night temperatures from -1° to 6°C, and a shelve life claimed to last until 2040 ! Quite a big difference, I would say. I meanwhile have changed the Varta batteries on my pictures with Energizer Lithiums.

Onkel Neal

12-21-20, 10:11 AM

T
The bag is packed ready-to-leave, with the only exception of the sleeping bag. Since I would need to choose due to the temperature zones of them being 15° apart, and their filling not liking to stay squeezed together all year long, they are placed nearby, open, and loose. Its the only item that I would need to add to the pack, plus my smartphone, purse and maybe some more money, if time allows. If there is time, I can tailor especially the tools according to what I think I can expect. But I could get moving within five minutes - so dont even think about trying to spend me a surprise visit. :D

That's an amazing kit, I cannot think of anything you are missing other than a Ruger SR9. 15 kg is about 34 pounds, Have you had a chance to simulate carrying the pack across the city on foot?

Tools obviously depend on what you expect to end up with. In an urban scenario you may want to prioritize others than if you expect to head for a natural destination, lets say a forest.

What kind of disaster would constitute an urban scenario vs a forest retreat?

Skybird

12-21-20, 11:20 AM

I have had a test run through a naturla reserve north of my location, four hours. I found that my physical durability can still handle it, and for more hours - but that shoes need to be choosen wisely. :) With such gear the temptation is to pick light shoes, but better is to go with heavier shoes offering better stability, helps to protect against injuries if doing a mistep. Also, in a longer scenario, the pack would become lighter over time due to the water getting consumed. But I certainly would not want to get any heavier. In rugged, steep terrain in free nature, I maybe would also throw off one, two, three kilograms, it depends. But keep on mind this is Germany, not the much bigger wildernesses you have in North America. Around my hometown, its flat, flat, flat. Even the Teutoburger Foirest in the North has just some hills easy to be mounted by foot and not higher than 270m. This is the Northern German plains where they expected the red tank columns racing through towards the Dutch ports...

On your second question. An urban scenario would be an evacuation organised by the authorities or government, as an example - or rioting, crime in the streets during a failure of civil order. A scenario with an escape into or through more natural places may be a chaotic escape due to some industrial accident (radioactive cloud), or again riots, civil war-like violence. We have no strict separation here between natural habitat and urban area, city, its all close together, titsy tiny. In its usual read ystate, my pack adresses both scnearios, orbvan and nature, it would be of greta help in both.

If things are not totally chaotic, and I have a few minutes time, I can choose on the equipment. I may not need the bivvy bag (-1 kg), maybe also not the elephant skin, (-800gr.). Or the tools: shovel, saw., howeverr these do not weigh much. The Geiger. However, I tend to kedep water. Ypou can pout it away underway if you find you can afford to do so, but not having it if you need it, is a bad surprise easy to avoid.

If time is of the essence, its easier to have a diverse layout packed and then sorting stuff out before leaving, than to have a half-empty bag and then needing to pack stuff in, getting it fixed and evertyhign packed tight and sealed weather-proof. That the pack weighs in its readyx state 15.5 kilograms, does not necessarily mean I would embark with all that. Could be up to 3 kilograms less in fact. It really depends. As I said, one should never go beyiond 18 kg if one is no well trained athlete. You loose on reach, speed and durability, and you need more water. Being closer to 12 than 18 kg, is better. I am in the middle, and likely would quickly shift to the lower end of thios range. Its okay. In a couple fo years form nbow on, I may thinn difrefebtly on weights - or sleeping in tarps and bivvy bags... :haha:

In the end, the most likely scenario is a blackout, I really expect that in the coming years, sooner or later, since the German energy policy is an unbelievable heap of incompetent mess and amateurishness. Beyond that, all this bagout bag prepping is a bit playing adult boyscout, like others go into the basement and build their miniature railroad. Due to my growing age, my most likely staretgy in case of such scneairo would be to stay put in palce and defend my place, sicne I am wel supplied to last in place for 2 months if not longer, without further preparation needed. At some age, you simply became too old to play the fresh youngling's games anymore. Age gets us all. Robust defence then may be the better option.

If somebody does like this, I just would really, really recommend to practice once a year to set up the tent, tarp, bivvy bag or whatever he has opted for, so that the manual routine gets freshed up. A bivvy is still uncomoplkic ated, a tent in strong gusts and at night - you need to know how to do it, you need to practice it, theoretical knowledge alone is not the best way... Because one can unlearn routines if not practicing them long enough, or one needs to do it in a real emergency, but under non-ideal conditons like darkness or heavy wind, and then routine helps. That is especially true for knots, tarps and tents.

A tarp always is more versatile to use than a tent. And lighter. I probabaly would choose either the tarp or the bivvy bag to carry with me, not both, due to weight. It depends. The bivvy bag works great, but you should not have claustrophobia, especially in cold conditions when you would reduce the space inside even more by using not just a sleepign bag but an isolation pad as well - the one I use is for use in even icy conditions, but that means it also is thick, and it cannot be placed under the bivvy bag because then you have an elevation inside and a dramatic lack of stability for the whole construction, you will slip off the pad in when crawling into the sleeping bag, or moviong too much in it. It must go into the inside, and the sleeping bag , too. Nothing for claustrophobics. Its effective a solution, but I do not like it. I also would not use a biuvvy in extreme hot conditions, not to mention tropics. You will drown in your condensed sweat.

This is the bivvy I use. I consider it to be excellent value for money, its light, surprisingly big, and if managing the zippers correctlyl, it is waterproof (complaints about the latter imo are caused by inappropriate zipper management). Very good value for money, really. Both visors must stay open, with nets if oyu want, but keep them open, condensation always is a topic to care for in these things, even if you use several times as expensive Goretex bivvies (which also are much heavier).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-HHYum58Ns
The head peg should alway sbe use,d not just in rain. It adds to the stability and wind resistence.

And tarps, these few types of using a tarp should be known, and practiced. What else do you have a garden for, eh? Always go with a 3x3 m, not 2x2m.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W76LyJdNYU

Funny guy, but he talks the truth. The last he shows, number five, is a favourite of mine. You can use stuff or your Rucksack to cram the door.

mapuc

12-21-20, 11:26 AM

Skybird

12-21-20, 11:53 AM

I could be wrong.

Buying survival kits is only a smaller part of surviving a disaster. The biggest thing is the mental and psychological side of it.

The world(society) has collapsed many of your family and friends are gone-would you have the psychological and mental strength to coup with these facts ?

Markus
You are not wrong at all. Equipment is nothing wiothout the routine gained how to use it, so: train with it. And mental preparedness additionally to the needed knowledge also is a must, you are absolutely right there. Every trainer in self-defence courses knows that: that people who have taken such courses, women especially, often nevertheless become victims although they could have escaped or drive their attacker away - if only they would have been better prepared to use physical violence themselves. This must be trained, its part of good self defence courses. If it is not, the course is not worth the money. Battle cries serve this purpose, too, to loosen and overcome such inhibitions. Thats why a martial arts teacher wants you to shout, yell, during a push, kick, whatever. Well, its not the only reason, but another good one. As my past mentor and trainer used to say: if you ever end up in a serious brawl, forget all what I taught you and forget martial arts, but switch to enjoy being a rabit dog. Martial arts master versus criminal scum used to mean street violance and cheats and tricks, looses. Always. It only works in the movies. If in serious trouble : be mean and unfair, or run, if you can. Don'T try to be a martial arts master, you will most likely end up pretty badly as long as you are no real Shaolin monk. And even a monk will not dodge a bullet, or a knife in his back.

There is no fairness in fighting. When there is fairness in it, its called a sport.

Rockstar

12-21-20, 09:50 PM

Here's some my kit. A 15 degree down sleeping bag. Over a down filled sleeping pad rated r-value of 5 and underneath it I sometimes use thermarest foam pad r-value 2 offers even more insulation but more importantly the foamy helps protect the inflatable pad against punctures.

I stole my wifes cotton facial wipes which already come in a plastic wrap. They catch fire very quickly with the Bushcraft firestick. I also carry matches. Got my Optimus cook stove, comes with cups and stuff sack can even find gas cans small enough to stow inside the cups, pretty convieniant.

There's a pack of Hoo-ahhs (dude wipes) for cleaning up in the field. Extra pair of skivvies and socks, Sawyer water filter, two bottles of waters (I reuse the bottles). Ontario Knife Company survival knife, lensatic compass, toothbrush and paste, small plastic garden trowel for digging catholes, and a frogg-togg rain poncho.

I use a two person MountainSmith tent. Rain fly is optional during clear warm nights. I like the two person because I can take all my gear inside with me and still have plenty of room inside. It rolls up nicely and weighs only four pounds.

All of the above fits inside a 40 liter Osprey back pack. With room for five days worth of dehydrated food. When I go to the Appalacians for a few days I pack a book that indentifies edible plants for the region.

https://i.postimg.cc/WpfzrBvN/PSX-20201221-113213.jpg
Set up at Osceola National Forest where I stayed a few nights ago
https://i.postimg.cc/zv2Vwx89/PSX-20201221-113404.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/y6G1PgF4/PSX-20201221-113520.jpg

Sailors beware. Thar be alligators 'ere.
https://i.postimg.cc/dtdhZmgS/PSX-20201221-113830.jpg

Heading home for the holiday
https://i.postimg.cc/vHRByxD7/PSX-20201221-113727.jpg

Skybird

12-22-20, 09:35 AM

Mr Quatro

12-22-20, 09:40 AM

Heading home for the holiday
https://i.postimg.cc/vHRByxD7/PSX-20201221-113727.jpg

Thanks for the tips and the picts Rockstar :up:

I've been following you for years and didn't know you looked like a mountain man :yep:

Rockstar

12-22-20, 12:27 PM

Nice kit for a clearly defined holiday scenario! I prefer thermarest for sleepign equipment, too, some of their stuff is really very good, light and warm.

I envy you in those nations where you can just go into the green, and camp. In Sweden you can do like this, too, as far as I know. In Germany, it simply is forbidden in state forests, you may camp over the day, but not over the night: then it is no longer a temporary rest; and in private forests you need to ask the owner'S permission (which probably is also the case anyhwere else, and even is okay, I mean after all its private property).

If you do wildcamping in Germany, stay hidden, keep low profile, and arrange your place in such a way that any observer - the ranger for example - can easily see the intention to not do damage and leave garbage behind. Therefore, be especially careful with open fires, and in much of sporing and over the summer and again much of autumn I would consider fire in forests to be a total no go. If you get found by a ranger, you depend on his good will, ylu have no legal claim whatever (althioguh you pay texes to the state and thus shoudkl be seen as co-owner of the public forests, and the ranger being your employee...) . He is authorized to even have you being carried away by the police (he has policing power), and getting sued. But he can also decide to tolerate your stay if he is in the mood and sees you being of good willingness to leave no footprint behind in the nature of the place you are in. It depends on the place, the chemistry between you and him, and the man himself. From a legal standpoint however the case is always clear: its illegal.

Chances to get caught by a ranger in germany I assume to be higher than in North america. Everythign is so small and tiny over here...

Similar issues here only some our National Forests allow someone to blaze a new trail to set up camp. Just dont use a bear trail and you'll be fine ;). Still, such things are frowned upon by rangers and campers alike because it does cause damage to the enviroment, especially with the recent influx of new visitors. Myself I make a point to use established man made trails and clearings. I always pack out everything I pack in and take a large contractor trash bag with me to pick up after those inconsiderate slobs. You know I have a fire starter and cotton balls to start a campfire but like my survival knife I seldom use them. Had'em for years but they look brand new. Mostly just use a match to light my stove cook a meal from time to time and thats it. There are some Appalachian Trail (APT) through hikers on youtube who share some good recipes for no cook 'survival' meals. I also dehydrate and vacuum seal my own food, so much less expensive and still very light weight I can pack foid for many days and I can always find water to rehydrate it.

Oh, Mr. Quatro. when I get my hair slicked back in a ponytail and look at you. Others have said I look closer to Rasputin than a mountain man :D

Mr Quatro

12-22-20, 01:33 PM

Oh, Mr. Quatro. when I get my hair slicked back in a ponytail and look at you. Others have said I look closer to Rasputin than a mountain man :D

I was thinking more like Big Foot, but I didn't want to upset you :o

Catfish

12-22-20, 02:20 PM

Hello Rockstar,
thanks for the photos, wishing you a good time and Merry Christmas :)

Sean C

12-23-20, 04:30 AM

I've been following you for years and didn't know you looked like a mountain man :yep:

No offense meant - and I might be showing my age here - but that's a phrase that I truly never would have expected to hear in my lifetime. :har:

mapuc

12-24-20, 05:26 PM

Have just seen Greenland together with my Mom.

While watching this action disaster movie I was thinking.

If this happen a earth killer of an asteroid should hit us. I don't think all these survival kits one may have is useable..if the person doesn't know a basement very, very deep underground(and of course not near the impact zone)

I came to the conclusion it would be better to have a................................

Heck of a end of the world party and party until the end.

Markus

August

12-24-20, 08:44 PM

This is how i roll in the woods.

https://i.imgur.com/vK04kmcl.jpg

Onkel Neal

12-25-20, 12:21 AM

What? No satellite TV dish? :arrgh!:

August

12-25-20, 01:01 PM

What? No satellite TV dish? :arrgh!:

:)

Basic "campsite vision" has but two channels:

1. The campfire and the friends sitting around it.

2. The starry night sky.

But i'll take those any day over the best TV service no matter how many channels it has.

Catfish

12-26-20, 01:59 PM

^ - ^^^ I like that.

I always wondered if those ATVs are easy to maintain and repair :hmmm:

August

12-26-20, 07:33 PM

^ - ^^^ I like that.

I always wondered if those ATVs are easy to maintain and repair :hmmm:

Easy enough I guess. I've had that one since y2k.

Onkel Neal

12-27-20, 09:08 AM

That's a beautiful setup, August, plus you seem to live near the woods, you will have the added responsibility to repopulate the world. :up:

Torvald Von Mansee

12-28-20, 04:09 AM

https://i.postimg.cc/vHRByxD7/PSX-20201221-113727.jpg

My beard has more white in it :wah:

Skybird

02-13-21, 06:01 PM

https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/gesellschaft/prepper-und-corona-einblicke-in-eine-unuebersichtliche-szene-a-367c46b7-6143-43e5-ba5a-af6c5acf9ea0

Listening to preppers can be worthwhile

From Gabriela Keller

Has the pandemic turned us all into preppers, prepared for disaster? Anyone who researches in the milieu will encounter end-time warriors, fanatics and survivors.
February 13, 2021, 6:19 p.m.

This text is an abbreviated and edited excerpt from the book: "Ready for Downfall: Prepper".

Security starts with a solid investment strategy, some gold and silver, a cash box with cash, a well-diversified share portfolio, Oliver Hornung knows that. "I'm not the prepper you find in the media who hops through the forest doing military exercises ", he says. It's Saturday afternoon, Hornung, a slender man with short brown hair who looks much younger than his 37 years is sitting in his apartment in a prefabricated building complex in the Marzahn district on the eastern edge of Berlin (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/berlin/) .

He says what many preppers don't have in mind are everyday, personal crises: losing one's job, for example. Or disability. “For example, I have a herniated disc and I'm out for a few months. That's why my employer fires me, ”he says. "Those are two problems that could have been provided for."

Hornung's answer to such risks is to save enough money to last six months. At least half of it should be at home in cash. He also stores precious metals and has invested part of his money in securities. In this way provision is made for all cases.

In prepperslang it says SHTF: ›**** hits the fan‹ - when the **** slaps on the fan.

The term prepper is derived from the English "to prepare" and describes people who prepare for the day when nothing is as it was before. In prepperslang it is called TEOTWAWKI, "The end of the world as we know it", the end of the world as we know it, or SHTF: "**** hits the fan" - when the **** slaps on the fan.

When journalists report on preppers, they are mostly about paranoid bunker freaks, nerds camping out in the wilderness, or politically confused Tag X strategists who bury food supplies in the ground. Since right-wing extremist groups such as the “Nordkreuz” network in Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/mecklenburg_vorpommern/) or the “Group S.” were exposed, the prepper has also come under the protection of the constitution; and in fact, in parts of the scene there are ideological and personal intersections with right-wing extremist milieus.

End-time militant warriors and neo-Nazis hoarding weapons have shaped the public image of preppers. This circumstance makes a differentiated representation of the scene difficult, one that does justice to reality and captures its heterogeneity. But those who only think of marginal figures wearing flecktarn with weapons depot are falling short: The movement has long been and not just since the corona crisis stretched far into the middle of society.

There are preppers from a wide range of educational backgrounds and income groups; many have academic degrees and an above-average income. In America (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/amerika/) , where the phenomenon originated, trend researcher Gerald Celente identified “neo-survivalism” as a new movement as early as winter 2010: “Every new horror creates a new, different group focused on survival, and so the spectrum expands from paramilitary stereotypes and now includes concerned citizens on all socio-economic levels, «he writes. »Survivalism«, so it goes on in his trend report, survival in emergency situations is advancing to mainstream.

In the USA (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/usa/) , of course, the topic has a completely different dimension: prepping is a billion dollar industry there. The corona crisis has made private crisis prevention a mass phenomenon in Germany as well: There is hardly a German household that did not at least set up a small warehouse with food and hygiene products in the first days of the pandemic.

The prospect of not being able to leave the apartment in the event of a quarantine also drove careless minds, who otherwise have little more in the fridge than mustard, butter, a half-empty bottle of gin and a pack of buffalo mozzarella, to careful storage. Canned bread sellers reported a rapid increase in demand at the beginning of the lockdown in spring 2020, suppliers of convenience food and emergency equipment barely kept up with their orders, and the number of prepper groups on social media exploded.

"You really have to have everything there because, in an emergency, they'll buy everything empty and would probably beat each other to death."

Oliver Hornung, born and raised in East Berlin (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/ost_berlin/) , has been prepping for a good ten years. But he stays to himself, he prefers to stay out of the prepper groups on social media, he says: “Because the majority are not only right-wing, but partly real Nazis. Reich Citizen. I don't want to have anything to do with people. ”In his cramped apartment he leans back on his couch, all around white Ikea shelves on light laminate. The trained wholesale and retail salesman works as an e-commerce consultant and runs his own web shop, through which he sells plastic-free packaged natural sponges. On his blog “City Prepper” he publishes tips for crisis preparedness in large cities.

When the corona crisis began and he saw people in the supermarkets frantically buying hamsters, he sensed that he was right with his precautions. "I was very surprised by the people's reactions because I thought: It's still nothing." He was above all amazed by the people who became aggressive in the Rewe aisles and got into arguments because there weren't enough on the shelves Noodles were. "I found it very bizarre and almost a little frightening how mindless people act," he says. "Which shows me: You actually have to have everything there because, in an emergency, they buy everything empty and would probably beat each other to death."

Since the pandemic spread across the world at the beginning of 2020, the prepper scene suddenly appeared in a new light. The New York Times ran the headline in March: “You have prepared for the worst. Now everyone is a prepper «. A headline in the Guardian read: “We laughed at preppers and survivalists. Until the pandemic struck. «It was an exceptional situation that most people in Europe (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/europa/) had never imagined before. Images from hospitals in Italy (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/italien/) and Spain (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/spanien/) looked like scenes from an end-of-time film: overworked intensive care units, half-naked, artificially ventilated patients who fill rooms and corridors, next to doctors in protective suits, nurses who collapse at their desks - suddenly it was all reality.

These impressions run deep and have shaken many people's feeling of security. In addition to the fear of the virus itself, there were far-reaching restrictions on public life. In the initial phase of the lockdown, it was also not clear to what extent the crisis would affect the supply situation: The media saw images of perplexed customers in front of empty supermarket shelves, desperate mothers looking for milk powder, and miles of queues of trucks stuck at the borders. The newspapers reported of hamster purchases and delivery problems, everyday goods such as baking yeast or toilet paper were hardly available for weeks.

The generations born after the war had never seen anything like it. In normal times, the only problem is choosing between dozens of variations of toilet paper. But these weren't normal times. Suddenly the concern about bottlenecks and temporary emergencies was real. The days in February made it clear that the flow of goods in Germany is also stalling and that temporary shortages can arise. Preppers have known this for a long time.

Oliver Hornung has enough supplies to support himself, his girlfriend and his child for six months. He's also written a book called Prepping. One-year plan «. In it, he describes how to build up a long-term supply within a year, which things belong in the bug-out bag, i.e. the emergency backpack that is always available, and how to develop skills that could be helpful in a crisis: baking bread, dried fruit establish first aid. "For many people, unemployment, natural disasters or other emergencies would cause fear and panic," he writes. "But if you've stocked up supplies for your family and you know you could survive in an emergency, you don't have to worry."

Many preppers are constantly working to improve their crisis-relevant skills ; at Oliver Hornung it is mostly about financial know-how. He taught himself how best to proceed when it comes to pensions. He has watched YouTube videos on investment strategies for retail investors, listened to podcasts, and read guidebooks. "That is one thing that is not taught at all in our education system: financial education - that is completely missing," he says. "But what if what happens then?" For him, it's not about a day or the collapse of all systems, but rather about temporary disruptions or supply bottlenecks.

That does not mean that he does not consider major catastrophes to be conceivable, such as meteorite strikes, super volcanic eruptions or lengthy power outages. Most likely, however, is an economic crisis, he says: “That will come. We are just at the beginning, I think. The next year or two will likely be very challenging for many people. "

When the crisis comes, whatever it should be, Hornung knows what to do. He is not going to stay in this apartment. He has a second one that he is currently using as an office. He would be there on foot in 20 minutes. There he would barricade himself with his girlfriend, his child and the dog, barricade doors and windows and behave as inconspicuously as possible so that nobody notices that they are still there. Looters and burglars do not worry him very much: "The good thing about these Marzahn apartments: They are already very safe," he says. “They have security doors. You can't just open it. "

"Preppers may think a little further than normal people."

How did he get into prepping? Hornung says that he was often out and about in the forest as a child and that he experienced two tsunamis while backpacking in Australia (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/australien/) . But none of that really explains why the crisis issue is so central to him. He ponders for a moment, then says, “I would almost say: logical common sense. That may sound arrogant, but preppers might think a little further than normal people who only care about themselves and the here and now. ”As Hornung sees it, many people give up responsibility for their lives, and when they face setbacks they give up put the blame on others and expect others to take care of their problems.

For him, the prepper is the active, prudent opposite of this dependent, wretched citizen. Storage is also not as expensive as it might look. In the beginning it takes some effort to accumulate the supplies, but now there is little more to do than regularly replenish the shelves and update stocks. So lack of time is not an argument. "The majority of people waste a lot of time, watch RTL in the evening, look at their cell phones, look at Facebook (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/facebook/) or Instagram and just waste time that can be used differently."

Oliver Hornung has worked his way up. His family lived in poor conditions, the lower middle class, there was no financial planning, but debts. At first he let himself drift, had what he calls a "Larry job" in the call center. Only the birth of his child made him ambitious. Today he is successful with his online business, business with natural sponges is going well, and his sales figures are even benefiting from the corona crisis. But he still has a lot to do. His goal is to develop the webshop into a plastic-free drugstore.

Hornung has already organized most of the prepping, his provisions are in place. Nevertheless there are still things that he wants to develop further; he would like to develop his survival skills. In the long term, he plans to buy a plot of land in the surrounding area. Hornung says he is an introvert and that he does not feel comfortable around people. His wish is to be able to grow fruit and vegetables himself, in other words: "a more natural life". How exactly should that look like? "Little house, in the forest, by the lake, where you really have peace."

Now we are all preppers - or at least at the beginning of the crisis the impression took hold that it can be smart to prepare for tougher times. Many of those who stocked up on tinned ravioli, pasta and dried meat in February 2020 broke their supplies just a few weeks later. But the crisis has shattered many people's trust in the reliability of just-in-time supply chains, and the preppers, who were previously treated with ridicule and disdain, feel confirmed.

The pandemic has triggered some paradoxical developments: on the one hand, the prepper idea spread among the German middle class, on the other, the radicality increased on the outer fringes of the scene: conspiracy theories are mingling in the semi-public of the prepper chat groups on Telegram and hatred with fantasies of an approaching collapse of society - and sometimes also looking forward to the catastrophe.

In the first few weeks of the pandemic in particular, observers feared that right-wing extremists and militant prepper groups might see the time for a violent overthrow in the corona crisis. As the Berlin Office for the Protection of the Constitution wrote in an analysis in spring 2020, crises "for constitutional enemies are signs of the flawedness of the democratic system". The "supposed weakness of the state" could "spark an uprising, a" day X "or other acts of violence represent «.

Sometimes it is just a step from telling stories about the coming system collapse to actively planning actions that are supposed to promote it - the mental games of the "Gruppe Nordkreuz" (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/panorama/justiz/mecklenburg-vorpommern-munition-fuer-den-tag-x-a-1272059.html) or the "Gruppe S." (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/politik/deutschland/gruppe-s-mutmassliche-rechtsterroristen-von-generalbundesanwalt-angeklagt-a-86125f28-48cb-4c88-a7f0-6344928e8bce) have proven this.

Most preppers aren't right-wing extremists (https://2pwutjqp3kfdm6ii7uvixqow44--www-spiegel-de.translate.goog/thema/deutschland_rechtsextremismus/) . More often, one encounters a mixture of libertarianism and an ecological back-to-nature ethos in the scene. At the same time, however, the belief in the instability of our systems and the susceptibility of digitized, globalized modernity extends deep into majority society. Prepping is always a form of analysis of the present, at the same time an expression of identity consumption and consumer criticism. It is precisely with this particular dialectic that the preppers represent a pointed cipher for the contradictions of late capitalism. So it is worth listening to them. Your preparations for collapse say a lot about the state of the world as we know it.

ET2SN

02-13-21, 06:16 PM

No one in their right mind is going to trade food and fire wood for gold and silver. :haha: You can't burn them or eat them, so what's the point?

I find it hard to believe that a post-apocalypse society is going to have a central bank.

At least with cash, you can burn it to start a fire. :yeah:

Skybird

02-13-21, 08:01 PM

^ Blödsinn.

My grandparents on my father'S side, their family and villagers had to flee from the Russians and Czechs at the end of WWII, they were Sudeten. I know for certain that on several occasions they had to barter with their women'S jewelry, rings, and silver coins with farmers to get something to eat (because the Reichmark did not buy anything anymore...), and to bribe policemen or guards or officials. They got ripped off, of course. But they made it through, though with luck, a Russian patrol once caught them, but the leader was a man with a heart and did not want to murder babies and kids, so let them go.If thery would niot have had somethign of value to barter with, I would not sit here and type this in, because I would have never gotten born.

And if it is an ounce of silver for tweo eggs and half a loaf of bread. Bartering needs somehing you can barter with.

As long as no meteor hits the earth, near future crisis will always have those who have something, and those who have nothing, or at least far less. The bartering value of precious metals and jewelry will drop zo zero only when nobody sees any future anymore when the light will return to the world.

And if this still does not make you think twice about what you just said, then explain why gold and silver and jewelry have maintained their value storage function and are being held in high esteem by humans not since just centuries, but since MILLENIA. ;) Is there any stock paper or paper currency that can claim the same?

The next crisis we face, will be the endgame of the financial crisis that runs since the 70s, and the showdown for the paper money system, and a resulting economic crisis. The latter I think could last for YEARS. And states will try to plunder people off their private property as best as they can, will steal where they know something of value is there that can be stolen. You said gold and central bank in on sentence, implying that it needs central banks to trade with precious metals. Thats Blödsinn, too. Central banks were only founded to replace gold - that one did not have enough of anymore - with in principle worthless paper "money"! When central banks and paper money are long since in ruins, gold will still be held in high esteem. Promised. So valuable that states will try to prohibit private ownership, and confiscate (=plunder) it from private people.

That worthless and useless gold is. ;) So worthless that everbyody of sane mind wants it.

Its a safety to keep and conserve bartering power you have accumulated and saved, do not want to spend it right now to have reserves for the future. Though a safety it only is if the state does not know you own it. thjats why you should buy and hold it anonymously, andnthat si why the mwerciells redecue the ammount of gold allowed to be bought anonymously. The state wants to know where he can plunder in the future, you see.

No one in their right mind is going to trade food and fire wood for gold and silver. :haha: You can't burn them or eat them, so what's the point?

If I have enough firewood and food supplies, I possibly am willing to take your bars and coins if they are of real gold and silver, and give you wood and some eggs for it. Because i have it and you seem to need it. Come better times again, I will be rich, and you will be poor. ;) What you bartered to get, will have been consumed up and your hands are empty, but I will go and have shopping tours again, and yes: plural.

em2nought

02-14-21, 04:44 AM

Silver is damned heavy. :D Having a little pirate chest full of it is kinda fun though. Too poor to do that with gold. :03:

Onkel Neal

02-14-21, 05:29 PM

In full prep mode starting now. Arctic blast coming down into South Texas, temps expected to below freezing for 48 consecutive hours! (https://weather.com/safety/winter/news/2021-02-14-winter-storm-uri-south-midwest-northeast-snow-ice)

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/attachment.php?attachmentid=4029&d=1613341757

Jimbuna

02-15-21, 10:57 AM

In full prep mode starting now. Arctic blast coming down into South Texas, temps expected to below freezing for 48 consecutive hours! (https://weather.com/safety/winter/news/2021-02-14-winter-storm-uri-south-midwest-northeast-snow-ice)

Good job you don't live where I do in 'Geordieland' then :03:

50 degrees, Texans turn the central heating on...
Geordies plant their gardens

40 degrees, Texans shiver uncontrollably...
Geordies Sunbathe

30 degrees, Texans cars will not start....
Geordies drive with their windows down

20 degrees, Texans wear coats, gloves and wooly hats...
Geordies throw on a t-shirt(Girls start wearing mini-skirts)

10 degrees, Texans begin to evacuate...
Geordies go swimming in the North Sea

Zero degrees, Texan landlords turn up the heat...
Geordies have the last barbecue before it gets cold

Minus 10 degrees, Texans cease to exist...
Geordies throw on a lightweight jacket

Minus 80 degrees, Polar bears start to wonder if its worth it...
Geordie boy scouts start wearing long trousers

Minus 100 degrees, Santa Claus abandons the North Pole...
Geordies put on their long johns

Minus 173 degrees, alcohol freezes...
Geordies become frustrated as the pubs are shut

Minus 297 degrees, Microbiological life begins to disappear...
The cows on the Town Moor complain that the vets have cold hands

Minus 460 degrees, All atomic motion stops...
Geordies start to stamp their feet and blow on their hands

Minus 500 degrees, Hell freezes over....
Trump wins the election after a recount :)

Onkel Neal

02-15-21, 11:34 AM

Mr Quatro

02-15-21, 01:24 PM

Man that's cold ... I don't think I've been below 10 degrees back in 2012, but this storm is a huge storm. :o

Surprised more people aren't trapped in it :yep:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/topstories/ice-snow-bitter-cold-hits-millions-as-major-storm-pummels-swaths-of-country/ar-BB1dH7PG?ocid=BingNews&pfr=1

As the plains continue to grapple with the Arctic chill, the National Weather Prediction Center said numerous new record lows were established Monday, including minus 6 in Oklahoma City and 5 degrees in Dallas.

ET2SN

02-15-21, 01:29 PM

When I was growing up in northern Maine, I remember going out to play when it was -50F. In order to get that cold, there couldn't be any kind of wind or breeze.

Of course, that was before I moved to Iowa. :doh:
Minus 10 and a "slight" 30 MPH breeze is something to behold- but not for long. :o

Still, the coldest I ever felt was in Pusan/Busan Korea in the winter. That was flat-out nasty.

Mr Quatro

02-15-21, 01:42 PM

Galveston, Texas this morning (just got it off of FB)

https://scontent-dfw5-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/p526x395/148449420_3863077717047400_5198961344681955700_o.j pg?_nc_cat=100&ccb=3&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=hC_5ehJuY3AAX-AbUCu&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-2.xx&tp=6&oh=f9d1209d4d08badd11302547e1acf8ee&oe=604E7CE0

August

02-15-21, 01:57 PM

I think global warming was all that was staving off the next ice age. All those people who stayed home this summer made a measurable dent in air pollution and this is the result.

Jimbuna

02-15-21, 02:09 PM

Three or four nights ago it was -16C but today it was +10C :doh:

Catfish

02-15-21, 03:39 PM

ET2SN

02-15-21, 04:02 PM

Power has been out since 02:30, outside temp is -8.3C / 17F

Temp in the house got down to 8C/48F before I woke up and hooked up the gennie. Generator has been powering the furnace and the PC, so it's 18C/66F now. I can hang on for 4 days.

Something I just remembered :o , if its significantly below freezing and that's REALLY novel to your location, as long as your have water pressure in the pipes its best to slightly crack open one or two faucets. Not a drip, more like a minimal stream of water. You want to do this for both hot and cold water. :yep:
The reason being, you want to maintain a minimal flow of water in your pipes if there's a chance your pipes could freeze. This is really important on the inlet side of your water system (this is why you also want to crack a hot water tap, even if you have power).

It could be worse, at least the Gators are hibernating. :yeah:

Skybird

02-15-21, 04:11 PM

Power has been out since 02:30, outside temp is -8.3C / 17F

Temp in the house got down to 8C/48F before I woke up and hooked up the gennie. Generator has been powering the furnace and the PC, so it's 18C/66F now. I can hang on for 4 days.
No need to die on day 5 with cold feet. You want one of these:

https://images.askari-sport.com/de/product/1/detail/sitz-und-fussheizung.jpg
https://images.askari-sport.com/de/product/2/detail/sitz-und-fussheizung-1612825243.jpg

:D

August

02-15-21, 04:54 PM

My Texan cousins report mostly burst pipes. They knew about cracking the faucets but that didn't help. Problem is their houses just aren't set up for those temps. I told them they should get a generator. A freeze might be a once in a lifetime event but if they loose power to their ACs in the summer they might easily burst into flame.

ET2SN

02-15-21, 09:00 PM

Most people know where to buy a generator but they have no clue how to own one. :yep:

If you use it for camping three weeks per year, that's great.
If you buy one to power the house when the lines shut down, you're probably wasting money (assuming you also had the house wiring changed).

The reality is that if you lose power for more than a day, you're better off driving to where things are still normal and renting a hotel room.:up:

To start off, consider how much you'll be running that generator. Let's say you buy a gas-powered 1 kilowatt generator with a Briggs and Stratton grass mower engine. You're thinking ahead so you also buy a spiffy new plastic gas can and fill it with E85 ethanol, just in case its ever needed. Assuming you bought everything "off season", you may be "in" for less than $1 grand. You even found a great place to store it in the garage.

:yeah:

Believe it or not, this is about as much thought as most people put into a generator. We're not even talking about paying an electrician to come out and re-wire the house and install a cross-over/isolation switch. Or, for that matter, how to start the generator and when to throw the switch/es.

What winds up happening is that the power goes out, the generator either won't start when its needed, or it runs until you plug it into the right plug and throw the switch and then it either stops immediately or starts smoking. :timeout:

Nine times out of ten, you just tried to use a 1 KW generator with a 5 HP engine to restore the power to every house and electronic device in your county. :yep: If you're lucky, a fuse or two blew out. If you aren't, you just blew up your source of electricity.

That 1 kilowatt sounds damn impressive. It should be plenty of power to run the house, right? Think again. You have 1,000 watts of power available at 120 volts AC. Divide that 1,000 watts by 120 volts and you get.. 8 amps. :yep:
Look up the typical amperage loads of house appliances and start adding them together, you'll quickly zoom past those 8 amps the generator is struggling to provide. :yep:

So, is the generator even worth the effort? It depends on your situation and your budget. That 1 KW generator sure beats the snot out of having nothing.
How you use that generator is best described with two words that are VERY important:

DUTY CYCLE

You only have 8 amps to play with and if you try to run that generator 24 hours a day, bad things will start to happen quickly. So, plan ahead. Plan what to run and how long it needs to run to get what you need.

Forget about the electric range and oven, wrong type of power. Forget about the TV, its too wasteful. Get used to one lamp in the living room and only having one hour to use it. Can you run the furnace off 120 volt AC? Now would be a good time to find out.

Speaking of power, let's spend some time thinking about that gasoline that's going to save your butt. :up: Has it been sitting in the garage for the last five years? It might not be any good now. How much do you have? One gallon, maybe five? Where will you get more? Remember, those pumps at the gas station run on electricity.. :yep:

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 04:07 AM

Something I just remembered :o , if its significantly below freezing and that's REALLY novel to your location, as long as your have water pressure in the pipes its best to slightly crack open one or two faucets. Not a drip, more like a minimal stream of water. You want to do this for both hot and cold water. :yep:
The reason being, you want to maintain a minimal flow of water in your pipes if there's a chance your pipes could freeze. This is really important on the inlet side of your water system (this is why you also want to crack a hot water tap, even if you have power).

It could be worse, at least the Gators are hibernating. :yeah:

Still no power, water company just sent alert, they are shutting down the water supply. Internet down too, just my mobile. What's worse: more icy weather rules out driving, expected to continue through friday

Skybird

02-16-21, 04:43 AM

Neal, hunker down as best as you can, more is coming.

The National Weather Service said the next storm was expected to move from the Rockies into the Southern Plains on Tuesday, bringing freezing rain to east Texas and Louisiana and as much as 8 inches of snow to parts of Oklahoma, Arkansas and southern Missouri.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/weather/knocked-out-texas-millions-face-record-lows-without-power-new-n1257964

Frozen roads in your part of Texas will not help electricity companies to have their teams moving around.

Jimbuna

02-16-21, 05:27 AM

Read your message and have responded, so hope you have been able to read it....you take good care and I'll keep the office tidy.

Rockstar

02-16-21, 12:19 PM

Still no power, water company just sent alert, they are shutting down the water supply. Internet down too, just my mobile. What's worse: more icy weather rules out driving, expected to continue through friday

Be careful when choosing secondary heating sources and where you place them, especially in homes with older outlets and wiring that may cause electrical resistance. Every season around where I live when it's the coldest fire trucks are racing to at least one residential fire.

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 12:55 PM

Boy, the power came on for about 10 minutes, long enough to get online and see the weather does not look as severe as previously predicted.

https://weather.com/weather/tenday/l/fc21edde2236c98ed7da1437ab13d8e9b9d6088f1cd0957b83 90b13ed784d26f

If the internet would just stay on... but it seems to go with the power.

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 02:26 PM

I have to say, 2021 is not off to a good start.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/attachment.php?attachmentid=4032&d=1613503601

Jeff-Groves

02-16-21, 02:34 PM

I am having the most interesting talks in other forums about the Winter Blast in Texas.
One of the big things is diesel fuel freezing in trucks!
Not a problem here in Ohio as additives are already placed in our fuel.
We also mostly have generators and fuel on hand just in case.

At what point did people down South figure they'd not need a Gen or fuel?
:hmmm:

I'd think after the 2005 Hurricane? A gen would be a requirement.

Another thing I see is how cold the house feels. Lack of insulation.
Ummm. You Air Condition down there so cold air getting in is cold air getting out!

Given the Internet can and does go out here?
I Hot Spot my Cell Phone for that.
Most Cell Towers have back up Gens to keep them running so Internet should be no issue.
But that is Ohio. We prep for hot and cold as both are well known to kill you here.

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 02:52 PM

Yeah, I have been using my cell as a hot spot for 6 years as my full time internet connection. The area where my new house is, the data is spotty. Will need to see if another carrier is better.

I do have a generator, a lot of folks do. You have to remember, we don't get this kind of weather here. Ever. This is like saying Ohio should be better prepared for hurricanes.

Mr Quatro

02-16-21, 02:55 PM

This kind of weather doesn't happen very often does it Neal?

at least in Texas :yep:

but tell us what you would do different next time :o

Jeff-Groves

02-16-21, 02:56 PM

You have to remember, we don't get this kind of weather here. Ever.
https://youtu.be/H2SuF9wxBjs

This whole thread is about prepping is it not?
So who says I'm not prepped for a Hurricane? I do get Tornado's here and the effects of Hurricanes.
I'm also near the New Madrid fault line.

I've not seen more then 10" of Snow in my drive way for about 10 years.
Today I had nearly 24"!
Should I have said it never happens here. Ever?

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 03:17 PM

This kind of weather doesn't happen very often does it Neal?

at least in Texas :yep:

but tell us what you would do different next time :o

Different cell carrier, although it doesn't matter much when the towers don't have juice and their backup generators run dry.

Jeff-Groves

02-16-21, 03:28 PM

In a total prepper situation?
ALL services are going to go the way of the DoDo.
No water, fuel, electricity, food, ammo, medicine, etc.

Given many depend on the slightest amount of all just to live day to day?
Why allow yourself to be in that type situation?

I can survive for quite awhile with no services of any type.
I may have to resort to taking what I need after awhile but I'm perfectly capable and armed for that.

Now. The Wife and I are not on any medications that are life saving. So I don't need to raid for Insulin or stuff like that.
Plenty of Deer and Turkey so food is not an issue.
Can burn wood for heat as I live near a large wooded area.
My Air Guns I can hand pump and have a HUGE reserve of ammo.

ET2SN

02-16-21, 03:52 PM

Still no power, water company just sent alert, they are shutting down the water supply. Internet down too, just my mobile. What's worse: more icy weather rules out driving, expected to continue through friday

Treat your vehicle(s) like your fall-out shelter. :up: Even if the roads are all ice and snow drifts, as long as the grill is clean and tail pipe is uncovered and the car is outside vs in the garage, you have a source of heat, light, and radio. :yep: With comfortable seats as well. :D

You don't have to think Survival, you just have to think Smart. :yep:

Skybird

02-16-21, 03:53 PM

I have to say, 2021 is not off to a good start.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/attachment.php?attachmentid=4032&d=1613503601
It could be worse. You could end up laying shockfrosted under a Texan glacier, in 100 thousand years it thaws, somebody mistakes your meat with a mammoth steak and you end up getting BBQed over a green-glowing plasma fire, marinaded in smoking Aucturus sauce with Nebula dill and Martian chilli flakes.

Have you ever been bitten before? A grey-skinned testbiter, maybe?

Skybird

02-16-21, 03:55 PM

Catfish

02-16-21, 04:14 PM

I have to say, 2021 is not off to a good start.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/attachment.php?attachmentid=4032&d=1613503601
:rotfl2::rotfl2: lmao
Post of the year material :up:

Still it is the power grid that failed, i don't think Greta has much to do with it ...
https://apnews.com/article/houston-sylvester-turner-austin-texas-c260c340f619688dd511cc6645b40a04
... yet!

Hope the weather will turn for the better as you wrote, it looked bad from here on monday.

Re surviving in a car, depending on engine and fuel consumption you can maybe survive 6-10 hours with engine idling, but what do you do then?
A generator is the better solution, and i am well aware of what all has to be done to install it.. as said before a wood oven, attached stirling engine for energy..
Living near a small stream can get you enough energy, but you have to install and maintain it all.
Don't make it too complicated, things can and will fail.

An oven with lots of wood, a well with a manual pump, some dried food and such should be enough for a few days. Maybe some solar panels for loading low energy devices like mobile phones, the car battery and such.

Catfish

02-16-21, 04:24 PM

As long as it is no e-car...
:haha:
I heard a burning Tesla gives you quite a lot of heat.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4Qhr_LLoJ0

External combustion engine :D

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 04:53 PM

Treat your vehicle(s) like your fall-out shelter. :up: Even if the roads are all ice and snow drifts, as long as the grill is clean and tail pipe is uncovered and the car is outside vs in the garage, you have a source of heat, light, and radio. :yep: With comfortable seats as well. :D

You don't have to think Survival, you just have to think Smart. :yep:

My car is a last resort. I have 10 days fuel with my generator to sustain me before I have to go to my car.

https://youtu.be/XUCMQ0Y7EzE

Still it is the power grid that failed, i don't think Greta has much to do with it ...
https://apnews.com/article/houston-s...11cc6645b40a04
... yet!

I've heard that a large part of the failure is due to wind turbines freezing up, and solar panels snowed over. Texas is one of the largest wind power producers. Certainly didn't help in this situation.

Jeff-Groves

02-16-21, 04:55 PM

We need your GPS co-ords to come rob.....
Umm. Rescue you!
:D

ET2SN

02-16-21, 05:00 PM

Re surviving in a car, depending on engine and fuel consumption you can maybe survive 6-10 hours with engine idling, but what do you do then?

The key is NOT to run the car for 6-10 hours in one lump. Do what you need to get done then shut it off. :yep: A normal car should stay warm for at least a half hour to 45 minutes (not counting body heat) as long as you keep the doors and windows closed. We're not talking about a long weekend in Cancun, we're talking about Getting By.

This also applies to generators unless we're talking about pimped out Gucci generators with diesel engines and underground fuel tanks.
Look up what I meant by Duty Cycle. :yeah:

Skybird

02-16-21, 05:06 PM

https://youtu.be/XUCMQ0Y7EzE

You really must hate squirrels, man, I mean your flat is a single giant squirrel death trap. :doh:

Jeff-Groves

02-16-21, 05:11 PM

Ummm............
That couch at 1:00 looks like the one in PearLand back in 2005!
:o

Onkel Neal

02-16-21, 05:29 PM

You really must hate squirrels, man, I mean your flat is a single giant squirrel death trap. :doh:

What? How? I feed my squirrels.

ET2SN

02-16-21, 06:07 PM

He's talking about the wimpy German Squirrels. :har:

Skybird

02-16-21, 06:58 PM

What? How? I feed my squirrels.
The many electric cables. ;) Rodents. Electric cables. Not good.

ET2SN

02-16-21, 07:07 PM

Sky; North American squirrels can (and often do) steal hub caps off cars.
Plus, Neal is (CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP) deep in the heart of Texas and you don't want to know what those beasts are capable of. :o
I hear they like to swim in the Gulf of Mexico to hunt sharks.

Mr Quatro

02-16-21, 07:11 PM

Galveston, TX beach this morning 26*

https://scontent-dfw5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/150283019_3731113006981417_7169042146671579541_o.j pg?_nc_cat=105&ccb=3&_nc_sid=825194&_nc_ohc=VClnmD3OZgsAX9OQPp2&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-1.xx&oh=d811b9e44a0f9b15c7359bb6d279b3aa&oe=605089AB

Skybird

02-16-21, 08:29 PM

Catfish

02-17-21, 04:28 AM

[...] I've heard that a large part of the failure is due to wind turbines freezing up, and solar panels snowed over. Texas is one of the largest wind power producers. Certainly didn't help in this situation.
I don't think so.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/joewalsh/2021/02/16/wind-power-isnt-to-blame-for-texas-electricity-crisis/?sh=76a51f7e21b3

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/texas-power-outage-frozen-wind-turbines-b1803135.html

https://time.com/5939749/texas-storm-power-outage-wind-turbines/

I read wind energy supply can be around 25 to 60 percent in summer and less than 10 in winter, in Texas. Wind turbines may shut down in storms and feather the blades, but have an own heating system and seldom freeze.
Looks more like grid problems (wasn't that Texas grid and maintenance deregulated in Texas? (https://www.texastribune.org/2011/02/08/texplainer-why-does-texas-have-its-own-power-grid/)), and general gas production and distribution hampered by the cold.

Onkel Neal

02-17-21, 09:19 AM

The many electric cables. ;) Rodents. Electric cables. Not good.

Oh lord. The electric cords aren't there all year long.

Besides, as a low-level survivalist, I use the cords as bait to shoot squirrels and trade their meat for water and firewood.

Onkel Neal

02-17-21, 09:24 AM

I read wind energy supply can be around 25 to 60 percent in summer and less than 10 in winter, in Texas. Wind turbines may shut down in storms and feather the blades, but have an own heating system and seldom freeze.
Looks more like grid problems (wasn't that Texas grid and maintenance deregulated in Texas? (https://www.texastribune.org/2011/02/08/texplainer-why-does-texas-have-its-own-power-grid/)), and general gas production and distribution hampered by the cold.

Yeah, a lot of the problem is people wanting energy cheap, so the industry saves a buck or two every where they can. Still, if the wind farms cannot function, that's part of the problem.

It seems apparent that power generators haven’t done enough to winterize their plants, so shutdowns and failures kicked in just when the power was needed most. That extends to renewables, too, as wind turbines froze over. Natural gas transmission has been a problem as well.

https://www.star-telegram.com/opinion/editorials/article249285685.html

Mr Quatro

02-17-21, 11:04 AM

Meanwhile on a hill far away :o

https://scontent-dfw5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/145399777_10221985816808836_4672693675949305724_n. jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=3&_nc_sid=825194&_nc_ohc=FUaIQJFguDgAX9n13v9&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-1.xx&oh=9c046a859929365e66e088651877afa2&oe=6051F221

Jeff-Groves

02-17-21, 02:00 PM

:hmmm:
I never got an answer on that couch.

:har:

ET2SN

02-17-21, 02:51 PM

Don't forget a pilgrimage to Mare Island and the original Horse And Cow. :D

Mr Quatro

02-17-21, 03:03 PM

Don't forget a pilgrimage to Mare Island and the original Horse And Cow. :D

I don't think there is one left ... taken over by gay boys by now though if there is one. :yep:

The kind that look like girls that is :o

Skybird

02-17-21, 08:03 PM

Oh lord. The electric cords aren't there all year long.

Besides, as a low-level survivalist, I use the cords as bait to shoot squirrels and trade their meat for water and firewood.

Eichhörnchen HATE you!

https://s16.directupload.net/images/210218/jtduv59g.jpg (https://www.directupload.net)

August

02-17-21, 09:21 PM

Oh lord. The electric cords aren't there all year long.

Besides, as a low-level survivalist, I use the cords as bait to shoot squirrels and trade their meat for water and firewood.

Squirrel is good eating. Kinda tastes like dog.

Onkel Neal

02-17-21, 11:39 PM

Oh boy. :haha:

Gorpet

02-20-21, 01:43 AM

He's a Texan, Hell i think he posted a pic of a rattlesnake he shot. Southern folks can survive. I must apologize for that statement and the picture may have been from 1920

Catfish

02-20-21, 07:02 AM

Here we shoot TVs, much more dangerous.

Jeff-Groves

02-20-21, 09:58 AM

Don't the Squirrels in Texas hunt Rattle Snakes to use as bait to get alligators to eat?
:hmmm:
:har:

Onkel Neal

02-20-21, 10:34 AM

Neal and all who live in this "special" weather area: Stay safe.
@ Neal: has the power returned? Which generator do you use?

If we get a power-out here we really have a problem. Chimney for the installed oven not ready yet, all pumps and ignition of the heater/boiler done by electricity. At -15 degrees celsius it may be the heater pipes might freeze, and this would be real fun ...

I wanted to convert the old canola Elsbett engine of the VW to a power generator, but it is way too much hazzle - the dynamo alone would cost as much as a whole Diesel generator. So i am thinking about a Diesel/fuel driven one. Should be 220 Volts and around 5 kilowatts for emergency, and last for at least three days :hmmm:
A combined heat and power unit would be better of course (exhaust gases heating the water via heat exchanger as a by-product while producing electricity), but those are really expensive, and i would have to integrate this into the house heating system.

I have a Champion duel fuel, small generator, cheap, made in China. I run it once a month and do preventive maintenance, swap out the fuel every 3 months. I've had it 5 years and this is the first time I got an opportunity to put it to the test. It's fairly quiet, and the online rep is that it's reliable. If you wanted true quality, I would go with a Yamaha or Honda, but they cost twice as much and I don't need a generator very often.
https://www.championpowerequipment.com/product/100263-3400-watt-dual-fuel-inverter/
https://generatorbible.com/wp-content/uploads/Champion-100263-1.jpg

It is big enough to run my heating furnace, fridge and freezer, and still have plenty left for the TV, PC, and a few lights and a fan for summer. I make coffee on the stove in blackouts. The only downside is it will not run the house AC, so an extended blackout in the summer will be brutal. But if my grandparents could survive, I guess I can too :) If I experienced frequent power outages, I might opt for a much larger generator to run the AC, but I just don't think it's necessary. This is good enough.

Something I just remembered :o , if its significantly below freezing and that's REALLY novel to your location, as long as your have water pressure in the pipes its best to slightly crack open one or two faucets. Not a drip, more like a minimal stream of water. You want to do this for both hot and cold water. :yep:
The reason being, you want to maintain a minimal flow of water in your pipes if there's a chance your pipes could freeze. This is really important on the inlet side of your water system (this is why you also want to crack a hot water tap, even if you have power).
:

I was fortunate, so far as I can tell, no burst pipes or leaks! Which is good because all over Texas now, people are coping with scenes like this
Be careful when turning water back on. I turned mine on. I waited and listened for 10 minutes and left for 5 minutes. I came back to this.

https://scontent-dfw5-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/150591797_244939767224315_317841221839935269_n.jpg ?_nc_cat=106&ccb=3&_nc_sid=ae9488&_nc_ohc=7Z3nrDy5a3sAX9t9hHy&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-2.xx&oh=a045e59febefbe8a7c0bdc0fe8b85459&oe=6056C7DF

Texas domiciles are not made for prolonged hard freezes in combination with 4 day power outages. It wouldn't cost much to build that in during construction but, you know, everyone has their eye on the bottom line.

Here we shoot TVs, much more dangerous.
Are they good eatin'? :hmmm:

Well, that's it for the Great Texas Blizzard and Ercot disaster, forecast shows no temps below 36 for the next week. Nothing left to do except prep the generator for storage, roll up the electric cords, and clean up.

mapuc

02-20-21, 12:02 PM

Catfish

02-20-21, 12:36 PM

^@Mapuc
"If we destroy the earth it will kill us"

The redneck approach: "Not when we kill it first!"

Catfish

02-20-21, 12:46 PM

I have a Champion duel fuel, small generator, cheap, made in China. I run it once a month [...]
https://www.championpowerequipment.com/product/100263-3400-watt-dual-fuel-inverter/
https://generatorbible.com/wp-content/uploads/Champion-100263-1.jpg [...]
Thank you, yes this seems like an affordable solution!
Good to hear you made without major problems :up:

re shooting TVs:
Are they good eatin'? :hmmm:
They are smeaky bastards, spoiling your attitude for nature and the world, effectively poisoning your mind. And you cannot even eat them (toxic waste) :yep:

Onkel Neal

02-20-21, 06:37 PM

If I understand from what I read in this thread, You are not expecting things like
Nuclear holocaust
Earth killer meteor/Asteroid/Planetoid

I guess you are planning on a total breakdown of the society and other disaster where you are able to live in your basement or in the woods/montains.

Markus

I'm a realistic person, there's not much I can do in those cases. My goal is to be able to ride out 3 weeks without power and services, and not be forced to stand in those mile long chump lines for water, gas, or something to eat.

Thank you, yes this seems like an affordable solution!
Good to hear you made without major problems :up:

re shooting TVs:

They are smeaky bastards, spoiling your attitude for nature and the world, effectively poisoning your mind. And you cannot even eat them (toxic waste) :yep:

Lol, yeah. The cost of the generator isn't too bad. I swear you'll be thankful when you need it and it's there.

Skybird

02-20-21, 08:27 PM

3 weeks is still short. Realistically, aim for 3-4 months. That timeframe can be prepared for if you invest a low 4-digit budget, and have the space, one room, to store it.

The reason is simply that if ther eis a nationw ide power blackoput lasting for lets say 3-5 days, it will take weeks and months to bring the poiwergrid back online (assuming that option still exists), a longer power grid is nothign that can be easily turned on again after it was off for that long. Consider sweet water from pipes not comign back before after weeks. Consider that supply line shad failed for mlogn time, and logistics will be seriousl interrupted therefore for longer time than just the power blackout lasted.

I aimed at mixing emergency ratios (NRG-5), canned food (fish, MREs) , cereals plus "atste-givers" (conserved sauces or whatever) at eqaul ammounts (measured in days). Plus a variety of different ioptions to heat water or a meal, I made sure that wahtever sort of fuel I can get when reserves are off - I can make use if it, no matter what kind of fuel it is, (including wood).

We talk not about havign a healthy meal every day. We talk emergency: we talk about calories, some variation in tastes (proven tastes that you like, dpo not buy cans you do not like), and water (exlsuively for drinkling).

We also talk medical items, batteries, light both electric and candle. All in big quantities.

Also, passive warming options if heating is off. Texans learned it the hard way these days. By passive I mean clothes, sleeping bags, all of according type and quality. Ask you granparents, if they still live. They still remember easy tricks.

Finally, weapons to defend what you have, and a quarter where you löivbe or where you quickly could move to, that is above average secured, can be defended against plunderers.

A power blackput of lasting quality is somethignt at causes disruptions for severla times as long time as the blackout lasted. One night, a few hours, is one thing.

I am not aiming at wanting to survive the apocalypse - why would anyone want that...? But I want to be bale to comfortbaly sit out sudden shop hord8ng ewars like the toilet aper thing in the early days of corona. and serious desaster for a time of up to 3 months - and I want that reserve beign there every day of the year, with no further preparation needed.

I have integrated parts of the food and household item reserves into my ordinary daily and weekly consume-and-resupply scheme. This kind of rotating stock-keeping is somethign that just 2-3 generations ago was very common and every household, especially if not living in big cities, practiced it. Modern delivery-on-demand is for stupids. Modern, but stupid. Our granparents thought rotating stock-keeping was clever. And it was, and is!

P.S. Stockpile drinking water not in palastic bags, but glas bags. Buy sparkling water, it provides additional desonfecting protection. Have empty storage tools like water bags and canisters and so forth ready, to fill them with usage water if you have time left to get prepared. People often overlook what effect it will be when the toilet flushing is off in a city and for longer time.

And the most important rule: ration form beginning on, since you do not know what is coming and how long it will last.

Have sweets, chocolate,cookies: and lots of them. They chemically boost morale, whcih is reölevant if you are not alone, and have maybe even chilkdren around. Emergencies are the wrong time to think of healthy diets.

I recommend also coconut oil/fat (depends on the temperature only). Easy to store, extrenely versatile, keeps fresh for long wothout needing cooling, and is an excellent energy supplier - AND is more uncritical for health concerns of any kind. Also, it tastes great, I even do it into my coffee sometimes.

ET2SN

02-20-21, 09:11 PM

I've been talking about "practical disasters" in this thread. Things like floods, tornados, blizzards and heavy snow fall that result in a disaster area.

If you're in a situation where you're looking at long-term hardship (loss of power for more than 4-5 days), bug out. As long as the roads are passable all you need to do is drive 100-400 miles until you see houses with the lights on.

Staying in a disaster area for a prolonged period only opens you up to a greater risk of infections, dysentery, parasites, and bullet wounds. Leave the fighting to the cave men and get out. :up:

Keep your important papers (titles, mortgages, birth certificates, policies, bank records, passports, ID) in a zip-type plastic bag and take it with you.

Onkel Neal

02-21-21, 09:45 AM

3 weeks is still short. Realistically, aim for 3-4 months. That timeframe can be prepared for if you invest a low 4-digit budget, and have the space, one room, to store it.

The reason is simply that if ther eis a nationw ide power blackoput lasting for lets say 3-5 days, it will take weeks and months to bring the poiwergrid back online (assuming that option still exists), a longer power grid is nothign that can be easily turned on again after it was off for that long. Consider sweet water from pipes not comign back before after weeks. Consider that supply line shad failed for mlogn time, and logistics will be seriousl interrupted therefore for longer time than just the power blackout lasted.

Also, passive warming options if heating is off. Texans learned it the hard way these days. By passive I mean clothes, sleeping bags, all of according type and quality. Ask you granparents, if they still live. They still remember easy tricks.

Finally, weapons to defend what you have, and a quarter where you löivbe or where you quickly could move to, that is above average secured, can be defended against plunderers.

A power blackput of lasting quality is somethignt at causes disruptions for severla times as long time as the blackout lasted. One night, a few hours, is one thing.

I am not aiming at wanting to survive the apocalypse - why would anyone want that...? But I want to be bale to comfortbaly sit out sudden shop hord8ng ewars like the toilet aper thing in the early days of corona. and serious desaster for a time of up to 3 months - and I want that reserve beign there every day of the year, with no further preparation needed.

And the most important rule: ration form beginning on, since you do not know what is coming and how long it will last.

True. Three weeks is my target, though I'm sure there's enough food for a couple months. I just don't expect any hurricane or freeze to shut down the trucks to the store for more than that. And you are right, rationing should take effect immediately, as you said, you just don't know how long a disaster will last.

Now, for the collapse of society or something that means stores are empty, power is out, no one has a job for months; that could happen but it would be unprecedented. I really don't have a plan for that, other than return to the ranch and dig in. The neighbors and my family would form a group and I would be guarding cattle from starving Houstonians. I can see it now, I'm engrossed in a book and a desperate band of urbanites overwhelms me. Let's hope it doesn't come to that!

I've been talking about "practical disasters" in this thread. Things like floods, tornados, blizzards and heavy snow fall that result in a disaster area.

If you're in a situation where you're looking at long-term hardship (loss of power for more than 4-5 days), bug out. As long as the roads are passable all you need to do is drive 100-400 miles until you see houses with the lights on.

Staying in a disaster area for a prolonged period only opens you up to a greater risk of infections, dysentery, parasites, and bullet wounds. Leave the fighting to the cave men and get out. :up:

Keep your important papers (titles, mortgages, birth certificates, policies, bank records, passports, ID) in a zip-type plastic bag and take it with you.

Bug out to where? Hotel in another area? Relatives? Country estate? That could be a problem if the disaster is widespread, lot of people, no place to go. Plus you would need to leave before the disaster, in many cases, to be able to travel. If you can get out and you have a place to go, that would be smart.

Mr Quatro

02-21-21, 10:19 AM

Learn from your mistakes :yep:
these are not my mistakes, but could very easily be

Old cars if allowed hold treated gasoline (gas gets old)
Old vans with inflatable water tanks inside
Garden supplies include seeds and fertilizer

Wind generators that are laying down on the ground ready to be raised up in an emergency (they make noise)

Male and female animals

Chicken coop

Make sure your septic tank is cleaned every year

Heck with solar panel for power

Get solar panels that circulate water for hot water :yep:

skidman

02-21-21, 10:40 AM

Matthew 6:26

Skybird

02-21-21, 11:31 AM

I do not plan for apocalyptic scenarios and scenarios of lasting social colklapse, becasue you cannot plan for that. And I wonder why I would wish to make it through such an endless scenario.

I plan for temporary and likely scenarios of limited tiomespan. Big blackout. Paper currency collapsing. And since corona for toilet paper shortages. :)

It is importan thowever that people do not overlook that such scenarios causea rattail of follow-on problems that extend the time of hardship. Many seem to not have this on their radar. The whole stores supply logistic depend on functioning electricty and communication. If these were off for logner time, the whole logistics chain has brojen down, and will not come back to life any time soon just because now there is power in the wire again. Or consider dried-out sweet water pipes, fully infected with all kind of germs and txcines avfter soem days not having held water. The sewages system. It all needs to be cleaned again,a nd started form scratch again. And that will take WEEKS and WEEKS after power came back.

Think long, look far, plan ahead.

I have no car, but cars loose their value if gasoline stations cannot pump out fuel and get no new fuel supplies.

I am getting older, and will find it ever more difficlt to endure pyhsicla challenges of moving around a lot with heavy luggage. The older I get the more my strategy will and must shift to stationary defence. Mobility is for the younger, stronger. Thats the grim truth.

And in the end: why asusming that I will or must live forever? At some oint it becomes mor eimpritant how we face the time we mist die. Crying, yelling and hysterically strampling, or - well, differently? Sooner or laer, everybody of us needs to answer this question, and it will be asked only once and the answer will be irrevocable. Fight fiercly as long as it makes sense, but if it makes no sense anymore, I see nothing wrong in calming down and stop fighting. All ways of living lead us to the moment we die. So...?

mapuc

02-21-21, 12:21 PM

How high the chance is that we will get hit by a killer asteroid or similar I can't say.

The chance for being hit by a massive magnetic solar storm is a lot higher. The positive is...it only hit part of earth. But the power loss will be for month in the areas where it hits...if the country hasn't equip the power thing for this(In Denmark only 6 % has been modified to withstand such a storm)

So plan for more than just these 2-4 weeks.

Markus

Jeff-Groves

02-21-21, 12:40 PM

I live in a VERY small Village.
I have camo and very high powered Air Guns. Totally silent!
I can charge those with a hand pump if need be.
I plan to garner better weapons and supplies when the Urbinites come into my field of fire.
And we all know they will wander out of their big Cities at some point.
Being they will be all bad THINKING they know the land in my area?
Easy kill zone.

I have no issues dropping anyone of it's me or them.
And my Air Guns will hit you in the eye at over 200 yards!
You'd never hear the shot and the Guy next to you would never hear it!
That gives me the next shots!

Better to be judged by 12 then carried by 6!

skidman

02-21-21, 01:06 PM

Don't know what is going on inside your head, but the effluent is disturbing to say the least.

August

02-21-21, 01:11 PM

Don't know what is going on inside your head, but the effluent is disturbing to say the least.

Lots of things seem to disturb you.

skidman

02-21-21, 01:13 PM

None of your business.

August

02-21-21, 01:14 PM

None of your business.

That ought to apply to you as well.

Jeff-Groves

02-21-21, 01:15 PM

Don't know what is going on inside your head, but the effluent is disturbing to say the least.
I highly doubt you even know what effluent means.
"liquid waste or sewage discharged into a river or the sea."
Really?
:hmmm:

Gonna think about your post for a second..........
OK. Don't care comes to mind.

skidman

02-21-21, 01:16 PM

You get the idea.

Jeff-Groves

02-21-21, 01:21 PM

You get the idea.
Yeah and only thing I can come up with is.....
If I decide to jump off a building and you disagree with my choice?
I will consider your advice like I would given the choice to breed with a skunk.

Both stink.
Just don't walk into my AO if STF!

Being your are over the Pond? What do you really care what the heck I do here in Ohio?
Are you judging me and what right gives you that?

Jeff-Groves

02-21-21, 02:36 PM

I think the only right you have is to post your opinion.
I'll give you that one. Don't mean I'll give a darn.
Those are to expensive to just hand out to anyone.

I rate opinions based on several factors.
Are you even in the USA? Think you failed that one.
Are you anywhere near me? OOPS! Failed again!
How much am I concerned about your opinion? Another FAILED!

1 out of 4 ain't bad.

ET2SN

02-21-21, 06:29 PM

Bug out to where? Hotel in another area? Relatives? Country estate?

Third cousins twice removed, old college roommates, shoot, if you could have made it to south-central Iowa you could have put me on the spot and asked and you didn't even serve on a submarine. :D

The point being, in an emergency its very hard to be a "Richard" to people you know.

Even with the power down, they tend to get the main roads passable for EMS and emergency services early-on.

Onkel Neal

02-22-21, 08:50 AM

Third cousins twice removed, old college roommates, shoot, if you could have made it to south-central Iowa you could have put me on the spot and asked and you didn't even serve on a submarine. :D

The point being, in an emergency its very hard to be a "Richard" to people you know.

Even with the power down, they tend to get the main roads passable for EMS and emergency services early-on.

Ok, so you have some destination in mind. I always wonder what people intend when they mention "bugging out".

Catfish

02-22-21, 09:11 AM

^ Yes, always depends on the circumstances, like if there is another/better place to go at all. Having papers and clothes ready is always useful advice, along with some emergency clothing and food/water.
Living "off the grid" can be great fun though.

Friends and me had this discussion before, if there is a major problem with civilisation like a nuclear war or a meteorite, there are of course no options left.
If circumstances allow we always had the idea of having a sailing boat ready, well maintained and stuffed with fuel, food and reserves, at least enough to survive some weeks.
Everyone would get there once a year in turn or together, to sail it and do some maintenance work, a problem would of course be to get it into the water in an emergency, without crane or slip system. In case the .. hit the fan we would drive down there and meet, and discuss where to go.
With some water conditioner/water maker(?), solar panels and fishing equipment you would be able to hold out for quite some time.

This is of ourse pure fantasy, you would have to be quite rich just for the proper storage of the boat, let alone the initial price and all :hmmm:

Onkel Neal

02-22-21, 09:20 AM

Yeah, that's a cool strategy but I would think it works best if you live near the marina and you use the boat frequently throughout the year. For anything less than collapse of civilization, a nice week-long fishing trip would be awesome!

But like you said, the boat and equipment would need to be maintained. I lurk on a prepper forum or two, and during this latest Texas disaster, there were more than a few "preppers" who spent many posts leading up to this, boasting about how ready they were for a hurricane or disaster. Then the SHTF and it's "Da**** it! All three of my gennies failed." Sounds like all 3 of the gennies were junk, not maintained, not ready. If you had a boat, yeah, that would be sweet but only if it was good to go.

Mr Quatro

02-22-21, 02:45 PM

Boats will have to face pirates you know :yep:

Pirates can sink fiberglass easy :yep:

No to boats :o

Plus if it's that bad you will just have to get in line for something and all you can carry would be the norm.

Unless your are bigger than they are they (your know who they are, right)
They will want to look into your back pack :o

Catfish

02-22-21, 03:20 PM

I did not say it was made of fibre glass. Problem would be getting there.

ET2SN

02-22-21, 04:55 PM

Pirates can sink fiberglass easy :yep:

So can angry squirrels who are hunting sharks. :k_confused:

ET2SN

02-22-21, 05:05 PM

Ok, so you have some destination in mind. I always wonder what people intend when they mention "bugging out".

The other side of the coin is that if you can get somewhere else, you aren't a burden on the emergency services folks who are trying to bring the local area back online.

One house having all of its electric loads turn back on is not a problem. Having an entire town try to re-energize everything at the same time can be a headache. Likewise, someone's going to step on a nail or slip on the ice or drink some tainted water. Its best not to overwhelm the ER.

ET2SN

02-22-21, 06:20 PM

Then the SHTF and it's "Da**** it! All three of my gennies failed." Sounds like all 3 of the gennies were junk, not maintained, not ready.

Lucky for me, I did all of the small engine work in my Dad's garage when I was growing up. :yeah:

Small engines have a bad habit of failing. :yep:
If you blew off your end of season maint. on the lawn mower or chain saw, chances were good you would need to see me the next spring.

This was up in northern Maine, where people are supposed to know better. :O:

I got a nice Generac ac/dc unit after we had a freak heavy snow storm followed by an ice storm. Most of the state lost power for four to five days. I had an electrician buddy do the wiring and switches on the house and I did stuff with the generator like using high grade synthetic oil in the crank case and using fuel stabilizer in the fuel I would cycle through to keep it fresh.

The big problem was that the freak storm was just that, a freak. The generator was just sitting around. The biggest hassle was that my folks had modernized the house to being all-electric and tossed out the old wood stove in the living room, which was all we really needed for the emergency. :doh:

After a while, I kept the house wiring in place but sold the generator to a carpenter. He used it for a year or two before he burned the piston and trashed the anti-vibration mounts.

The lesson being- don't trust a totem to save your ###. :up:
A portable generator is little more than a nice idea that lets you feel safe.
In practical terms, folks either don't know how to use them or they forget.

Shutting a generator down the right way becomes a pain and the carb gets glazed up with varnish from old gas and the oil turns to sludge. Your modern Briggs and Stratton gas engine is supposed to only last for 2-5 years before it wears out, Honda isn't far behind in terms of quality. Gasoline and oil plus plastic parts is trouble waiting to happen. Its better to build them cheap and sell more. It was designed that way, which is why you see so many junk lawn mowers sitting by the edge of the road during the summer. :yep:

Now, before you need to argue that-consider that the old pot-bellied stove was all my folks needed for the emergency. :03:

Mr Quatro

02-24-21, 01:51 PM

I hate the click bait of Quora, but this was in my mail box today and I thought it might be a good topic for us :yep:

If there is a nuclear war and I am hiding in a bunker on land that I own, will the government come and take it?
Yes.

One of the basic provisions of post-attack reconstruction is the pooling of resources, this means, in practice, the temporary abolishment of private property.

Your bunker could be used as a radiation-free hospital, food storage site, etc. Your supplies would be confiscated as well.

You would be assigned a job, a place to stay, food, clothing, and medical attention by the government.

3catcircus

02-24-21, 09:41 PM

Lucky for me, I did all of the small engine work in my Dad's garage when I was growing up. :yeah:

Small engines have a bad habit of failing. :yep:
If you blew off your end of season maint. on the lawn mower or chain saw, chances were good you would need to see me the next spring.

This was up in northern Maine, where people are supposed to know better. :O:

I got a nice Generac ac/dc unit after we had a freak heavy snow storm followed by an ice storm. Most of the state lost power for four to five days. I had an electrician buddy do the wiring and switches on the house and I did stuff with the generator like using high grade synthetic oil in the crank case and using fuel stabilizer in the fuel I would cycle through to keep it fresh.

The big problem was that the freak storm was just that, a freak. The generator was just sitting around. The biggest hassle was that my folks had modernized the house to being all-electric and tossed out the old wood stove in the living room, which was all we really needed for the emergency. :doh:

After a while, I kept the house wiring in place but sold the generator to a carpenter. He used it for a year or two before he burned the piston and trashed the anti-vibration mounts.

The lesson being- don't trust a totem to save your ###. :up:
A portable generator is little more than a nice idea that lets you feel safe.
In practical terms, folks either don't know how to use them or they forget.

Shutting a generator down the right way becomes a pain and the carb gets glazed up with varnish from old gas and the oil turns to sludge. Your modern Briggs and Stratton gas engine is supposed to only last for 2-5 years before it wears out, Honda isn't far behind in terms of quality. Gasoline and oil plus plastic parts is trouble waiting to happen. Its better to build them cheap and sell more. It was designed that way, which is why you see so many junk lawn mowers sitting by the edge of the road during the summer. :yep:

Now, before you need to argue that-consider that the old pot-bellied stove was all my folks needed for the emergency. :03:

Maybe it's just me, but it seems that we have a veneer of civilization but most people in Western societies will die or become enslaved should a major disaster cause society to fold and we go all Mad Max. We see what lawless maniacs most cityfolk turn into if they lose electricity for more than a few hours... Not many of them know how to grow their own food, hunt, repair an engine, drive in snow, or build a fire.

Sean C

02-25-21, 01:00 AM

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Skybird

09-24-21, 06:19 AM

Stumbled over this reader'S comment and found it interesting to know, I did not know the inherent trickeries of prepping for a Diesel generator. But one should know them.

------------
" And since I work professionally with emergency power systems, here are a few more tips on diesel fuel. The diesel commercially available in Germany is known to contain up to 7% biodiesel. This "bio" portion prevents the unlimited shelf life, since biodiesel is hydroscopic in contrast to normal diesel and draws water over time. This then leads to contamination, the so-called diesel plague. Please google it yourself. In fuel tanks for emergency systems, the fuel is turned over and replaced frequently , or measures are taken to prevent contamination. This is done through drainage or disinfection systems, through the addition of substances that inhibit bacterial growth or, best of all, through the use of fuel without bio components. Large customers can buy this fuel if they are tax-exempt or tax-privileged At the refineries it is called "low-sulfur heating oil according to DIN EN 590". This is practically diesel fuel as it used to be common, but which you cannot actually buy privately. The use of normal heating oil is no longer possible nowadays, as heating oil there is no red-colored diesel fuel! Heating oil does not have to comply with fuel standards, which is why cheap additives are added to heating oil today. The quality varies greatly. Above all, commercially available heating oil today usually does not meet the requirements relating to the minimum cetane number (ignitability). Modern diesel engines do not start with commercial heating oil, or only start with a delay and when they run, then not on all cylinders. They produce very white smoking exhaust gases (unburned fuel in the exhaust gas). Modern diesel engines only run reasonably with heating oil when they are preheated to operating temperature. So if you want to use heating oil or bio-oil, you should get an antechamber engine that is as old as possible. If you have a new unit, you need suitable fuel."

LINK (https://www.achomkrise_ist_da)

Skybird

10-12-21, 08:10 AM

I made a nice deal, a household clearance, they sold it as "new but unused", and it indeed even was factory-sealed. They found it in the garage of the person that had deceased. The rocket stove I already had, but the cast iron pot is the item I talk of, a "Dutch oven". In that size and of that weight it usually costs 70-100 taler, depending on the brand - I got it for 30. :) I almost had bought one of these some years ago, by Petromax, and if I would have done that, I would have paid three times as much.

https://i.postimg.cc/jd878VsX/20211012-144316.jpg (https://postimg.cc/mtHkD51z)

https://i.postimg.cc/gJYcFJs6/20211012-144426.jpg (https://postimg.cc/QByZcjRX)

That oven, btw, is great, it burns not only wood and bio mass, but charcoal and brickets as well. I have used it for fun severla times in the past two years, with a wok pan or a swedish cast iron pan.

Who knows, this winter with all the electricty instability and gas reserves empty... I have enough wood and coal for 6 weeks of hot meals. Then, if not collecting wood in the "wild", i would switch to gas cookers and other alternatives I have. These stoves are great, they are just fun to handle, and open fire always is great.

Skybird

10-12-21, 08:34 AM

I confirm everything he says, this model works great.

Rocket stoves produce not even half as much smoke thna open fires, they burn hotter than open fire if sticks are small in diameter, and you need two thirds less burning material than for an open fire. Most rocket oven like this are models meant to burn biomass and wood exclusively, only designs like this one (two doors) are good for burnign charcoal and brickets as well - and they do no compromise there. Great stuff!

Ooops, you need to watch it directly on Youtube. Click the link in the banner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfdHr-1JnaI

Why do you want one?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFzueCHVfDU

Onkel Neal

10-13-21, 07:12 PM

That oven, btw, is great, it burns not only wood and bio mass, but charcoal and brickets as well. I have used it for fun severla times in the past two years, with a wok pan or a swedish cast iron pan.

Who knows, this winter with all the electricty instability and gas reserves empty... I have enough wood and coal for 6 weeks of hot meals. Then, if not collecting wood in the "wild", i would switch to gas cookers and other alternatives I have. These stoves are great, they are just fun to handle, and open fire always is great.

That's awesome! :yeah:

Jimbuna

10-14-21, 07:30 AM

Are these intended for outdoor use only Sky?

August

10-14-21, 07:52 AM

Are these intended for outdoor use only Sky?

Of course they are, they burn wood and coal. You guys are acting like these are new inventions but these jet stoves have been around for decades.

Onkel Neal

10-14-21, 08:06 AM

Yeah, I didn't mean to imply these are new tech, but in conjunction with the dutch oven and the casters, it's a pretty neat set up. :shucks:

August

10-14-21, 08:29 AM

Yeah, I didn't mean to imply these are new tech, but in conjunction with the dutch oven and the casters, it's a pretty neat set up. :shucks:

I understand. But do you really think so? To me Dutch ovens were designed to bury into live coals so that the heat surrounds it and cooks the food evenly. They weren't meant to sit on top of a burner like a soup pot.