US mulling Syrian emergency intervention?

[Skybird]

After reports that Syria has started to mix chemicals and produce Sarin, by doing so apparently preparing the use of chemical weapons soon, Obama and his speaker both delivered clear words and warnings of "consequences", apparently wanting them to be understood as an announcement that using chemical weapons would trigger a direct military intervention by the US immediately.

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/12/03/world/meast/syria-civil-war/index.html

A group of 150 US specialists already has been moved to Jordan earlier this year, to help both with refugee movements, intel and preparing the Jordanians for a possible chemical use in Syria.

Syria has practiced and live-fired chemical artillery shells already earlier this year and in the presence of high military commanders from Iran.

I assume war-tired Americans do not like the prospect of just another war to embark on, with a later war against Iran also within possible reach. I sympathise with that attitude.

[Jimbuna]

If chemical weapons are used in defiance of the Geneva Convention then something will have to be done militarily.

I'd like to see a joint effort with Russias direct involvement should this come about.

[Tribesman]

Syria has practiced and live-fired chemical artillery shells already earlier this year and in the presence of high military commanders from Iran.

But I thought you said Iran was backing the rebels:rotfl2:

I assume war-tired Americans do not like the prospect of just another war to embark on, with a later war against Iran also within possible reach. I sympathise with that attitude.

You said you sympathised with the dictator and wanted him kept in power as the rebels are militant islamists who want to take over the world

[Oberon]

I'd like to see a joint effort with Russias direct involvement should this come about.

I think that this is about the only feasible way that this can be done. Obviously it means that people that are in Russias court are going to 'escape' but at least it won't be a US/Allies only affair again.

[Jimbuna]

I think that this is about the only feasible way that this can be done. Obviously it means that people that are in Russias court are going to 'escape' but at least it won't be a US/Allies only affair again.

Aye...the joint efforts of the US and Russia (should it come about) would far outweigh abnything the Chinese could say or do on the matter.

[Skybird]

The Chinese will retaliate.

Financially, economically.

They have the means, and the will.

Tja, it sucks when you drown in your debts, and it makes you vulnerable to blackmailing.

The Russians - cannot be trusted on this.

Conclusion: if preparing for intervention in Syria, prepare for doing it against Russia and China, not with them.

[Jimbuna]

Not sure Obama would open up another war front without meaningful allies and I doubt the UK has the resources anymore so Russia would have to take a role.

[Oberon]

The Chinese will retaliate.

Why would they do so?

Assad is Russias ally, not Chinas. China has no strategic interests in the region, they have no reason to retaliate. China only backs Assad in the UN because Russia is doing so, and if Assad uses chemical weapons then he loses his viability as an ally, he becomes expendable. So he will probably find himself couped by his own generals while Russia and NATO make preparations to actively get involved in Syria. Then Russia will lean on the generals to make a couple of small concessions and present them to the world as people who the UN can do business with, and we'll be back to square one.

I would be more concerned with China retaliating over Iran, personally, if the US goes into Iran. Iran is a good source of oil for China, and if that supply is threatened then China will consider herself threatened and may seek retaliation. However, economic retaliation is a double edged sword for China, it is easier and better for the PRC to threaten retaliation than actually to do it, because if the US economy falls apart then the PRC will collapse shortly afterwards since their economies are very linked at the moment, a problem that Beijing is seeking desperately to fix before the American public realise it.

EDIT: A short research later and I've found that the PRC is a major player in Syrias oil industry, so there's a small chance of retaliation, but when you compare Syria and Irans outputs, there's quite a difference, and traditionally and strategically, Russia is more linked to Syria than the PRC. If you get Russia on board then the PRC will not offer any real complaints. Of course, if you get Russia on board then a lot of Assads staff will 'escape' and find housing, probably in China or another Russian ally. Assad himself though will probably be used as a sacrificial pawn, if he is dumb enough to use chemical weapons in a war that the world is focused on, and against the world opinion, then he is no longer a usable ally of Russia and will be discarded.

[Jimbuna]

^Saved me posting a very similar viewpoint.

[Oberon]

Furthermore, out of the three blocs involved in any intervention (NATO, China, Russia) only NATO will lose out if Assad is removed and the opposition put in, because NATO nations struggle to work with nations who go into Islamic law because of their notions of freedoms. China and Russia have no such qualms, and will gleefully supply arms for oil. So it'll be just a change of faces really, although it'll have to be skilfully manoeuvred so that they are seen to be turning their backs on Assad after his chemical usage, so that the new opposition government doesn't see them as friends of Assad.
Although, honestly, money speaks louder than loyalties, and weapons speak even louder, so I think any old ties would be forgotten as soon as the first shipment of AK-74s and T-72s landed.

[Skybird]

because NATO nations struggle to work with nations who go into Islamic law because of their notions of freedoms. China and Russia have no such qualms, and will gleefully supply arms for oil.

Wha wanted to deliver Milans and Tiger helicpters and huke tech to Libya? France. Who has armed Saudi arabia and Kuwait and others up the the teeth despite their dictatorships and violation of human rights and records of supressing freedom? America, Germany, Britain, France, Italy. The Saudis have just asked for several hundreds of German Boxer APCs - and Berlin is considering it. This after the yjust have askewd for several hundred Leopard-2A7PSO, which berlin was or is still considering. Egypt has asked for German submarines, with Berlin considering it. The Americans have sold them even more arms.

Western nations have never struggled to make business with polcie states and supressive regimes, not in the ME, no in South America, not in Africa. German arms sales have significantly exploded in the past 12 months, Merkelianism means that regulations and limitations get seriously toned down. That is to protect the German military industry, which is sufferign to the shrunk demand in weapons in germany and in NATO countries: political changes, shrinking budgets, etc.

The Chinese: Syria is important fore them, in a potential menaing. They act by accumulating small shares of influence all over Africa, the ME, South American and in Europe as well. They use their enormous financial resources to buy themselves an entry gate that they then can widen to a parade alley. Onc they have a foot in the door, they become stronger and stronger, and demand more and more. A less militant pratcice than the Wetsenr era of Imperislaim and colonialism maybe, but not any less mercyless: you can see the desastrous results of their policies and the terrifying human cost in Africa. - Now, Syria is their big opportunity to get a strong foothold in that region. I'm sure they will hate to let that opportunity pass by unused.

[Skybird]

Various German newspaper report that 75,000 American troops are readying and preparing for Syria. No word on where they come from. This news is making the round over here since all this day.

[Tribesman]

Furthermore, out of the three blocs involved in any intervention (NATO, China, Russia) only NATO will lose out if Assad is removed and the opposition put in, because NATO nations struggle to work with nations who go into Islamic law because of their notions of freedoms. China and Russia have no such qualms, and will gleefully supply arms for oil.

If that were the case why do NATO contries beg for arms deals with the Gulf states including the extreme fundamentalists in Saudi?
Now in fairness there was some voices raised in opposition in your country when Bahrain started rounding up doctors and nurses as "revolutionaries" because they treated wounded protesters that were brought to hospital, but your governments response was to send a delegation to secure more arms deals.

As for Syria "going into islamic law". Article 3.2 of their constitution...islamic jurisprudence doctrine is a primary source of legislation

[Oberon]

Wait...wait...wait...

Did Tribesman and Skybird both just say the same thing?

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTmNb3DfDcCAeGfoqP9o9Dgq1GDT-4k-mjzwB46r0fqVjAu6S9puQccsZKQHQ


In all seriousness, you both make good points that I had overlooked, however I would say that Syria is probably not particularly high on Chinas foot-in-the-door list. It's a good wedge in the region, I don't deny, but I don't think that they'd deploy their currency bomb over it. Personally, I think that they'd only do something like that over something a lot closer to home, like Taiwan or Tibet, and it'd have to be a real last ditch reason because the currency bomb is a kamikaze attack.

[Oberon]

Various German newspaper report that 75,000 American troops are readying and preparing for Syria. No word on where they come from. This news is making the round over here since all this day.

Didn't the same sort of rumours start up over Libya?

[em2nought]

Yep, Ron Paul is the insane one. :D

[eddie]

There is no US troops getting ready to go anywhere. Only movement of any kind is from NATO sending Patriot Missile batteries to Turkey. Nothing more. No evidence has shown the Syrians are mixing their WMD's. The US has plans to react if they start doing that, but it would not involve ground force. It would take thousands to go into Syria to secure their WMD sites, but there are no plans to do that ATM.

If we do anything, most info leans towards the use of Cruise missiles, strikes against the leadership mainly. Strikes against the WMD sites would probably not be the smartest thing to do either.

[Tribesman]

Didn't the same sort of rumours start up over Libya?
Yep, and as well as Libya he also posted the same rumour that thousands of US troops were invading Egypt two weeks ago.
At least its consistant:rotfl2:

[Jimbuna]

Various German newspaper report that 75,000 American troops are readying and preparing for Syria. No word on where they come from. This news is making the round over here since all this day.

Why don't they name their sources?

[Skybird]

Why don't they name their sources?
They do, its the Washington Post which for itself refers to confidential informants, German newspapers say. They claim to just echo a report by the WP.

However, investigating a bit via Google, it is possible that they messed up another news from mid-November, that says internal studies by the Pentagon show that securing of WMDs in Syria would need 75,000 troops. Could be coincidence that the number is the same, but I think not.

Destroying chemicals via air strikes once they are filled into missile warheads and shells is seen as relatively ineffective by military analysts of the matter, the reports from mid-November say. Destroying the agents before they get filled however would be effective, but releases them to the environment in very large quantities,

[Jimbuna]

Whilst accepting the details about the dangers of destroying the weapons and releasing them into the environment I am of the opinion the 75,000 figure is probably coincidental...yes it may have been decided that many personnel may be needed but it doesn't automatically mean that is the preferred method.

I still suspect it would be missile strikes from air, surface and sub surface that would be used to take out his military infrsatructure, weakening him to the point where the land battle was even sided, just as it was done in Libya.

[Skybird]

I now think the German media has blown it up. Here is the NYT, mid-November.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/16/world/middleeast/pentagon-sees-seizing-syria-chemical-arms-as-vast-task.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

[Skybird]

And this is the German edition of Der Spiegel who seems to be one of the very few German newspapers of the past 48 hours who got ir correctly summarised, saying that it is a rpeort by the NYT (not the WP), that "75000" is the answer given in an analysis of the question how much troops would be needed "if", that it is unclear if it still is just in the planning stage or a decision on executing the plan already has been made and material preparations already have started. There is a special forces unit in Jordan, 150 men, this seems to be certain, tasked with helping the Jordans with refugees and protective measure against Syrian chemicals at the border with Syria.

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/usa-planen-fuer-militaerische-intervention-in-syrien-a-870876.html

Many newspapers here stll paint it as if 75000 troops are already standing ready.

Quality "journalism".:88)

[Jimbuna]

I obviously can't read German but that first link and your last post makes for clarity and how I suspected the real position is/was :up:

[eddie]

I agree it would be a missile type attack if it was warranted, but there's something I don't understand.

Back a few years ago, when either Hezbollah or Hamas (not sure which) kidnapped that Israeli soldier, the IAF bombed the main airport runways in Beirut, blew up bridges that crossed from Lebanon into Syria also. When Israeli intelligence discovered Assad was at his vacation home in NW Syria, the IAF flew in low ands fast, causing several sonic booms directly over his house. Letting him know they better not take that soldier to Syria. All aircraft returned safely.

When the Israeli's discovered the nuclear facility the Syrians were building, the IAF flew in and took it out. Again, all aircraft returned safely.

We don't want to expose American pilots to the so called Syrian air defense sytems, and yet the Israelis, don't have much problem with this sytem at all. What do they know, that we don't?

[Jimbuna]

We don't want to expose American pilots to the so called Syrian air defense sytems, and yet the Israelis, don't have much problem with this sytem at all. What do they know, that we don't?

I doubt they know anything more than the US because of mutual intelligence gathering and sharing.

[Skybird]

I doubt they know anything more than the US because of mutual intelligence gathering and sharing.
A wise card player keeps his ace hidden until the correct time to play it. ;) I think the Israelis probably have the one or the other hidden information in their backhand that the Us so far does not know about. And US intel services are known for their notorious allergy against sharing their info. They only do it when it absolutely cannot be avoid. To get what the "partnerside" has, but not to give what one has oneself, however is the preferred working method of American intel.

[Jimbuna]

A wise card player keeps his ace hidden until the correct time to play it. ;) I think the Israelis probably have the one or the other hidden information in their backhand that the Us so far does not know about. And US intel services are known for their notorious allergy against sharing their info. They only do it when it absolutely cannot be avoid. To get what the "partnerside" has, but not to give what one has oneself, however is the preferred working method of American intel.

Possibly where certain super sensitive information is concerned but I believe the deatl in question is about flying low and with a certain imunity to SAM radar defences and I doubt the Israelis are any further advanced than the US...probably even less so.

[eddie]

Assad is playing with fire now, the bombs loaded with sarin are ready, but haven't been used yet. This is going to get real ugly now.

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12/05/15706380-syria-loads-chemical-weapons-into-bombs-military-awaits-assads-order?lite&ocid=msnhp&pos=1

[Armistead]

We have moved a carrier group off of Syria...

China isn't going to do nothing but rant, their economy is still heavily tied to ours. Russia will do nothing. My guess is we push action through the UN if chemical weapons are used.

The bigger issue if Assad falls, what will happen to all the chemical weapons. This is probably the biggest fear right now, no telling whose hands these could fall into. If Assad goes the country will fall into chaos.
Let's face it , when it comes to the Mid-East

It takes a Dictator....

[Jimbuna]

We have moved a carrier group off of Syria...

China isn't going to do nothing but rant, their economy is still heavily tied to ours. Russia will do nothing. My guess is we push action through the UN if chemical weapons are used.

The bigger issue if Assad falls, what will happen to all the chemical weapons. This is probably the biggest fear right now, no telling whose hands these could fall into. If Assad goes the country will fall into chaos.
Let's face it , when it comes to the Mid-East

It takes a Dictator....

I fear you may well be right...the time is drawing nigh.

[Skybird]

As always with WMD, uncontrolled proliferation is my major concern.

Hezbollah is reported to have set up several camps in direct vicinity of chemical weapons storage sites in Syria, and has been allowed by Assad to even conduct combat training inside those compounds.

Go figure. Israel no doubt is not amused. But the threat goes far beyond that.

[Jimbuna]

If that is in fact the case then Hezbollah could soon find themselves in direct line of fire.

I should imagine there are a few satellites watching the areas in question even as I type this.

[Platapus]

Syria does not have all that much oil. Nothing in Syria is worth a single American life.

[Armistead]

If these chemical weapons fall into terrorist hands, it will be a whole different game. The question will remain, if Assad leaves, what will fill the vacuum, probably something worse.

I'm not sure what we can do, if we bomb the gas sites, how many 1000's will die. If we leave them....

The Mid-East remains a stain of the underpants of modern humanity.

[Skybird]

Syria does not have all that much oil. Nothing in Syria is worth a single American life.



My attitude exactly, widening it to not just American but Western soldiers in general. Even more valid when considering the very anti-Western nature of Assad's opposition, which is anthiong but humanistic or democratic in orientation.

However, the chemical weapons, and these getting into the hands of Muslim terror organisations - that is something we cannot afford to ignore. Israel cannot ignore it either. Even the new regime can use them to blackmail us: "Give us what we want (money, anti-Israeli diplomacy, whatever), or we give chemical weapons to Hezbollah, still - that would bring us back into the Lebanon game as well."

[Jimbuna]

The chance of chemical weapons falling into the wrong hands is reason enough to get involved.

[yubba]

I think Russia should step up, it's their bestest buddies they should put a lid on it, or maybe the UN should grow a set and get off our backs and do something other than try to set mandates to hobble the american people.

[Jimbuna]

The main obstacle is usually when one of the 'big boys' exercise their right to use the veto.

[mapuc]

This is just a thought

Is NATO going to make a preimptive strike on Syria, if and when they start to load those bombs on the planes?( it's only then, ´cause thereafter it's a little to late)

And if NATO do that, what about Syria's friend Iran, will they close the strait of Hormuz ?

Markus

[Jimbuna]

I doubt Nato will make a pre-emptive strike and I also doubt Iran has the means to close the Strait of Hormuz for more than a day or two at best.

[eddie]

Oh great, as if the Rebels didn't have enough going on fighting Assads army, they are now opening up a new front in Syria, taking on the Kurds!
This going to turn into a nasty civil war.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/07/world/middleeast/wider-chaos-feared-as-syrian-rebels-and-kurds-clash.html?pagewanted=1&ref=middleeast

[Tribesman]

they are now opening up a new front in Syria, taking on the Kurds!

Its not a new front, since the start some kurds have been with the rebels and some have been backing Assad.
Throughout Iran Iraq Syria and Turkey the Kurds are not unified force, they are lots of very different splinters often fundamentaly opposed to each other, much like the palestinians

[Skybird]

Oh great, as if the Rebels didn't have enough going on fighting Assads army, they are now opening up a new front in Syria, taking on the Kurds!

It's been like that since a bit longer already. Not really new. ;) There never was one unified Syrian opposition, but many factions temporarily coordinating their efforts. But the majority of these have been fighting for a fundamentalist Syrian regime to be established form beginning on, and it seems these forces have managed to form the dominant power in the competition - and this too since quite some longer time already. Thus in preparation for the time they will grab for power, they already have started to decimate their potential challengers.

Assad is done anyway. What comes after him is either a Lebanonization or Somaliazation, or a fundamentalist regime with a strict fundament in Sharia law.

[eddie]

I guess they don't have anything else to do but keep the old Sunni vs Shia feud going for another couple of centuries!

[Jimbuna]

The rebels are now intent in capturing Damascus airport, they've already caused its closure.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20637079

[Alex]

The arrival of the american aircraft carrier Eisenhower in the Mediterranean sea shows that the united states of America are planning a military intervention in Syria. A perspective likely to happen if we rely on some assertions from the usonian administration concerning supposed preparations from the syrian army to use chemical weapons.

Many corroborating sources, including the website from the television channel Russia Today, report that the USS Eisenhower (featuring 8000 marines and crew members, as well as 70 fighter-bombers in its belly) has got to join the helicopter-carrier Iwo Jima that was already patrolling along the syrian coast, with 2500 marines aboard.

That movement from the usonian military fleet comes as the NBC channel just stated that the syrian army would be loading sarin gas into bombs to be released by aircraft, citing some usonian officials speaking on the basis of anonimity.

A spread of false news according to the syrian government, afraid that the occident would be trying to justify a ground intervention in Syria with the spurious argument that the syrian government would hypothetically make use of some chemical weapons against opponents of the president, Bachar El-Assad.

More disturbing is that video (link removed) (CAUTION : beware, animal lovers, that video shows one of those crazy members of the so-called free syrian army doing some experiences on rabbits) from the FSA (Free Syrian Army), in which a rebel claims to possess chemical weapons and threatens to use them against the syrian powers-that-be and its partisans and followers.

That video bears out the fears of Faisal Mikdad, syrian foreign affairs vice-minister, who indicated very recently on Al-Manar (lebanese television channel) : « We have concerns about a plot from the united states of America and some european countries, that could have been able to transfer such weapons to terrorist groups in Syria, in order to state subsequently that chemical weapons have been used by the syrian government ».

At a time when official syrian forces are about to regain all the bastions of the FSA throughout the country, particularly on the outskirts of Damascus, really it may be possible that such a manipulation is orchestrated by the usonian administration and its subordinates from the NATO, in order to arrange a military operation in Syria without having to wait for a resolution from the UN security counsel.

http://b8.uk.imgsrc.ru/c/compdrag/9/30716889KxH.gif

(And I'm not blaming the united states of America here. That font style just shows who-does-what, and how it's all going to end)

[Takeda Shingen]

Adding 'usonian' to the glossary.

[Hottentot]

Adding 'usonian' to the glossary.

Certainly we are able to extrapolate that this cornucopia of verbal expressions will cause the homo sapiens craniums on this virtual platform for sharing perspectively differentiating sentiments migrate from upwards position towards the posture closer to the center piece of Tellus' gravitational force and anon orient theirselves towards the aforementioned configuration in promptly iterating succession and the twain spherical objects on the above named component of the person designed for visual observation of the world to escalate due to the accruing sensation of astonishment.

[Tribesman]

And I'm not blaming the united states of America here.That font style just shows who-does-what, and how it's all going to end
No, because its the jews again:rotfl2:
Well done alex you consistantly show yourself for what you are while ridiculously claiming you ain't really just a silly neo nazi:yeah:

[MH]

I love your sigs Alex.
You are very creative.

[eddie]

Right, I'm sure we are going to invade Syria with just 10,000 Marines,lol A country the size of Syria, with its Army, 10K Marines should do the trick, I suppose. Only if you're smoking some illegal stuff again!:D

[Karle94]

Certainly we are able to extrapolate that this cornucopia of verbal expressions will cause the homo sapiens craniums on this virtual platform for sharing perspectively differentiating sentiments migrate from upwards position towards the posture closer to the center piece of Tellus' gravitational force and anon orient theirselves towards the aforementioned configuration in promptly iterating succession and the twain spherical objects on the above named component of the person designed for visual observation of the world to escalate due to the accruing sensation of astonishment.

You do know that the latin name for our planet is Terra, and not Tellus?

[Hottentot]

You do know that the latin name for our planet is Terra, and not Tellus?

Congratulations for finding the core point of the post. :O:

[August]

Right, I'm sure we are going to invade Syria with just 10,000 Marines,lol A country the size of Syria, with its Army, 10K Marines should do the trick, I suppose. Only if you're smoking some illegal stuff again!:D

Exactly and it's not 10k Marines. Note the Pravda Alex posts: "featuring 8000 marines and crew members" aboard Enterprise. Yeah maybe 100 Marines and the rest Swabbies. A CVN doesn't have much of a Marine contingent. So more realistically between the Iwo and the Enterprise they could field maybe 2,000 combat troops ashore., not 10,000. Hardly an invasion force.

Might be enough to temporarily secure those NBC sites though.

[eddie]

You're right on that August, 2000 Marines is more like it. Problem with that though, if the sites are spread out, would be tough to support them, would leave some of those detachments pretty exposed!

Not sure I can keep a striaght face while typing this, its so goofy to think we would even concider sending in those troops.:salute:

[Oberon]

If anything is going to hit those NBC sites, it'll be aircraft and cruise missiles. B-2s, drones and TLAMs fired from the carrier group and/or submarines in the area. It's better to have five or six sites blanketed with mixed chemicals and have the delivery systems and warheads gone than to let them remain viable.

I'm not sure if something like a thermobaric or napalm strike would neutralize the chemical and biological weapons or just cause them to be spread over the site. However, if the US puts in ground forces it is committing political suicide.

[Skybird]

Bombing chemical weapon storage facilities from the air will release huge ammounts of agents into the environment, often with civilian settlements nearby and thus causing uncalculatable ammounts of collaterals.

Thus I am not so certain that this is the American intent.

They maybe are more focussing on bombing any transport activity that is moving for these sites instead.

And keeping Hezbollah away.

As a side effect they also may consider to bomb Iranian units which now seem to operate in Syrian in significant numbers. The Iranians have recently boasted with how many Syrians rebels they have killed. Sending them greetings via air mail may be meant as a strong hint, regarding the nuclear bomb program of theirs.

It could also be that the carrier group moves in for protecting evacuation operations only.

[Jimbuna]

Wondering what the timescales are before any action might be undertaken :hmmm:

[Alex]

Wondering what the timescales are before any action might be undertaken :hmmm:

Very unfortunately, it looks like the monkeys will soon be taken out of their cage (http://youtu.be/KqzsitnnLaA).

[Hottentot]

Very unfortunately, it looks like the monkeys will soon be taken out of their cage (http://youtu.be/KqzsitnnLaA).

Are they the cheese-eating variant?

[Takeda Shingen]

Are they the cheese-eating variant?

Le gasp!

[Hottentot]

Le gasp!

My good fellow male member of our species, the enjoyment of dairy products by primates of the Haplorrhini suborder and simian infraorder is no matter of verbal expression conveying a conceit of arid amusement.

[Oberon]

My good fellow male member of our species, the enjoyment of dairy products by primates of the Haplorrhini suborder and simian infraorder is no matter of verbal expression conveying a conceit of arid amusement.

"Take your stinking paws off my cheese, you damn dirty ape!"

[Betonov]

This page is somewhere between Douglas Adams and Animaniacs

[Jimbuna]

Very unfortunately, it looks like the monkeys will soon be taken out of their cage (http://youtu.be/KqzsitnnLaA).


http://www.criticallayouts.com/images/rsgallery/original/monkey-0214-1.gif

[eddie]

:haha:That's great Jim:yeah:

[Jimbuna]

:haha:That's great Jim:yeah:

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/2063/image2rza.png

[Alex]

Mrs Clinton, foreign affairs minister of the united states of America, may well have pressed the president Obama to adopt such a stance, as she's got only a few weeks remaining as a minister, and she has ambitions in the democrats camp. And so, hand in hand with some democrat friends, she tries to put pressure on Obama in order to go into Syria.
That's it.
Now, is there really a danger of the use of chemical weapons ? The answer is inevitably "no", categorically and systematically.
So, what did our media do to make it look so probable. That is the question, after all. In fact, Jihad Makdissi, ex-spokesperson on syrian foreign affairs, told a few months ago that "Syria would have to use these weapons if ever NATO or foreign forces would attack the country". And obviously, that raised quite some reactions as well as an outcry. His message was poorly understood. And it happens that a few days ago, those who keep an ear open for news on the international media scene have got to know that this syrian spokesperson has been voted out of his office, and that he may be outside Syria now, in the united states of America, United Kingdom, no one knows exactly. So some people quickly stated that he defected, yet nothing just lets anyone think that could be the case. Others said that he just resigned. As a matter of fact, all the evidence brings us to the conclusion that he may well have been sacked, due to the fact he was used to afford to say some improvised things now and then, some things that fit the privacy policy of his minister (in his opinion), but apparently that's not the case any more.
So the media has definitely exploited the fact that this man has got to be fired, in order to make it possible to restart the debate related to chemical weapons in Syria once again. And while everyone gets to hear about that stuff, and dares to talk about the SUPPOSED use of those chemical weapons by Syria without even being aware of WHY he gets to talk about that these days, the real issue that is going on right now is "that guy told such a thing, and now he's got to be fired. So we feel like it's time to suspect the syrian government, it's going to use chemical weapons not against an aggression from abroad, but against its VERY-OWN people".

Honestly, that stuff smells of a plan from the Pentagon or CIA from kilometers away, that may be trying to prepare the ground for a military strike in Syria.

For some time now, quite some pressure has been put on Syria. Let's not forget that NATO has accepted to deploy american missiles "patriot" on the Turkey-Syria front. On the other hand, also we get to hear that some of our occidental idiots have got to see (via some satellite) that there was quite some unusual action around some weapons storage places in the country, and that could be chemical weapons. Here's one more invented pretext. I just can't figure out how those people (may they come from the united states of America and have the best technology at hand) might assume that chemical weapons are indeed the manipulated ones actually.

The third pretext that is important in that chemical weapons story is that this matter reminds all who have a good memory about the Irak war. And so the media needs everyone to believe that there are definitely chemical weapons, and that the great danger in Syria right now is that Islamists could seize control of them.
So that mental manipulation looks sufficiently solid for everyone to cast doubt on the syrian government that could use chemical weapons. For a minority of people who refuse to comply with what the same old red white and blue wants them to believe (wise principle, I'm sure you will confirm it, since no one can always be right in what he says), and rather make some use of their own brain seeking infos on the international scene, it's a tissue of lies that can convince only the very naive.


And the occidental television is blasting everyone with untruth related to Syria. To make it all an even more solid theory, the NATO president and even the UN secretary general have been used, by the way the UN secretary general (in all his greatness) dared to speak out against the syrian president, saying no one should provide the syrian president with an immunity in case he would leave Syria. So it's all an orchestrated campaign to convince everyone that Syria and its government are broken, that rebels are progressing everywhere in the country, while in reality, the situation is the absolute and total opposite. Nowadays, it is well known that in the north of the country, at Alep, the syrian army has got to deploy weapons (tanks, heavy artillery, missiles) and that it's heading towards the turkish border.
It is admitted that in the next few weeks, turkish border checkpoints close to A'zaz will be cleaned up and will remain in proper custody from the syrian loyalist army.

But you'll never hear about that. I'm wondering why. Maybe the occidental countries are just too intelligent, and like to swallow the truth coming from their own media instead of doing their own searches, LOL. No occidental media will talk about the situation at the north of Alep. On the contrary, you hear about the Damascus airport quite a lot.

So let's say that this chemical weapons story can not convince any reasonable person, BUT the ones who are already convinced that something definitely must be done. And here the situation is becoming increasingly more critical for countries that brought some support to the so-called rebellion. Especially when it comes to Qatar.

When the real Syria is going to emerge victorious from all that international campaign against the country, what do the Arab gulf states (supported by the united states of America) are going to say, when it comes to why they've got to fully influence it all, with their financial weight ?
Same with rebels from that coalition. If they end up suffering a crushing defeat, they will definitely be subject to prosecution of high treason related to the sharing intelligence with the enemy in order to crush Syria.
Some days ago I was going to post a message related to that stuff. But now that our beloved united states of America have just got to send the Eisenhower in the mediterranean ? Well, I'd say things are getting clearer, you know.

But, well, when it comes to why we get to hear about chemical weapons and that s*** called patriot missiles, that stuff is supposed to mask something else : if our beloved and irreproachable united states of America get to direct some air strikes on syrian soil, they will definitely not target places where chemical weapons are supposed to be stored - you expected that, didn't you. On the contrary, these air strikes will target missile factories, or no less than sites where you can find them missiles.

I would remind you of the fact that Syria has got many hundreds of thousands of missiles on its soil. And so it looks like we're getting all elements of the decor in order to set up an air strike, yet it's still no more than probable actually. Yet the arrival of the Eisenhower in the Mediterranean makes the united states of America's wishes clear enough. But you've got to admit one thing : our public opinion is prepared for such a thing (and in order not to be disrespectful towards our friends living in the united states of America, let's not even talk about the public opinion in their country that is complete nonsense, very unfortunately for them, everyday we get to know they're just ready to do anything).

Now I'd eventually like to criticize my *uc**** country and its attitude in that war. But who cares about France, that country is crap anyway.

I'll just say that this rubbish related to chemical weapons is no more than claptrap. Syrian missiles and strategic sites will definitely be the targeted stuff, and in the end, you'll get to hear that in fact, yes it was all against chemical weapons, just like it's been the case in Irak, and yet again, those people responsible for that will not be judged, yet you'll hear that those who must be judged are those evil dictators in the Third World.

Poor poor world.

[Oberon]

The occidental count is off the scale!

It's probably something to do with Pierre Sidos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occident_%28movement%29)... :hmmm:

[eddie]

He sounds like this article from Pravda!

http://english.pravda.ru/opinion/columnists/08-12-2012/123062-imperialism_chaemical_weapons-0/

[Takeda Shingen]

zomgoccidentaljewishzionistconspiracyjews!!!!!111o neone

[Tribesman]

I am confused, if this occidental worldwide conspiracy is running all the televisions and blasting everyone with untruth, then doesn't that mean that the kremlin propoganda poor alex swallows from RT is also really just part of that global jewish media conspiracy.

dumb neo nazis eh:yep:

[HunterICX]

Did anyone say Juice?

oh...never mind *leaves*

HunterICX

[Penguin]

Did anyone say Juice?

oh...never mind *leaves*

HunterICX

Damned juice, it controls the world! The politicians and media guys often drink juice during their meetings. The zionist juice tastes especially awfull.

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/054/435/juicese3.jpg

[Jimbuna]

^ :har:

[Hottentot]

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/054/435/juicese3.jpg

I'm afraid those guys are some six or so years late. He left some (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7W9DP8mdqs) music (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GZ3dmJKzfE) behind, though. Maybe they should listen to more of it and relax?

[Alex]

Fabricating WMD “Evidence”: Israeli Covert Operation inside Syria to “Track Chemical Arsenal”

Israel is conducting a covert cross-border operation directed against Syria in liaison with NATO and the Pentagon.
After looking for a “smoking gun” in Iran earlier this year, Israeli special forces are now “tracking” Syria’s “stocks of chemical and biological weapons”, according to The Sunday Times.
“The cross-border operation is part of a secret war to trail Syria’s non-conventional armaments and sabotage their development. ‘For years we’ve known the exact location of Syria’s chemical and biological munitions,’ an Israeli source said, referring to the country’s spy satellites and drones. ‘But in the past week we’ve got signs that munitions have been moved to new locations.’” (Uzi Mahnaimi and Lucy Fisher Israel tracks Syria’s chemical arsenal (http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/world_news/Middle_East/article1172960.ece), The Sunday Times 9 December 2012.)
Everyone recalls the WMD hype prior to launching the war on Iraq. It turned out that the Iraqi WMD threat was an outright fabrication.
Those involved in the Iraq WMD propaganda ploy are now applying their skills with a view to fabricating a WMD pretext to intervene in Syria. According to a report from the Jaffee Center for Strategic Studies at Tel Aviv University, “Israelis ‘misread’ the Iraqi threat”. In 2003, the BBC wrote on the report’s findings:
Israeli intelligence miscalculated the threat posed by Saddam Hussein […] This contributed to the “false” picture painted by US and British services […]

“Israeli intelligence was a full partner with the US and Britain in developing a false picture of Saddam Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction capability,” said the author of the report, retired Brigadier General Shlomo Brom.
“It badly overestimated the Iraqi threat to Israel and reinforced the American and British belief that the weapons existed.”
“From now on, when we present serious data on other countries, like Iran for example, who will treat us seriously?” Israel Radio quoted Israeli left-wing parliamentarian Yossi Sarid as saying. (Israelis ‘misread’ Iraqi threat (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3294865.stm), BBC,December 5, 2003)
In late March 2012 The Sunday Times reported that “Israel is using a permanent base in Iraqi Kurdistan to launch cross-border intelligence missions in an attempt to find ‘smoking gun’ evidence that Iran is building a nuclear warhead.” (Israeli spies scour Iran in nuclear hunt (http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/public/sitesearch.do?querystring=%22Israeli+spies+scour+I ran+in+nuclear+hunt%22&sectionId=743&p=sto&bl=on&pf=all), The Sunday Times,March 25, 2012)
There is no evidence that Iran has nuclear weapons, even US intelligence agencies agree on that. Global Research ran a story on the Israeli covert op, potentially fabricating WMD evidence in relation to Iran. What is now unfolding in relation to Syria’s alleged WMD is a rerun of previous attempts to funnel fabricated evidence into the news chain:
Western sources told the Times Israel was monitoring “radioactivity and magnitude of explosives tests” and that “special forces used Black Hawk helicopters to carry commandos disguised as members of the Iranian military and using Iranian military vehicles”. The sources believe “Iranians are trying to hide evidence of warhead tests in preparation for a possible IAEA visit”. (Cited in Report: Israeli soldiers scour Iran for nukes (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4207265,00.html), Ynet, March 25, 2012)

The number of Israeli intelligence missions focussing on the Parchin military base in Iran has increased in the past few months, according to the article. During that period, Tehran has been negotiating with the IAEA which had requested to visit Parchin. According to Iran’s permanent representative to the IAEA, Ali Asghar Soltanieh, both parties had agreed in early February that the visit would take place in March. (Gareth Porter, Details of Talks with IAEA Belie Charge Iran Refused Cooperation (http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=29901), IPS,March 21, 2012)
The IAEA requested to visit Parchin in late January and late February, after having agreed to a visit in March. The IAEA thus requested to visit the military complex exactly at the same time Israel was intensifying its secret operations to allegedly search for a “smoking gun”. (Julie Lévesque, Fabricating a “Smoking Gun” to Attack Iran? Israeli Spies Disguised as Iranian Soldiers on Mission Inside Iran (http://www.globalresearch.ca/fabricating-a-smoking-gun-to-attack-iran-israeli-spies-disguised-as-iranian-soldiers-on-mission-inside-iran/29981) Global Research,March 27, 2012)
Israel’s covert operation in Syria is part of a longstanding intelligence agenda directed against the Damascus government. According to intelNews:
[…]Israel’s covert activities against the Syrian government’s chemical and biological arsenal go back almost 30 years. Reputedly, some of the more recent such activities may have involved the targeting of Russian scientists.
Although Russia routinely denies it (http://rt.com/politics/chemical-weapons-syria-russia-196/), it is believed that Syria’s non-conventional arsenal was significantly augmented in the late 1980s and early 1990s with the help of Russian retired general Anatoliy Kuntsevich [...]

Interestingly, Kuntsevich died suddenly in 2003 onboard a flight from the Syrian capital to Moscow. It was widely speculated at the time that the Mossad, Israel’s covert-action agency, may have played a role in the Russian general’s sudden death. In 2010, another retired Russian general, Yuri Ivanov, who had served as Deputy Director of the GRU, Russia’s military intelligence agency, died (http://intelnews.org/2010/08/31/01-367-2/) in unclear circumstances […]
According (http://intelnews.org/2010/09/03/01-554/) to reports in the Israeli press, the former GRU official was on his way to a meeting with Syrian intelligence officers when he went missing. Israel has never acknowledged having played a part in Ivanon’s death, but many suspect that Tel Aviv had been targeting the two Russians for quite some time. (Joseph Fitsanakis Israel special forces conducting cross-border operations in Syria (http://intelnews.org/2012/12/10/01-1150/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed:+intelNewsOrg+%28intelNews.org%2 9), intelNews.org, December 10, 2012.)
This interpretation of events is plausible since targeted assassinations of foreign scientists by Israeli secret services have been acknowledged in the past:


The reduction [of Israel’s covert operations in Iran] runs across a wide spectrum of operations, cutting back not only alleged high-profile missions such as assassinations and detonations at Iranian missile bases, but also efforts to gather firsthand on-the-ground intelligence and recruit spies inside the Iranian program, according to the officials. (Karl Vick, Mossad Cutting Back on Covert Operations Inside Iran, Officials Say (http://globalspin.blogs.time.com/2012/03/30/mossad-cutting-back-on-covert-operations-inside-iran-officials-say/#ixzz1rsJyzNBN), TIME, March 30, 2012, quoted in Julie Lévesque, “Running Short of New Targets: Israel’s Secret Service is “Cutting Back on Assassinations” in Iran (http://www.globalresearch.ca/running-short-of-new-targets-israel-s-secret-service-is-cutting-back-on-assassinations-in-iran/30352), Global Research, April 17, 2012.)


While Israel’s secret operation in Syria could conceivably also target Russian scientists, it should be understood that its ultimate objective is to reinforce the intense propaganda campaign pertaining to Syria’s chemical arsenal. This leak in The Sunday Times could be part of the ongoing psychological operation against Syria, with a view to building a pretext for waging a preemptive war on Syria.


Since the beginning of the armed insurrection in March 2011, the US and its allies alongside the Western mainstream media have been blaming the Syrian government for committing atrocities directed against civilians, including the Houla massacre. According to independent media reports as well as the testimony of witnesses on the ground, these atrocities were committed by the US-NATO sponsored opposition forces.


The Syrian government has been demonized to such an extent by the mainstream media that if an attack were to occur, public opinion could easily be led to believe, without evidence, that the Syrian government is responsible for crimes against its own people.


This is a perfect context for a false flag operation or intensive propaganda involving chemical weapons. These allegations based on fake WMD evidence directed against the Syrian government could be used once again to pressure the UN Security Council to give NATO a “legal mandate” to intervene in Syria under the “responsibility to protect” doctrine.


CNN recently reported (http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/09/sources-defense-contractors-training-syrian-rebels-in-chemical-weapons/?hpt=hp_t1) that the US and “some European allies are using defense contractors to train Syrian rebels on how to secure chemical weapons stockpiles in Syria.” The Syrian government expressed its concerns in a letter to the UN:


What raises concerns about this news circulated by the media is our serious fear that some of the countries backing terrorism and terrorists might provide the armed terrorist groups with chemical weapons and claim that it was the Syrian government that used the weapons [...] (Quoted in John Glaser, US Defense Contractors Training Syrian Rebels to Handle Chemical Weapons (http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-defense-contractors-training-syrian-rebels-to-handle-chemical-weapons/5315180), Antiwar.com, December 10, 2012.)
Warning

Still, I think you should better not believe that, remember : that may well be RussiaToday Pravda from Vladivostok fabricated in Lake Baikal, in conjunction with remains of a far right collaborationist french SS division (http://www.globalresearch.ca/fabricating-wmd-evidence-israeli-covert-operation-inside-syria-to-track-chemical-arsenal/5315012). http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/982127ugly21.gif http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/529306uglybacho.gif http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/173914uglybanana.gif http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/308997uglycoucou2.gif http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/960740uglybanana.gifhttp://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/729315uglylire.gif http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/309467uglyhat.gif http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/786129uglyup.gif

[Tribesman]

Well done Alex, such wonderful delivery you managed, todays top story.... CHEMTRAILS Americas next global conspiracy after already poisoning everyone with floride:har::har::har::har::har::har:

[eddie]

You know something Tribesman, you could get arrested for giving away America's top secret plans! The CIA could swoop in and take you away and make you spend a week in a pub, so let that be a warning to you!:D

[Jimbuna]

You know something Tribesman, you could get arrested for giving away America's top secret plans! The CIA could swoop in and take you away and make you spend a week in a pub, so let that be a warning to you!:D

Mines a pint :Kaleun_Cheers:

[eddie]

We'll be keeping an eye on you too Jim, lock you up with Tribesman, but will put everything on Alex' tab!:salute:

[Jimbuna]

We'll be keeping an eye on you too Jim, lock you up with Tribesman, but will put everything on Alex' tab!:salute:

Why thank you kind sir :sunny:

[Tribesman]

You know something Tribesman, you could get arrested for giving away America's top secret plans! The CIA could swoop in and take you away and make you spend a week in a pub, so let that be a warning to you!
:up:
you gotta laugh at his pathetic nonsense though, I mean chemtrails for gods sake:nope:
then again if you look at the crazy kooks other stories on the wonderful site Alex kindly provides for ridiculing him as a nazi twat then you get the jews did 9/11, the jews did the London bombings, the jews did the nuclear meltdown in Japan and of course some nice holocaust denial sit as its all about an occidental conspiracy and how they run America and Britain and errrr...the world.
Dumb Nazis eh:doh:

Still if its to be a week in a pub I am game for one of Sam Smiths fine yorkshire establishments.

[eddie]

Even if you were in a pub for a week, so drunk you couldn't stand up, you still wouldn't understand what he wrote, let alone when you are sober!

More then likely, if you are like me, why would we even want to read it!:haha:

[Alex]

CHEMTRAILS Americas next global conspiracy after already poisoning everyone with floride:har::har::har::har::har::har:
LOL, not my fault if the Occident doesn't provide you with fair news only. See, you too are against the absence of meaning you can find in our occidental news, Tribesman. :yep: http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/80484324ha.gif

[Tribesman]

LOL, not my fault if the Occident doesn't provide you with fair news only.
yes its wierd, the occidental global media conspiracy doesn't run websites full of crap about chemtrails and jews blowing up the twin towers, its left to idiot nazis to "enlighten" us with those amazing news items from loony conspiracy theory websites.

[August]

http://home.comcast.net/~rdsterling/pwpimages/indiannajonesihatenazis.jpg?PHPSESSID=99e719f19574 849672ccad14abeef220