Jakob Nielsen SHREDDERS Windows 8

[Skybird]

http://www.useit.com/alertbox/windows-8.html

Devastating verdict.

I especially recommend the links to materials he gives in the last paragraph and at the end. There is plenty of information (hundreds of pages) on details and principles of handling design that I usually summarize under the simple term "ergonomy".

And ergonomy seems to be something that Windows 8 has no clue about.

In case you never heared of Jakob Nielsen, he is no unknown:

http://www.useit.com/jakob/

[Gerald]

Windows 8, I would wait to install for a new OS,they need time for more dev.

[Skybird]

Windows 8, I would wait to install for a new OS,they need time for more dev.
More dev on 8? No, they need more time for a new OS. :know: Trying to save W8 imo is a waste of resources.

With W8, they did it wrong from the starting line on. In a new OS, they must already start with keeping the classic PC and touchscreens/tablets two different OS in design and ergonomy. Not one OS - TWO. Instead of having a Windows Home and a Windows Pro and a Windows Business, they must do a Windows PC and a Windows Tablet/Touchscreen and a Windows Smartphone.

[antikristuseke]

W8 needs to go the way of the dodo, it is complete and uter garbage.

[the_tyrant]

I have to say, I like the new design, but than, everyone has to admit, that certain compromises were made.

Well, lets discuss the desktop first. The start button has been hidden. You still click in the same location to get into the start screen, but there is no more button.

Aero has been removed. It depends on if you liked aero or not, but aero has been removed, and again, it depends on your tastes.

The first big improvement that I like, is the new animations. You barely notice it when it is there, but you do notice it when its not. The thing is, your computer has bottle necks when it comes to performance. Your graphics card is rarely one of them. When say you boot a program, instead of showing a static splash screen, it would have a little spinning animation.

What do these little animations do? Well, they show that the computer is still responding, and not dead. You see, when your computer is completing an action that takes a few seconds, in windows 7, it seems "dead", whereas in windows 8, there is an animation that shows that your computer is still working.

This explains a common statistic. Statistics show that in windows 8, users on average force close programs less. Why? Lets say your computer has been bottlenecked, and the program "freezes" for 10 seconds. In windows 8, the built in programs all have forms of feedback, aka you know that the program is still working. However, it windows 7, it just looks like the program is "dead", you will continuously click on it, until you get the message that the program is not responding and that you should close it.

The second main thing that I like, is the new, app neutral notification system.

Consider this, I am in excel entering some data. My right hand would be on the number pad. In windows 7, if someone sends me a message on facebook at the time, I would hear a "ping", and I would have to move my hand off the number pad, use the mouse to click the browser and select the right tab, than view what the message is, and decide to respond.

In windows 8, under the same situation, the messages app would have a notification pop up on the top right, I would see who messaged me, and what he/she is saying. If I decide to respond, I would move my hand to the mouse, click on the notification, and start my response. If I decide not to, I can ignore it, and continue entering my data.

Thirdly, the "glanceability" is hugely improved. Consider this, lets say I want to check the number of unopened emails I currently have, in windows 7, I would have to press the windows button, click on the outlook icon, wait for it to boot, wait for it to download my email, and finally I can see if I have an unopened email. takes me 10 seconds in all.

I windows 8, I just need to hit the windows button, and I can instantly see the number of unopened emails I have. Hit the windows button again, and I am back doing what I was just doing. Takes me less than 1 second.

The Metro applications are "lighter" applications, I use them for light tasks, and that is what they are suited for. I use them if I am in the mood to take some notes/doodle in OneNote, or to quickly check some sports scores.

In fact, I would argue that Metro is simply an extension of OS X's much loved dashboard. It is a collection of lighter applications for some light weight use. The article you linked mentioned that the information density is lower, and that you need to go through one layer of menu to reach the more advanced stuff. I believe that is the point of metro, less information on the first layer means that there are less buttons, allowing the buttons to be bigger, easier to find, and easier to touch.

After all, most users, say my grandmother, do not need the laundry list of features. Outlook intimidates her, but the windows 8 mail app does not.

Finally, from the UX perspective, Windows 8 has made some significant gains. Have you ever see the MacBook pro Retina? it has a magnificent screen. However, it does have its issues, the "retina" is simply double the pixels, and the content is simply upscaled. Windows 8 however, is resolution and DPI independent. Ever tried a laptop with a 1080p screen? the text is TINY. Yet with windows 8, since it is resolution independent, the on screen elements would dynamically scale to a size suitable for your screen.

Also, windows 8 has native touchpad gesture support. It allows the touchpad to most of the multitouch gestures on the touchscreen. Pinch to zoom, two finger scrolling, slide down to close, etc, they are all included.

Yes, it is true, Windows 8 has made many compromises when it comes to UI design. The control panel is HORRID for touch. Metro snap makes certain apps too small for them to be useful, etc.

However, I firmly believe that windows 8 moving in the right direction. it simply implements everything that the competition is working on.

OS X has "light" applications in its dashboard, Windows 8 has the metro applications. OS X has the Launchpad, windows 8 has the start screen. Ubuntu unity has the HUD, aka the "click and type" with universal search, Windows 8 has the same thing, with the metro start screen. KDE has desktop widgets, Windows 8 has the metro start screen.

[danlisa]

^ In Win 8, can or can you not have more than one active window displayed on screen at any one time?

I quite regularly require 2 or 3 active and displayed windows. Can Win 8 do this?

[the_tyrant]

^ In Win 8, can or can you not have more than one active window displayed on screen at any one time?

I quite regularly require 2 or 3 active and displayed windows. Can Win 8 do this?

Yep, you can

The highly popular aero snap is still there, and there is a "windows snap" now

[Skybird]

^ In Win 8, can or can you not have more than one active window displayed on screen at any one time?

I quite regularly require 2 or 3 active and displayed windows. Can Win 8 do this?

If you can, as tyrant claims, than not that easily anymore. You can trake form the article I lijnkied that users are forced to switc h bck and forth betweewn TWO OS, and that certain software used in offices for example first needs to switch to the other OS before it can run.

In reply to your question I quote from thjat article:


One of the worst aspects of Windows 8 for power users is that the product's very name has become a misnomer. "Windows" no longer supports multiple windows on the screen. Win8 does have an option to temporarily show a second area in a small part of the screen, but none of our test users were able to make this work. Also, the main UI restricts users to a single window, so the product ought to be renamed "Microsoft Window."

The single-window strategy works well on tablets and is required on a small phone screen. But with a big monitor and dozens of applications and websites running simultaneously, a high-end PC user definitely benefits from the ability to see multiple windows at the same time. Indeed, the most important web use cases involve collecting, comparing, and choosing among several web pages, and such tasks are much easier with several windows when you have the screen space to see many things at once.

When users can't view several windows simultaneously, they must keep information from one window in short-term memory while they activate another window. This is problematic for two reasons. First, human short-term memory is notoriously weak, and second, the very task of having to manipulate a window***8212;instead of simply glancing at one that's already open***8212;further taxes the user's cognitive resources.


It seems to me that while you can reuse some old features from W7, you cannot access these features that easily anymore like you are used to do under W7. You need to do more working steps to get there. That is no increase in ergonomy, but a drop.

I had the opportunity early this week to deal with it myself a bit on somebody else'S system, (who has deleted in meanwhile...). and handling it myself instead of just watching over people's shoulders. It was a constant working-around. And whenever I jumped into an office-type of software, I had to wait until the other OS had been loaded. Ergonomy-wise, this all is crap. Simply crap. Simple, self-explanatory, ergonomic - whatever these terms means, W8 all this is NOT.

[kiwi_2005]

I had windows 8 pro running for about a week then went back to 7 only because i had that graphics driver out of date problem with SH5 on 8 tried everything i knew of, older drivers beta drivers, direct x repair still wouldn't load up a campaign. So went aback to 7 Ultimate edition with sp1 but now i got the same problem with SH5. . WTH I can not longer play this game :/\\!! Should never had install windows 8 as i never had this problem before with 7.

Windows 8 that Metro it grew on me i actually liked it, someone said metro is just one big advertising spam window :haha: But it is a cool feature once you get use to it. Tip: if going to use 8 learn the windows shortcut key commands its far quicker than using a mouse to move around the interface, unless you using touchscreen.

[kranz]

Windows 8
my dad has bought a new notebook recently and they wanted to sell us windows 8. but i said "no, no mr. salesman, keep that crap for yourself". we bought the cheapest windows 7 oem which will perfectly fit my dad's needs (i.e. 5 lines in Word, Print, Alt+F4)

[the_tyrant]

my dad has bought a new notebook recently and they wanted to sell us windows 8. but i said "no, no mr. salesman, keep that crap for yourself". we bought the cheapest windows 7 oem which will perfectly fit my dad's needs (i.e. 5 lines in Word, Print, Alt+F4)

You know, if it comes with windows 8, you just wasted a lot of money

Windows 8 comes with downgrade rights.

[Dowly]

You know, if it comes with windows 8, you just wasted a lot of money

Windows 8 comes with downgrade rights.

But he saved the time it would take to downgrade to 7. :O:

[Madox58]

But he saved the time it would take to upgrade to 7. :O:

I'm not so sure yet if I fixed your post or not.
:hmm2:
But I did it based on alot of what i'm reading.
I got my legal copy but I'm still not convinced to install it yet.
(much like Vista that I never installed which hind sight proves was a wise move)
Show me multiple Windows open at the same time running programs.

[Dowly]

Oh... yes.. you fixed it. Thank you. :haha:

[CaptainHaplo]

My verdict on Windows 8:

I have windows 7 installed. Call me when Windows 9 RC's start showing up in my MSDN kit.

Nuff said.

[longam]

I see a trend here....hmmm :hmmm:

http://s3-ak.buzzfed.com/static/imagebuzz/terminal01/2011/9/27/12/windows-8-will-probably-suck-4150-1317141475-7.jpg

[Dowly]

I'm starting to think they are just throwing stuff in every other build and see
the reaction of the consumers, then they take out the hated features for their next
build and just leave the good ones. :hmmm:

[antikristuseke]

Throw enough **** at the wall and some of it is bound to stick. Windows design philosophy pretty much.

[AVGWarhawk]

I'm starting to think they are just throwing stuff in every other build and see
the reaction of the consumers, then they take out the hated features for their next
build and just leave the good ones. :hmmm:

They called it Vista! :03:

[the_tyrant]

I'm starting to think they are just throwing stuff in every other build and see
the reaction of the consumers, then they take out the hated features for their next
build and just leave the good ones. :hmmm:


I have to disagree with the "every other edition" theory, simply because originally, XP was horrible.

the majority of complaints people have against 8 now, was the same for xp. http://www.zdnet.com/windows-8-is-the-new-xp-7000006095/

in fact, arguably, it was worse for XP, since while 8 ran faster and used less resources than 7, XP took more resources than 2000.

XP in its initial state was so bad, that Microsoft literally scrapped its next generation OS, and rolled the changes into XP SP2 (something that Microsoft, and a huge for profit company never did). It was only after SP2 that XP finally took off, and that explains why Vista came so much later than XP.

[HunterICX]

I have to disagree with the "every other edition" theory, simply because originally, XP was horrible.

in fact, arguably, it was worse for XP, since while 8 ran faster and used less resources than 7, XP took more resources than 2000.


And you still don't get it...

It's not the Performance Windows 8 is beeing trashed for...its the fact that ''Desktop'' users are stuck with the features that are made for Tablets, Smartphones and touchscreen supported notebooks.

If Windows 8 had the option to install it as a PC user which means No Windows 3.1 tiles, Classic Start Button back where it belongs and all that Tablet and Smartphone crap removed it wouldn't be that bad.

HunterICX

[the_tyrant]

And you still don't get it...

It's not the Performance Windows 8 is beeing trashed for...its the fact that ''Desktop'' users are stuck with the features that are made for Tablets, Smartphones and touchscreen supported notebooks.

If Windows 8 had the option to install it as a PC user which means No Windows 3.1 tiles, Classic Start Button back where it belongs and all that Tablet and Smartphone crap removed it wouldn't be that bad.

HunterICX


Hmm, the exact same complaints where levied against XP:

Many complained about XP's "Fisher-Price interface" and noted that the first thing they do on any XP machine is switch back to Classic View. I wholeheartedly agree.


I like the new UI, (as outlined in a previous post in this thread). All I can say is, try it. When you buy a new computer that comes with Windows 8, don't go running to downgrade, give it a week or two, go to it with a sincere, welcoming attitude, and I am willing to bet that you would agree with me afterwards.

[HunterICX]

Hmm, the exact same complaints where levied against XP:

And here's the difference in Windows XP once you changed it to classic it stayed that way.

You don't have that in Windows 8 you don't have to option to go to classic (start button, boot straight to desktop and those tiles are gone)

HunterICX