Marijuana legalization victories could be short-lived

[geetrue]

Even though President Obama won the states of Washington and Colorado I have the funny feeing that the feds are going to come down hard on this new law that permits anyone 18 and over to purchase and use pot.

The NFL has already said that it's no pot rules are still in effect.

http://news.yahoo.com/marijuana-legalization-victories-could-short-lived-022257328.html


(Reuters) - Votes making Colorado and Washington the first U.S. states to legalize marijuana for recreational use could be short-lived victories for pot backers because the federal government will fight them, two former U.S. drug control officials said on Wednesday.

They said the federal government could sue to block parts of the measures or send threatening letters to marijuana shops, followed up by street-level clampdowns similar to those targeting medical marijuana dispensaries the government suspects are fronts for drug traffickers.

"This is a symbolic victory for (legalization) advocates, but it will be short-lived," Kevin Sabet, a former adviser to the Obama administration's drug czar, told reporters.

"They are facing an uphill battle with implementing this, in the face of ... presidential opposition and in the face of federal enforcement opposition," Sabet said.

Colorado and Washington state legalized the possession and sale of marijuana for adult recreational use on Tuesday through ballot measures in defiance of federal law, while a similar initiative was defeated at the polls in Oregon.

The initiatives appeared to reflect growing national support for liberalized marijuana laws, as indicated by a Gallup poll last year that found 50 percent of Americans favored making it legal, versus 46 percent opposed.

[Sailor Steve]

So what it comes down to is the Federal Government openly opposing the will of the people. This could be entertaining.

[geetrue]

Here's an interesting side note.


Ian Millhiser, senior constitutional policy analyst with the left-leaning Center for American Progress, said the federal government, even if it sues to challenge the Colorado and Washington initiatives, cannot force police in those states to arrest people for marijuana infractions.


in other words no matter what the feds do to the state the local law enforcement don't have to do a thing to the users.

[Buddahaid]

And I doubt any will since they are likely as cash strapped as every other force. Maybe a Sheriff here or there will but that's all. The Feds will still fight it uselessly just like they did during prohibition, but what I'll find more interesting is will the Mexican drug gangs leave now? Will the toxic secret plantations disappear?

[the_tyrant]

Marijuana is a difficult substance to regulate, because it stays in your bloodstream for so long. You will test positive up to one month after smoking it.

Even if it is legalized, there will be many places that demand that you are not on it. For example, driving, work, school, etc. until new testing measures are developed, it is effectively illegal anyways

[sharkbit]

Even if it is legalized, there will be many places that demand that you are not on it. For example, driving, work, school, etc. until new testing measures are developed, it is effectively illegal anyways

Even if I wanted to smoke it(never really liked all that much in college), I can't. My line of work(aircraft mechanic) requires random pee tests for drugs. If I fail one, I lose my job and very possibly my A&P certificate allowing me to work on airplanes and then my career is out the window. At 48, I don't want to start thinking about a new career.

:)

[Armistead]

Difficult issue with the majority of employers requiring drug testing, even if you legally wanted to enjoy it on Friday night, you would fail a drug test on Monday.
What is a cop suspects you're high, but it was days ago that you smoked, but you fail the test and get a DUI.

I have no problem with it being legal, but lot's of issues need to resolved.

[RickC Sniper]

Pot was already legal in Colorado, you just needed a prescription to purchase it legally.
ANYBODY could get a doctor to write them a prescription. There are already more places that openly sell (prescription) marijuana than there are Starbucks in Colorado.


The new law allows you to posses only one ounce of the stuff, and the age limit is 21, not 18. You won't even be allowed to smoke it publicly.

The Federal government now has to decide if it wants to challenge a state's right to legalize, regulate, and tax it.

http://www.collegian.com/2012/11/08/colorado-makes-history-and-legalizes-pot/

[RickC Sniper]

in other words no matter what the feds do to the state the local law enforcement don't have to do a thing to the users.

The job of the local authorities will be to enforce the age limit, the possession limit, and the illegal use of it in public.

[Buddahaid]

Guess it all depends where you live but I've watched a cop say to a group smoking "That better be pot."

Around where I live they pretty much have bigger fish to fry all the time. Sure, you'll get busted lighting up in a car but rarely for just having it in public.

[Penguin]

There has certainly be a limit of THC in the body to be defined - similar like for alcohol in the blood.

The interesting point is still, how a legalization will look like. The Netherlands went the pragmatic way: they didn't change one law. Their cops just have the order to stay put under a certain amount.
The reason for this is also that they signed international treaties to fight drugs, as well as WHO-treaties. This is what would hinder a legalization on the federal level.

A Dutch sollution could lead to interesting scenarious in the US. When a guy walks along the street sporting a spliff and gets spotted by the local PD, they must not act, while a DEA agent standing next to him would have to seizure the joint.

[Betonov]

Didn't know that THC lingers in blood for a week :huh:

Good thing my employer doesn't do blood tests and I never give anyone a reason to send me to one

[geetrue]

The job of the local authorities will be to enforce the age limit, the possession limit, and the illegal use of it in public.

I didn't know the age limit was 21, thank you, but I did know that it was legal to possess one ounce or less on your person in downtown Denver for several years now.

I do know that the feds rarely bother anyone growing pot of less than 100 plants (if it's not for sale) and that is in California or any of the other states.

I also know that Colorado is one of the few states that allow marijuana to be in energy drinks among many other non FDA approved items you can purchase and consume (not good says I :down:)

[Stealhead]

That is nothing hair tests are the most accurate they cost alot so many places dont use them.Pretty much via a hair test they will know about anything you have used in the past 6 months any regular user of any substance(except booze) the hair test will nail you.Some dumb dumbs think that shaving your head saves you... wrong they can use any type of hair from your body.So if you shaved your head they'd get the hair off of your arm or leg and if you where 100% hairless well that would just be highly suspect.

Many people are very lucky that the most common test is urinalysis it is the most easy to cheat.In the US military they make it much harder though if your pee is too clean they suspect that you did something and they make you go again also when you give the sample someone stands right over your shoulder and watches you because some people will try and use a fake penis and pee fake pee.

In the civilian world labs don't look that close so they get fooled by fake urine or a sample that has been thinned by some substance.

Personally I dont see anything wrong with an adult smoking pot within reason I think booze is much worse than pot from an abuse standpoint someone drinks too much they beat someone up or crash their car someone gets high they eat a bunch of junk food and laugh while watching their stoned buddy play Golden Axe and beat the game and only die once.(I have never done any such thing die only once in Golden Axe that is).

[geetrue]

Just found this information:

The new laws allow those 21 and older in Washington state to purchase an ounce of marijuana from a licensed retailer and in Colorado to possess an ounce of the drug and grow as many as six plants in private. The Colorado law is scheduled to go into effect in June. The Washington law starts in December 2013.

Still a long way off if you ask me ...

[CaptainMattJ.]

What's with the feds lately? This is clearly a state issue aand one the feds should mind their own business about. It feels like prohibition all over again. is it for health concerns? Maybe we should ban alcohol, tobacco, high-fat foods and many prescription drugs then too. Marijuana is proven to be at least on par in body debilitation as cigarettes and alcohol with, in moderation, less side effects. Alcohol in many ways is worse. But they go after marijuana, for little to no conclusive reason. Why dont they just let people do what they've already voted to do? They need to seriously check their boundaries.

It's the same as the immigration reform in Arizona. Arizona's immigration problem is deplorable. The people of Arizona spoke, they wanted to ENFORCE THE LAWS THAT WERE ALREADY THERE, and still the feds got involved. This is where the democrats and i violently part. immigration, so relevant and such a problem for border states, shouldn't be an issue at all. These people are coming illegally into this country. They therefore should be deported without having to jump through hoops to enforce the laws we already have in place. Arizona's laws were hardly unconstitutional. It didn't target anyone, it allowed officers to check anyone's ID. ANYONE. But the feds stuck their nose into where it didn't belong.

There are certain issues where federal intervention is required. These are not those kinds of situations.

[Sailor Steve]

What's with the feds lately? This is clearly a state issue aand one the feds should mind their own business about.
Technically everything except foreign policy and interstate dealings are state issues. The idea of a Federal Government was to do only the things the states couldn't do.

Time for another Jefferson quote:

"The true theory of our Constitution is surely the wisest and best, that the states are independent as to everything within themselves, and united as to everything respecting foreign nations."
-Thomas Jefferson; letter to Gideon Granger, August 13, 1800

Of course the Fed really does need to interfere when State issues involve violating the people's rights, but this time they're trying to stop States from acknowledging peope's rights. Something is screwy here.

[breadcatcher101]

If I understand it correctly they for the most part only test those with a job that is important or very critical in nature.

Makes sense to me. I guess that's why they don't drug test members in congress.

[August]

I think we're seeing the beginning of the end for pot prohibition in this country at least at the Federal level. I think we're headed toward another recession regardless of whether they avoid the budget cliff, and they're going to need the money they can make from taxing it. Since I think a majority of the country is in favor of it's legalization I would not be at all surprised if it happens within the next 4 years while there is a sympathetic administration.

[Buddahaid]

I think we're seeing the beginning of the end for pot prohibition in this country at least at the Federal level. I think we're headed toward another recession regardless of whether they avoid the budget cliff, and they're going to need the money they can make from taxing it. Since I think a majority of the country is in favor of it's legalization I would not be at all surprised if it happens within the next 4 years while there is a sympathetic administration.

Fair assessment but I still think it will take longer. Maybe the demise of an older generation.

[RickC Sniper]

I didn't know the age limit was 21, thank you, but I did know that it was legal to possess one ounce or less on your person in downtown Denver for several years now.

No, it is not legal under current law to carry up to one ounce. It is only a considered a class 2 petty offense though. Up to 8 ounces is still a misdemeanor for the first offense More than that and 2nd or 3rd time offenses the penalty starts getting stiff.
http://www.hebetsmccallin.com/marijuana-possession.html


I also know that Colorado is one of the few states that allow marijuana to be in energy drinks among many other non FDA approved items you can purchase and consume (not good says I :down:)To my knowledge currently you can only legally purchase marijuana from a licensed dispensary, and you need a prescription. Lots of people don't like a smokey room so there are many ways to ingest it. The FDA would have a hard time inspecting things that are homemade.:ping:
Maybe national legalization is needed so the FDA can set standards and inspect.
Check out the menu!
http://legalmarijuanadispensary.com/dispensaries/colorado/denver-north/physician-preferred-products

[August]

Fair assessment but I still think it will take longer. Maybe the demise of an older generation.

I believe that generation, the WW2 generation, has pretty much passed already. My fellow boomers are far more agreeable to the idea than our parents ever were.

[RickC Sniper]

I believe that generation, the WW2 generation, has pretty much passed already. My fellow boomers are far more agreeable to the idea than our parents ever were.

True. And the "medicinal" use that few seemed to object to is laughable in it's misuse. To legalize it seems inevitable but legal analysts here feel the Feds will challenge this new law here.

[August]

True. And the "medicinal" use that few seemed to object to is laughable in it's misuse. To legalize it seems inevitable but legal analysts here feel the Feds will challenge this new law here.


Well they have to or the whole house of cards will fall but I'll bet it'll be a half hearted effort at best. I think it'll fall anyways and when it happens it will be relatively quick.

[AVGWarhawk]

Fair assessment but I still think it will take longer. Maybe the demise of an older generation.

The demise of the older generation is more than likely the reason we are seeing legislation like this. Same sex marriage, gambling, dream act and legalization of pot. These activities were basically unheard of or simply not discussed by the older generation. It seems to me the baby boomers are the generation that began accepting legislation like this. Now the young generation today accepting these things as reality. Older generation ideals are fading along with their memories.

[geetrue]

Looks like President Obama and the president of Mexico are going to have a little talk about the pot problem:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/nov/8/mexico-reconsider-smuggling-new-pot-laws-colo-wash/


A top aide to Mexican President-elect Enrique Pena Nieto says votes to legalize the recreational use of marijuana in Colorado and Washington state will force the Mexican government to rethink its efforts at trying to halt marijuana smuggling across the southwestern border.

Luis Videgaray, former general coordinator of Mr. Pena Nieto’s presidential campaign this year and now head of the transition team, told Radio Formula 970 in Mexico City that the new administration has consistently opposed the legalization of drugs, and the Colorado and Washington votes conflict with his government’s long-standing and costly efforts to eradicate the cultivation and smuggling of marijuana.

“These important modifications change somewhat the rules of the game in the relationship with the United States,” Mr. Videgaray said. “I think we have to carry out a review of our joint policies in regard to drug trafficking and security in general.

“Obviously, we can’t handle a product that is illegal in Mexico, trying to stop its transfer to the United States, when in the United States, at least in part of the United States, it now has a different status,” he said.
Mr. Videgaray is expected to play a significant role in the Pena Nieto administration. The president-elect, who will assume office Dec. 1, said in September that Mr. Videgaray would head the team that will set policy direction for the new government.

More than 47,000 people have been killed in drug-related violence in Mexico since President Felipe Calderon began a military assault on violent drug cartels in 2006. Many of the dead have included Mexican military personnel and police.