View Full Version : Is the cold war here again?
Is the cold war back for good or is it just a few bad vibration in the friendship between them
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17937795
Markus
Jimbuna
05-03-12, 04:57 PM
Nearly posted that link this morning....simply sabre rattling OMO. Neither side wants to go back to those times I reckon.
I doubt that both sides want to go back to the Cold War.
Today's rhetoric should probably seen more in backlight that russia was harmed in the NATO missile shield program and also threatened.
Russia should not feel threatened by this shield. It's not built to protect Europe against Russia but against North Korea and Iran.
In addition, a cold war, that will mean more poverty in East and Russia will again lose that war
Rockstar
05-03-12, 06:47 PM
What kind of rifle does that soldier have?
Perhaps the Russian reactions are primarily for domestic Russian consumption, making it seem the Russian government is putting up the "good fight"...
...
Halgarre
05-03-12, 10:54 PM
What kind of rifle does that soldier have?
It appears to be a SKS.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/74/PLAN_sailors.jpg
It also appears that the "ballistic" missile is actually a S-300 SAM. Which in it's own right is pretty mean.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-300_%28missile%29
I doubt that both sides want to go back to the Cold War.
Today's rhetoric should probably seen more in backlight that russia was harmed in the NATO missile shield program and also threatened.
Russia should not feel threatened by this shield. It's not built to protect Europe against Russia but against North Korea and Iran.
In addition, a cold war, that will mean more poverty in East and Russia will again lose that war
Still, it would probably ruin the whole concept of MAD
Molon Labe
05-03-12, 11:10 PM
It's just self interest at work in geo-politics. If the host nations for the missile system perceive having the ABMs to be a greater security risk than not having them (not necessarily their leaders... the people in the streets is enough), then they'll pull out. And even if they don't pull out, they'll probably ask for conventional air defenses (as we've seen, IIRC, in Poland), which will drive up the cost/committment for us... and we're already stretched thin as it is.
It's obviously a bluff, but it's not a bluff that's going to cost them anything, they can only benefit.
Still, it would probably ruin the whole concept of MAD
Please enlighten me. I have forgot what the abbr. MAD stand for.
Markus
Herr-Berbunch
05-04-12, 11:12 AM
Please enlighten me. I have forgot what the abbr. MAD stand for.
Markus
Mutually Assured Destruction. :yeah:
Is the cold war here again?
No.
Fincuan
05-04-12, 11:43 AM
What Russia conveniently "forgets" is that the missile shield, even if implemented to the fullest, is totally inadequate against its arsenal of ballistic missiles. The published plans include just a fragment of the missiles and sites required against a Russian threat, and the geographical locations are poor. The US version, that they're meant against Iran and NK, is imho very credible judging by the plans.
The missile shield, as currently planned, has zero effect on MAD. It's all internal politics at its worst and another attempt at restoring Russia's lost superpower status.
Not nessicarily a cold war, but it demonstrates Russias growing distrust for the West (because in their eyes, our interventionism is starting to get out of hand).
A recent quote from Putin
"We once wanted to be allies with the U.S.A, the problem is that the U.S dosen't want allies, it wants servants".
Not that Russia's own track record is entirely a glowing example of peace and diplomacy, but yes we are certainly starting to get on their nerves with our military shenanigans across the globe. Russia knows our wars have stuff all to do with protecting freedom and democracy, they are not stupid.
Also here in Germany there were a lot of discussions...most of them I have never understood...if you are threatened by an air force you've interceptors to defend yourself...if you've threatened by ballistic missiles you defend yourself with ABM systems if feasible.
What is the alternative...to do nothing or just hoping for the best?
Halgarre
05-06-12, 01:27 PM
Every time I read a story of countries becoming upset about a ABM defense and they have a large stockpile of missiles it reminds me of a bully getting mad that a victim is considering buying a baseball bat.
BossMark
05-06-12, 01:53 PM
Dont about a cold war, but its bloody cold outside to say we are into May.
So who has bigger....Russia needs glory rehabilitation.
Simply put Putin tries to fix low birth rate.
Jimbuna
05-06-12, 02:47 PM
Every time I read a story of countries becoming upset about a ABM defense and they have a large stockpile of missiles it reminds me of a bully getting mad that a victim is considering buying a baseball bat.
A good analogy :yep:
Bilge_Rat
05-07-12, 04:42 PM
Standard sabre rattling. Even though the cold war is over, Russia still is concerned about any overt threats to its national security or encroachment on its sphere of interest. The finlandisation of Belarus, ongoing meddling in Ukraine politics and the 2008 invasion of Georgia are all clear signs that Russia will not allow any interference in its playground.
However, as long as the West respects these limits, I doubt we have anything to fear from Russia. Russia is integrated into the world economy and is making mucho cash from selling Oil and natural resources to resource hungry economies. It has not interest in upsetting the money flow.
China however is a different story, resource hungry, huge demographic pressures, deep suspicion of western motives, it is a ticking time bomb.
Forget Russia, it's China we have to worry about.
China however is a different story, resource hungry, huge demographic pressures, deep suspicion of western motives, it is a ticking time bomb.
True, although many will hate me for saying this - doesnt most of that statement not also apply to the USA and Europe too? the worst part is we are all near bankrupt, where as China is not.
Catfish
05-08-12, 03:35 AM
Scenes from the cold war, the fight from 1:05 on is epic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTOQUnvI3CA
Still the best visualization :D
kraznyi_oktjabr
05-10-12, 03:18 AM
I encountered following comment in another forum. Its not directly linked to article in question but more generally in USA - Russia sabre rattling: "This is not about missile defence nor about it's perceived or real threat to Russian ICBMs - it is about trying to keep US out of Central Europe hoping for the day Russian garison will again station in Warsaw or in vicinity (as it did, 1795-1807,(break for Bonaparte) 1813-1830,(break for uprising),1831-1915 (break for Germans and independence, then again Germans) 1945-1993..."
Writer of that comment is from Poland.
vBulletin® v3.8.11, Copyright ©2000-2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.