Request tactical advice on convoy approaches

[MKalafatas]

It's a dark, moonless night. Cruising in the S-boat northwest of Luzon, I dive for a sonar check. (The S-boat has no sonar on the surface). Get a faint reading at compass heading of 100 degrees and --- expecting a convoy from the east, head due south on the surface to engage.

Perfect interception. Except....

I can't see what the hell I'm shooting at. The bow-on approach angle is so acute and the night is so dark, that I can't identify targets. Ergo, I have no range data. Ultimately, I "guess" the target is a large composite freighter and fire four fish with a small spread. All missed.

Some depth charging for my troubles.

What have I done wrong?

Thanks much!

[PacificWolf]

It's a dark, moonless night. Cruising in the S-boat northwest of Luzon, I dive for a sonar check. (The S-boat has no sonar on the surface). Get a faint reading at compass heading of 100 degrees and --- expecting a convoy from the east, head due south on the surface to engage.

Perfect interception. Except....

I can't see what the hell I'm shooting at. The bow-on approach angle is so acute and the night is so dark, that I can't identify targets. Ergo, I have no range data. Ultimately, I "guess" the target is a large composite freighter and fire four fish with a small spread. All missed.

Some depth charging for my troubles.

What have I done wrong?

Thanks much!




Perfect interception is when You know what You shooting at, whats the size of the convoy (if theres any), and You know the range and speed of the target.
Besides the S-Type boats are the worst in game so try to start the carrer with other sub, and always fire a torpedo from 1000m away its 100% accurate when You attacking Merchant (no matter what kind torp You use Steam or Electric).

[MKalafatas]

Perfect interception is when You know what You shooting at.

! I think you hit the nail on the head. Instead of diving in to shoot, I might have paralleled the convoy to ID the targets first. It was a 9-knot convoy with 8 merchants and 3 escorts. There was plenty to shoot at; I headed for what looked like the largest ship, fired from 1000m @ 90 degrees, and came away empty.

The stadimater is giving me migraines.

Thank you!

[PacificWolf]

My tactics is:
1. Swimming at the surface and searching for radar (if You had any) or sonar contacts.
2. when i have a contact i slow down and track this bastard and plant his course on the map.
3. When i had the course im going to set my position within firing range and go to periscope depth, go to silent running (strangely even the merchants can hear You so keep that in mind)
4.When i identify that the ship im about to engage is hostile I Fire torp (if thats nessary, because if the ship doesnt have deck gun i surface i engage it with my gun to save the torp).

[MKalafatas]

4.When i identify that the ship im about to engage is hostile I Fire torp (if thats nessary, because if the ship doesnt have deck gun i surface i engage it with my gun to save the torp).

Are you saying you will engage escorted merchants with the deck gun?

Thanks for answering a newb's question. I played a few games with the auto TDC, which IDs targets automatically. "Diving in" is the way to go, I guess, with the auto TDC ... but manual targeting requires more prep.

[PacificWolf]

I only engage lone (unarmed) merchants with deck gun, my convoy tactics is different.

[Ewall007]

Are you saying you will engage escorted merchants with the deck gun?

Thanks for answering a newb's question. I played a few games with the auto TDC, which IDs targets automatically. "Diving in" is the way to go, I guess, with the auto TDC ... but manual targeting requires more prep.

Hi; you might want to try this if your auto-targeting

Use your sonar to get a range on you target ( is he coming toward you or going away from you)

When within radar range start running a track using the marking tool (black pen) mark an X wait 3 minutes mark another X. This will tell you not only what direction he is moving, but if you measure between the 2 points you can find the speed of the target (I think its 100yrds per minute) go 1200yrds in 3 minutes and that is 12 knts speed.

Use the TBC to ID the target then use the "N" key to look up what ship it could be there will be all the information about the target.

Set your boat to intercet the target at a 45 degree angle either side doesn't matter. (Even if you have to run at a 5 mile distance to pass the target do it) the whole idea is to be out in front of him to set your self up for the big shot.

Now the fun part; once I get lined up at the right angle I dive my boat to around 170 to 200 feet depending on what part of the ocean your in. Reason; a thing in the game called a "thermal cline" once your below it there sonar has trouble picking you up. I've run into the middle of convoys at "FULL" speed and the escorts never knew I was there untill the first and then the second ships were hit.

Lock the TDT before you go under, if the target does not change it direction he will be where he should be when you come up to parascope depth. (remember to unlock the TDT before firing) Adjust your boat (using rudder) to get the best shot.

I give my self some time when coming up; target is at 3500 yrds, I want to shot at 2000 yrds or less if I can. I start to go to parascope depth using 1/3 slient running at around 3000 yrds. As I come up I watch the map to make sure there are no escorts with in 1500 to 2500 yrds of me. Then I raise the parpscope manually Keys(Page-Up / Page-Down)

When the target is in range and everything else looks good I fire. If I have a chance to get anoth shot I fire again. :D

Ewall007
"Ranging Far, Sweeping Wide"
Quote from Victory at Sea 1955

[MKalafatas]

Thanks for the comments, captains. Many interesting ideas. Going through the manual targeting tutorials now...

[Rockin Robbins]

Good hunting to you! We expect a report of success soon. Keep in mind that hunting with the S boat relies very heavily on the luck that you will find a convoy heading in your direction. Catching one from a large angle away from their track is often just an exercise in frustration with the slow S Boat.

But we who have put our time in with them love the S Boat. It is slow on the surface, but submerged you have a full knot more speed than a fleet boat and they seem stealthier and harder to detect.

[MKalafatas]

Keep in mind that hunting with the S boat relies very heavily on the luck that you will find a convoy heading in your direction. Catching one from a large angle away from their track is often just an exercise in frustration with the slow S Boat.

But we who have put our time in with them love the S Boat. It is slow on the surface, but submerged you have a full knot more speed than a fleet boat and they seem stealthier and harder to detect.

Your advice hit the mark in my current patrol. While cruising from Suribaye to my patrol area in the Celebes, I was about 10 nm west of Ternate. Diving for a sonar check, the console lit up with a faint reading to the southwest. Turning about to intercept at flank speed on the surface, it took three and a half hours, chugging precious fuel, to gain visual confirmation.

I could make 11 knots on the surface in moderate seas; the small convoy was headed due south at 9 knots, 8 miles distant.

Expecting that by end-of-patrol we might need to make Fremantle, I could not justify the expenditure of fuel to run them down. A 7-knot convoy might have been within reach, but not a 9-knot convoy. The tank was already depleted by 25% from earlier adventures and I had not even reached my patrol area. It would take at least six hours at flank speed to gain a firing position. The price was too high; I turned about and headed north.

[0rpheus]

Thanks for answering a newb's question. I played a few games with the auto TDC, which IDs targets automatically. "Diving in" is the way to go, I guess, with the auto TDC ... but manual targeting requires more prep.

More prep is exactly it. There will be some weather situations, especially when using supermods like TMO, that you just can't get a visual on the target. Heavy fog, rain and moonless nights can all ruin a potential attack, forcing you to rely on sonar/radar ranging (a whole different kettle of fish entirely). I've turned off quite a few convoys after tracking them through days of 200m visibility weather - leaves a sour taste in the mouth! :damn:

CapnScurvy's Optical Targeting Correction mod greatly improves the manual targeting experience too - well worth a look :up:


EDIT: just remembered: even with manual targeting, you can ID the target by locking them in the periscope ('L' key) and clicking the ID Target button. It might take a few goes to work, but it will get it eventually. 'Course you need a visual on the target to do this, but it can save you a few seconds if you're in a hurry.

[MKalafatas]

More prep is exactly it. There will be some weather situations, especially when using supermods like TMO, that you just can't get a visual on the target. Heavy fog, rain and moonless nights can all ruin a potential attack, forcing you to rely on sonar/radar ranging (a whole different kettle of fish entirely). I've turned off quite a few convoys after tracking them through days of 200m visibility weather - leaves a sour taste in the mouth! :damn:

CapnScurvy's Optical Targeting Correction mod greatly improves the manual targeting experience too - well worth a look :up:


EDIT: just remembered: even with manual targeting, you can ID the target by locking them in the periscope ('L' key) and clicking the ID Target button. It might take a few goes to work, but it will get it eventually. 'Course you need a visual on the target to do this, but it can save you a few seconds if you're in a hurry.

The ID target button? Where is that?

I believe I solved the original problem in another way (i.e., shooting at unknown targets whose speed and course is known). Reached a similar firing position on my current patrol. Escorted target, large but unidentified (turned out to be an old passenger carrier). The seas were so high that if was difficult to keep the periscope locked; yet, I knew the target's speed and course.

I simply drew a triangle: 36-unit leg on the vertical axis, representing torpedo speed; 7-unit leg on the horizontal axis, representing target speed. The two legs must meet, no? The handy protractor tool gave an 11-degree separation from the bottom of the vertical leg to the outward point on the horizontal leg.

I maneuvered the boat to a perfect 90-degree angle, zeroed out the TDC, and determined to fire torpedoes when the target reached a bearing of 11 degrees. (It would have been a bearing of 349 degrees had the target approached from the left).

After a minute, I realized that I didn't even need the periscope. The sonar was tracking the target --- so I dived to 90 feet, fired two fish when target bearing reached 11 degrees. Two torpedo impacts, target destroyed.

Actually, as the target was approaching the firing reticle, the bearing changed so quickly that the sonar operator was calling out two-degree intervals. I fired the first torpedo when the target reached a bearing of 12 degrees, trusting to luck and my close firing range.

Surely some others have hit upon this method also...

I will definitely grab CapnScurvy's optical targeting mod!