PDA

View Full Version : Destroyer ignores my attack

gambla
02-10-12, 11:08 AM
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/%3Ca%20href=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/213/destroyeri.jpg/%20target=_blank%3E[IMG]http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/1500/destroyeri.jpgHi Kaleuns,

it's early in the war, 1939. I've attacked a convoy and two ships were in flames. But this destroyer didn't show any sign of any reaction at all ? He just moved on. Is this one of the original bugs or is IRAI failing ? Maybe i hit a random detroyer awareness of 0 % ?

thanks guys






http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/1500/destroyeri.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/213/destroyeri.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)
Maki4444
02-10-12, 12:43 PM
It's ok because I believe that you are patroling along the British eastern coast. Ant it's the beginning of the war. Destroyers then we're mostly caught by surprise bcause so early in the war they didn't really know that the Germans would launcha u boat campaign, secondly a lot of the time they were convinced that a ship struck a runaway mine. So the IRAI is good, wait until 1942 Then you'll see some destroyer action :D
misha1967
02-10-12, 01:42 PM
What Maki said.

I had the same reaction when I ran into a convoy of two large steamers in September of 1939 along the British coast, sank one of them and then watched dumbfoundedly as its three escorts steamed on regardless.

Just wait. Soon enough you're going to find yourself wishing they'd pay less attention to you! :DL
Hinrich Schwab
02-10-12, 01:44 PM
Before the Battle of Britain began (roughly), Destroyer tactics and performance were somewhat underwhelming. I haven't tinkered with IRAI yet, but relating previous SH games, destroyers start stepping up their game around the end of 1941. During the early war, expect a lack of consistency. I remember getting caught out by a pair of V&Ws near the Straits of Dover (you know...the Deathtrap :Kaleun_Crying:) I was on the surface, so they took potshots at me with their guns in the dark. My conning tower got dinged pretty good, but nothing critical. I crash dove, of course, and one of the two destroyers trundled over to my last position and banged once or twice with ASDIC. I was already long gone before he made it over there.

Enjoy the laziness while you can. Once the Tommies get their act together, they are on you like angry fans at a football riot.:o
gambla
02-10-12, 02:26 PM
Thanks guys, :up:

yes, it's the british eastcoast and it's early in the war, so it's for sure still easy to deal with them. I just wish that the escorts would move to the sinking ships, using their search lights, pick up survivors, or just monitoring the events. Just moving on and ignoring everything is a bit strange.:shifty:

But some weeks earlier, after leaving Scapa Flow, two bigger destroyers (two gun turrets on bow) gave me the first hard time. Must have been veterans of WW I. :salute:

cheers,
gam
Catfish
02-11-12, 11:29 AM
Really, a dark gray U-boat in the night - what do you think a destroyer would see under such circumstances ?

There are hundreds of reports telling they were almost running alongside destroyers at less than 100 meters, and were NOT seen, in the night.

ANd also destroyers and DEs also had no Radar, most not until 1943 (some not even then) - apart from Radar being useless under 1000 meters. So seeing a destroyer most U-boats just changed the course a bit, and were never seen.

If this is in the sim, it is good, because it is real.
gambla
02-11-12, 12:14 PM
You got me wrong, even if my made it clear. It's not the point that i would expect the DDs hunting my boat. Talking about realism, i don't think the sim is "good" here. If there were massive explosions and large fires on one of the convoy ships, the DDs would move to the sinking ships, using their search lights, pick up survivors, or just monitoring the events. I mentioned that already.
Catfish
02-11-12, 05:12 PM
Hello Gambla,
ah ok. The convoy itself was ordered to go on if attacked, but destroyers would somehow react to torpedoed ships changing their patterns or anything, right.
Greetings,
Catfish
Sailor Steve
02-11-12, 06:59 PM
This is weird. Everyone is talking about how well ships can see in 1939, and it doesn't appear to me that anyone has asked the most important question: Gambla, are you using TDW's AI mod? If not, no destroyer will ever react to you, even if you sail up to one in broad daylight. The AI in the stock game is all screwed up. With TheDarkWraith's mod you will quickly learn to hate life.
Michael13
02-11-12, 07:53 PM
This is weird. Everyone is talking about how well ships can see in 1939, and it doesn't appear to me that anyone has asked the most important question: Gambla, are you using TDW's AI mod?
May be because:
Is this one of the original bugs or is IRAI failing ?

:hmmm:
Hinrich Schwab
02-12-12, 03:00 AM
From what I have seen, the stock AI reminds me a lot of what I am seeing in SH II. The stock AI does not react until after a ship takes a hit. From what I have read in the AI doctrine in IRAI*...well, let's just say that the battleship requirement in Operation Weserübung just got a lot more complicated. :Kaleun_Crying:

*I haven't installed this yet as I am still tweeking my mod soup and chasing persistent campaign bugs.
gambla
02-12-12, 04:30 AM
The stock AI does not react until after a ship takes a hit.


That's not too bad. But i had hit two ships. :06:
However, the minimum reaction in the Sim that i would like to see is that they head to the burning ship and "take notice".
TheDarkWraith
02-12-12, 05:11 AM
That's not too bad. But i had hit two ships. :06:
However, the minimum reaction in the Sim that i would like to see is that they head to the burning ship and "take notice".

For them to take any action they need to be part of a group or they need to 'see' an enemy. If they are single units then they behave as single units. As a single unit they will continue following waypoints until they 'see' something or they take damage from a player's weapon. Not my limitation but the game itself.
gambla
02-12-12, 06:08 AM
Don't take that wrong, TDW. I appreciate your great work. So the convoy with escorts is not defined as a group ? I wonder what a modder could about it. Could we solve this with any message (internal message, not a radio message) sent from attacked ships (status,position) that would trigger the escorts. Or maybe could it be linked with the hitpoints ?
Sailor Steve
02-12-12, 11:24 AM
May be because:

:hmmm:
Yes, it may be. :doh: :oops:
Hinrich Schwab
02-12-12, 03:21 PM
For them to take any action they need to be part of a group or they need to 'see' an enemy. If they are single units then they behave as single units. As a single unit they will continue following waypoints until they 'see' something or they take damage from a player's weapon. Not my limitation but the game itself.

When you say "see" something, are you referring to visual detection only or any sensor detection? From what I saw in stock, it seems to be visual only.
TheDarkWraith
02-13-12, 01:06 AM
When you say "see" something, are you referring to visual detection only or any sensor detection? From what I saw in stock, it seems to be visual only.

When they are not in alert state they rely mostly on visual sensors. You'll notice their hydrophone cone is very small when not in alert state. They come into alert state when they see something via any sensor.
Hinrich Schwab
02-13-12, 03:10 AM
When they are not in alert state they rely mostly on visual sensors. You'll notice their hydrophone cone is very small when not in alert state. They come into alert state when they see something via any sensor.

Just as I suspected. Thanks for the confirmation. :salute:
misha1967
02-14-12, 02:21 AM
Actually, they're ignoring you on purpose!

Just their way of saying "hah, you're not even worth bothering with!" The ultimate insult! :D

Sorry, just kidding. Had to. Don't pay attention to me. TDW is right :DL
gambla
02-15-12, 08:58 AM
No, no, i got it now ! It wasn't ignorance or a bug. I've double checked the situation and believe or not : My attack was finished at exactly 5 pm ! It was team time ! :o
Hinrich Schwab
02-15-12, 02:35 PM
Actually, they're ignoring you on purpose!

Just their way of saying "hah, you're not even worth bothering with!" The ultimate insult! :D

Sorry, just kidding. Had to. Don't pay attention to me. TDW is right :DL

I am sure that the Queen Elizabeth Class BB did not agree with her escorts' apathy when three of my four eels sheared off her bow and ignited an ammo magazine. :Kaleun_Los:
That Norwegian water is cold.