Food Constraint

[Joe's #2 son]

Happy New Year:woot:! I was wondering if any of the forum members would know how many days of food a uboat could carry. I feel voluntarily setting this constraint on a patrol would make the game more realistic, instead of staying on patrol indefinitly until your torpedoes are spent. If this historical information is available, it seems each class of uboat would have a different limit. If any of you have applied this constraint, would you kindly share your method or insights. It could be possible, that you would have to return to base with full torpedoes and an empty stomach.
Thank you all, good luck in '12. Sinks zem all !!

[Gargamel]

Usually for me, depending on where I get assigned, fuel becomes an issue first. Unless, of course I'm in a target rich location.

But I think I remember reading somewhere (Blair maybe?) that they tried to match the food load to the expected fuel usage. Iirc, somewhere around 2-3 months. But don't quote me on this.

Edit:
http://uboat.net/men/foodstuffs.htm

Per that link, a IXC usually carried a 12 week supply. In game you would be hard pressed, short of being assigned to the sargasso sea, to keep torpedos for that long.

[Kapt Z]

I try and adjust my cruising speed to allow for about 50+/- days in a type VIIB/C which is my boat of choice.

The type IXs of course, could stay out much longer.

[andwii]

idk how you guys can make it more then 20 days at sea. I always seem to be in within 15 days, or in a refuel station.

[Sailor Steve]

I cruise to my zone at setting 2, and patrol at setting 1, only going faster if I'm actually in pursuit of something. I had one patrol in a Type VII last 85 days, which I'm sure is not historic.

[Missing Name]

My patrols rarely last longer than a month. One did last two, though.

Uboat crews had the best food in the Kriegsmarine. Which only tells how atrocious the rest of it must have been... fishing, anyone?

[PappyCain]

You might enjoy this site and this page. I always wished there was a mod for food allotment, a sort of a days at sea metering - sometimes your fuel could outlast your food in reality.



http://uboat.net/men/foodstuffs.htm (http://uboat.net/men/foodstuffs.htm)


you can also check against the length of patrols and type of boat for historical data.

Me? I have my immersion kit. When the food rack is lean, I head home.

"U-boat crews would often trade with fishermen for fresh fish as well as board their victims and remove any foodstuffs they could carry."


:salute:

[Sailor Steve]

But is it anywhere stated that any u-boat ended a patrol because they ran low on food? That's the real question.

[PappyCain]

I have read that in a true account. The only way they extended the patrol was to filtch fish at gunpoint with local fisherman. Especially when they transited to to S.A. and the Caribbean. You could not feed 40 men plus on what was provided, as cured meat was the only thing left - the flour and bread even spoiled and all fresh fruit was devoured in the first week. Add too a stinking hot boat, hot climate and black mold was an issue in all seas too, a major issue. What I suggest is that the food stores lost a fair percentage that was not consummed even if the weevils, maggots and larvae were picked off.

:salute:

[Sailor Steve]

Source please. I've also read about fishing, stealing fish and of course killing polar bears. What those don't say was whether they did it because they had no food left or because they were tired of canned food. I've still not read of a patrol ending over lack of food.

[PappyCain]

There is an excellent book on this subject: White, John F. U-Boat Tankers 1941-45 Submarine Suppliers to Atlantic Wolf Packs. Annapolis, MD: Naval Institute Press, 1998. ISBN: 1-55750-861-5. Copyright: John F. White, 1998

[Sailor Steve]

And? What does it say?

[Gargamel]

But is it anywhere stated that any u-boat ended a patrol because they ran low on food? That's the real question.

Page 91 of Blair's first volume Indicates that a number of boats did return due to low food stores, but also indicates it wasn't the only reason.

U-69 had to resort to killing dolphins to gain food (pg 301).

Type VII's only had enough fuel and food to patrol for ten days when they were assigned to canadian waters (pg 440).

U-332 arrived off of hatteras in feb '42 low on fuel, and u-128 was ordered to divert from Florida on their return trip to resupply u-332. They refused citing not enough food to make that detour. Pg 517.

There are also numerous accounts of both food and fuel being limiting factors in the campaign in American waters.

So, yes, I would say food did affect patrols.

[Sailor Steve]

Thank you. That was what I was looking for. Now I can join the crowd asking for food as an option in the games. :sunny:

[Gargamel]

Thank you. That was what I was looking for. Now I can join the crowd asking for food as an option in the games. :sunny:

As I mentioned before, I think they stocked to match expected fuel load. Most of the incidents I found, quite a few of them were from skippers who were later reassigned, leading me to believe mismanagement lead to food shortages.

I think adding food management would just be another annoyance of creW micro management, similar to fatigue.

[flag4]

I cruise to my zone at setting 2, and patrol at setting 1, only going faster if I'm actually in pursuit of something. I had one patrol in a Type VII last 85 days, which I'm sure is not historic.

SS, can you remember how long this 85 day patrol lasted in real time for you. was it 2-3 months or a couple of weeks or half a year?

(i think heinrich timm of u862 clocked in at 99 days on one of their patrols)

[PappyCain]

Food stores would not have to be micro managed - just a simple bar that goes from fully stocked to a 'we have 12 days rations' left sort of thing. Makes for a inconvenient or welcomed trip home. Just a thought. Maybe an randomized optional toggle box in SH3 Commander. Or, a bucket of Tootsie Rolls and Snickers under your desk - when empty head for the barn! Burp!


http://www.almightydad.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/bucket-outside.jpg

:salute:

[Gargamel]

If its a bucket, I don't make it out of port :)

[Sailor Steve]

SS, can you remember how long this 85 day patrol lasted in real time for you. was it 2-3 months or a couple of weeks or half a year?

(i think heinrich timm of u862 clocked in at 99 days on one of their patrols)
I honestly don't remember. If I was playing consistently then it probably wasn't more than two weeks. I currently have a career stalled in the middle of its fifth week, because it's been two real weeks since I last even loaded the game. That career was several years ago.

[Randomizer]

I just set a return to base date and a maximum endurance in days as part of my self-generated orders before leaving on patrol. These orders are written into the SH3 Commander log (or on paper for SH4 and every attempt is made to adhere to them.

I guess this method would not be to popular as you have to do the planning yourself rather than the computer doing it for you.

[Kapt Z]

I think adding food management would just be another annoyance of creW micro management, similar to fatigue.

I suppose they could have created some kind of food supply 'clock'. Something that would just start counting down as soon as you left port. Even if you went out into the middle of the atlantic, shut the engines down and drifted you still could not stay out there forever. This 'clock' could only be reset by visiting a port or resupply boat/ship. Just like the CO2 gauge, out of your control.

Having said all that, I don't think enough boats had to return due to food supply issues to warrant the time and effort to put it in the game.

Edit- Sorry PappyCain, didn't see your post which says basically the same thing as above...