Noob: how much GWX look can be taken to SH3?

[89]

What a great film- Das Boot! I watched its 3.5 hour version a few days ago, then rewatched it with my gf, but the 4.5 hour version that time! What would you know - I went from knowing NOTHING about subs and caring even less about them (I played nothing but Rise of Flight sim until a week ago), to being completely hooked on Silent Hunter universe!..

Such is the introduction:) Now to the question. I LOVE graphics/sound of GWX3.0 - I have it and its perfect (or lets say so for the purpose of my question). But lets also say that as far as I am concerned, the AI of stock SH3 is also perfect (once again, for the purpose of this question ;) ).

I do understand that one cannot take AI form vanilla SH3 and stick it into GXW. But what about the other way round - take as much graphical splendor from GWX and put it into SH3?

I have already replaced the stock sound with GWX's - via JGSM and it works perfect, what fantastic job Grey WOlves did!:up:

1. Next step would be the skins. I love the skins of U-boats in GWX - almost pristine and almost no rust (hey, these "boots" are German! ;) ) But I could not find them in my GWX install - its TNormal tex folder is empty:06: I would like to drag-n-drop at least the uboats skins into my SH3, the ships can stay stock as far as I'm concerned - they are a bit too clean in GXW for me anyway)

3. The periscope screen in GXW - is there an easy way to transfer it into SH3? (apart from the sliding out compas of course)? The spirally-stripy periscope height gauge in particular. But to have the whole thing with higher res buttons etc would be perfect.

4. GWX water - this is the hardest part and I ask, but I already guess that that it is unlikely (new visibility leads to new sensors leads to new AI). Is it not possible to have stock AI with increased visibility graphics? Yes, I would see them and they wouldnt at long ranges- thats ok. It will be likeSplinter Cell game - still good fun. In fact, Splinter Cell analogy is important to me gameplay wise - I do feel there is something like it in stock SH3 gameplay mechanics - not very realistic, but somwhat believable and hugely enjoyable.

5. Is there anything else major that makes GWX so much nicer to look at compared to SH3 ?

Cheers!:up:

[Herr-Berbunch]

1. Many skins available in the download section, installable with JSGME.
2. There is no 2?
3. Again, check out the download section, plenty of things to choose from.
4. I'm guessing there are water mods available in the downloads section. Also if you use SH3 Commander (highly recommended!) you can adjust the water clarity in that. In-game water colour or visibility has no effect on AI sensors, or yours other than the Mk. 1 Eyeball.
5. Erm, 16km environment, improved water, much more besides. Even the manual weighs in at some 600 A4 pages compared to the stock manuals lame effort (just the way game packagings are going).

I'm sure someone else will be along to add to this. :yeah:

[89]

Looks like I cant count to 5 lol :DL Corrected the numbers, thanks!

1. What about the actual particular GWX skins- in what folder does one find them?

Thanks for the other answers, I will browse the mods forums a bit more tomorrow. (Just wish the skins downloads section was as structured as the IL2 Sturmovik site Mission4Today :salute:)

[von Kinderei]

You can find stuff to D/L at these locations as well

http://www.silenthuntermods.com/forum/index.php?board=7.0


http://www.mediafire.com/Magic1111#yhhv23rf400h4,1



http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=f33c76a30b3444741bee9a6e9edd9c7666416aa0 4d394890c81041a3fc51d567

[Sailor Steve]

What a great film- Das Boot! I watched its 3.5 hour version a few days ago, then rewatched it with my gf, but the 4.5 hour version that time! What would you know - I went from knowing NOTHING about subs and caring even less about them (I played nothing but Rise of Flight sim until a week ago), to being completely hooked on Silent Hunter universe!..
Well, WELCOME ABOARD! :sunny:

Such is the introduction:) Now to the question. I LOVE graphics/sound of GWX3.0 - I have it and its perfect (or lets say so for the purpose of my question). But lets also say that as far as I am concerned, the AI of stock SH3 is also perfect (once again, for the purpose of this question ;) ).
Of course a lot of us completely disagree about the stock AI, but that's not your question, so...

I do understand that one cannot take AI form vanilla SH3 and stick it into GXW. But what about the other way round - take as much graphical splendor from GWX and put it into SH3?
Sure you can. Use MultiSH3 to create a second installation. Load GWX into one of them. Now you can copy and paste all the graphics folders from GWX into the stock game.

I have already replaced the stock sound with GWX's - via JGSM and it works perfect, what fantastic job Grey WOlves did!:up:
If you love the movie so much (I do too) then why not try the Das Boot Sound Mod? Many many files from the movie.

1. Next step would be the skins. I love the skins of U-boats in GWX - almost pristine and almost no rust (hey, these "boots" are German! ;) ) But I could not find them in my GWX install - its TNormal tex folder is empty:06: I would like to drag-n-drop at least the uboats skins into my SH3, the ships can stay stock as far as I'm concerned - they are a bit too clean in GXW for me anyway)
JSGME lets you swap out skins at your leisure. SH3 Commander lets you install them by date, so the swap themselves out at the correct time.

3. The periscope screen in GXW - is there an easy way to transfer it into SH3? (apart from the sliding out compas of course)? The spirally-stripy periscope height gauge in particular. But to have the whole thing with higher res buttons etc would be perfect.
Yes, it can be done, but better modders than I will have to tell you the exact procedure.

4. GWX water - this is the hardest part and I ask, but I already guess that that it is unlikely (new visibility leads to new sensors leads to new AI). Is it not possible to have stock AI with increased visibility graphics? Yes, I would see them and they wouldnt at long ranges- thats ok. It will be likeSplinter Cell game - still good fun. In fact, Splinter Cell analogy is important to me gameplay wise - I do feel there is something like it in stock SH3 gameplay mechanics - not very realistic, but somwhat believable and hugely enjoyable.
I would recommend Rik007's SH5 Water For SH3. It comes with a 20km rendering distance. If you like the water but not the 20km there are files that can make that work.

5. Is there anything else major that makes GWX so much nicer to look at compared to SH3 ?
Mostly the goodies, like the the sights along the Kiel Canal and the blimps and things. Oh, in stock SH3 there is no Canal at all, let alone cool things to see there. If you're interested mostly in graphics then LSH3 might be more to your liking.

[CCIP]

Have you thought of working the other way? I.e. instead of trying to plug select features from GWX into SH3, why not take GWX and replace parts of it you don't like with stock (or stock-like) features?

I'm not certain about the changes to sensors made in GWX, but in theory there isn't really a difference in the AI between stock SH3 and GWX - because AI is hard-coded and GWX was developed without making any .exe changes. The differences in the AI, then, are due to sensor data and config files. The AI in GWX isn't "smarter", but has a different set of data available to it than the stock, causing it to behave differently. If there's so much you like about the look of GWX and AI is your main concern, working backwards from a GWX install could be a better way.

[Jimbuna]

I think CCIP makes a valid point....why not start with GWX and replace what you don't want with stock/vanilla files.

As Steve suggests....perform two installations and transfer opne file at a time ensuring there are no conflicts at each stage.

[89]

Many thanks for the welcome!

I have copied the entire Cfg folder from stock SH3 into GWX and played the training convoy mission - no crashes, killed the destroyer after sailing into middle of the convoy from behind him at medium speed/periscope depth, then toyed with the trawler. The trawler seemed rather clueless as to waht to do (do they only have hydrophones?) and was doing circles about 2 km behind the convoy as i lit up tanker after tanker after tanker (with torpedoes, not deck gun).

I guess i will need to try the same training mission in stock SH3, repeat all my steps and make sure that AI reaction would be identical... Or could anyone of the Grey Wolves confirm that if I replace the Cfg folder in GWX with that from stock SH3, the AI, sensors and the overall gameplay would be SH3's? I'm a noob and it is hard for me to second guess whether AI is broken:)

EDIT: Just played the same mission in stock SH3 and had exactly the same behaviour from the AI. So... it looks like, if one likes the GWX graphics but thinks that it is too hard (not just too hard, too little sneaking fun - AI seem to see you too soon too easily. To me the whole beauty of U-boats is in their sneakiness :) ), copy and replace Cfg folder from stock SH3 into the GWX. I'll update if I run into some trouble.

[Fish In The Water]

Or could anyone of the Grey Wolves confirm that if I replace the Cfg folder in GWX with that from stock SH3, the AI, sensors and the overall gameplay would be SH3's?

I think you're off to a good start, but the issue runs deeper than just the Cfg folder. There are certain key files, (such as Sensors.dat and AI_Sensors.dat), residing in the 'SH3\data\Library' folder that establish key detection parameters within the game.

Changing the one without the other is likely to produce an uneven response. So if the goal is to revert back to the stock AI detection ability, I'd be looking to swap out those files as well. :sunny:

[89]

If you love the movie so much (I do too) then why not try the Das Boot Sound Mod? Many many files from the movie.


JSGME lets you swap out skins at your leisure. SH3 Commander lets you install them by date, so the swap themselves out at the correct time.


Yes, it can be done, but better modders than I will have to tell you the exact procedure.


I would recommend Rik007's SH5 Water For SH3. It comes with a 20km rendering distance. If you like the water but not the 20km there are files that can make that work.


Mostly the goodies, like the the sights along the Kiel Canal and the blimps and things. Oh, in stock SH3 there is no Canal at all, let alone cool things to see there. If you're interested mostly in graphics then LSH3 might be more to your liking.

I am a HUGE Das Boot fan now, but I would not want to hear the phrases from the film to be repeated- especially long ones like there is one sample from Das Boot in GWX for surfacing the boat - it's cool for about 10 times to hear the same sentences, but then it gets old fast. Overall (apartfrom the surfacing "niggle") I think GWX sound is as good as it can get. Ah, the only other niggle I would like to replace there is the "Jawohl Kaleun! Ding-ding!" stuff :DL , but other than that the sounds simply amazing, the torpedo launch sounds bring shivers down my spine every time:)


Thanks for the advise to put skins into JGSM, so far I have replaced one boat's skin, but I put into the main game folder (for some reason my NormalTex folder was completely empty, all skins are in LowTex folder?). But your method is much quicker to reverse -thanks!

[89]

I think you're off to a good start, but the issue runs deeper than just the Cfg folder. There are certain key files, (such as Sensors.dat and AI_Sensors.dat), residing in the 'SH3\data\Library' folder that establish key detection parameters within the game.

Changing the one without the other is likely to produce an uneven response. So if the goal is to revert back to the stock AI detection ability, I'd be looking to swap out those files as well. :sunny:

Awesome advice! Many thanks, I will do that straight away!

[Jimbuna]

Or could anyone of the Grey Wolves confirm that if I replace the Cfg folder in GWX with that from stock SH3, the AI, sensors and the overall gameplay would be SH3's? I'm a noob and it is hard for me to second guess whether AI is broken:)



The quickest and easiest solution for you might be to use a file comparison programme such as 'BeyondCompare' to check what the differences in each file are.

That is what I did many moons ago when looking to change one or two parameters.

[Fish In The Water]

Awesome advice! Many thanks, I will do that straight away!

You're welcome, and good hunting! :arrgh!:

[89]

The quickest and easiest solution for you might be to use a file comparison programme such as 'BeyondCompare' to check what the differences in each file are.

That is what I did many moons ago when looking to change one or two parameters.

Thanks!
There is one problem though- the SH3 library folder contains 112 files, GWX contains 159!

There is no way to know which files code AI, and obviously simple replacement of Libraby folder can not work. Indeed if AI code was given additional files in GWX, then no replacement can achieve my goal. Unless i could simply deactivate the 47 "unnecessary" files?

[Jimbuna]

Thanks!
There is one problem though- the SH3 library folder contains 112 files, GWX contains 159!

There is no way to know which files code AI, and obviously simple replacement of Libraby folder can not work. Indeed if AI code was given additional files in GWX, then no replacement can achieve my goal. Unless i could simply deactivate the 47 "unnecessary" files?

With a file comparator you may be able to identify said files but I'm going to be brutally honest/frank with you....certain files were purposely connected to others for reasons felt valid at the time.

You have a mammoth task ahead of you hence...small steps, one at a time.

[Madox58]

certain files were purposely connected to others for reasons felt valid at the time.


Many files are cross-linked for many different reasons in GWX.
If you tried to draw a picture connecting all the cross-links?
It would probably look like a young child's first time with a crayon!!
:haha:

Many times this was done to re-use existing data instead of just slapping in more stuff to load at Game start.
There are many dats and such that were used from many Modders that GWX Dev's rolled into one dat and such instead of many as they used the same textures and stuff.
No need to have 4 dats that use the same texture when 1 dat will do the job.

Other times it was done to place things in logical locations for a particular reason.

It's nice to create new dats and support files for a stand-alone Mod as it makes it mostly cross Mod compatabile.
But for any Major Mod such as LSH, NYGM, WAC, GWX?
Cutting down total files and file sizes is a major consideration.

Had We went on another year or so?
I'd bet GWX would have been reduced quite a bit more in total on-disk size while offering even more cool stuff.
:yep:

[Jimbuna]

Many files are cross-linked for many different reasons in GWX.
If you tried to draw a picture connecting all the cross-links?
It would probably look like a young child's first time with a crayon!!
:haha:

Many times this was done to re-use existing data instead of just slapping in more stuff to load at Game start.
There are many dats and such that were used from many Modders that GWX Dev's rolled into one dat and such instead of many as they used the same textures and stuff.
No need to have 4 dats that use the same texture when 1 dat will do the job.

Other times it was done to place things in logical locations for a particular reason.

It's nice to create new dats and support files for a stand-alone Mod as it makes it mostly cross Mod compatabile.
But for any Major Mod such as LSH, NYGM, WAC, GWX?
Cutting down total files and file sizes is a major consideration.

Had We went on another year or so?
I'd bet GWX would have been reduced quite a bit more in total on-disk size while offering even more cool stuff.
:yep:

Much better put than me Jeff :yep:

[Madox58]

Much better put than me Jeff :yep:

Didn't want someone miscuing your meaning as an 'implied purposeful intend to hide things'.
;)

After all. You can't hide anything once you release the files!
:rotfl2:

[89]

Much better put than me Jeff :yep:

Guys, you did an awesome job, there is absolutely no denying that!

I will go back to my original plan and inject stock SH3 with as many goodies as possible to make it as close to GWX as possible. Although it will also a bit of time and effort, but at least I will know what I am doing and the end result will definitely have the AI and core gameplay that I prefer :)

I have found the periscope, deck gun and UZO graphics and successfully replaced the stock ones with the GWX ones (they live here: Progs\SH3\data\Menu\Gui)

Could anyone be so kind and tell me where I can find the mod so that my navigation map would be labeled like it is in GWX? I looked through every single SH3 mod in download section here (there arnt that many of them here to honest) and could not find anything.
http://img545.imageshack.us/img545/6182/mapxu.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/545/mapxu.jpg/)

English lables would be better still, but German would be better than nothing too. My map at the moment looks like this secondary school geography project in its initial stages:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/4500/map2n.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/148/map2n.jpg/)

[Madox58]

Find any post by jimbuna and go to his downloads by the links you'll find.
Get the GWX 3 Manual and all Mods are documented in it.
Maybe that will help.

[89]

You can find stuff to D/L at these locations as well

http://www.silenthuntermods.com/forum/index.php?board=7.0


http://www.mediafire.com/Magic1111#yhhv23rf400h4,1



http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=f33c76a30b3444741bee9a6e9edd9c7666416aa0 4d394890c81041a3fc51d567

Thanks for those links! I got a couple of mods from the first one (seabed and uniforms:) ), but links 2 and 3 are dead. Could you kindly check them?

[89]

Find any post by jimbuna and go to his downloads by the links you'll find.
Get the GWX 3 Manual and all Mods are documented in it.
Maybe that will help.

Good advice, thank you!


EDIT: Followed the advice and found out that the Navigation map mod author is FLB Sale 999. I have now successfully extracted the properly labeled maps form GWX and put the into SH3. Their location is SilentHunterIII\data\Terrain\Maps. One needs to replace both Map1 nad Map2 folders. A SUPERB mod!

[Jimbuna]

Good luck with your project http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[89]

I have now found the location of all GXW u-boats' skins (they are superb! The boats look well maintained and do not have weird paint schemes- very classy!). If one reads this and would also want to do the same- copy folders "Objects" and "Submarine" and paste'n'replace these folders into your original SH3 directory.:up: Also I was not able to find these particular skins in the Downloads section, but I prefer them to everything that i saw there.

[Fish In The Water]

I have now found the location of all GXW u-boats' skins (they are superb! The boats look well maintained and do not have weird paint schemes- very classy!). If one reads this and would also want to do the same- copy folders "Objects" and "Submarine" and paste'n'replace these folders into your original SH3 directory.:up: Also I was not able to find these particular skins in the Downloads section, but I prefer them to everything that i saw there.

Good stuff, keep on keepin' on! :yep:

[Jimbuna]

I have now found the location of all GXW u-boats' skins (they are superb! The boats look well maintained and do not have weird paint schemes- very classy!). If one reads this and would also want to do the same- copy folders "Objects" and "Submarine" and paste'n'replace these folders into your original SH3 directory.:up: Also I was not able to find these particular skins in the Downloads section, but I prefer them to everything that i saw there.

If you want a further source of quality skins I have the full set by FUBAR....click on the link above my sig.

[Herr-Berbunch]

... Overall (apartfrom the surfacing "niggle") I think GWX sound is as good as it can get. Ah, the only other niggle I would like to replace there is the "Jawohl Kaleun! Ding-ding!" stuff...


You may have come across them by now, but if not:

No Jawol http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=2861

No Ring Ring http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=419

And a quieter Ring Ring http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=425

:D