depth under keel almost zero - shallow waters quite off the coast

[Tozzifan]

www.marcogabbrielli.com/DIY/TEMP/snap605.jpg

Hi,
is that correct that in that sea area of Northern Scotland water is so shallow? (I mean, so off the coast)

thanks
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/www.marcogabbrielli.com/DIY/TEMP/snap605.jpg

[Herr-Berbunch]

In some places yes, the colouring on the map is only a vague idea of depth and the game itself isn't accurate to real life depths. The continental shelf is relatively shallow compared to mid-ocean.

You just have to be very, very careful not to get caught there!

[Tessa]

Shallow water is a plague until you can hit the open sea, with only a few relatively deep spots around England/Scottland. Save for some of the larger bodies of water like the Irish Sea most areas around AM/AN aren't more than 25-35 m deep (drop twain).

[Jimbuna]

Feel free to use your depth sounder....the enemy can't hear it.

[Fish In The Water]

I'm not usually much of a 'reality cop,' but in a case like this, pinging right in front of the enemy is a real buzz kill for me. :-?

[acetoolguy]

I just count it as a replacment for the maps showing depth we should have in game.

[Sailor Steve]

I just count it as a replacment for the maps showing depth we should have in game.
Charts weren't all that accurate seventy years ago. Harbors, sure, but no in the open sea.

[Pisces]

The channel north of the Isle of Skye, where you are, is not what I would call open sea yet. So 15 meters of depth isn't so strange. Then again, the fjords of Norway are pretty deep in real. Not what you would expect inland.

Google Earth does give depths between 50-150 meters in that region. So the SH3 maps are definately not hi-fi(delity).

[Tozzifan]

Feel free to use your depth sounder....the enemy can't hear it.

that was just another question you saved me, because I thought that pinging into enemy's grounds would perhaps give my sub away ...

[PappyCain]

Google 'bathymetry charts' in any region of the planet and you may find 'free' bathymetry views. Today, for our commercial and military purposes, the entire world's oceans are accurately mapped and surprisingly close to the sim for gaming purposes.

S'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bathymetry


Also, I read my fathometer de riguer. The only pinging that might alert warships is foward looking sonar. That signal strength out and return is to be avoided when warships are in the range to listen!

S'

[Jimbuna]

that was just another question you saved me, because I thought that pinging into enemy's grounds would perhaps give my sub away ...

I've always stated people should play the game the way they get the most enjoyment from.

Personally I don't recall having used it other than for testing purposes but that's just me.

[Jimbuna]

Charts weren't all that accurate seventy years ago. Harbors, sure, but no in the open sea.

A couple of Admiralty examples...showing different levels of detail:

http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/8626/a1chart.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/856/a1chart.jpg/)

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/218/stgeorgechannel.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/69/stgeorgechannel.jpg/)

[Sailor Steve]

Like I said - harbors. Jane's has accurate harbor maps going all the way back to 1906, but it required sounding every few yards with a plumbline. Doing that for every coastline was a near-impossible job. I have a lot of WW2 Pacific maps. Places like Midway are accurate down to the foot. Others have no soundings at all.

[Jimbuna]

Rgr that matey :salute:

[Randomizer]

Don't forget however, that Hitler's U-Boats had access to the sailing instructions, patrol reports and chart corrections from four years of intense inshore warfare from 1914-18. I could not find a single incident in WW2 where a u-boat that had a solid position fix ran aground in British waters, which indicates that the boats operating in UK coastal waters probably did have reliable depth information.

Since the in-game charts do not provide this info, using the pinger to get an accurate depth under keel is not really so gamey as it might appear.

Just $0.02.

[Jimbuna]

Didn't U-47 run aground on her approach to Scapa at one point? :hmmm:

[Herr-Berbunch]

I could not find a single incident in WW2 where a u-boat that had a solid position fix ran aground in British waters, which indicates that the boats operating in UK coastal waters probably did have reliable depth information.


Somebody should've told this man about a year ago!

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/535/acolesastute.jpg

[Randomizer]

Didn't U-47 run aground on her approach to Scapa at one point? :hmmm:
There is little information regarding U-Boats in 1914-18 that operated in Scapa or its approaches without being lost so it's likely there was not much hydrographic data in the KM records for that area.

My only point was that it is probable that the there was relatively solid navigation information on much of British coastal waters due to Germany's Great War experience where many of the U-Boat attacks took place in the shallows of the Channel, Western Approaches, North Sea and Irish Sea.

As I recall, U-47 touched bottom on a raising tide while trying to circumvent a series of block ships while on the surface. Not quite the same navigation problem as stalking shallow water coastal sea lanes submerged.

[Tessa]

Didn't U-47 run aground on her approach to Scapa at one point? :hmmm:

That particular area between the two sunken block boats was only usable during high tide. On the same date (oct 14/39) I took my boat through the same passage; if it weren't for a storm raging on it would have been difficult to make it through. One spot that (on the map) was supposed to be water was shallower than the map and did run aground once. Luckily it wasn't too harsh and was able to back out of it and get back on course.

Even so still had to make a '3 point turn' to get between the two subs safely. It's a tribute to Prien's navigational skills and previous experience that he made it through unharmed and unnoticed. Though it was a major help that he was able to use both engines - one going forward and one in reverse to force the boat into making very sharp turns like what was needed at that location.

[PappyCain]

I use my fathometer all the time and tonight it saved me in shallow water where I was able to stay 10 meters off the harbor sediment and next to a disabled British warship I hit with an eel ... the 4 others that hunted me would not drop charges close to their stricken vessel .. so in time (6hrs) they gave up. I had conning tower damage so I navigated her by chart map and using my fathometer readings I manuevered closer deep into the cove and shallower where I knew they could not come after me. I stayed submerged until nightfall. Assured the British vessels were gone, I surfaced, repaired all damage and took off for base on the surface full ahead and pass the coffee.


:salute: