View Full Version : Deck gun or Torpedo
soopaman2
10-02-11, 03:47 PM
I know traditionally it was more effective for U-boats to engage with the deckgun especially on single unarmed targets. I tend to play it historically, using my deckgun as much as possible, and saving my fish for warships and striking multiple convoy targets quick fast and in a hurry. I love my deckgun, like a marine loves his rifle.
So I ask you, my fellow Kapitänleutnants, What is your favored method of sending Allied tonnage to davy jones' locker?:arrgh!:
Well i play with GWX and in 1941 almoste every small trawler has a deckgun. But i still use my Deckgun for small targets without escort. But i try to keep enough distance to it so it doesn't hit me.
ya us GWXers cant just surface and destroy lol, stupid enemy deck guns, I almost was completly sunk because of one deck gun shot at about 3 KM. Lucky pain in the stern tube.
Fish In The Water
10-02-11, 06:28 PM
On occasion I still like to run and gun...
When the mood strikes me, I'll pop up directly behind a juicy merchant and target her guns before she knows what hit her. It's a bit of a gamble, but then playing it safe all the time isn't much fun. :arrgh!:
If the target is unarmed, the deck gun works fine. Otherwise, let the torpedo do the talking. :D
Not much fun when a merchie starts popping caps at ya from 2000 meters....learned that that hard way the 1st time I booted up GWX :wah:.
Seriously, depends on the tactical situation. I tend to use the gun when I can at night, much prettier when they blow up.....:up:
If the target is unarmed, the deck gun works fine. Otherwise, let the torpedo do the talking. :D
:up:
Sailor Steve
10-02-11, 09:58 PM
I know traditionally it was more effective for U-boats to engage with the deckgun especially on single unarmed targets. I tend to play it historically, using my deckgun as much as possible, and saving my fish for warships and striking multiple convoy targets quick fast and in a hurry. I love my deckgun, like a marine loves his rifle.
Really? Have a look through these lists and see how many ships were sunk by deck guns. I think you'll find that "playing it historically" means using the deck gun as little as possible.
http://uboat.net/allies/merchants/listing.php
Hinrich Schwab
10-02-11, 09:59 PM
Even with small unarmed targets, I use the deck gun as a last resort. Odds are the weather will not cooperate with the desire to use the deck gun and in most instances, you have to man the gun yourself to prevent wasting time and shots. I usually reserve the gun for anything smaller than a Coastal Merchant.
papa_smurf
10-03-11, 03:57 AM
Wait till Merchants are armed, then come back and tell us how it went using your deckgun:D
Really? Have a look through these lists and see how many ships were sunk by deck guns. I think you'll find that "playing it historically" means using the deck gun as little as possible.
http://uboat.net/allies/merchants/listing.php
Reinhard Hardegen used the deck gun very often. :03: And he survived the war and is still living. You could ask him. :O:
VONHARRIS
10-03-11, 04:42 AM
I use the deck gun (10,5 cm on a IX) at small UNARMED and UNESCORTED targets and from a safe distance - the closest I get is 1000m.
I keep a parallel course to the enemy ship and shell it.
I like to think that coming very close to the target , makes my crew a target for small arms fire.
I have changed the number of rounds my IX carries:
130 10,5 cm rounds
None 3,7 cm rounds - the early war heavy flak is useless.
1000 2 cm rounds.
soopaman2
10-03-11, 07:01 AM
Really? Have a look through these lists and see how many ships were sunk by deck guns. I think you'll find that "playing it historically" means using the deck gun as little as possible.
http://uboat.net/allies/merchants/listing.php
Point taken. Maybe I should change playing it historically to playing it reliably:88)
Osmium Steele
10-03-11, 08:43 AM
Reinhard Hardegen used the deck gun very often. :03: And he survived the war and is still living. You could ask him. :O:
No need. His story is all over various media.
The vast majority of his tonnage was unarmed merchants off the N. American coast. The deck gun was the obvious choice in those situations.
He was transferred to a school command before the U.S. routinely armed their merchants.
desirableroasted
10-03-11, 12:30 PM
Reinhard Hardegen used the deck gun very often. :03: And he survived the war and is still living. You could ask him. :O:
Yeah, well, is he playing GWX?
Yeah, well, is he playing GWX?
I think he has more knowledge about it then we all together. :03::O:
sharkbit
10-03-11, 12:42 PM
Wait till Merchants are armed, then come back and tell us how it went using your deckgun:D
+1 :up:
I've since unbolted mine from my sub and placed it in the flotilla commander's front yard with flowers sticking out of the barrel. :D
Waste of time and space later in the war.
I seem to remember reading in the second volume of Clay Blair's book "Hitler's U-Boat War" that the IX's kept their guns throughout the war but the VII's weren't produced with them late in the war.
soopaman2
10-03-11, 12:57 PM
Yeah, well, is he playing GWX?
I'd be willing to bet he had his fill of submarine adventures. After all a depth charge attack was alot more "real" for him than us.:DL
He would make a kick-butt modder for this game, talk about realism!:D
member reading in the second volume of Clay Blair's book "Hitler's U-Boat War" that the IX's kept their guns throughout the war but the VII's weren't produced with them late in the war.
All submarines in the baltic sea were fitted with deckguns, and also some of the most decorated commanders were allowed to keep their guns. All others were removed.
Sailor Steve
10-03-11, 01:55 PM
Reinhard Hardegen used the deck gun very often. :03: And he survived the war and is still living. You could ask him. :O:
Really? Are you sure? Okay, let's check the records.
Augvald: 1 torpedo.
Ganda: 2 torpedoes, finished off with deck gun.
P.L.M. 22: 1 torpedo.
Oberon: 1 torpedo.
Rio Azul: 1 torpedo.
Auditor: 1 torpedo.
Aurania: 2 torpedoes.
Cyclops: 2 torpedoes.
Norness: 3 torpedoes.
Coimbra: 2 torpedoes.
Norvana: 1 torpedo.
City of Atlanta: 1 torpedo.
Malay: Attacked with deck gun, finally hit with 1 torpedo. Malay survived the attack.
Ciltvaira: 1 torpedo.
Culebra: Deck gun. Culebra fired back, resulting in five hits on U-123, any one of which could have killed the gun crew or Hardegen himself. I'm not an expert, but I'd say this makes him both foolish and lucky.
Pan Norway: Deck gun (out of torpedoes).
Muskogee: 1 torpedo.
Empire Steel: 2 torpedoes. Deck gun fired at burning wreck to hasten demise.
USS Atik (Q-ship): 2 torpedoes. Ship stopped by 1 torpedo. Attempt to finish target with deck gun resulted in 1 man killed on U-123. Ship finished by second torpedo.
Liebre: Deck gun.
Oklahoma: 1 torpedo.
Esso Baton Rouge: 1 torpedo.
Esparta: 1 torpedo.
Gulfamerica: 1 torpedo. Finished with deck gun.
Leslie: 1 torpedo. The last one.
Korsholm: Deck Gun. Out of torpedoes.
Alcoa Guide: Deck Gun. Out of torpedoes.
So, out of 21 ships sunk, only 4 were sunk solely with the deck gun, and 3 of those were because he was out of torpedoes. Hardly "very often". He also suffered damage twice while using the gun, and was lucky he didn't lose his life in the process.
http://uboat.net/men/hardegen.htm
So it is better to have and use a Deckgun, so you can sink ships, even if you're out of torpedos. I won't waste a torpedo on a small sailing ship.
Sailor Steve
10-03-11, 02:05 PM
So it is better to have and use a Deckgun, so you can sink ships, even if you're out of torpedos. I won't waste a torpedo on a small sailing ship.
Nor would I. I just don't make it my primary weapon, unless the target is small and undefended.
Nor would I. I just don't make it my primary weapon, unless the target is small and undefended.
Thats what i am talking about. But in 1941 there is no unarmed ship anymore.
Sailor Steve
10-03-11, 02:10 PM
Thats what i am talking about. But in 1941 there is no unarmed ship anymore.
Then the deck gun isn't good for much except a coup-des-gras.
Fish In The Water
10-03-11, 06:06 PM
All submarines in the baltic sea were fitted with deckguns, and also some of the most decorated commanders were allowed to keep their guns. All others were removed.
Too bad the game doesn't model the benefits of not having one installed. Less drag resulting in a slight increase in speed (even just a knot) would be nice. :yep:
Missing Name
10-03-11, 06:54 PM
I am among those who consider the deck gun to be my primary weapon. This is a WWII sim and not a WWI sim, though. I suppose I've just had plenty of practice with the darned thing.
Angelo Cire
10-04-11, 02:03 AM
I feel as though the game allows you to be far more accurate with the deck gun than seas would have permitted. Land-based guns didn't have to worry about the pitch and roll of the boat, so extremely long ranges would be far more feasible.
You can, with practice, lob rounds well over 2 or 3 km, which would have been (I imagine) extremely hard to do on even very calm seas with any accuracy.
Fish In The Water
10-04-11, 04:34 AM
I feel as though the game allows you to be far more accurate with the deck gun than seas would have permitted.
Perhaps...
In my case though I generally end up manning the gun myself as even when I have 'trained' personnel at the station half the shots end up hitting the ocean. :nope:
Sailor Steve
10-04-11, 11:41 AM
I said I believe the deck gun was only used to finish off cripples, or against very small targets. So I just encountered four merchants in the space of a little over one day. Two went down with one torpedo each. When the weather cleared up I sank the other two with the deck gun. The 105 is nice! :oops:
:rotfl2:
Perhaps...
In my case though I generally end up manning the gun myself as even when I have 'trained' personnel at the station half the shots end up hitting the ocean. :nope:
Which is correct. Naval gunnery is the most imprecise of sciences, and the historical hit rate in WW2 was about 7% overall, with long-range gunnery dropping to 2% and close-range fire being about 12%. The game lets the player be far too accurate.
desirableroasted
10-04-11, 12:24 PM
The game lets the player be far too accurate.
At least GWX takes down the power of the deck gun a few notches. In stock, that is one hell of a gun.
Zedwardson
10-04-11, 01:05 PM
one lone ship, with no guns on it - sure.
otherwise, eels it is.
Hans Uberman
10-04-11, 01:41 PM
Otto Kretschmer had the right idea, but I take it further. "One shell, one ship." I haven't had any success yet, but I know my stratagem is sound!
Otto Kretschmer had the right idea, but I take it further. "One shell, one ship." I haven't had an success yet, but I know my stratagem is sound!
Oh you must have some kind of nuclear super shell from krypton and ahead of all other commanders. :hmmm::D
BigRich
10-04-11, 04:08 PM
I have approached lone merchants @ night on a calm sea and taken them on with my deck gun, despite them being armed. If I can get close enough I target their gun first, even with my AAA which are capable of quickly destroying a gun mounting.
However, if my first shots are not placed accurately and she has a chance to shoot back, or if I failed to spot a smaller secondary gun then I have lost entire gun crews that way.
Fish In The Water
10-04-11, 06:28 PM
I have approached lone merchants @ night on a calm sea and taken them on with my deck gun, despite them being armed. If I can get close enough I target their gun first, even with my AAA which are capable of quickly destroying a gun mounting.
However, if my first shots are not placed accurately and she has a chance to shoot back, or if I failed to spot a smaller secondary gun then I have lost entire gun crews that way.
In real life I doubt I'd play with the lives of my crew that way, but in-game it's a real rush! :up:
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