Watchman qualifications

[Canovaro]

Today something strange caught my eye.
We all know the 'watchman' qualification gives lots of efficiency on the conning tower.

I noticed that an officer with anti-aircraft qualification also adds lots of efficiency.

I wonder, does that mean that if I give some officers AA qualification, I don't need to train any of them for 'watchman' qualification?

Any thoughts?

[Jimbuna]

That is correct....on the reverse side of the coin though would be giving a second qualification of say....helmsman, that would add nothing below decks.

[Paul Riley]

Jim,

Does the helmsman qual do anything in the game? (when I first started playing SH3 I originally thought helmsman stabilised the UBoat more in some way ie making dives and surfaces more efficient),i've often wondered about this a lot personally.It seems there are quite a few 'invalid' quals in the game which dont actually do anything when applied in conjunction with others?
Do you mind drawing a short list up of the quals that dont work with others?,would save some of us a lot of time when configuring our officer's skills.

Cheers mate.

[Jimbuna]

Jim,

Does the helmsman qual do anything in the game? (when I first started playing SH3 I originally thought helmsman stabilised the UBoat more in some way ie making dives and surfaces more efficient),i've often wondered about this a lot personally.It seems there are quite a few 'invalid' quals in the game which dont actually do anything when applied in conjunction with others?
Do you mind drawing a short list up of the quals that dont work with others?,would save some of us a lot of time when configuring our officer's skills.

Cheers mate.


Hi Paul

I know drawing up a list would simply invite many responses based mainly on individual opinion...

Most if not all qualifications complement each other IMHO but the Helmsman would appear to give the least increase of benefit closely followed by the Medic (and that is the one where people would usually input their positive and negative experiences/comments).

The above is simply my own opinion based on my modding and gameplay experiences of the game.

What I tend to do is give one officer solely a Watchkeeper qualification in keeping with their watch crew responsibilities and all the others the same qualification after their individual primary ones, Machinist, Gunner etc.

[Paul Riley]

Ok,thanks Jim,

Could you just briefly describe what exactly 'helmsman' qual does in game?,would it be safe to assume it could give a small performance boost to the UBoat's overall performance,eg such as in an emergency dive?

Thanks again mate.

[Jimbuna]

Ok,thanks Jim,

Could you just briefly describe what exactly 'helmsman' qual does in game?,would it be safe to assume it could give a small performance boost to the UBoat's overall performance,eg such as in an emergency dive?

Thanks again mate.

I've no evidence to support that but during stringent testing of GWX and its earlier versions we found that the sea state was the main factor in diving times and even then only marginally so.

[desirableroasted]

Could you just briefly describe what exactly 'helmsman' qual does in game?



Just to echo Jim... I tested having the helmsman qual a couple of years ago, and could find zero effect. You can fill the control room with them (officers and petty officers) and it makes not a jot of difference to any maneuvering.

Others have reported that the medic qualification can slightly speed injury recovery and slightly retard fatigue. I have never tested it.

The radioman qualification works for petty officers, but not for officers.

And, while you can give more than one qualification to POs, only the "top" one applies. You can give 3 to any officer and they all apply. Don't bother with sailors, it's just eye candy.

[Fish In The Water]

Don't bother with sailors, it's just eye candy.

Some folks like to assign them to sailors as well, but it's just for sorting purposes to make it easy to identify who belongs where. :sunny:

[VONHARRIS]

Some folks like to assign them to sailors as well, but it's just for sorting purposes to make it easy to identify who belongs where. :sunny:

It also makes it easier to award medals.
For example , if your crew shoots down an aircraft you can can easily find to whom you should give the medal.

[FIREWALL]

Concerning Watch O : I GIVE TORP, DG and Repair in that order.

With UZO he does real well on surface attack. Same with DG. Below he'll be able to help with repairs.

My Weapons Officer is used for other things as I manual target with Peri.

HELL!!! I'M THE Kptlt. :arrgh!: :D

I don't fight aircraft. I check my depth and don't get into shallows.

When surfaced I check weather on a regular when on map and at Max 128 TC.

If I can get H.sie's mod to work I will have it all WO automaticaly goes to Conning Tower instead of being dragged among a lot of other great things to much to list. :yep:...:D

If anyone cares I play 100% minus external cam for screenshots only.

I play a minimun 4hrs a day. Mostly longer.

I bought SH3 on release and if it hadn't been for GWX and Great helpfull team I would have shelved it long ago. :yep:

To GWX Team :salute: And to h.sie and stiebler and SO MANY others for their GREAT MODS. :salute:

btw I also humbly thank the GREAT MODDERS of SH4 & SH5 which I also have installed and have ALL their GREAT MODS. :salute:

[Paul Riley]

Just to echo Jim... I tested having the helmsman qual a couple of years ago, and could find zero effect. You can fill the control room with them (officers and petty officers) and it makes not a jot of difference to any maneuvering.

Others have reported that the medic qualification can slightly speed injury recovery and slightly retard fatigue. I have never tested it.

The radioman qualification works for petty officers, but not for officers.

And, while you can give more than one qualification to POs, only the "top" one applies. You can give 3 to any officer and they all apply. Don't bother with sailors, it's just eye candy.

Thanks for the notes :up:
Weird about the medic qual,I would have thought his role pivotal to say the least.

A few configs I will be looking at for my crew are:

Watch Officer - watchman,flak gunner, (unsure for 3rd slot)
Chief Engineer - machinist,repair, (unsure for 3rd slot)
Navigator - helmsman?, (medic COULD have been useful) (unsure for 3rd slot) ,largely I think his role will be to assist the Chief Engineer if he is busy elsewhere.
Weapons Officer - torpedoes,deck gunner, (unsure for 3rd slot)

Any further ideas on some useful crew configs?

[Jimbuna]

No Crew Fatigue setting in SH3 Commander http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/whistle.gif

[Paul Riley]

No Crew Fatigue setting in SH3 Commander http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/whistle.gif

Never use it either Jim,pain in the arse having to babysit submariners all the time when to change shift,I much prefer the action of the game myself :arrgh!:

[Jimbuna]

Never use it either Jim,pain in the arse having to babysit submariners all the time when to change shift,I much prefer the action of the game myself :arrgh!:

No, what I meant was try the 'No Crew Fatigue' setting in SH3 Commander, that will alleviate the need to 'babysit' the crew.

[Canovaro]

You cheater!
:D

[Jimbuna]

You cheater!
:D


http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/wacko.gif

[Sailor Steve]

You cheater!
:D
http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/wacko.gif
Of course Jim is a cheater. Just take a look at the Screenshots thread. He flies around like Superman with a modern digital camera, blithely snapping pictures from all sorts of impossible angles. :O:

[Jimbuna]

LOL :DL

[Fish In The Water]

Weird about the medic qual,I would have thought his role pivotal to say the least.

Critical for sure, just never fully implemented by the devs. :nope:

[desirableroasted]

You cheater!
:D

No, he is just saying to his department heads and leading POs: Make sure the watch is assumed on time.

[irish1958]

The Captain will always assign the job of allocating personnel to the XO, who will then assign it to one of the junior officers to work with the highest ranking petty officer to do this.
The XO will then test proficiency and report it to the Captain.
The Captain will be responsible, but he will not decide when the crew in a particular department should be rotated.
Making the Kaleum do this is not realistic.
The no fatigue option is a game savior.

[Jimbuna]

No, he is just saying to his department heads and leading POs: Make sure the watch is assumed on time.

Precisely :smug:

[Fish In The Water]

The Captain will be responsible, but he will not decide when the crew in a particular department should be rotated.
Making the Kaleum do this is not realistic.
The no fatigue option is a game savior.

Can't say I disagree here. Crew rotation has to be delegated else the skipper is essentially micromanaging. :nope:

[Snestorm]

The Leading PO (or Chief) of each section writes the Watch Bill.
It's generaly to trivial even for the Division Officer to bother with.

Fatigue disabled.
But, both engine rooms are fully manned, and everybody get's a GQ station, which they remain at for the entire patrol.
IE: The Watch, Torpedo Rooms, Damage Control, and Gunnery have to compete for sailors. No sharing. Thus my torpedoes generaly take 24 minutes per tube for reloading.
Everybody starts at the bottom. No "bought" promotions.

No nonsensicle hassles, but far from perfect efficiancy. (EN spelling - Sorry)

[Gerald]

24 minutes to load a tube, an unusual long time, the crew may need to be trained up a bit more,or they get no food, and are powerless :o

[Snestorm]

24 minutes to load a tube, an unusual long time, the crew may need to be trained up a bit more,or they get no food, and are powerless :o

Being as I can't shift their GQ Stations, Damage Control gets all the manpower they need.
I prefer good Damage Control to fast torpedo reloads. I can't have both early on.

[desirableroasted]

Being as I can't shift their GQ Stations, Damage Control gets all the manpower they need.
I prefer good Damage Control to fast torpedo reloads. I can't have both early on.

If you are getting smacked around, torpedo reload goes way down the priority list!

[zygoma]

In my current IXC, I've got two officers with Watch qualification, and for their second and third quals I've made Flak Gunner and Deck Gunner. When standing bridge watch during patrol, he can make even the non-rated enlisted men give the bridge a "full potential" bar graph, and during those rare times when I've got a calm sea state, the same guy stays on the bridge to direct (and apparently benefit) our gunfire.
I haven't figured out how to use the Petty Officer who I made our medic. On those rare occasions when a deck crewman gets only wounded rather than killed outright, I've tried putting the wounded man in a compartment with the medic in the same space, but no amount of right- or left-clicking on either the medic or the victim seems to make any difference in his outcome. The last three injured crewmen apparently died during the cruise.
Maybe I should have made Bernard the medic, and he and the injured crewmen could use the aft escape trunk together to play "hide the torpedo" or some such morale-boosting (?!?) activity LOL!
FWIW, the men have been giving me some dirty looks for stashing the dead crew in quarters. If I had some way to leave them on the deck, I could at least dive out from under them for a kinda sloppy burial at sea, or shoot them out of the torpedo tubes along with a tub of oil and some teak scraps to try to dupe the surface vessels into thinking their depthcharging had been successful.....it seemed to work in the old movies.....
So -- has anyone found a benefit of having an officer or petty officer qualified as a medic during gameplay (SH3 here, no upgrades yet), and how to treat an injured guy?
<sigh!> I think I'm destined to be a n00b forever. At my age, they say two things start go: memory, and.....ummmmm.....I'll think of it..... gimme a sec......
:.Zygoma
-.- .-.. --... .... -. -.-- -..-. .-- ....-

[Eisenwurst]

In my experience with SH3/GWX, Officers with Medic qualifications only heal wounded Officers, but Petty Officers with the Medic qualification heal other PO's and also seamen/matrosen, but not Officers. I've had a few wounded of all ranks during various careers and found this to be the case.
It's a funny world.
To heal the wounded place them next to the medic, and cross yer fingers.

[Frenchy849]

Also,Zygoma,you can actually bury dead dudes at sea by right clicking on them.

[Gargamel]

Scored a 1.5 on the necro.

2 points to Gargamel. :D

[Raptor]

I start each career with a 10 second harbor patrol,end it, and qualify a PO as a Gunner. After exiting SH3, I go to MyDocs/GWX/data/config/careers,career name/ and edit the /Crew_Career_01.cfg file to assign quals to my officers and POs. After all, there was no such thing as an unqualified PO at sea.


SH3 qual codes are as follows:

0 = watchman
1 = gunner
2 = flak gunner
3 = sonar/radio (can not be assigned to an officer)
4 = helmsman (does nothing in the game)
5 = machinist
6 = torpedo
7 = medic
8 = repair


I assign these quals to each officer:

Watchman = 0, 1, 2
LI = 5, 8
Nav = 4, 8, 7 <= I consider the Nav to be one of my 4 Chief POs and replace the default officer here with an Oberfähnrich
Weps = 0, 1, 2

I carry only 3 officers, not the 4 SH3 gives me by default. (I dismiss the Navigator and replace him with an Oberfähnrich)


I add 4 Oberfahnrichs to my boat before the first patrol; these are my other 3 CPOs. I qualify them as follows:

Navigator: 4, 8, and 7
Diesel obermaschinst: 5, 8
Elecktro obermaschinist: 5, 8
Oberbootsmann: 6, 8 (in Fwd torp room)

As the career advances, I'll add Medic (7) quals to the CPOs

[zygoma]

[QUOTE=Raptor;1860562
(snippage ensueth henceforth) ... and edit the /Crew_Career_01.cfg file to assign quals to my officers and POs. After all, there was no such thing as an unqualified PO at sea.


SH3 qual codes are as follows:

4 = helmsman (does nothing in the game)
I assign these quals to each officer:

LI = 5, 8

Diesel obermaschinst: 5, 8
Elecktro obermaschinist: 5, 8
Oberbootsmann: 6, 8 (in Fwd torp room)

[/QUOTE]
(thus endeth the snippage)

Coupl'a n00b questions, for which I'm rapidly becoming (in)famous:

I understand you're running this under GW. Does that let you assign more than one qual to a petty officer? If I can find the equivalent folder in the vanilla SH3, I'll try to edit it and see what happens.

Since the actual helmsmen are typically defaulted to the non-PO enlisteds, can the Helmsman qual be edited out of the default "officer loadout" when a career begins (or during the career, for that matter), freeing up a more useful job specialty?

And what's an "LI"? I don't understand the position.

Zygoma, Perpetual n00b

May the number of your surface activities exceed your dives by exactly one at the end of your career.

[zygoma]

Frenchy,
Thanks for that -- I'd missed it in my searches. I don't know if it'll help my crew's morale, but it should at least help slow the spread of pestilence and disease whilst traveling about in a sewer pipe.
Zygoma, Perpetual n00b

[Raptor]

LI - Leitender Ingeniere = Chief Engineer (officer)


POs can be assigned more than one qualification in both stock SH3 and GWX, but only the first one, Qualification0=X, is active in the game; any other quals are mere eye candy. Seamen can also be assigned quals, but none of them are active; again - just eye candy.

As stated, I have 4 Oberfähnrichs (officer cadets but consider to be officers in SH3) aboard. As such, each can have up to 3 active qualifications; your choice. They serve as the (historical) four senior POs or Warrent Officers carried by combat boats.

Yes, you can edit the Helmsman qual (or any other qual) out when manually editing the file. For example:

The default: the bridge watch officer has only one qualification; Helmsman
[CREW_MEMBER_0]
Name=Wolfgang Eisenholtz
Index=5
NrComp=0
Type=2
Grad=6
Renown=0.000000
Patrols=5
Morale=0.800000
Fatigue=0.000000
HealthStatus=0
WasWounded=No
HitPoints=14.000000
Experience=305.000000
Rank=11
NrQual=1
Qualification0=4
SpecialAbility=-1

After manual editing: the bridge watch officer now has three qualifications; Watchman, Gunner, and Flak Gunner
[CREW_MEMBER_0]
Name=Wolfgang Eisenholtz
Index=5
NrComp=0
Type=2
Grad=6
Renown=0.000000
Patrols=5
Morale=0.800000
Fatigue=0.000000
HealthStatus=0
WasWounded=No
HitPoints=14.000000
Experience=305.000000
Rank=11
NrQual=3 <= You must increase this value to match # of quals assigned or they won't activate in the game
Qualification0=0
Qualification1=1
Qualification2=2
SpecialAbility=-1

[Sailor Steve]

LI - Leitender Ingeniere = Chief Engineer (officer)
:yep:

In the game he's erroneously called "Helmsan".