Libya: UK Apache helicopters used in Nato attacks

[Gerald]

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/5420/530221530120692471.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/684/530221530120692471.jpg/)
The Apache helicopter is prized by troops because of its hardiness and versatility

UK Apache attack helicopters have been used over Libya for the first time, Nato has confirmed.

They attacked and destroyed two military installations, a radar site and an armed checkpoint near Brega, the Captain of HMS Ocean told the BBC.

French Gazelle helicopters also took part in simultaneous attacks on different targets in Libya for the first time.

On Wednesday, Nato extended its mission in Libya by 90 days.

The BBC's defence correspondent Jonathan Beale said: "The Captain of the HMS Ocean reported that those targets had been successfully destroyed and both Apaches returned to their base on HMS Ocean."

"This successful engagement demonstrates the unique capabilities brought to bear by attack helicopters," said Lt Gen Charles Bouchard, Commander of Operation Unified Protector.

"We will continue to use these assets whenever and wherever needed, using the same precision as we do in all of our missions."

A Ministry of Defence statement said: "UK Apache Attack Helicopters have taken part in coordinated operations over Libya as part of Nato's Operation Unified Protector to protect civilians under UNSCR 1973. All of the aircraft recovered safely to HMS Ocean. Further details of the operation will released in due course."

Missile risk

The decision to send four British Apache helicopters to Libya was made by Prime Minister David Cameron on 27 May.

Their deployment via HMS Ocean means there should be less chance of civilian casualties in operations that previously relied on the use of Tornado and Typhoon aircraft.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13651736


Note: 4 June 2011 Last updated at 04:58 GMT

[MH]

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/5420/530221530120692471.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/684/530221530120692471.jpg/)


Their deployment via HMS Ocean means there should be less chance of civilian casualties in operations that previously relied on the use of Tornado and Typhoon aircraft.



Excellent reasoning.
Maybe some troops on the ground to further eliminate civilian casualties?
Just genius.:yeah:

[BossMark]

I am surprised that we have any Apache helicopters left after all the cuts to our armed forces David Cameron and his cronies have made :06:

[Gerald]

David, had stashed them for this special occasion, :DL

[Jimbuna]

Excellent reasoning.
Maybe some troops on the ground to further eliminate civilian casualties?
Just genius.:yeah:

These can get in real close to id the target with more certainty unlike the aircraft who are often thousands of feet up out of range of AAA.

One problem though (other than short range and time in theatre)...they are operating well within range of shoulder launched rpg's and small arms fire.

[Oberon]

No, I see where MH is coming from, even at low altitude WAH-64s are not able to make a pure POSIDENT on ground forces, particularly in this kind of situation when the good and bad forces are wearing the same clothing. Likewise there's the risk of misidenting civilians. The wikileaks Collatoral video demonstrated this. It is not the fault of the WAH-64 pilots, they will no doubt radio for confirmation, but at the end of the day not even ground forces could tell the difference unless they had prior intelligence that only enemy forces were operating in the area, and we all know how accurate the intel beanies can be at times. :damn:
However, I still think that they won't put in ground forces, not anything above special forces anyway, which are probably already in there. It would be political suicide for anyone other than perhaps the French.

[CCIP]

I on the other hand see this as a gesture from the military going "You thought we could do without carrier-based aircraft? Well ha!"

I wish them well, though, tough mission for them with a lot of pressure to perform well.

[Jimbuna]

The Brit government have also just given a three month extension to the operations (Seept)....whose going to pay for this back home when it's all over? :hmmm:

[BossMark]

Yes I wonder who? Us the tax payer maybe?:cry:

[Jimbuna]

Actually I'm thinking even further afield....those in receipt of benefits and those in real serious need of public services...heaven forbid it should be the banks or oil companies having to pay out of their vast profits :o

[Gerald]

They attacked and destroyed two military installations, a radar site and an armed checkpoint near Brega, the Captain of HMS Ocean told the BBC.

The Apaches are understood to have faced incoming fire.

Meanwhile, it has been confirmed that Foreign Secretary William Hague has arrived in rebel-held Benghazi in eastern Libya.

He is due to hold talks with the head of Libya's opposition National Transitional Council (NTC), Mustafa Abdul Jalil, later.

International Development Secretary Andrew Mitchell has also made the trip to Benghazi.

French Gazelle helicopters also took part in simultaneous attacks on different targets in Libya for the first time.

On Wednesday, Nato extended its mission in Libya by 90 days.

Major General Nick Pope, the chief of the defence staff's strategic communications officer, said:"The Apaches were tasked with precision strikes against a regime radar installation and a military checkpoint, both located around Brega.

"Hellfire missiles and 30mm cannon were used to destroy the targets. The helicopters then returned safely to HMS Ocean."

He said the targets had been "carefully and rigorously selected" and said intelligence about the positions of the Gaddafi forces had been improving "despite their efforts to conceal themselves".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13651736


Note: Update Record, 4 June 2011 Last updated at 13:15 GMT

[Jimbuna]

They attacked and destroyed two military installations, a radar site and an armed checkpoint near Brega, the Captain of HMS Ocean told the BBC.

The Apaches are understood to have faced incoming fire.

Meanwhile, it has been confirmed that Foreign Secretary William Hague has arrived in rebel-held Benghazi in eastern Libya.

He is due to hold talks with the head of Libya's opposition National Transitional Council (NTC), Mustafa Abdul Jalil, later.

International Development Secretary Andrew Mitchell has also made the trip to Benghazi.

French Gazelle helicopters also took part in simultaneous attacks on different targets in Libya for the first time.

On Wednesday, Nato extended its mission in Libya by 90 days.

Major General Nick Pope, the chief of the defence staff's strategic communications officer, said:"The Apaches were tasked with precision strikes against a regime radar installation and a military checkpoint, both located around Brega.

"Hellfire missiles and 30mm cannon were used to destroy the targets. The helicopters then returned safely to HMS Ocean."

He said the targets had been "carefully and rigorously selected" and said intelligence about the positions of the Gaddafi forces had been improving "despite their efforts to conceal themselves".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13651736


Note: Update Record, 4 June 2011 Last updated at 13:15 GMT

For those of you who don't have BBC News24, SkyNews....or internet :hmmm:

Wait!....you wouldn't see it here as well for that matter :doh:

:O:

[TarJak]

C'mon someone must have loaded it on YouTube by now?

[Bakkels]

Actually I'm thinking even further afield....those in receipt of benefits and those in real serious need of public services...heaven forbid it should be the banks or oil companies having to pay out of their vast profits :o
:sign_yeah:

[Gerald]

Good news, in their entirety because they used,:yep:

[Gerald]

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/8326/05libyapopup.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/11/05libyapopup.jpg/)
NATO officials say the helicopters can pinpoint targets like snipers or small groups of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi's loyalists hiding among civilians or close to schools and hospitals.

[TarJak]

Yeah right. And can they take them out without any collateral damage?

[Gerald]

Yeah right. And can they take them out without any collateral damage? Yes,right and with good precision!

[XabbaRus]

Sorry guys but I can't see why people are bleating about how much this war is going to cost.

The biggest outlay in any organisation is payroll.

AFAIK the guys doing the work are getting paid just the same as they would if they were to be sitting at their base and just doing training missions. Didn't the government axe the special duty pay?

The missiles have been paid for and yes there is an increased use of fuel but its not like we have to get it in especially is it.

There will be replacement costs but I'm guessing here that can be spread over time.

I don't have a problem with the cost of the war or that fact we are there. I do however wish we would just hit Gadhaffi and be done with it.

[Castout]

Give the pro democracy fighters some heavy hitters like tanks and let them roll into Tripoli. They can't possibly remove Gaddafi with pick up trucks.

Be quick before Kim Jong Il decided to launch couple missiles into South Korea and triggering at least an air campaign retaliation from South Korea and God knows what comes after that..[who knows peace is always a precarious thing to keep especially when it is kept with fear and sticks] :DL

[Gerald]

Sorry guys but I can't see why people are bleating about how much this war is going to cost.

The biggest outlay in any organisation is payroll.

AFAIK the guys doing the work are getting paid just the same as they would if they were to be sitting at their base and just doing training missions. Didn't the government axe the special duty pay?

The missiles have been paid for and yes there is an increased use of fuel but its not like we have to get it in especially is it.

There will be replacement costs but I'm guessing here that can be spread over time.

I don't have a problem with the cost of the war or that fact we are there. I do however wish we would just hit Gadhaffi and be done with it. Of course you can, in my opinion remove Gaddafi, relatively quickly, and without loss and time, but the resort will hardly be sanctioned by the UN,and Case theory and the "practice" already exists"I would say that this is a pure matter of time, then the mandate has been extended by 90 days.

[Jimbuna]

Sorry guys but I can't see why people are bleating about how much this war is going to cost.

The biggest outlay in any organisation is payroll.

AFAIK the guys doing the work are getting paid just the same as they would if they were to be sitting at their base and just doing training missions. Didn't the government axe the special duty pay?

The missiles have been paid for and yes there is an increased use of fuel but its not like we have to get it in especially is it.

There will be replacement costs but I'm guessing here that can be spread over time.

I don't have a problem with the cost of the war or that fact we are there. I do however wish we would just hit Gadhaffi and be done with it.

Let me put it this way...no matter which one of us is right the bottom line will be Cameron et al putting much of the emphasis of the real cuts which will start biting near the end of this year on the costs incurred in ridding Libya of this tyrant.

Yesterday we saw a failed ex political party leader sitting in Libya with the rebel leadership, no doubt cosying up to them and hoping for a prime spot in the rebuilding of said country.

Problem being, I suspect the rebels won't be too interested in the West once they have served their purpose of winning the struggle for them, nor would it suprise me if Russia or China do the cherry picking after the cessation of hostilities.

I want this tyrant out as much as any here but tbh I can't help but notice a bit of hypocricy here....aren't civilians threatened when the other side attacks Libyan troops?

People like Mugabe must be well relieved they don't have any oil reserves.

It's about time NATO and the UN come clean with the world...if it's the tyrant they want out for whatever reason then simply say so and go in and do it.

A lot of the world thought Obama didn't have the balls but he carried out what he said he would do if the opportunity arose...he didn't hide behind or twist mandates.

Thankfully we've only had one aircraft destroyed (afaik) let us hope we don't start losing service peoples lives whilst we dilly dally around cosy little protocols that satisfy the politicians back home.

[Schroeder]

Yes,right and with good precision!
And here I was thinking that 30mm cannons and Hellfire missiles (or their French counterparts) had a spray and blast radius....let alone that the cannon ammo will go through human bodies like a hot knife through warm butter and eliminate everything that's behind them as well.

[Gerald]

And here I was thinking that 30mm cannons and Hellfire missiles (or their French counterparts) had a spray and blast radius....let alone that the cannon ammo will go through human bodies like a hot knife through warm butter and eliminate everything that's behind them as well. Sure, but the accuracy is relative, and much safer than previously has been inserted.

[Castout]

Let me put it this way...no matter which one of us is right the bottom line will be Cameron et al putting much of the emphasis of the real cuts which will start biting near the end of this year on the costs incurred in ridding Libya of this tyrant.

Yesterday we saw a failed ex political party leader sitting in Libya with the rebel leadership, no doubt cosying up to them and hoping for a prime spot in the rebuilding of said country.

Problem being, I suspect the rebels won't be too interested in the West once they have served their purpose of winning the struggle for them, nor would it suprise me if Russia or China do the cherry picking after the cessation of hostilities.

I want this tyrant out as much as any here but tbh I can't help but notice a bit of hypocricy here....aren't civilians threatened when the other side attacks Libyan troops?

People like Mugabe must be well relieved they don't have any oil reserves.

It's about time NATO and the UN come clean with the world...if it's the tyrant they want out for whatever reason then simply say so and go in and do it.

A lot of the world thought Obama didn't have the balls but he carried out what he said he would do if the opportunity arose...he didn't hide behind or twist mandates.

Thankfully we've only had one aircraft destroyed (afaik) let us hope we don't start losing service peoples lives whilst we dilly dally around cosy little protocols that satisfy the politicians back home.


There are two words that you should know. That is goodwill and good faith.

Any thing given to any man by any man or to any people by any people must be given by acts of goodwill and in good faith.
This is the basis of nurturing any relationship.

Stop viewing these Arabs with so much contempt or ill feeling or belittling them. These people are willing to sacrifice themselves for a better tomorrow. And by no means that is a small feat. That is the trait of great person. Do you know why our civilization respect heroes? because heroes would risk themselves and sacrifice themselves if necessary. These people have turned heroes and no less. They have become eagles and no longer chickens. Even many Americans and Europeans need to learn from these people. The courage to give yourself for something bigger and worthwhile, the courage to stand your ground when it matters, the courage of having and holding on to hope within. To put it simply they are GREAT people. If left to their own devices I believe they will make their each nation a great nation.

[Jimbuna]

I wasn't aware I was treating either side of the conflict with "contempt or ill feeling or belittling them" actually.

If I hold any contempt at all it would probably be against my hypocritical government and yes I reserve the right to challenge them as that is my right as a British citizen.

Better still....how about you stop preaching to me "There are two words that you should know. That is goodwill and good faith".

"Any thing given to any man by any man or to any people by any people must be given by acts of goodwill and in good faith.
This is the basis of nurturing any relationship".

Send your own soldiers and countrymen in and do what YOU THINK IS RIGHT.

Don't forget to foot the bill for the immense costs incurred and explain to your civilian population it was all worthwhile sacrificing vitally needed services for the vulnerable and needy sections of your society as a consequence.

[Oberon]

"One defends when his strength is inadequate, he attacks when it is abundant."

"There is no instance of a nation benefiting from prolonged warfare."

Sun Tzu

[MH]

Stop viewing these Arabs with so much contempt or ill feeling or belittling them. These people are willing to sacrifice themselves for a better tomorrow. And by no means that is a small feat. That is the trait of great person. Do you know why our civilization respect heroes? because heroes would risk themselves and sacrifice themselves if necessary. .
:rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::r ock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock:
Bravo to ahmadinejad....to bin laden .....lenin....stalin....hitler
Viva la revolution.

[Jimbuna]

Precisely!!

[Gerald]

:rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::r ock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock::rock:
Bravo to ahmadinejad....to bin laden .....lenin....stalin....hitler
Viva la revolution. Insightful!

[Platapus]

Give the pro democracy fighters some heavy hitters like tanks and let them roll into Tripoli.

There are pro democracy fighters in Libya? :shifty:

[TLAM Strike]

There are pro democracy fighters in Libya? :shifty:

Yep, they are called the forces of NATO... :03:

I don't know about the other guys... :haha:

[Platapus]

Yep, they are called the forces of NATO... :03:

I don't know about the other guys... :haha:

I am thinking the two of us are on the same frequency. :yeah:

[Gerald]

I am thinking the two of us are on the same frequency. :yeah: Short waves,:know:

[Jimbuna]

Short waves,:know:

ROFLMAO :har:

*best lost in translation*

[Gerald]

Hey...Very High Frequency still, :know:

[Platapus]

Short waves,:know:

<looking at my antenna>

(sigh) Yeah. Sadly yeah. :oops:

[Gerald]

<looking at my antenna>

(sigh) Yeah. Sadly yeah. :oops: You mean your third leg, :O:

[Jimbuna]

You mean your third leg, :O:

Hey, make up your own analogies :stare:

[Gerald]

Hey, make up your own analogies :stare: Ok! :D

[Jimbuna]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hk_cayNIONo/RqZ7jMuaz7I/AAAAAAAAEqA/qUIp_RR_xpo/s400/spanking1.jpg

[Gerald]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hk_cayNIONo/RqZ7jMuaz7I/AAAAAAAAEqA/qUIp_RR_xpo/s400/spanking1.jpg Hey....what is this :stare: .....:haha:

[Jimbuna]

I won't tell if you won't :03:

[Gerald]

Maybe Frau like these,"practicing" :O:

[Jimbuna]

Dream on :dead:

[Gerald]

:haha:

[Jimbuna]

:salute: