I can see ships, but the crew can't

[GreyBeard]

Hello gentlemen, have been away from SH for a while. Right now I'm just running SH4 1.4 stock. In light fog ships have to be closer than 450 yards before the crew or auto lock spots them, although I can see them. Sometimes it's as bad as 350 yards. Earlier today a destroyer was bearing down on me with it's searchlights aimed at my periscope at less than 1000yds distance and auto lock still failed to see it, this was with light fog about 0400. I could make out the ship and obviously the searchlight. This just doesn't seem right. Anyone have any ideas why this might be happening and how to correct it? I remember being able to lock on targets that were so far away they still couldn't be seen, at least in SH3. Is SH 4 that different?

[WernherVonTrapp]

Was your PS zoomed in? That's the only thing I can think of offhand.:hmmm:

[magic452]

I ran into that many times in V1.4 not so much in 1.5 with TMO.
It's the pits if you're using auto targeting 'cause you can't shoot.
You can't even use a constant bearing shoot.

Magic

[WernherVonTrapp]

I ran into that many times in V1.4 not so much in 1.5 with TMO.
It's the pits if you're using auto targeting 'cause you can't shoot.
You can't even use a constant bearing shoot.

Magic
Yeah you can. Well, sort of, that is. Just point your scope to any bearing, press the Target Lock key and fire. Your torp will travel the route of your target lock, even if there's no target there.:03:

[Stealhead]

You dont even need to lock at all with auto target you just simply press fire any time and the torps will travel on to that heading that the scope or TBT is centered on(meaning your are moving the center of the scope yourself no lock following on its own).In fact when I used to play auto-target I found that not even locking on the target and simply firing at points on the ship gave me better hit ratios than firing with a lock.

IIRC even if you cant "see" the ship(no colored arrow over it with auto-target) you can still fire towards its bearing.I for sure recall doing what you say but with out locking the target.

[TorpX]

Hello gentlemen, have been away from SH for a while. Right now I'm just running SH4 1.4 stock. In light fog ships have to be closer than 450 yards before the crew or auto lock spots them, although I can see them. Sometimes it's as bad as 350 yards. Earlier today a destroyer was bearing down on me with it's searchlights aimed at my periscope at less than 1000yds distance and auto lock still failed to see it, this was with light fog about 0400. I could make out the ship and obviously the searchlight. This just doesn't seem right. Anyone have any ideas why this might be happening and how to correct it? I remember being able to lock on targets that were so far away they still couldn't be seen, at least in SH3. Is SH 4 that different?

There is an issue in the game. Not only with fog, but in general with the crew spotting things before you could see them, often at night, I think. There was a lot of discussion about this and modders tweaked stuff to bring the crew abilities and visuals into line. I think you will have less of a problem with the latest RFB or TMO.

[Platapus]

RFB2/RSRD

I find that happens a lot in harbours. A little fog and I can't lock on, even though the ship is clear enough to identify. :damn::damn:

[GreyBeard]

RFB2/RSRD

I find that happens a lot in harbours. A little fog and I can't lock on, even though the ship is clear enough to identify. :damn::damn:

That's exactly what I'm talking about, only I find it happens everywhere, not just in harbors. As soon as there's a little fog it happens, without fog no problem. I was on lifeguard duty at Guadalcanal yesterday. There were a dozen or more downed pilots in the water and I couldn't see one. Frustrating!

[torpedobait]

That brings up an interesting question. While I've never received the lifeguard mission, I have encountered survivors from aircraft my crew has downed. They show up as objects on the map, but when I approach the location can see nothing. Should they be visible if approached properly? Does SHIV/TMO/RSRDC expect anything be done with those survivors? I'm not into gunning them, but also expect they would not necessarily welcome rescue, Japanese warrior culture being what it was.

[GreyBeard]

That brings up an interesting question. While I've never received the lifeguard mission, I have encountered survivors from aircraft my crew has downed. They show up as objects on the map, but when I approach the location can see nothing. Should they be visible if approached properly? Does SHIV/TMO/RSRDC expect anything be done with those survivors? I'm not into gunning them, but also expect they would not necessarily welcome rescue, Japanese warrior culture being what it was.

Thanks for hijacking my thread. :06::)

I suspect you'd get more answers if you start your own thread.

[Daniel Prates]

IIRC even if you cant "see" the ship(no colored arrow over it with auto-target) you can still fire towards its bearing.I for sure recall doing what you say but with out locking the target.

Not only that, you can also input manually all the TDC data, according to your best guesses.

Do you think real skippers had a 'lock' option? the best they could to, I guess, was to have an officer constantly pointing the scope to the target, assuming he wasn't doing that himself. All the data TDC need in inputed either manually, or directly by the sub's systems. Bearing on the target is inputed directly by the scope. Rotate it 10 degrees to the left, and the TCD considers the target to be 10 degrees to the left.

Let's digress a little more. A corolary of this argument is this: if you are in good visual situation, and has already every TDC data plotted in, you can 'unlock' the target and aim for an specific part of the target with your scope.

[WernherVonTrapp]

Not only that, you can also input manually all the TDC data, according to your best guesses.

Do you think real skippers had a 'lock' option? the best they could to, I guess, was to have an officer constantly pointing the scope to the target, assuming he wasn't doing that himself. All the data TDC need in inputed either manually, or directly by the sub's systems. Bearing on the target is inputed directly by the scope. Rotate it 10 degrees to the left, and the TCD considers the target to be 10 degrees to the left.

Let's digress a little more. A corolary of this argument is this: if you are in good visual situation, and has already every TDC data plotted in, you can 'unlock' the target and aim for an specific part of the target with your scope.Perhaps I'm confused here because GreyBeard's problem is that he can't get a visual on the ship. Are you referring to course and speed through sonar only?

[Dogfish40]

Hi Greybeard,
Last week I had the same problem with a heavy fog which lasted for days, if you can't get the crew or the ship to recognize on the nav-map, surface and bag that bad boy with the deck gun. I sunk two that way. They can't see you either (hopefully), and the fun part is, you have to man the gun yourself! Whoopie!!:woot: Also, this begs another question which I think is appropriate here, and that is, if you have auto-targeting on, can't I enter the TDC data manually anyway?? So if you're in this situation and can't get the game to read the ship, you should be able to enter the data from the sonar station manually, right?
Good Hunting!!
D40:salute:

[GreyBeard]

Not only that, you can also input manually all the TDC data, according to your best guesses.

Do you think real skippers had a 'lock' option? the best they could to, I guess, was to have an officer constantly pointing the scope to the target, assuming he wasn't doing that himself. All the data TDC need in inputed either manually, or directly by the sub's systems. Bearing on the target is inputed directly by the scope. Rotate it 10 degrees to the left, and the TCD considers the target to be 10 degrees to the left.

Let's digress a little more. A corolary of this argument is this: if you are in good visual situation, and has already every TDC data plotted in, you can 'unlock' the target and aim for an specific part of the target with your scope.

Oh man! That's entirely too much work for me. These days I only play the lazy mans way - auto mode! :D :haha:

Hi Greybeard,
Last week I had the same problem with a heavy fog which lasted for days, if you can't get the crew or the ship to recognize on the nav-map, surface and bag that bad boy with the deck gun. I sunk two that way. They can't see you either (hopefully), and the fun part is, you have to man the gun yourself! Whoopie!!:woot: Also, this begs another question which I think is appropriate here, and that is, if you have auto-targeting on, can't I enter the TDC data manually anyway?? So if you're in this situation and can't get the game to read the ship, you should be able to enter the data from the sonar station manually, right?
Good Hunting!!
D40:salute:

That's an interesting idea about using the deck gun. In fact, I finished off a merchant in exactly that manner. I had already put one torpedo into him and then lost the ability to lock on target, so I surfaced and manually used the deck gun to sink it while I could still see it even though my crew couldn't.

I wonder if this has to do with crew experience? This is only their second patrol.

[Daniel Prates]

Perhaps I'm confused here because GreyBeard's problem is that he can't get a visual on the ship. Are you referring to course and speed through sonar only?

No, he's saying that he CAN see the ships (even if only their sillouette or something like that) but the crew can't, so he also can't lock on them.

I have the same situation sometimes. In low visibility conditions, though that small colorful triangle appears when i pass the scope by, the lock won't mantain itself for more than a few moments (a second or so). It then un-locks and I have to repeat the same procedure again.

[WernherVonTrapp]

There's only two reasons that I can think of (off the cuff) why you'd get a triangle (in the fog) which subsequently disappears. If the ship is broadside for a moment and the triangle appears, then the ship turns, blading itself and creating a smaller profile, then the triangle disappears. This can occur also during low light conditions without fog.

The second would be commensurate with the ship passing briefly into, and then out of, visual range while you're at a 90 degree angle to the target. The reason I point to (any) bearing and lock is because, if your sonar man calls out (or is continuously calling out) the target's position, your torp will travel the last known sonar path if you don't lock onto a bearing.

[Stealhead]

For me unless the watchmen see the vessel I will not be able to lock onto it until they do I think this is the OP issue and there is not really a way to fix this all I can say is from playing stock RFB and TMO that TMO seems to have less occurrence of this than any other.I think it has more to do with the environmental mod and tweaks to crew "vision".

As to the whole "lock" thing well they sort of did have a lock because whomever was running the TDC could update the bearings the TDC gave(after inputting the target data that is) for the person manning the scope so the game is simulating this as best it can it is giving you an extra set of hands so to speak so you can do other things and not have to keep moving the scope to follow the target.

In a real sub the skipper had an entire crew of men to help him attack subs he was just the head of the chain and made the decisions if SH4 was a true simulator like what real US Navy submariners use it would take 20 subsim members to play the game maybe more.

And you can not pick up enemy folks in the water.

P.S.
Thanks for hijacking my thread. :06::)
I suspect you'd get more answers if you start your own thread.

What is the deal with that? an off shoot question/related topic happens all the time here on subsim better get over thread ownership real fast we arent too serious round here.