basic hydrophopne tutorial

[jangles]

Hi,

Are there any basic guides on using the hydrophone available anywhere that arent videos? , I cant watch videos where I am currently.

Im a bit of a noob , I have been trying to get to grips with using it the last few sessions.

I am diving down to about 50m during a patrol and doing a manual scan - I sometimes pick up ships engines , but im not even completley sure of how to tell which direction it is in relation to my boat :oops:

I dont seem to get the hydro lines appear on my Nav map anymore (I used to), but I would really like to be able to find a contact by myself from a random scan anyway.

Im using GWX

thanks

[Gerald]

Yes there somewhere, came just can not remember where, try the search function ... or else it will surely someone very soon, and talk about what you can find it....wondering if Neon had something like that :hmmm:

[Osmium Steele]

I'm not an expert; but I played one on television :-j, but here's what I do.

Remember that 0 on the sonar scope is always the front of the boat. The scope only shows bearing to the target relative to the direction of travel of the boat. i.e. relative bearing.

I make all my sonar sweeps during partols from PD, periscope depth. In my experience, there is no difference in sonar efficiency at deeper depths. Not realistic, but hey, it is a game.

Your ship's heading is 020. You detect a contact at 040 on the scope. Just add the ship's heading and the relative bearing, and you have the true bearing to the contact. (I know, let's not discuss the difference between true north and magnetic north.)

020 + 040 = 060 true. You steer 060 and the contact should now be at 000 on the scope. Dead ahead.

You are playing GWX, so the big white compass which slides in from the right of your screen is your best friend. It makes the math unnecessary.

The inner dial on the white compass is relative bearing, the outer dial is true. In the example above, just click on 040 on the inner dial and your ship will turn to 060.

To determine a rough direction of travel of your target, just listen for a few minutes. 5 - 15 minutes is ample for most contacts. I'll turn 45 - 60 degrees, whatever I feel like, toward his direction of travel, surface and run 15 - 20 minutes. Go to PD and listen again.

Rinse and repeat until your deaf sonarman has the contact.

[jangles]

great, thanks! , that clears it up for me a bit.

I was getting a bit confused where to click on the white compass and in some cases ended up going in the wrong direction completely..

I'll do some more listening tonight and hope to get some tonnage :)

[Osmium Steele]

Not a problem mate. Happy hunting. :up:

[Pisces]

These links should get you going for a while:

My handheld disk-tool to figure out AOB/course (only): sit still, take bearings and wait, slide the wheel and know which way he is going

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=147719


A pretty clear document describing a technique to get position and course (and speed if you divide the sections between the bearings with the time interval):

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=160817

Another, document describing a similar technique (different geometrical steps, same idea):

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=160817

A program to calculate it for you:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=167103

[EDIT] I wouldn't call this 'basic'. That would be simply homing in on the direction of the sound, surface and sprint, while ever so often adjusting the course after you take a dip to listen. These methods above are the smart 'advanced' way of doing things. A bit more patience is required, but the result is a solid solution. (as best as you can measure the bearings though) And these methods are not neccesarily historically accurate. But in the game they do work!

[derrinurban]

I do much the same as osmium steele, except for some minor differences.

I make all my sonar sweeps during partols from a depth of about 25m. I have found it to be more reliable. I can click 25m depth on the dial easily and do not have to worry about missing any contacts. In some stormy/bad weather situations, at periscope depth, I just about missed some contacts because the hydrophone would only work sporadically. My depth was varying to the point that at times I was above the depth where hydrophones activate, giving me a dead spot in the sweep (hope that makes sense).

Once I first hear a contact, I surface and head straight for him, at standard or full. After running on surface for 15-20 mins., I submerge and listen again. I now take note of which side of 000 the contact is at now. This tells me the rough direction he is heading.

Slightly left/right - target is either slow moving or moving at a sharp angle to my present course (still not sure at this time if it towards me or away from me)
Significantly left/right - target course is closer to perpendicular to my course.

This information helps you to determine how to adjust your course to intercept the target. A few more rounds of surface and submerge and even Bernard should be able to hear him.

[jangles]

thanks for the tips.

Last night I picked up a contact NW of Loch Ewe , I surfaced and opened the engines up and repeated again after a while to check which direction it had travelled.

a while later I had succesfully intercepted a town-class warship with an a&b some distance behind it.

I lined myself up and waited until the town class came right across me .

I sunk him with one torp hit :)

I couldnt get a decent line on the A&B , so I dived and evaded him.

[Gerald]

thanks for the tips.

Last night I picked up a contact NW of Loch Ewe , I surfaced and opened the engines up and repeated again after a while to check which direction it had travelled.

a while later I had succesfully intercepted a town-class warship with an a&b some distance behind it.

I lined myself up and waited until the town class came right across me .

I sunk him with one torp hit :)

I couldnt get a decent line on the A&B , so I dived and evaded him. Good luck, :yep:

[jangles]

I may need it , Im thinking of snooping around loch ewe next ...:-?

[Gerald]

I may need it , Im thinking of snooping around loch ewe next ...:-? Be careful, it is quite shallow and it is not without risks :yep:

[desirableroasted]

Once I first hear a contact, I surface and head straight for him, at standard or full. After running on surface for 15-20 mins., I submerge and listen again. I now take note of which side of 000 the contact is at now. This tells me the rough direction he is heading.

The problem with that approach is that 20 minutes-at-full speed later you are almost sure to be where the target is not, because you haven't gathered any intelligence before starting the run, and are pretty much hoping to be lucky.

Why not stay submerged and let the shift in angle tell you the rough direction to start with? Takes 1 to 10 minutes of game time, and at least tells you up front whether he is moving to your port or starboard. At the same time, the speed at which the target direction changes may give you a sense of proximity.

Also, if you are tracking a target that BdU informed you about, you already know the approximate speed and direction. Using that and the angle change over 10 minutes, you can in fact calculate a rough position and heading. At least enough to more than double your chances of finding him.

Armed with that first intelligence, then you make a 10-12 minute run on the surface (or less if you sense he is closer), rinse and repeat.

The good thing is that if you run your game at TC1 once you get into a tactical situation, you have a wealth of time to weigh data, think things through, fiddle around with the calculator, look up advice here on the forum. A merchant moving at 5 knots is going to the bottom, period, so there is no reason to be impatient.

[derrinurban]

The problem with that approach is that 20 minutes-at-full speed later you are almost sure to be where the target is not, because you haven't gathered any intelligence before starting the run, and are pretty much hoping to be lucky.

Why not stay submerged and let the shift in angle tell you the rough direction to start with? Takes 1 to 10 minutes of game time, and at least tells you up front whether he is moving to your port or starboard. At the same time, the speed at which the target direction changes may give you a sense of proximity.

Also, if you are tracking a target that BdU informed you about, you already know the approximate speed and direction. Using that and the angle change over 10 minutes, you can in fact calculate a rough position and heading. At least enough to more than double your chances of finding him.

Armed with that first intelligence, then you make a 10-12 minute run on the surface (or less if you sense he is closer), rinse and repeat.

The good thing is that if you run your game at TC1 once you get into a tactical situation, you have a wealth of time to weigh data, think things through, fiddle around with the calculator, look up advice here on the forum. A merchant moving at 5 knots is going to the bottom, period, so there is no reason to be impatient.

This is the approach I use for contacts that I find or if I am playing with map contacts off. For any contacts that BdU gives me, I plot an intercept course based upon the information given and do not bother with the hydrophone until I am close to the intercept area.

I may have mistated or simplified a few things in my original post.

I usually run at standard (better fuel economy) to start and up it to full later if need be (chasing a target heading away from me). I choose 15-20 mins. (in good weather) because if I hear him on hydrophone but do not have visual yet, this time frame generally gets me in visual range. If not another quick check will allow an adjustment and get me there. Then I can plot a proper intercept and set up for a shot.

The reason I do not wait submerged to gather more information is that I have lost contacts this way. Obviously they must have been at the very outskirts of detection range and moving away. Even using my method I have lost some contacts that I would have to presume were the faster moving tankers.

As I stated above this is strictly for acquiring targets I find and before I get into a tactical situation. Generally once I find a contact and get close enough to shadow him and gather the information about his course, I plot my intercept or run around (just at the edge of visual). I totally agree that once you are in the tactical situation (5-15 km from firing position), have nothing but time to gather/tweak the information required for a firing solution.

[Fish In The Water]

I make all my sonar sweeps during partols from a depth of about 25m. I have found it to be more reliable. I can click 25m depth on the dial easily and do not have to worry about missing any contacts. In some stormy/bad weather situations, at periscope depth, I just about missed some contacts because the hydrophone would only work sporadically. My depth was varying to the point that at times I was above the depth where hydrophones activate, giving me a dead spot in the sweep (hope that makes sense).

Makes perfect sense as the AI_Sensors.dat file sets the maximum hydrophone height to minus 10 meters. (Or 11.5 in a type IX). This being the case, I can see how rough seas could periodically bounce you in and out of the zone.

25 meters seems a good idea. :up:

[sublynx]

Out of curiosity I was glancing BDU's war diaries from January 1945 in U-boat archive and found a report that said:

IV. Current Operations:
a) None.
b) 1) U 427 (acting as shuttle-escort to the convoys off the S.W. coast of Norway), fired a 3 fan torpedo on a destroyer formation which was attacking the convoy, at 2338, in AM 3277.
At 0012 and 0045 she fired hook shots on hydrophone bearings. Detonations and sinking sounds occurred both times. The submarine was thought to have sunk 2 destroyers, a short report is awaited.

Later the report said:

d) 1) Escort-submarines off southern Norway: A short report from U 427 showed that of the 2 destroyers presumed to have been sunk yesterday, 1 destroyer was sunk for certain as a direct hit was observed and sinking noises heard, and another destroyer had anyway been torpedoed. The ship which was sunk might possibly have been a cruiser. A statement to this effect will be made in the OKW-report (Supreme Command of the Armed Forces).


In Wikipedia U-427 is mentioned as a U-boat that never sunk anything, but managed to survive over 600 depth charge attacks. I think the report is probably wrong in assuming that the torpedoes hit anything, but it does indicate that in 1945 shooting torpedoes on hydrophone bearings was an acceptable procedure to BDU and if I remember correctly I think I read somewhere on these forums that the Americans actually sunk one Japanese ship shooting blind, based on hydrophone bearings.


If someone is curious about the report, you can find it here:

http://www.uboatarchive.net/BDUKTB30362.htm

P.S. oh yeah, sorry about this message being a bit off topic.

[Hotspur1337]

I think my hydrophone is messed up. My sonarman can hear contacts that I cannot. I haven't even rated him yet, and his hearing is better than mine.

Is it this way for other players?

[Pisces]

I think my hydrophone is messed up. My sonarman can hear contacts that I cannot. I haven't even rated him yet, and his hearing is better than mine.

Is it this way for other players?Usually not. There might be too much noise from the sound effects. There is a bug that sometimes pops up (and eventually goes away again) where the outside sea noise is heard inside. This might bug you. There is also a volume switch on the station to help you a bit. But I personally edited the amb_Hydrophone.wav file in Sh3_gamefolder\data\sound because it didn't sound like as I was listening through my own headphones.

[Osmium Steele]

In Wikipedia U-427 is mentioned as a U-boat that never sunk anything,

Wikipedia, any wiki for that matter, is not to be trusted as a definitive source of information.

Uboat.net lists U-427 firing 5 torpedos at HMS Norfolk on 12 Jan, but all missed. It is possible that the explosions mentioned in the BdU report may have, at a later date, been attributed to another boat. Conflicting reports and all that.

It certainly wouldn't be the first time a U-boat was robbed of a kill.