UK 'over-reliant' on GPS signals, engineers warn

[XabbaRus]

You don't say?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-12668230

I'm not surprised. I think most people have a GPS system in their car. I have one that I got as a present, but must admit it is onbly used so I can see what time I might be arriving at a destination rather than for guidance.

I do love studying a map though when going on a new route, often I find places to go on the way I'd miss if I stick in the GPS coordinates.

[STEED]

Not that surprised at all, too much tech worship in this country I say.

[Gargamel]

I hate the things. I can navigate better on my own. Whenever somebody has one, I try to beat the estimated time. Gimmy a map and compass any day.

As a medic, I refused to let new partners use them. Did they really expect to sit and punch in addresses when seconds count? They need to know the roads.

If I ever saw another crew using one, and they were out of there truck, I'd change the voice setting to swedish. "Bjork 2 kilometeres BORK BORK BORK!" People would really flip out when that happened.

[Jimbuna]

I find mine to be very helpful in planning alternative routes when it is warned of traffic congestion or accidents up ahead.

[Oberon]

Some of the screw-ups that people have deliberately made whilst following their GPS astound me...like driving into a river that the GPS thinks is a ford...I mean...you have eyes don't you?! :damn:

[XabbaRus]

They have their uses but like I said you look at a map when working out where to go you spot other places that look interesting and you plan a detour.

I sometimes wish that it would all go wrong just to see how the nuggins in the street cope.

[Oberon]

They'd probably all drive into the sea.

I like using maps too...I might not be so great with them sometimes...but that's how you find interesting little places. :up:

[Jimbuna]

The only time my satnav was no good to me (not that I use it that often) was last year when I tried to use it to find Grizedale Hall (U-boat Hotel) but in fairness to it, Grizedale Hall is now a Forestry Commission Centre and probably goes by another name.

I also had fun with an earlier model shortly after the motorway modifications at Ferrybridge where the A1 links up with the M62....the bloody thing didn't know the motorway had been moved 1/4 of a mile and thought it was in a field :DL

[CCIP]

I wanna see what would happen if you take one of those things up on a plane :O:

"Drive down 10 kilometers, then turn left..."

[Gargamel]

I wanna see what would happen if you take one of those things up on a plane :O:

"Drive down 10 kilometers, then turn left..."

Spent 2 weeks on a house boat on the St Lawrence a few years ago. Brought the Garmin car GPS.

Yeah... the thing was useless. Kept trying to get us to drive to the nearest road. And it didn't even have the rideau canal properly mapped so it thought we were going through fields.

Then, on the week long drive home (stopped and camped at mutiple spots), we stopped at Fort Ticonderoga. The GPS found it ok... but only the driveway...... which is like 4 miles long. The entire time, it kept saying (cause I couldn't mute it or get the volume below 10%) "Turn around, turn Around"

After about 15 minutes of this, I swear to God, it said "Fine!" and turned off.

[jumpy]

Never used a twat-nav myself, and I've seen plenty of articulated lorries stuck down small side streets/under low bridges :DL

Might be useful with finding speed traps and some town destinations, but I rarely go to other big cities by car. Any other time I'll use the OS roadmap and a line sketch of roads around destination for quick reference.

[Schöneboom]

This looks like an "appropriate technology" question: when is GPS the sensible solution, and when not? A handheld device for a trekker in the wilderness, that I could justify. And for a ship to navigate on the open sea. But the talking car units, as they are right now? Nah.

Given that satellites are not invulnerable, it would behoove us to maintain the old skills of navigation, just in case.

[CCIP]

I like them in cars, but not for directions or talking. I don't drive myself, but having gone on roadtrips with friends who have them, I find them useful for being able to quickly figure out where exactly you are. Also handy for when you have to make a quick pit stop for food or supplies in an unfamiliar area. Directions? Nah. Honestly, these often distract and confuse more than help - road signs more than do the job for that.

[Gargamel]

A handheld device for a trekker in the wilderness, that I could justify.

I've thought about that a lot.

Yes, I have carried them when I've done long backpacking trips. But usually just following the map and trail has sufficed. So if I want to go overland? I take a bearing with the compass and head that direction, and using the topo maps I would know land features to help navigate. If you're really good, you don't even need a compass. Just an altimeter and topo map. (That I have done, but my altimeter was my GPS :cool:).

back country the GPS is good for setting where you parked your car, where you left your tent, etc, So in an emergency, you can easily find your way back. But to travel into the wilderness with only a GPS? :o:doh:

I can see it being useful for situations 'similar' to ocean travel. Ie, Tundras and wide open plains while in/on a motorzied vehicle.

[Platapus]

Whether it is in the military or in someone's car, there is nothing wrong with using a GPS nav system. The technology is there you might as well use it.

The problem, that I see, is when people (military or civilian) can't use anything but a GPS to navigate.

Now if a civilian can't navigate without a GPS, they may end up coming late to little susie's birthday party.

When someone in the military can't navigate without GPS, people will die, or more appropriately, the wrong people will die.

Does the military still teach the basic map/compass skills any more? I sure hope so and not just as a back up.

But that is not the only problem. How many weapon systems depend on GPS to the extent that no GPS no weapon.

GPS navigation is a great thing. It has helped me many times, it is a great convenience and it often helps me do what I need to do more efficiently.

But, and this is as large a but as my Butt is, it should not be the only way to navigate. People still need to know how to use maps and how to mentally visualize their trip.

The problem is not GPS, but the reliance on GPS. :yep:

[nikimcbee]

:haha:you should see my dad, he's helpless w/o his gps:haha:.

[TLAM Strike]

The problem is not GPS, but the reliance on GPS. :yep:

Exactly, I work in a pizza shop and have to take down directions to people's houses. If they are on one of the major North-South roads I will ask "are you north or south of route 441 (the major East-West road)"... I can swear I can hear their brain cells stutter and die after I ask a question like that; its like I just asked them a question about Cold Fusion. People don't know if they are north or south of the biggest road in town. Or when one of the drivers doesn't know where to go and I tell them to look in the road atlas (we have two FCOL) its like I'm talking french or something. :damn:

[Herr-Berbunch]

Jim - I had fun in the Lakes, too. My parents had rented a cottage over Christmas and we drove up to Hawkshead on Christmas Day - Satnav was wonderful until we got to the B5285 at Windermere - Take the ferry! The ferry is only closed one day a year - Christmas Day! No problems - I'll just head down to Newby Bridge and go around the Lake, it'll recalibrate the route and all will be fine.

Nope, all the way to Newby Bridge, and for many miles after - Turn around when possible, Turn around when possible, Turn a:damn:

[Platapus]

I am guilty of the north south failing too.

We have two major highways that are used for reference. None of them are North/South or East/West, but they are referred to as being North/south...

In my tiny brain, I have a visualization of my area and what I envision as the major north south road is actually a west and east road, but major portions go north and south. :damn:

Only in Virginia can you be west of a east and west road. But then in North Virginia you can have an intersection of Lee Road and Lee Highway which is close to Old Lee road and Old Lee highway.
:damn::damn::damn:

[MaddogK]

This looks like an "appropriate technology" question: when is GPS the sensible solution, and when not? A handheld device for a trekker in the wilderness, that I could justify. And for a ship to navigate on the open sea. But the talking car units, as they are right now? Nah.

Given that satellites are not invulnerable, it would behoove us to maintain the old skills of navigation, just in case.

Here's an example of proper application of technology- Went to Oshkosh air show a couple years ago, we park the car amongst the thousands already there and the wife starts to grab sunglasses, tanning oil, food, etc. I reach into the glove box and pull out my magellan camping GPS receiver and get out of the car, mark the spot and pocket the unit. We head off to the air show. 8 hours later we start to head back to the car and the wife asks if I remember where we parked, I smile and pull out the GPS and lead her back to the parking spot.

She insisted I buy her one.

:rock:

[Geno_Mariner]

Here's an example of proper application of technology- Went to Oshkosh air show a couple years ago, we park the car amongst the thousands already there and the wife starts to grab sunglasses, tanning oil, food, etc. I reach into the glove box and pull out my magellan camping GPS receiver and get out of the car, mark the spot and pocket the unit. We head off to the air show. 8 hours later we start to head back to the car and the wife asks if I remember where we parked, I smile and pull out the GPS and lead her back to the parking spot.

She insisted I buy her one.

:rock:

I should get one of those :o I sometimes forget where my car is in a major carpark, especially if there's a couple of cars that looks the same or if there's way too many white cars (had one embarrassing moment of approaching a car that isn't the same make and had the owner coming towards it as well :doh:).

I don't mind the GPS but also be aware of Google Map's possible errors when you use the directions thing. I used it to get me to my Agriculture college, and it gave me several streets wrong that I ended up a good 10-15 mins away (could be more) from the college....

[Platapus]

They make small simple GPS units designed especially for that purpose. They are small and fit in the pocket.

Been thinking of getting one

[Geno_Mariner]

I shall have to look at that, good to know there's at least something to be able to locate my car in a big and busy carpark :hmmm:

[Herr-Berbunch]

Don't need a GPS to screw up, my wife once drove to Nottingham (about 90 miles away) for an exam, was running a bit late, parked her car, paid for a ticket and ran to the exam centre.

An hour or so later she returned to the car park but couldn't find her car, frantic searching provided no results so she phoned the car park operators (NCP) to advise/help her.

A man from the company drove to her location and asked to see her ticket to ascertain what floor/area of the car park she'd parked in.

'But this isn't a ticket for an NCP car park!' :har:

He kindly drove her to the correct car park where they found the car at once. :oops:


Another time she'd parked at Sainsbury's supermarket, bought some stuff and went out to the car, but couldn't unlock the car!!! She phoned the RAC to come and get her sorted but while she was waiting she spotted the car in the next row! :nope:

I swear, she is an intelligent woman, currently studying for her Masters, but like I say - there is a balance between education and common sense, not many people are blessed with both.

[Herr-Berbunch]

They make small simple GPS units designed especially for that purpose. They are small and fit in the pocket.

Been thinking of getting one

I shall have to look at that, good to know there's at least something to be able to locate my car in a big and busy carpark :hmmm:

If you've got or are getting a smartphone they usually have some gps built-in and most, if not all, use signal triangulation to find locations - there are some apps now that can use this to locate things like your car. Saves buying a separate phone and gps unit. :yep:

[Platapus]

If you've got or are getting a smartphone they usually have some gps built-in and most, if not all, use signal triangulation to find locations - there are some apps now that can use this to locate things like your car. Saves buying a separate phone and gps unit. :yep:


I have a Jitterbug and it always stays in the car. :D

[Herr-Berbunch]

I have a Jitterbug :D

Can you get some medication for it? :hmmm:

[nikimcbee]

Can you get some medication for it? :hmmm:

Well, it's like crabs, but they take bigger bites.:o

[Platapus]

I have a Jitterbug and it always stays in the car. :D

Can you get some medication for it? :hmmm:

Don't be a Jitterbug hater. :nope:

I love my Jitterbug. It is just a cell phone. It makes and receives phone calls. And it does it well. Since it stays in my car all the time, I don't need the extra "features" that other cell phone/electronic friends have. To me a cell phone is a specialized tool. I don't want to have a "relationship" with it. I don't want it part of my life.

I want it to sit quietly and obediently until I decide to use it. I don't want my cellphone reminding me of things, nor to I want to "share" my life experiences with my cell phone.

Best of all, with the Jitterbug J, it has blue tooth so once I program my car, I never have to see nor touch my cell phone any more. It is hidden in the center console (which makes it easy to "forget" to check voice mail too. :yeah:

[Jimbuna]

I always thought the Jitterbug was a dance :doh:

[Gargamel]

I always thought the Jitterbug was a dance :doh:

Nope... just a cell phone for old people. :O:

[krashkart]

Nope... just a cell phone for old people. :O:


Hey! I...!
:hmmm:
I'll resemble that remark someday! :stare:

[Geno_Mariner]

If you've got or are getting a smartphone they usually have some gps built-in and most, if not all, use signal triangulation to find locations - there are some apps now that can use this to locate things like your car. Saves buying a separate phone and gps unit. :yep:

Hmm lessee, all I got is an iPod and a Nokia E71. Though I plan to upgrade at some point :hmmm: I'll have to take a look at smartphones.

[Jimbuna]

Nope... just a cell phone for old people. :O:

LOL :DL

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/1311/men1411.gif

[krashkart]

Someone hit on pizza delivery again, I guess I'll add my own bit of lore. Where I used to work, most of us used a combination of the big sector map on the wall and a $5 street guide to plan our routes. The street guide was great to have in a vehicle just in case we got lost along the way, or had a delivery that would take us outside city limits. On busy nights you might have three or four orders at a time, and in some cases even more than that (reminded of the dreaded St. Patrick's Day nightmare :dead:), and somehow I don't think that having a GPS would have helped any more than the maps we had. Part of the area we served was being actively developed, which meant that within a couple of months a whole new neighborhood would spring up and there would be a fresh influx of hungry, pizza-loving customers dialing in orders. I am not 100% sure if GPS units would have had those streets updated quickly enough, but quite honestly if you spend 20-30 hours a week driving the area you develop a fairly keen sense of where places are in relation to home plate.


Edit:

I forgot to mention that the new developments use the European style street layout, and in the early days I got lost out there more than once. Once I picked up a street guide my delivery times became more and more efficient. Very, very handy when the big rains started sweeping through. :)