Who killed Prien?

[Bilge_Rat]

70 years ago today, march 7,1941, Gunther Prien, arguably the most famous U-boat commander of the war disappeared.

This much is known, he filed his last position report on 0440, attacked a 20,000 ton ship in convoy Outbound 293, hitting her with two torpedoes, then U-47 disappeared for all time.

initially the Admiralty gave the credit to "Wolverine" for a DC attack at 0400 on march 8, however this would have meant Prien had chased the convoy far to the west for 24 hours which is unlikely given that he was low on torpedoes.

According to Clay Blair, the most likely explanation is that U-47 was destroyed during the many DC attacks "Wolverine" and/or " Verity" launched on U-47, U-70 and U-99 on march 7.

Among the other possibilities are that U-47 was sunk by a circular running torpedo, by crew error or for unknown causes on the way back to Lorient with a defective
radio.

U-47 had sailed on February 20 after 76 days in port. There had been a substantial turnover in the crew and little opportunity to train before sailing, so crew error is a real possibility.

[Gerald]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%BCnther_Prien

http://www.uboat.net/men/prien.htm

http://www.u47.org/english/u47_pri.asp

http://www.leisuregalleries.com/prienp.html

[Feuer Frei!]

Conclusion: Inconclusive.

[nikimcbee]

If I recall, the one the Wolverine sunk had a bent prop shaft, and that is how they were able to track it. Whether or not it was the U-47, I guess we'll never know.:06:

[Bilge_Rat]

we should have a better idea on the cause when they find the wreck of U-47 at the bottom of the Atlantic.

I am surprised it has not been located yet, considering all the other wrecks which have found in recent years.

[Dowly]

Dont think there is an answer to this. Not definitive atleast.

[nikimcbee]

we should have a better idea on the cause when they find the wreck of U-47 at the bottom of the Atlantic.

I am surprised it has not been located yet, considering all the other wrecks which have found in recent years.

That would be quite the find. I don't know how'd they ID the boat though, unless they went inside.

[Bilge_Rat]

That would be quite the find. I don't know how'd they ID the boat though, unless they went inside.

They keep finding new u-boats and other wrecks, although most of them are in relatively shallow waters (i.e. Less than 300 feet) and accessible to scuba divers.

http://www.uboat.net/announce.html

[Feuer Frei!]

That would be quite the find.

Don't hold your breath. (Pun intended).

[Jimbuna]

I subscribe to Blairs theory....well either that or he met his end in GWX

http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/whistle.gif

[Tchocky]

Cigarettes!

[MaddogK]

Probably an errant torpedo, they seemed to follow Prien (pun intended),

Unfortunately defective torpedoes weren't invented before Royal Oak.
http://www.postimage.org/gx1aKk9r.jpg
http://s1.postimage.org/231wpky74v/image273_18.jpg

[CCIP]

It's not very likely they'll ever find her. The sub sank in a very deep part of the ocean, and considering the manner in which subs usually go down (i.e. implode from the pressure) it's probably in a pretty poor shape. Not very many wrecks this small tend to be located that deep, and even with radar searches it's unlikely to be easily identifiable as a U-boat, let alone a specific boat. I think there's almost no chance the boat will ever be found, and even if it's found, it's improbable that will yield any clues as to how it sank.

[TLAM Strike]

It's not very likely they'll ever find her. The sub sank in a very deep part of the ocean, and considering the manner in which subs usually go down (i.e. implode from the pressure) it's probably in a pretty poor shape. Not very many wrecks this small tend to be located that deep, and even with radar searches it's unlikely to be easily identifiable as a U-boat, let alone a specific boat. I think there's almost no chance the boat will ever be found, and even if it's found, it's improbable that will yield any clues as to how it sank.

Not that it hasn't been done (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Azorian) its just there is no pressing demand to find out what happened.

[CCIP]

Not that it hasn't been done (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Azorian) its just there is no pressing demand to find out what happened.

Oh indeed. Though I think the search for U-47, especially with the number of other very similar wrecks littering that area, would be even more difficult and costly, and who'd pay?

I'm also skeptical that she's not just a debris field now. At least that's my impression of what most U-boats sunk in violent action in deep ocean look like - i.e. torn up and in pieces.

[Jimbuna]

It's not very likely they'll ever find her. The sub sank in a very deep part of the ocean, and considering the manner in which subs usually go down (i.e. implode from the pressure) it's probably in a pretty poor shape. Not very many wrecks this small tend to be located that deep, and even with radar searches it's unlikely to be easily identifiable as a U-boat, let alone a specific boat. I think there's almost no chance the boat will ever be found, and even if it's found, it's improbable that will yield any clues as to how it sank.

^ + 1 http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Bilge_Rat]

I dont necessarily agree, as technology has evolved, many wrecks which were thought to be unfindable have been found.

Bismarck at 17,000 feet:

http://img852.imageshack.us/img852/9913/bismarck001.jpg


Titanic at 12,000 feet:

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/1497/titanic0001.jpg





USS Thresher at 8,400 feet:

http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/images/h97000/h97557.jpg


http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-t/ssn593-l.htm


USS Scorpion at 10,000 feet:

http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/images/u130000/u136662.jpg


http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-s/ssn589-k.htm


As to what the wreck will look like will really depend on what caused the sinking. The USS Thresher imploded and debris was littered all over the sea floor. However, both the K-129 and the USS Scorpion flooded and parts of their hull were found on the seafloor.

[MaddogK]

Also note that if the hull was ruptured by a shallow water explosion chances are slim that there would be a crushed hull sitting at the bottom of the ocean.

NO air.

[TLAM Strike]

Also note that if the hull was ruptured by a shallow water explosion chances are slim that there would be a crushed hull sitting at the bottom of the ocean.

NO air.

Although if her batteries exploded as she/after she sank there might not be much left.

[nikimcbee]

I forgot where she was sunk at (roughly:haha:)

[CCIP]

I forgot where she was sunk at (roughly:haha:)

Location given as approximately 60N/90W. That is, about 300 miles directly south of Iceland.

That's about 2-3000ft of water there.

[Madox58]

OK!! DAMNED IT!
I confess.
He was messing with my Wife and I lost it!
:stare:
Oh, I saw the E-mails.........

Uh,
:-?
What a minute.
That was in the 40's right?

Never mind.

[Ducimus]

All those ships (or boats) are much larger then a 740 ton uboat. If for whatever reason it is in pieces, it just became ALOT smaller. If it crushed, it became REALLY smaller.

Trying to find U47 in the depths of water its believed to be.....

Thats like saying here:
Find the crushed beer can that John Doe Prein threw overboard and sunk somewhere in the bottom of this lake over 60 years ago:
http://www.rwongphoto.com/RW1043_web.jpg

Oh and nevermind the rest of the trash, we just one this one specific crushed beer can. So go ahead... find it. Just try.

[Subnuts]

http://i52.tinypic.com/2h2f3x0.jpg

[bookworm_020]

Dont think there is an answer to this. Not definitive atleast.

I think your sig might have something to do with it!:D

[Gargamel]

I Think the ONLY way it will be found is by an expedition looking for something else when the ROV cable snags on the hulk of the U-boat. Nobody is going to mount an expedition to find it, chances are just way too low. It will only be found by total chance, if ever. In another 50 years, there won't be anything left to find, and then that will be buried by silt.