View Full Version : Pope Benedict: Jewish people not guilty for Jesus death
Pope Benedict has rejected the idea of collective Jewish guilt for Jesus Christ's death, in a new book to be published next week.
Tackling an issue that has led to centuries of persecution, the Pope argues there is no basis in scripture for the Jewish people to be blamed.
The Catholic Church officially repudiated the idea in 1965.
But Jewish groups say the Pope's detailed analysis of the gospels is a major step forward.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12634176
Note: 3 March 2011 Last updated at 12:28 GMT
Sailor Steve
03-03-11, 11:04 AM
Well duh...
Herr-Berbunch
03-03-11, 11:34 AM
All the news channels available on t'interweb :o
Penguin
03-03-11, 01:11 PM
I heard it were the Romans...
which leads me to some thinking: which city was it where the pope resides? :hmmm: :o
I heard it were the Romans...
which leads me to some thinking: which city was it where the pope resides? :hmmm: :o
Vatican. :88)
Armistead
03-03-11, 01:20 PM
Thought the story went Christ died for mankind, that would be God's plan, not mans. Course I don't fall into this doctrine that man condemned himself by eating an apple in the first place.
Penguin
03-03-11, 01:28 PM
Vatican. :88)
aaarrgghhhh! :rotfl2:
may the Swiss Guard invade you!
aaarrgghhhh! :rotfl2:
may the Swiss Guard invade you!
*Scatters boxes of juggling balls around*
There, that should slow them until I come up with a proper plan. :hmmm:
Mel Gibson reference in five...four...three...
http://celebrityreligion.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/melgibsonpassionchrist.jpg
Best I could do with no swearing in it...
frau kaleun
03-03-11, 02:26 PM
Oh hai great excuse to post this:
http://chzsomuchpun.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/1c274750-f2aa-4615-8019-1d29eff20b40.gif
Platapus
03-03-11, 02:36 PM
So the pope comes out and has to make a declaration that one can't hold an entire worlds population of a specific religious group responsible over the years, for what a small number did a long time ago?
Wow, glad he is on the job. :yeah:
Looks like they picked the right man for the job.
So the pope comes out and has to make a declaration that one can't hold an entire worlds population of a specific religious group responsible over the years, for what a small number did a long time ago?
Wow, glad he is on the job. :yeah:
Looks like they picked the right man for the job.
Now, it's not quite like that. He's just restating the long held position the church has held since... 1965.
So the pope comes out and has to make a declaration that one can't hold an entire worlds population of a specific religious group responsible over the years, for what a small number did a long time ago?
That's not what his old boss said... :hmmm::haha:
Herr-Berbunch
03-03-11, 02:58 PM
That's not what his old boss said... :hmmm::haha:
:rotfl2::har:
UnderseaLcpl
03-03-11, 03:08 PM
How considerate of the embodiment of God's Will on Earth to offer the same forgiveness that the Son of God demonstrated. Throw in communion and the same amount of forgiveness for all those who accept the Lord Jesus Christ as their saviour and we might just end up with Protestants.
Castout
03-03-11, 06:39 PM
Embodiment of God's will on earth? That's blasphemy in my view and I'm Catholic :D. Maybe I'm a bad Catholic but who cares as I don't believe the highest people in the Catholic church hierarchy have any personal knowledge of God at all. You see if you spend too much time dwelling in religious life high hierarchy without actually knowing God personally you'd fool yourself that nobody else knew God either and over time that faith would weaken or be lost and changed to merely humanitarian goals liberally interpreted by their own free will and mind which means they would be vulnerable to abuse and corruption.
Man ----x---- God, then he busies himself with
Man---------- himself or
Man----------other people
When man doesn't know God personally in his life man will busy himself with himself and or other people. How could he tell that God is really real by only reading a book? If God is really a living God which mean He exists a believer MUST expect to know God whom he claim to worship and follow otherwise he's not really seeking or his living is not fit to be considered worthy of knowing God . Because the book is not just a book but a living word of God(But
it's not encyclopedia well it's encyclopedia for what can't be reached by men).
Of course nobody would know God like knowing another person but even what little is personally known would change a man foundation KNOWING that God is there and bring him comfort even in difficult times. It doesn't mean faith is not required even on the contrary because nobody knows God like knowing another person.
Castout
03-04-11, 01:25 AM
So who's actually guilty for Jesus death then?
I vouch for the Swedish! :hmmm:
UnderseaLcpl
03-04-11, 02:11 AM
Embodiment of God's will on earth? That's blasphemy in my view and I'm Catholic :D.
You have my apologies, then, I wouldn't know any better since I'm a protestant blasphemer:DL
Maybe I'm a bad Catholic but who cares as I don't believe the highest people in the Catholic church hierarchy have any personal knowledge of God at all.
Really? You'd make an excellent protestant, then. It's a sweet deal. You don't have to swear allegiance to anyone other than God Himself and His Son, our Saviour. You also get to partake in communion with no strings attached and the worship services are a lot better. You don't even have to confess your sins or say prayers to express your penitence!
The only downsides are that we don't have rebellious Catholic schoolgirls dressed in nice uniforms that God Himself must have designed and we're expected to actually do stuff. It's not all bad, though. Helping a homeless person build a house or making and delivering dinner to an incapacitated senior citizen is quite rewarding.
Castout
03-04-11, 03:00 AM
You have my apologies, then, I wouldn't know any better since I'm a protestant blasphemer:DL
Really? You'd make an excellent protestant, then. It's a sweet deal. You don't have to swear allegiance to anyone other than God Himself and His Son, our Saviour. You also get to partake in communion with no strings attached and the worship services are a lot better. You don't even have to confess your sins or say prayers to express your penitence!
The only downsides are that we don't have rebellious Catholic schoolgirls dressed in nice uniforms that God Himself must have designed and we're expected to actually do stuff. It's not all bad, though. Helping a homeless person build a house or making and delivering dinner to an incapacitated senior citizen is quite rewarding.
Well I consider myself to have never owed allegiance to any man but my own conscience and to God.
Though technically I'm a Catholic I consider myself simply as a Christian.
In my 31 year of life and some of the worst things a man have to go through not a single Catholic would stand up for me . . . .If it wasn't because of God I'd have given up my faith completely and became a broken man in spirit and mind.
Religion saves no one. It's merely a feel good ritual meant to fill man's inability to reach and understand and know the God whom he wishes to worship.
Men need God to be saved. No one is perfect and even no one is worthy of living forever in abundance or to receive eternal power. All is in the grace. Men cannot save himself nor his religion could offer him salvation. It's his relationship with God that would save him. And that doesn't depend on anyone but God's initiative and the man's own response to it.
I've come to the realization that even if I make it to be acceptable in God's presence, it will not because of me at all. Not because I'm such a bad person but I've realized that I'm actually completely absolutely nothing and who will not even stand there in the first place if it wasn't because of God's own initiative and grace.
This God whose face shines beyond all light, who changes heart, who has the power to give the ultimate peace which brings joy and change man's heart to be alive and ever gentle, this God who answers prayer, whose spirit sounded like a great mighty wind to those who it came to, this God who knows the whisper of our every thought who never leave us or go to sleep or rest even when we are in death, who is able to reveal secrets and see into the hearts of men and nations, whose command even nature would obey, who actually make plans before carrying them out, who actually prefer us being clean physically and make us so before making an encounter or when His spirit lives in heart of His people, who love people who do not know Him and are unworthy, who has the power to forgive sins and who gives forgiveness even without being asked!
All those things would only be possible if He was indeed the Creator of all things whose mark of authority resides in every thing that has been created whose power defined by His Holiness, the scepter of His rule.
I feel lucky for having known such a God not as a God who only exists in a book but who let His believer to know the truth in it. Truly the living God.
Pope Benedict's absolution of the Jews for the death of Jesus is not unprecedented in Roman Catholic teaching.
A decree issued in 1965 by the Second Vatican Council rejected the age-old charge that the Jews bore collective responsibility for the decision by the Roman governor Pontius Pilate to condemn Jesus to death by crucifixion.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12637128
Note: Update Record,on the original topic,3 March 2011 Last updated at 18:33 GMT
Jimbuna
03-04-11, 04:18 PM
That's not what his old boss said... :hmmm::haha:
LOL :DL
kiwi_2005
03-04-11, 04:23 PM
Where's The Avon Lady.;)
It happened two thousand years ago about time the Catholics got over it. Besides it was Pontius Pilate who was the judge and jury and ordered Jesus to be crucified. The Jews may have been part of it but Pilate had the last say. Instead he set free Barabbas the freedom fighter & sent Jesus to his death.
Always look on the bright side of life......
Even if Jews killed Jesus we helped to create the biggest religon in the world and the most powerfull coutry-The Vatican.
Pope should be proud.
Was not this Gods will anyways?
Thnx to him anyway.
seaniam81
03-04-11, 05:31 PM
So who's actually guilty for Jesus death then?
I Vote those pesky Druids. You can never trust those tree huggers.
Armistead
03-04-11, 05:35 PM
You have my apologies, then, I wouldn't know any better since I'm a protestant blasphemer:DL
Really? You'd make an excellent protestant, then. It's a sweet deal. You don't have to swear allegiance to anyone other than God Himself and His Son, our Saviour. You also get to partake in communion with no strings attached and the worship services are a lot better. You don't even have to confess your sins or say prayers to express your penitence!
The only downsides are that we don't have rebellious Catholic schoolgirls dressed in nice uniforms that God Himself must have designed and we're expected to actually do stuff. It's not all bad, though. Helping a homeless person build a house or making and delivering dinner to an incapacitated senior citizen is quite rewarding.
Glad some christians help people, seems to me "let's pray" has become code for "I don't have to do nothing." or "I'll put it in God's hands."..code for I don't have to use my hands. If Christians actually got involved in all those things they pray about something might get done.
Again, the bible teaches Christ was ordained to die by God to start with, so who would that make responsible. I don't take Gen: as literal, but regardless looks like God put all the pieces in place for man to fall like it or not.
Castout
03-04-11, 06:36 PM
Always look on the bright side of life......
Even if Jews killed Jesus we helped to create the biggest religon in the world and the most powerfull coutry-The Vatican.
Pope should be proud.
Was not this Gods will anyways?
Thnx to him anyway.
It was never intended to create a religion. But in a way I'm also grateful that the majority of the Jews then to have rejected Jesus. Otherwise there would not be a chance for Gentiles to know this God who is a living God.
My proof came when I cried on the bed when I was a kid a 7th grader. Being a naive Catholic I asked to be allowed to see Jesus face. God gave me unexplainable unimaginable explosion of love to Jesus then I was allowed to see Jesus all while awake right then. I saw a man but whose figure was enveloped by the brightest white light I have ever seen. The light was coming from his head or face which grew in intensity if you try to look upon the man's face until both my eyeballs hurt that I gave up trying to see this man face. From that night I knew Jesus is really alive and he is indeed the Messiah.
Had the Jews not rejected Jesus most of the world would have not probably even be invited to know this true God and hardly any Gentiles would be chosen people of God. It's there in the parable of the king's invitation to a party. The catch is it's all in God's will from the beginning to include everybody. But God can't be blamed for Jesus death on the hands of the Pharisees. He wasn't in it but it was from the beginning to be God's will that everyone to be included for the coming kingdom, the life even power everlasting
In the parables of Matthew 22, the King has gone to great trouble preparing a wedding feast for his son, slaughtering enough oxen and fatted calves to feed several hundred people. He sends out invitations and then twice reminds the guests to attend. Not only do the guests refuse, but some of them seize his messengers and kill them. In response, the king sends his troops to burn their city. Then he sends out another invitation requesting that all persons -- the "good" and the "bad" -- be invited to the banquet. The hall is filled, and the party begins. This is one of several parables of judgment spoken by Jesus against the chief priests and Pharisees during the last week of his life. Taking the parable is an allegory, we can see that the king is God, the wedding feast the messianic banquet. The messengers who are killed represent the prophets and early Christian missionaries, and the invitation to the "bad" and "good" is the church's outreach to both gentiles and Jews. Seen in this way, the parable becomes a radical invitation. The table is spread for all to come. Those gathered mm the streets have no reason or right to be there -- except that a gracious king invites them. Jesus is issuing the invitation for all to join him as God's guests in a banquet feast called the kingdom of heaven.
Armistead
03-04-11, 07:53 PM
So if the jews would've accepted Christ, the rest of the world would've been condemned to hell by default? God did all this to save one race and toss the rest in hell for eternity, what a plan. If you believe the bible, wouldn't we all have jewish blood somewhere in the line?
Not sure what you saw, but the bible says no man could look at God's face and live. How did you know if was Jesus's face, no one knows what it looks like? How did you know it wasn't an angel, ghost or maybe carlights reflecting why you were half asleep dreaming? Heck, when I was that age I saw UFO's, few Ghost myself.
Seems the bible says man must accept God on faith, so why would he come to you personally and demand faith from the rest of us? Heck, every athiest I know says they would gladly accept God if he would show himself. God being no respector of person, why should they not get the same proof? Course if salvation would've been for the jews only, God indeed is a respector of persons....
If it was God's will to include everyone, how can mere mortals defy his will?
Is he so powerless that he can't fulfill what he wills? If a being is all powerful and knows all beforehand, how could less powerful creatures become more powerful to ruin his plans?
Don't see this " well, God allows it" If I'm a parent and have the power of all knowledge, if I allow my kid to go outside and play knowing a car would run over him, would I let him go outside and get killed.. I would be like " that car is gonna be showing up in 20 seconds, maybe I should call him in...nah.. The police would lock me up. The way christians sell God is like he had a perfect plan A for all mankind, but Satan and two creatures made from dirt undid that perfection, so God had to come up with plan B. If God can't keep control of plan A, how could we ever trust plan B?
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