How well lit were WWII subs

[Goetz von B]

Hello everyone, I have a question

What was the ambient lighting in a German sub like? We seem to be developing two schools of thought on the matter. One school is going for the darker, less lit more shadow look, while the other school more towards more light less shadows.

HINT: There is no right answer.

For my own two cents, I tend to think that there was no lighting except for the electric lights day and night. I would think you would want to keep as well lit as possible for crew efficiency, if for no other reason.

What do you think? Remember no right answer, just opinions

GvB

[mookiemookie]

Hello everyone, I have a question

What was the ambient lighting in a German sub like? We seem to be developing two schools of thought on the matter. One school is going for the darker, less lit more shadow look, while the other school more towards more light less shadows.

HINT: There is no right answer. Wrong. There is a correct answer.

Remember no right answer, just opinions

There's no room for opinions. It's a fact. We have surviving U-boats in Chicago and Germany. We know for a fact how they were lit, what color the walls were, etc.

It boils down to - some people want the Das Boot Hollywood dramatic lighting, and some people want realism.

[Zedi]

Das Boot is not the typical crappy Hollywood made fantasy, is why is so realistic.

Actually, I dont think it was any standard ambient for any u-boot interior. If my crew fell comfortable with a pink interior and wear short leather skirts, I would paint it pink just to make sure no torpedo will miss. Is me and my crew who need to survive months and years all alone out in the ocean, not the engineers and designers. So use whatever makes you comfortable and feel good.

[mobucks]

the only problem I have is with the HDR bloom making my crew's faces shine like they are the second coming of christ or an angel or something. Lots of games seem to overuse bloom.

[MoN]

http://www.deutscher-marinebund.de/02_U-Boot-Maschine_max.swf

http://www.deutscher-marinebund.de/04_U-Boot-Zentrale_max.swf

Note that it isn't lit by its own lights.

[Goetz von B]

Wrong. There is a correct answer.



There's no room for opinions. It's a fact. We have surviving U-boats in Chicago and Germany. We know for a fact how they were lit, what color the walls were, etc.

It boils down to - some people want the Das Boot Hollywood dramatic lighting, and some people want realism.

Fair enough, but as I understand from MoN in a later post these subs are lit by external lights, not solely by their own lighting

[drakkhen20]

ooooohhhh boy here we go. :D i would think in war time it wouldnt matter in the daytime and just take a average watt light bulb or look it up on google to see what kinda lightbulbs were used in subs and see what their respective candle light power was and go get one close to that and turn it on in a dark room and sit back for awhile and let you eyes adjust to it and youll get your answer. but i do know that at night they used the red lights as to not mess up their night vision if you were going up and down between the conning and the command room.:salute:

[Ducimus]

Fact of the matter is, u boat interiors were not dimly lit, dark walled caves. Look at U995 and U505 for examples. The only uboat that was a dimly lit, dark walled cave was the stage set in the Das Boot, and for dramatic effect.

[mookiemookie]

Das Boot is not the typical crappy Hollywood made fantasy, is why is so realistic.

It's realistic as far as cinema goes, but do not mistake it for being realistic as far as U-boats go.

[Takeda Shingen]

Fact of the matter is, u boat interiors were not dimly lit, dark walled caves. Look at U995 and U505 for examples. The only uboat that was a dimly lit, dark walled cave was the stage set in the Das Boot, and for dramatic effect.

It's realistic as far as cinema goes, but do not mistake it for being realistic as far as U-boats go.

Yup. Too many people regard Das Boot as a documentary.

[Stormfly]

the pictures show a fresh white intact interrior painting, its still fresh because the subs arent in service any more and also got repainted. If you look in some ships how the painting is suffering over a short time, you think omg. Also in submarines and engine rooms we have very dirty air mixed with oil and other ****, which is darkening the interrior also, not to forget the corrosion from the salty air. Ithink together with a real WWII sub lightning (not to powerfull because of power consumtion) it have a much darker interrior look as on that pictures above.

[Bilge_Rat]

Re. Das boot
I recall reading that the original plan was to film the boat with the proper color and lighting, but it did not look right on screen, so they went with the grey walls and dimmer lighting.

If you pay close attention, you will notice the wall and hatch leading to the engine room is painted the correct cream color.

[Budds]

Cant Speak to Subs......

But I have spent Many hours at Sea in a Few different ships.
My Experience was From the lowest Fishing Boat, to the "State of the Art" Yacht, to the Ocean going Tug, to the Crew Boat......
While there will always be the occasional "Scow", Most boats are regularly and CONSTANTLY being maintained.
I would be VERY surprized if the Military would allow many "Scows" !
I cant remember being on a Boat that was "Dark and Dirty" !

Night Light......
It dont take Much !
With no other competeing light sources, it takes Very Little to "Light-Up" the Cabin.
In Fact..... Once WELL Off-Shore, we most times would turn off all deck lights including the Running lights as they Blinded you to things that ambient Star/Moon light would allow you to see. ( Like Semi Floatting Cargo Containers that washed off a Frieghter somewhere..... Birds Standing on things in the middle of the Ocean is a BAD thing... Steer AWAY from them !!! ).
One Capt. I worked for would also cover instrument lites with Tape, so as to not get "Glare" when trying to look "Out".

One Fishing Boat I worked had two sets of Lights.
One set was HI Halogens..... Lit the Boat up like a Christmas Tree, mostly used for Cleaning/Inspecting or Showing Off how fast you can deplete your Batteries !
The Other set was Very Dim ... I wanna say 20/25 watt... and we then unscrewed about half of them as they were Too much.

Interesting Note :
Dark, Dirty, Confined Spaces were/are a degenerating effect on Crew.
Thats why a Great deal of thought is put into "Colors", Lights and such.
I asked A Tug Boat Capt. once why the Interiors of a lot of the Tugs I had been on, used a similar Blueish/Green color.
He said that it did not reflect light as bad so as to help eliminate Glare, AND... Military Studies showed it to be a "Shoothing" color... to help with crew anxiety. ( Ocean Goers See some Tall Waves ! ).

For what its worth..............

[noctis]

the lighting would deffinently be pretty dim and have more shadows.
Going off 1970 DE boats iv seen, i couldnt imagine WW2 boats would be any better.

[Webster]

well just think about how Anything was lighted back then in that time period, high wattage bulbs werent very easy to make and expensive to use so most "routine" environments were very shadowy and dimly lit so taking a sub into account it was probably better lit then most buildings yet still be engulfed in shadows that make vision for maps and charts not all that easy

movies andf games play tricks with lighting to serve ther purpose the want so as mentioned before you must decide if you want it to be in line with realism or to satisfy the image you got from some movie

[gazpode_l]

Das Boot is not the typical crappy Hollywood made fantasy, is why is so realistic.

Actually, I dont think it was any standard ambient for any u-boot interior. If my crew fell comfortable with a pink interior and wear short leather skirts, I would paint it pink just to make sure no torpedo will miss. Is me and my crew who need to survive months and years all alone out in the ocean, not the engineers and designers. So use whatever makes you comfortable and feel good.

BRILLIANT REPLY! :yep: :rock:

[Ducimus]

Yup. Too many people regard Das Boot as a documentary.

Isn't it wonderful how a cinematic movie about a novel, becomes the benchmark upon which history is gauged? :har:

[Zedi]

Lemme see... no u-boot captain or crew still alive who can share some personal video footage, photos and feedbacks, so all we got is tons of nazi propaganda movies on YT followed by the hollywood garbage plus 2-3 original boat in museums, all of them overpainted and altered to survive the weather and time and attract tourists.

In these conditions, why I should not trust in a movie made by germans based on Buchheim's book and visual feedback. Also, at that time there were hired few consultants whom actually served on u-boats, just to quote it right:
"During the film's production, Heinrich Lehmann-Willenbrock, the captain of the real U-96, and Hans-Joachim Krug, former first officer on U-219, served as consultants."

So how is Das Boot not a documentary? Or I should trust more on those trash movies made by hollywood with shinny and luxury boats where everything is altered, including the history?

Anyway, every boats interior should be comfortable to his crew and I dont believe in standards and ISO's when we talk about humans. Especially when is about humans sailing for months in a iron coffin in the middle of nowhere.