Just got Silent Hunter 3, I think I'm doing it wrong. Is there a guide?

[Jonny K]

I spent maybe 5 hours studying the manual, reading some online FAQs, and watching the tutorial videos to try and learn this game, and I think I've gotten a decent understanding. But then I tried to play the campaign. Here's what happened:

1. I start a new campaign and realize I need to pick my crew, have no idea how to do that or how it should be balanced, can't find any guides. Add one senior officer and leave it at that.

2. Start a mission, learn I must travel half way around the world. Set course, put time compression on highest setting.

3. Suddenly time compression ends and I'm being shot by a battle ship or something. I'm freaking out in a panic to figure out what's going on, I do an emergency dive, and just as I dive the ship runs over me. My sub leaks, the crew freaks out, and then we all die.

This led me to believe that maybe I mis-used the time compression. It would be great if the game could pause when something happens instead of keeping it real time. Anyway, I try another new campaign.

1. As before, add one senior officer.

2. Plot a course.

3. Micro manage the trip, spending about 4 hours of my real-life time turning the time compression up and down, submerging and surfacing, trying to only travel on the surface during the night (even though my battery power only seems to last 5 hours or so).

4. While traveling I suddenly have massive issues with crew fatigue. Everybody's got an exclamation next to them. I try to swap them around to rest, but it doesn't work too well. I don't have enough rest places for my senior crew. I micro manage this stuff like mad.

5. I get to my destination, do a patrol, don't see anything.

6. I opt to end the mission with the menu instead of traveling back.


So what am I missing? How do I get to the good stuff without hours of traveling and micro managing my crew? Is there a guide out there somewhere that explains how to actually play the game? The manual covers some topics roughly, but leaves soooo much out.

Thanks,


Jonny K



Update - I just looked at Subsim.com and I see some stuff to read. I'll get on it (posted this before finding the root site).

[thehiredgun]

use SH3 Cmdr,use the no fatigue option & most P.C.'s Despise Time Compression.I use 2048 T.C. but only sparingly.

[Gerald]

:salute:

[yubba]

1. start with VII boat they usually have shorter cruises. 2. crew 3 officers easier to jockey around. 3. crew management they have a fatigue patch, me ,I hit the normal surface cruise button this rotates crew. 4. watch your map for shipping reports. 5. best to start in France patrol western approaches.

[mookiemookie]

I spent maybe 5 hours studying the manual, reading some online FAQs, and watching the tutorial videos to try and learn this game, and I think I've gotten a decent understanding. Welcome aboard! Steam Holiday Sale buyer? If so, you made a great purchase. But you're going to need to un-learn a few things if you're a newbie to sim games.

You may want to mine this thread for newbie material: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=96026

1. I start a new campaign and realize I need to pick my crew, have no idea how to do that or how it should be balanced, can't find any guides. Add one senior officer and leave it at that. This isn't as vitally important as you think it'd be when you're first starting out. Your new crew is going to be very green - meaning that those little bars above the compartments that symbolize that compartment's effectiveness will not be very full. This gets better as your crew gains experience and earns promotions. I wouldn't worry about it too much for now.


2. Start a mission, learn I must travel half way around the world. Set course, put time compression on highest setting. The game has certain issues with running TC at the highest setting. You'll miss ships and planes will appear right on top of you. I don't use anything higher than 512x or 1024x unless I'm in friendly waters.

3. Suddenly time compression ends and I'm being shot by a battle ship or something. I'm freaking out in a panic to figure out what's going on, I do an emergency dive, and just as I dive the ship runs over me. My sub leaks, the crew freaks out, and then we all die. See above. This is the peril of using high time compression.


3. Micro manage the trip, spending about 4 hours of my real-life time turning the time compression up and down, submerging and surfacing, trying to only travel on the surface during the night (even though my battery power only seems to last 5 hours or so). It's a game of patience. I'm not sure if 4 hours is really necessary to get where you're going, but be prepared to sit for a while doing nothing. It is a submarine simulator after all. :03:

Your battery power should be enough to last you through the game day. You just have to realize that the faster you run, the less amount of time your battery will last. I recommend no more than 3-4 knots submerged and no more thna 9 knots on the surface unless you're chasing something. You don't really have to worry about travelling submerged during the day in the early years of the war - say up until about mid-1941 - or when you're in friendly waters.


4. While traveling I suddenly have massive issues with crew fatigue. Everybody's got an exclamation next to them. I try to swap them around to rest, but it doesn't work too well. I don't have enough rest places for my senior crew. I micro manage this stuff like mad. Ah, fatigue. There's a lot of us who hate micro managing that stuff, so we turn it off.

"How" you may ask? Mods! SH3 out of the box is a decent game, but there are many little issues that could be much better. The "standard" mod that many people use around here is the Grey Wolves Mod (http://www.thegreywolves.com/). It's a big download, but it comes with an installer (if you're using the Steam version of the game, you'll need to change the install directory path, but other than that, it works fine). I'd recommend that heartily. It adds new campaigns, new airplanes, new ship types, new visual effects. It's amazing the difference between stock and GWX.

SH3 Commander (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=147237) is a companion program that allows you to change lots of little tweaks to the game - such as turning off fatigue entirely. It's a very unobtrusive little program. Just install it and run it whenever you want to play SH3.

Welcome aboard again. You'll find that the Subsim forums are full of some of the most helpful people anywhere.

[Sailor Steve]

WELCOME ABOARD! :sunny:

1. I start a new campaign and realize I need to pick my crew, have no idea how to do that or how it should be balanced, can't find any guides. Add one senior officer and leave it at that.
First off, get SH3 Commander. No matter whether you play stock SH3 or use one of the supermods, Commander is the lifeline for playing SH3 realistically.

Now, when you choose your crew you will have the option of choosing qualified or unqualified officers and men. The qualified ones cost renown, and are at the top of the list. The unqualified "free" ones are at the bottom. Qualified men placed in the correct compartments will improve the efficiency of those compartments.

With Commander you can add any qualifications you like after the first patrol.

2. Start a mission, learn I must travel half way around the world. Set course, put time compression on highest setting.
First, a question: In what year, port and boat type are you starting? Starting in a Type II in 1939 will mean you have an assigned grid that is very close by, in the North Sea. Start in a Type VII and you will be assigned a grid somewhere in the North Atlantic. Start in a Type IX and you do indeed run the risk of being assigned a station "halfway around the world".

Again, SH3 Commander actually lets you choose the grid you will patrol. And, as mentioned, starting in 1941 from a French Atlantic port in a Type VII will put you very close to the action.

3. Suddenly time compression ends and I'm being shot by a battle ship or something. I'm freaking out in a panic to figure out what's going on, I do an emergency dive, and just as I dive the ship runs over me. My sub leaks, the crew freaks out, and then we all die.
The game default setting for "Enemy Ship (or plane) Spotted" is 8x, which means they spot you and open fire at before you realize it's happening. It is possible to change that in the game cfg files, but once again Commander makes it easy. Set it for 1x and you will drop to real time the instant the enemy is spotted, which is usually before he spots you.

This led me to believe that maybe I mis-used the time compression. It would be great if the game could pause when something happens instead of keeping it real time. Anyway, I try another new campaign.
No, you did nothing wrong. You were just unaware of the game's quirks.


4. While traveling I suddenly have massive issues with crew fatigue. Everybody's got an exclamation next to them. I try to swap them around to rest, but it doesn't work too well. I don't have enough rest places for my senior crew. I micro manage this stuff like mad.
Some of us, like me, enjoy dropping out of TC every four hours (two hours if it's stormy) and changing all the crew around. Unless you have that sickness, yet again Commander is your friend. As mentioned before, you can set it for 'No Crew Fatigue' and leave it alone.

[Pisces]

I spent maybe 5 hours studying the manual, reading some online FAQs, and watching the tutorial videos to try and learn this game, and I think I've gotten a decent understanding. But then I tried to play the campaign. Here's what happened:Welcome from me too.!

1. I start a new campaign and realize I need to pick my crew, have no idea how to do that or how it should be balanced, can't find any guides. Add one senior officer and leave it at that.There is a bug in the game that makes you loose all renown earned during the 1st patrol, because you modified anything to your Uboat load-out before the 1st patrol. That includes crew. Next time don't bother, just go out with the crew and equipment that is given. Only change crew or equipment before the 2nd patrol.

2. Start a mission, learn I must travel half way around the world. Set course, put time compression on highest setting.

3. Suddenly time compression ends and I'm being shot by a battle ship or something. I'm freaking out in a panic to figure out what's going on, I do an emergency dive, and just as I dive the ship runs over me. My sub leaks, the crew freaks out, and then we all die.

This led me to believe that maybe I mis-used the time compression. It would be great if the game could pause when something happens instead of keeping it real time. Anyway, I try another new campaign.Correct! As allready has been said. Limit yourself to about 256x or 512x. The non-player units have an edge over you when you come out of TC. They allready know what's going on and have made their move. Also, SH3 Commander has a nice table in which you can easily change the desired time compression levels.

3. Micro manage the trip, spending about 4 hours of my real-life time turning the time compression up and down, submerging and surfacing, trying to only travel on the surface during the night (even though my battery power only seems to last 5 hours or so).You do not need to travel submerged during the day. (definately not during the early years) With reasonable TC levels even green crew will report visual contacts in time. But don't forget to put the Watch Officer back on the conning tower yourself. He is lazy as hell!

4. While traveling I suddenly have massive issues with crew fatigue. Everybody's got an exclamation next to them. I try to swap them around to rest, but it doesn't work too well. I don't have enough rest places for my senior crew. I micro manage this stuff like mad.Yeah, things get cramped on a Uboat. ;) You have 2 resting places for the Senior crew (big face icons, officers), forward and aft resting quarters. You need two of them on station (engineer and navigator) or you won't be able to command the uboat. The Weapon Officer station can be left unmanned until required. So, 2 on station, and 2 resting you should be able to keep them in a patern.

DON'T fall for the trap of using the "Crew Configuration Buttons" as they can cause CTDs. Micromanage is unfortunately required if you want some level of fatigue experience.

5. I get to my destination, do a patrol, don't see anything.Perfectly normal. There is nothing specifically scripted to arrive there for you in this specific patrol. Ships have their routes scripted from some place to some destination, via some waypoints. Whether you encounter them depends on luck (or hindsight ;) ) and the frequency of their spawning. Look on the map for icons that appear in your vicinity (a couple of 100 kilometers) and go after them if you so desire. Just remember that they may have moved along while you intercepted them. Or just visit the areas that are of logistical importance for England. (like the north and south entrances to the Irish sea, Gibraltar area, Eastern shores of England) Oh yeah, If you would like to know more of what goes around you, then listen ;) , rather than see. Your own ears to the hydrophones can hear further than your 'sonar'crew can hear, or even much further than your deckcrew can see. Stock SH3 has a horizon of up to 8 kilometers. Most big mods allow you to see up to 16kilometers. Well, weather permiting. But hydropone upto 34km.

6. I opt to end the mission with the menu instead of traveling back.That's ok. In stock SH3 you are supposed to receive extra renown by docking in the vicininty of your home port, but that also doesn't (allways) work because of bugs. Flying back to your homeport is not so realistic, but if you don't feel like wasting time, go ahead. But you might have encountered some ships if you did go home the slow way. BTW, you can stay at sea as long as you have fuel and torpedos (and gun shells) You do not have to go back after those 24 hours on your patrol location. Go anywhere you please for as long as you want.

So what am I missing? How do I get to the good stuff without hours of traveling and micro managing my crew? Is there a guide out there somewhere that explains how to actually play the game? The manual covers some topics roughly, but leaves soooo much out.

Thanks,


Jonny K



Update - I just looked at Subsim.com and I see some stuff to read. I'll get on it (posted this before finding the root site).It's a massive quantity of information but I'd guess the whole SH3 forum has all that you need to know. Use the search function with topic words that you would like to know more about. And when all else fails, simply ask! The game manual is barely adequate in telling you what you can or should do. Grow yourself a forum-addiction and you'll no longer be a newby soon enough. :up:

[Jimbuna]

Nothing much I can add other than... http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/welcome.gif

[Pisces]

Nothing much I can add other than... http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/welcome.gifAnd "BE MORE AGRESSIVE" :arrgh!:

[Sailor Steve]

There is a bug in the game that makes you loose all renown earned during the 1st patrol, because you modified anything to your Uboat load-out before the 1st patrol. That includes crew.
Are you sure about that one? I always fill out my crew right from the start and haven't had that problem. On the other hand for awhile now I've been in the habit of running a first "false patrol" (a quick trip around the harbor), just to make sure my first real patrol doesn't start on the first day of the month, so I may be misremembering.

On the other hand, not long ago someone commented that the only things that cause renown loss are equipment upgrades, because they delay the start date.

[Brag]

Welcome aboard! :salute::salute::salute:
There is little I can add to the above. I seldom run TC above 128. The micromanaging the crew represents the many frustrations a green crew causes.

To learn where the ship traffic is, visit the Operation Spinnennetz thread. :DL

[Tinman764]

Are you sure about that one? I always fill out my crew right from the start and haven't had that problem. On the other hand for awhile now I've been in the habit of running a first "false patrol" (a quick trip around the harbor), just to make sure my first real patrol doesn't start on the first day of the month, so I may be misremembering.

On the other hand, not long ago someone commented that the only things that cause renown loss are equipment upgrades, because they delay the start date.


That's exactly how what I do. As I understand it, you can change crew and torpedos without a problem.

@ Jonny K, welcome :salute: I'm pretty new to SH3 myself. You definatly want to take a look at SH3 Commander and GWX3.0 mod.
Only thing I think needs stressing is to be patient when you're setting up attacks, especially on convoys. Nothing worse than rushing an attack and spending the next 2 hours dodging escorts without scoring a hit lol

[Jonny K]

Hey,

Thanks for all the input guys, this is a lot of good info for only a few hours time! I can't believe I missed the newbie guide in the forum, stickied and everything.

Yes, this was a steam sale purchase (gotta love Steam). It's good to see mods and updates for the game. I'll try to run a few conservative mods, but I'm also cautious about changing the game too much just yet. It's always possible to mod a game until it no longer resembles what it should, and if the original game was so good then I shouldn't need to change too much, just a little. I'll see if I can keep fatigue enabled for the moment. As for realism, I'm currently running about 60% realism with most options on but not manual targeting. I know this is a major point of the game, but I'll work my way up to it. I'm going to assume I have a competent crew who will do that for me.

As for loosing renown after your first patrol with a modified crew, I didn't encounter that.

I should admit that I did have an encounter on my first patrol, but I lost the ship. In very stormy waters I detect a merchant ship via hydrophone, I put the periscope up and see it's right in front of me and extremely close (only a few meters) and moving away. I jump to my crew section and start throwing guys into the torpedo room to prepare an attack. I jump back to the periscope and the ship was gone. I searched around the area but never found it again. It was exciting for a moment though. :-)

I'm going to go through the guides and check out the mods. One other thing I was wondering - when identifying ships, I have that guide book, but the book doesn't tell me the nationality of the ship (specifically, is it an enemy or not?). I assume that the color of the ship on my map and in the periscope indicates it's an enemy if red, correct? And blue is ally, right? I couldn't find any description of the colors.


Thanks,


Jonny K

[frau kaleun]

In the stock game:

red=enemy
blue=friendly
green=neutral

For realism's sake, GWX (and maybe the other supermods, I'm not familiar with those) remove the color-coding and require you to ID ships the way real sub commanders did - by getting close enough to make out the flags and markings on them. But with GWX at least you can add the colors back easily enough if you find you'd rather keep them around.

Also be aware that in the game a torpedo needs to run at least 300 meters to arm itself, so if you find yourself a few meters away (:o) from an unexpected target there's really no rush to set up a shot... you've got to get some distance before there's any point in firing off an eel at her.

[Jonny K]

Ok, an update. I went through much of the newbie guide thread and found that most of the links are dead (5 years old). Is there a new place I can find the community manual?

I think I'm going to try playing a little more on the stock game first to get some experience before I crank it up with the Grey Wolves or anything else. Are there any graphics only mods? I'm suffering info overload and have spent so many hours studying stuff while playing the actual game very little, so I need a break.

One more question - when I have my navigator ping for the ocean depth does that give away my position? I've hit the bottom before (I thought ordering my engineer to dive would mean he'd dive to a reasonable level, but he just kept going). The Nav map seems to show some depth colors, but they are hard to make out and I don't know the legend for how deep the colors mean.

Thanks,


Jonny K

[Gargamel]

Hey,and if the original game was so good then I shouldn't need to change too much

Actually, the original game wasnt that good, just created a foundation for the modders to make a good game. I would start with a clean install, and Install one of the Super mods out there, GWX seems to be the consensus, but there is nothing wrong with using any of the others.

And until it becomes a liability, I'd run on the surface as much as you can, only occasionally dropping down for hydro checks. The RAF/RN don't get radar until early-mid '42, and the air cover doesn't seem to get oppressive till slightly after then.

99% of this game is waiting. You can alleviate this by using TC, but only to a certain point. While most games are action action action, you have to think of this as a Sim. Its wait wait wait wait wait wait SHOOT OH MY GOD WERE GONNA DIE wait wait wait wait etc.

[frau kaleun]

Ok, an update. I went through much of the newbie guide thread and found that most of the links are dead (5 years old). Is there a new place I can find the community manual?

The original URL for it has been dead for a while IIRC, every so often someone inquires about it and I don't remember anyone posting an updated link for it. You can try doing a search of the forum for "community manual" and see if you have any luck.

I think I'm going to try playing a little more on the stock game first to get some experience before I crank it up with the Grey Wolves or anything else.

Some folks will advise just that, others will say to go ahead and install a supermod right away. Do whatever floats your own boat. :DL


One more question - when I have my navigator ping for the ocean depth does that give away my position?

I real life? I'm guessing yes, if there's another ship near enough listening in with some type of sonar that can pick up on your ping.

In the game? Nope. The enemy AI doesn't hear it. Ping away to your heart's content, unless you want to refrain from it for realism's sake.


I've hit the bottom before (I thought ordering my engineer to dive would mean he'd dive to a reasonable level, but he just kept going).

The officers do what you tell 'em to. No more, no less. If you order a dive, the LI will keep you in a dive until you tell him to level off or go in the other direction, even if it means he sends you bow first into the sea bottom at flank speed (or takes you below crush depth and kills you all that way).

If you order a heading or plot a course, the navigator will keep you on it even if it ends up with you slamming into another ship or the dock or running a stop sign in downtown Kiel. Oh, they may alert you to the fact that there's another ship in the vicinity, or that you're getting close to land, or that you're taking damage from the pier on which you've impaled the boat, or that the traffic cop behind you is motioning franctically for you to pull over and produce your license and registration*, but they won't change course to avoid any of that unless you order it.

In other words, it's all up to you.



*I may have made this part up.

[Pisces]

Are you sure about that one? I always fill out my crew right from the start and haven't had that problem. On the other hand for awhile now I've been in the habit of running a first "false patrol" (a quick trip around the harbor), just to make sure my first real patrol doesn't start on the first day of the month, so I may be misremembering.

On the other hand, not long ago someone commented that the only things that cause renown loss are equipment upgrades, because they delay the start date.It's the first bug of SH3 that is mentioned in the GWX manual. Page 14 (page 27 in pdf-counts)

[Arnold]

Is there a new place I can find the community manual?
One more question - when I have my navigator ping for the ocean depth does that give away my position?
^
I have a link to the Silent Hunter 3 Community Manual yet I cannot get the link to work here. :( From history, considering the HF/DF technology the British used, it may also be prudent to limit your radio traffic to Bdu to eliminate detection. Rather than give Bdu contact reports every two hours, if a convoy is detected, in the game, every 12 hours is adequate.
As a fellow noob, it would be nice to locate a tutorial for learning to use the tools in the navigation map.
Good hunting!

[Gargamel]

Pinging for depth does not give away your pos, and I'm pretty sure HuffDuff is not modeled in the game.

[Sailor Steve]

I jump to my crew section and start throwing guys into the torpedo room to prepare an attack.
You don't need anyone in the torpedo room to fire torpedoes - just to reload them.

I've hit the bottom before (I thought ordering my engineer to dive would mean he'd dive to a reasonable level, but he just kept going).
P: Takes you to periscope depth.
C: Takes you to 70 meters, very quickly.
D: Takes you deeper until you tell him to stop. If you don't tell him to stop, he won't.

If I want to go to periscope depth or crash dive, I use those keys. Otherwise I use the guage to order a specific depth. I never touch the 'D' key.

It's the first bug of SH3 that is mentioned in the GWX manual. Page 14 (page 27 in pdf-counts)
"If you upgrade your U-boat before the first patrol of a new career, you may not receive any renown for ships sunk during the first patrol, so you should not upgrade or change anything on your U-boat on your first patrol of a new career before leaving port."

It doesn't say anything about adding crew.

[Jonny K]

Another update. First, I learned that mis-typing a key while in compressed time mode is pretty bad. Ooops, I hit D. Oops, my sub is destroyed in an instant. So don't do that.

Anyway, I'm on a new campaign on my first patrol. I didn't add any new crew, and I've done most of the trip on the surface. In the middle of the night I found a ship and spend an hour or so tracking and then sinking it. Then I sunk another. Then I sunk a war ship without even looking (fired and then dived). Then I evaded the other war ships. It's getting interesting. I still haven't made it to my patrol area, I'm maybe 50% of the way there and down 25% fuel. I'm not sure how I'm going to make it back again at this fuel burn rate.


Jonny K

[Gargamel]

P: Takes you to periscope depth.
C: Takes you to 70 meters, very quickly.
D: Takes you deeper until you tell him to stop. If you don't tell him to stop, he won't.

A: Maintain Depth.

Forgot to mention HOW to make him stop Steve! :yeah:

[Gargamel]

Another update. First, I learned that mis-typing a key while in compressed time mode is pretty bad. Ooops, I hit D. Oops, my sub is destroyed in an instant. So don't do that.

Anyway, I'm on a new campaign on my first patrol. I didn't add any new crew, and I've done most of the trip on the surface. In the middle of the night I found a ship and spend an hour or so tracking and then sicking it. Then I sunk another. Then I sunk a war ship without even looking (fired and then dived). Then I evaded the other war ships. It's getting interesting. I still haven't made it to my patrol area, I'm maybe 50% of the way there and down 25% fuel. I'm not sure how I'm going to make it back again at this fuel burn rate.


Jonny K

pssssst.... check a lot of the other recent "Hey Im new!" threads for a lot of your questions! :DL

Fuel shouldnt be a major concern in this game, especially if your using GWX, as they increased the boats ranges to correctly match their real life ranges (the flat map plays havoc with distances).

Go get the Fuel efficiency mod. It'll set the ahead 1/3 command (2) to run at your most efficient screw speed (even if you dont, sail at 1/3). You should really be able to sail for 45-60 days before running out of fuel. Normally, you'll run out of ammo first, or be damaged enough that you have to RTB.

[Sailor Steve]

I still haven't made it to my patrol area, I'm maybe 50% of the way there and down 25% fuel. I'm not sure how I'm going to make it back again at this fuel burn rate.
Second speed setting, or 7 knots in a Type II, 10 knots in a type VII. You'll get there with more than 2/3 of your fuel left.

A: Maintain Depth.

Forgot to mention HOW to make him stop Steve! :yeah:
A: CTD

I always click on the guage to pull out of a dive.

I didn't forget anything.:O:

[Gargamel]

Really? Never had that problem.

I'll be careful using it then, and yeah, 99% of the time I just click the gauge, so the dive officer doesn't have to reverse the dive, come up and then level, he can just level out at the new assigned depth.

[Tinman764]

Some other things to avoid that I've read can cause trouble. Don't save your game while your submerged and don't use the preset station buttons (surface cruise etc), apparently both are a cause of crashing the game. I've never experienced either myself, but I've made a point of avoiding them since I read about the issues.

[Jonny K]

I'm still not at my destination, but I've sunk another bunch of ships. On the last ship I fired three torpedoes in rough water, only one hit. I'm now completely out aside from a single external torpedo, and I assume I can only access in calm waters. I can't man my external guns because of the rough water. So my last option was to try ramming the ship (which was busy burning, but still driving along at 5 knots). Several ram attempts failed as well. Oh well, I guess I have to give this one up. Grrrr. Now I have to finish my mission in stealth only.

[Gargamel]

Ramming is a last ditch thing. I can't really think of a scenario where I would. The ships can detonate taking you with them, even if you are a few hundreds meters away. Not to mention the damage done to your boat in the ramming.

Just follow it, and wait for the weather to clear. Some ships just take a long time to sink.

Historically, you can't load torps from the outside during rough weather. The game doesn't model this restriction though. Most players just play by the rule that if you can't man the guns, you can't load eels.

[Jonny K]

Ok, finished the patrol. Everything went well on the way back except docking. Of course, the instructions don't tell you how to return to base, just that you must. So, I returned to base and parked my sub in the sub bay. Parking a sub is tricky business, but I managed it after 20 minutes of careful rudder and engine work. After I'm in the bay my sub rubs on the walls and I get hull damage. :-/ But I still can't figure out why the mission didn't end. I'm as docked as I can be. Then I learn I have to hit esc to end the mission. :damn:

Another curious thing, after the mission I was awarded about 800 renown. I had sunk 3 merchant ships and 2 warships. On the other hand, when I had done a patrol yesterday and encountered no ships at all I was awarded 500 renown. I somehow expected to get much more renown for sinking all those ships.

Anyway, not bad, though it's a massive time sink so I won't be able to play very often I'm afraid. As for the boat ramming, I received no damage even though I hit it fairly hard. Funny that rubbing on the wall in the sub bay does more damage than ramming a ship.


Jonny K.

[Gargamel]

Renown is based on the type of ship you have sunk and your total tonnage. Having hull damage also lowers your renown earned. There's multiple threads on here about which ships give the most renown, etc etc.

When you get close to base, just hit esc, and click return to base or Dock At:. You dont need to actually park the boat, although some choose too. I usually wait till I'm "home free" on my return leg before doing so.

[mookiemookie]

Several ram attempts failed as well. Oh well, I guess I have to give this one up. Grrrr. Now I have to finish my mission in stealth only.

:rotfl2: And now you know why submarines don't ram their targets. A submarine is a very fragile unarmored boat. In real life, any sort of damage to the exterior of the boat could render it unable to dive.


I'm maybe 50% of the way there and down 25% fuel. I'm not sure how I'm going to make it back again at this fuel burn rate.
The faster you go, the faster you burn fuel. Keeping it to around 9 or 10 knots should ensure you have enough fuel to get to your patrol area, patrol and get back



Anyway, not bad, though it's a massive time sink so I won't be able to play very often I'm afraid. As for the boat ramming, I received no damage even though I hit it fairly hard. Funny that rubbing on the wall in the sub bay does more damage than ramming a ship.


Don't forget that there's single missions. They start you out with ships in front of you, so there's none of that patrolling and docking stuff involved.

[Sailor Steve]

I'm as docked as I can be. Then I learn I have to hit esc to end the mission. :damn:
Oh, one more thing - you have to hit Esc to end the mission.
:rotfl2:

Sorry about that. We're so used to it that none of us thought to tell you.

On the other hand, if you're really pressed for time you don't have to drive home at all. You can hit Esc wherever you are, and select the 'Return To Base' option. You're supposed to earn extra renown for making the journey, but reliable sources say that part has never worked. Many of us do it anyway, because it feels right, but don't let that sway you if your time is limited.

Another curious thing, after the mission I was awarded about 800 renown. I had sunk 3 merchant ships and 2 warships. On the other hand, when I had done a patrol yesterday and encountered no ships at all I was awarded 500 renown. I somehow expected to get much more renown for sinking all those ships.
Were any of them by chance neutral? If you sink a neutral ship you are docked the same renown you would have earned had they been enemy ships.

[Pisces]

...
"If you upgrade your U-boat before the first patrol of a new career, you may not receive any renown for ships sunk during the first patrol, so you should not upgrade or change anything on your U-boat on your first patrol of a new career before leaving port."

It doesn't say anything about adding crew.Theoretically you are correct. But it states not to change any-thing on your U-boat. Aside from that it explains the one occurrence I had of not receiving renown after a succesfull 1st patrol, I only added an experienced officer. So from then on I take it as it was given to me at a 1st patrol.

[Pisces]

In my experience you can get a few 1000 more kilometers from your tank in a Type VII Uboat by going at 8 knots. That's the best range at speed that I found. (Ask the navigator for endurance at current speed when speed settled on different speeds) But since you have plenty of fuel anyway to go most places in the north atlantic, 8 knots might take too long to get there. In the interest of Blitz-krieg you might indeed want to speed up a bit.

[desirableroasted]

In my experience you can get a few 1000 more kilometers from your tank in a Type VII Uboat by going at 8 knots. That's the best range at speed that I found. (Ask the navigator for endurance at current speed when speed settled on different speeds) But since you have plenty of fuel anyway to go most places in the north atlantic, 8 knots might take too long to get there. In the interest of Blitz-krieg you might indeed want to speed up a bit.


Fuel is the last thing you will run out of in stock or GWX. All the boats in the game are figured to run best at around 200 rpm. Stick to that and you have fuel for weeks.

[desirableroasted]

:rotfl2: And now you know why submarines don't ram their targets. A submarine is a very fragile unarmored boat. In real life, any sort of damage to the exterior of the boat could render it unable to dive.

I always liked the CSS Hunley's approach of dragging a torpedo behind on a rope, diving under the target, then popping her from the other side. Wouldn't that freak out the Black Swans?

[Jonny K]

A few comments:

1. Ramming - Yeah, not something I would normally do, but I had a ship here that was on fire and barely floating, but wouldn't sink after 30 minutes or so and kept on going. I had hoped that a light touch would make the difference. When a light touch didn't do any damage to either of us, I tried a harder touch. Now I learn that ramming really isn't a tactic (nothing happened). I really wish I could force my dudes to man the gun. The water wasn't very rough at all from what I saw, and if I said "Ok dude, either you man the gun or we ram our boat into their boat" I'm sure the guy would jump on there no prob.

2. Yes, at low speed you have quite a bit of range I learned. But wow, submarines are slow things. I never expected that a sub would spend months traveling at a few knots just to go somewhere and patrol for 24 hours and then return again. Even modern subs are somewhat slow. Crazy.

3. It would be so nice to have an option in the game that says "auto-rotate people between rest and duty", and an option that says "auto-man the stations when I push the red alert button, but hang out in the crew quarters otherwise". I'm sick of dragging dudes around. I hear the fatigue thing gets better with time, we'll see how long I can hold out before I just force it off.

4. After the mission I have some medals that I can give some people in my crew. Is there a strategy on how to do this? Do I want to just give them to my highest officers to try and extend their performance, or do I want to give them to lower dudes to boost them up?

5. I don't think I sunk any neutral ships. All of them showed red on my map. By the way, what does it mean if the marker on a ship is orange or yellow when viewed through the periscope?

6. If anybody has an archive of that community manual I could still use it, and I would be able to put it back online with a new website for future use (if that helps).


Jonny K

[frau kaleun]

Ok, finished the patrol. Everything went well on the way back except docking. Of course, the instructions don't tell you how to return to base, just that you must. So, I returned to base and parked my sub in the sub bay. Parking a sub is tricky business, but I managed it after 20 minutes of careful rudder and engine work. After I'm in the bay my sub rubs on the walls and I get hull damage. :-/ But I still can't figure out why the mission didn't end. I'm as docked as I can be. Then I learn I have to hit esc to end the mission. :damn:

*pumps arm*

YES!

I am now not the only person to have done this!

Actually I kept backing the boat in and out of the pen thinking there was some magic spot I had to hit in order to signal to the game that I was really and sincerely docked. :oops:

[Gerald]

*pumps arm*

YES!

I am now not the only person to have done this!

Actually I kept backing the boat in and out of the pen thinking there was some magic spot I had to hit in order to signal to the game that I was really and sincerely docked. :oops: Well,in and out can be hard, :O:

[MILLANDSON]

Well,in and out can be hard, :O:

That's what he said...

I mean she, SHE! Obviously we don't get up to anything like THAT during our weeks and months alone, in an all male crew, on-board a glorified sardine can, heavens no! Red blooded men who only crave drink and women, that's us sailors!

>.>

<.<

Do you think they believed me?

[desirableroasted]

A few comments:

1. Ramming - Yeah, not something I would normally do, but I had a ship here that was on fire and barely floating, but wouldn't sink after 30 minutes or so and kept on going.... I really wish I could force my dudes to man the gun

30 minutes is nothing; they can take hours. If the wind is over 7knts, you can't deck gun. There is a mod for deck-gunning in all weather, but you still shoot very poorly in high winds/rough seas.


2. Yes, at low speed you have quite a bit of range I learned. But wow, submarines are slow things. I never expected that a sub would spend months traveling at a few knots just to go somewhere and patrol for 24 hours and then return again. Even modern subs are somewhat slow. Crazy.

Not sure what you expect; that's how fast they were. At any rate, it doesn't take "months:" even at 8knts you are making nearly 200 nautical miles a day. Very few players here spend just 24 hours on station... a week or two seems to be the norm.

3. It would be so nice to have an option in the game that says "auto-rotate people between rest and duty",

Yep, but we don't have it. Use SH3 Commander to get past that... as a captain you wouldn't be moving your crew around, anyway.

After the mission I have some medals that I can give some people in my crew. Is there a strategy on how to do this?

Medals help with fatigue, though not a great deal. Again, SH3 Commander gives you full control over medals, promotions, etc.

5. By the way, what does it mean if the marker on a ship is orange or yellow when viewed through the periscope?

It means the gyroangle for a torpedo shot is unfavorable or poor (the colors are green, yellow, orange, red). You want your torpedoes to come pretty much straight out of the tube, without having to veer. The colors indicate how much of a veer it will have to take. Green is gyroangle 355-005, but anything between 345 and 015 will generally work. Note that the colors have nothing to do with AOB, which is a far more important consideration.

[Sailor Steve]

Theoretically you are correct. But it states not to change any-thing on your U-boat.
Well :O:

Aside from that it explains the one occurrence I had of not receiving renown after a succesfull 1st patrol, I only added an experienced officer. So from then on I take it as it was given to me at a 1st patrol.
You could be right. As I said my first patrol of any new career is always a quick tour of the harbor, so effectively I never have that risk.

[Jonny K]

Ok, another update. I went to try and sink some subs at full realism, just playing the torpedo tutorial. And then I got stuck.

1. I can't make out the darn flags on ships. And even when I can see it somewhat, I don't know what countries the flags represent! I think I found the flag of the Republic of China. Riiiight. :hmmm:

2. The names of countries on the recognition manual are all in German! I can make some out, but others I'm lost.

3. I flipped through my little picture book of ships for pretty much every country and didn't find a single ship that looked similar to the one I had targeted.

Now I'm busy looking at mods. I need something to crank the resolution and improve these textures! I haven't been able to even start targeting.

[Jonny K]

GAH! I finally learned I want to look in the "Handelsschiff" section of my manual for Merchant Ships, and I was able to download an image from some mod somewhere that decodes the flags and who is my actual enemy. :damn:

[Pisces]

...
Another curious thing, after the mission I was awarded about 800 renown. I had sunk 3 merchant ships and 2 warships. On the other hand, when I had done a patrol yesterday and encountered no ships at all I was awarded 500 renown. I somehow expected to get much more renown for sinking all those ships.
...

Jonny K.I forgot to respond with the following. The amount of renown you receive is also in a large part dependant on the realism level. It's not linear. Meaning you still get a reasonable amount of renown if you have 1% realism. There is a formula for renown and realism factor hidden deep in the forum, I'm sure. But where!?

[Jonny K]

I'm getting more hardcore. I've installed the Grey Wolves mod and it does make significant improvements to the game, and I'm now learning how to manually target and actually hit stuff (and have my hits explode instead of bouncing off).

I would have never expected to be so involved in this game a few weeks ago when I first bought it, but suddenly I'm a submarine geek. People at work are starting to wonder about me as I rave about torpedo strategy and U-Boat history. :)

[mookiemookie]

I'm getting more hardcore. I've installed the Grey Wolves mod and it does make significant improvements to the game, and I'm now learning how to manually target and actually hit stuff (and have my hits explode instead of bouncing off).

I would have never expected to be so involved in this game a few weeks ago when I first bought it, but suddenly I'm a submarine geek. People at work are starting to wonder about me as I rave about torpedo strategy and U-Boat history. :)

Exactly how it happened with me, man. Sink 'em all!

[frau kaleun]

Exactly how it happened with me, man. Sink 'em all!

I think most of us can file that one under "been there, done that." :haha: :yeah:

[desirableroasted]

I'm getting more hardcore. I've installed the Grey Wolves mod ... I would have never expected to be so involved in this game a few weeks ago when I first bought it, but suddenly I'm a submarine geek. People at work are starting to wonder about me as I rave about torpedo strategy and U-Boat history. :)

I live on a cliff on the ocean... and every day look out with the scope and calculate tonnage, distance, and AOB. If they only knew what I am plotting.

[Sailor Steve]

I guess I'm in pretty rare company then. I was a naval geek as far back as 1960, and pretty much fell in love when Silent Service was released back in 1985. I first found Silent Hunter in 1998, two years after its release.

[Jonny K]

Ok, two new questions.

First, the recognition manual with GWX has multiple entries for some ships with different measurements. Is this correct, and if so which is which? I found a thread that mentions one being for "lit" and one for "not lit" but what does that even mean?

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=149396&highlight=recognition+manual+multiple


Second, I was playing the convoy training mission. I fired two torpedoes and then dove to escape. The two convoy war ships started tracking me and dropping depth charges. Then suddenly one ship attacked and destroyed the other before resuming the hunt for me. Huh? Is this a bug or what?

http://i.imgur.com/VHaMe.jpg


Thanks.

[Pisces]

Yes, they did that very often when I played the convoy academy mission. I'm not sure what the cause is. Last year it was discussed again in some thread, and there was a pretty plausible reason for it, but I forgot exactly. I write it down to one somehow received damage by depth-charges or direct gunfire (aimed at you) of the other and changed allegiance. (which it does only temporarily for 24 hours) Either ignore them or make use of the confussion.

[mookiemookie]

Lit ships are neutrals. Don't fire on them. Unlit ships are usually fair game. There can be unlit ships flying neutral flags. Not sure why they have two separate entries in the recognition manual, but you can treat them as the same.

Your other problem seems like a funny bug. I bet that's exactly what happened - one got hit by the other's depth charge and went batsheet crazy.

[Jonny K]

Another update. I just sunk my first ship playing at full realism in a new campaign with the Grey Wolves mod. Most excellent. I identified the ship, tracked it, intercepted it, identified the nation (I had to be super close for this), calculated a firing solution, fired a single torpedo which hit, and then finished the job with the deck gun!

A few new questions:

A radio message bearing "SSS" is an "SOS", right?

How do I know the best places to hit a ship? Is there a guide that tells me where different components reside on different ships?

Is there a reason why I'd want slow or medium speed torpedoes instead of fast other than to time multiple shots on multiple targets? For a single target would I just use the fastest speed? Does this cause more of a trail on the surface?

When I'm given a patrol what if I go sink a bunch of ships and then return without going to my patrol sector. Is that a problem?

Is there a faster way to identify a nation's flag without spending an hour tracking the ship only to learn after all that time that it's a friendly ship?

I tried the resolution mod, it messed up the mouse screen edge barrier on the right and bottom of the screen. Was there any fix for this? I never found one.

Thanks!

[Pisces]

Another update. I just sunk my first ship playing at full realism in a new campaign with the Grey Wolves mod. Most excellent. I identified the ship, tracked it, intercepted it, identified the nation (I had to be super close for this), calculated a firing solution, fired a single torpedo which hit, and then finished the job with the deck gun!Well done. Little Grey cubs growing up fast. ;)

A few new questions:

A radio message bearing "SSS" is an "SOS", right?'Yes, but remember those messages are immersion only.


How do I know the best places to hit a ship? Is there a guide that tells me where different components reside on different ships?Stock SH3 actually has a neat 'cheat'. If you got close enough and had the periscope pointed up front (or gyroangle near zero/green solution) then you would see colored rectangles in the recognition manual, signifying vulnerable areas. (un)Fortunately it has been removed in GWX because it is too simple. Aside from that they completely overhauled the damage system with more emphasis on flooding. But the vulnerable areas still exist, you just have to think logically. i.e. where would ammo-storage likely be located? Where would the engine room be? Fuel is more trickier. Hmm, how do I break it's 'back'. But try to make as many compartments flood as possible, that speeds up sinking. Either hit it with multiple torpedos at different parts of the hull, or fire one at a place that hit multiple sections. Hint: Cranes are not located on the lids of the compartments but onto..... ;) Finding weak-spots is mostly trial and error. Especially if you have a ship added by a mod, you cannot be sure that the modder also took care of the damage sections. Often they just copy a unit and focus on the 3d model.

Is there a reason why I'd want slow or medium speed torpedoes instead of fast other than to time multiple shots on multiple targets? For a single target would I just use the fastest speed? Does this cause more of a trail on the surface?Good question if it leaves more of a bubble trail. Don't know if it becomes more dificult for the AI to detect. Slower speed does mean longer range. But for long range shots beyond 5km you need really really accurate target speed. So it's hardly a selling point. A slower torpedo means the TDC needs to aim it with bigger lead. In some cases this can be useful if you want to hit a far away target in a convoy, without a closer ship taking the bullet for it.

When I'm given a patrol what if I go sink a bunch of ships and then return without going to my patrol sector. Is that a problem?Nope, none whatsoever. Except if you feel like you should stick to historical militaristic realism. Orders are orders. But if you don't have torps left, what else is there to do?

Is there a faster way to identify a nation's flag without spending an hour tracking the ship only to learn after all that time that it's a friendly ship?You can cheat by using the free movable camera, but I guess that is a no-no for you too. I don't think so. Not without mods that provide super-zoom optics. You can get the colored icons back in GWX, but that is also somewhat cheating.

I tried the resolution mod, it messed up the mouse screen edge barrier on the right and bottom of the screen. Was there any fix for this? I never found one.

Thanks!Sorry, no experience. I prefer to let my graphics driver scale the 1024x768 screen up to native, with aspect ratio. It's a fuzzy look on my 1920x1080 screen, but works with all mods and circles remain circles instead of ellipses.

[Mittelwaechter]

Is there a reason why I'd want slow or medium speed torpedoes instead of fast other than to time multiple shots on multiple targets? For a single target would I just use the fastest speed? Does this cause more of a trail on the surface?

Fast setting is good for 5000 meters, medium setting for 7500 meters and slow for 12500 meters. 'Fast' was not used by U-Boats as I understand it, but by German E-boats/Schnellboote and Destroyers. I never realized a difference in the length of the bubble trail.
The slow setting is formidable for stand off attacks - especially with pattern running FAT or LUT torpedos as they do not need to be aimed precisely.

[mookiemookie]

Another update. I just sunk my first ship playing at full realism in a new campaign with the Grey Wolves mod. Most excellent. I identified the ship, tracked it, intercepted it, identified the nation (I had to be super close for this), calculated a firing solution, fired a single torpedo which hit, and then finished the job with the deck gun! Well done! After playing the game for 5 years, I still don't use manual targeting. The whole "angle on bow" calculation was always too much trouble for me.



A radio message bearing "SSS" is an "SOS", right? "SSS" was an SOS radio message meaning "sub spotted". But as Pisces said, the radio messages don't necessarily correspond to what's going on in the game world. The GWX team took real life radio messages and put them in the game at their corresponding historical dates. So if you get a radio message from U-whatever radioing back in to BDU that they're sinking or what have you, that means that U-whatever really did sink on that date and send that message. But there are also other scripted events in GWX that model reality that you're going to get radio messages about, like the invasion of Norway.

There's mods floating around that take out the extraneous radio messages and just leave the stuff that you actually have to worry about. Search for the "WB News Network" mod if you're interested.

How do I know the best places to hit a ship? Is there a guide that tells me where different components reside on different ships? Under gun turrets and under smokestacks are usually good places to aim. That's where ammo bunkers and engine rooms would be, respectively.

[desirableroasted]

Is there a reason why I'd want slow or medium speed torpedoes instead of fast other than to time multiple shots on multiple targets? For a single target would I just use the fastest speed? Does this cause more of a trail on the surface?

The speed does not affect the trail. And AI merchants don't see trails: they will watch one coming from a mile off and not twitch. AI naval ships, however, do see them, and react. Escorts will try to evade, then turn on you. Capital ships in convoys will try to evade, but won't turn on you.

Because I rarely need variable speeds (it's easier to do "set off" shots by stopwatch), I find electrics perfectly adequate. Then I don't have to worry about some pesky, sharp-eyed escort spotting a trail. I do keep a gas-powered in Tube 4, though, in case I need to make a fast snap-shot.


When I'm given a patrol what if I go sink a bunch of ships and then return without going to my patrol sector. Is that a problem?



Not in GWX, as there is no renown award for going to your patrol area (however there is an easy modification you can make that will award it).

Even so, for realism, I go to my assigned station 7-10 days.

[Gargamel]

I like to keep 2 air, and 2 electrics loaded. I use the electrics only when I need a stealth shot, and use air for most other shots. Especially when the target is zig zagging, having high speed eels gives you a little more edge in range, but not much.

[kapuhy]

Slow torpedoes are great when attacking multiple ships in a convoy - after launching last torpedo you have more time to dive deep and change position before ships start blowing up and the escort start their counterattack. First place where they look for you is the area from which torpedoes came, so you don't want to be there now.

Fast torpedoes are good for lonely merchants that have noticed your boat and started zigzagging. It's hard to calculate torpedo solution for those, so instead you just close to point blank range, turn towards the target and launch a fast torpedo. It's a naval equivalent of putting a gun to the Agent's head and muttering "Dodge THIS!".

[stokeyblokey]

I like to keep 2 air, and 2 electrics loaded...

Same here early on but as soon as I can get my hands on a type IV or type V then I drop one of the electrics so Tube 4 always has a "save my bacon" shot ready...I found the longer I played the game the more I used the old G7a instead of the electric eels, although a mixed loadout is always sensible :up:

[TwoGamers]

Going half-way across the world is a bad idea and in order to avoid battleships just watch the updates down thwe bottom this will tell you what to do:ping:

[Sailor Steve]

Going half-way across the world is a bad idea and in order to avoid battleships just watch the updates down thwe bottom this will tell you what to do:ping:
If you're counselling the original poster, he hasn't been on this board in well over a year.

[Steve Gad]

I too am having the fatigue problems - over 2 years after my comrade here - but I am trying to minimize the amount of helpful tweaks I tick in SH3 Commander. Having said that I am going to turn fatigue off as I want to enjoy the sim, not be plagued by moaning sailors, nagging me to pull into Pearl Harbour for a weekend break every ten minutes. :-))

I may be alone on this one, but (with the exception of the maddening navigation of Kiel - even with auto nav on) I find just roaming around waiting for something not to happen, to be quite satisfying. I stand on the conning tower in choppy North Sea swells, collar turned up, oilskin hat tilted to jaunty angle, wet cigarette dangling from chapped lips, and I'm as happy as one of the 7 dwarves.
I'm a complete rookie of course (And it shows. When I appear, all hands hit the deck of the ship I'm engaging, to stand,doubled up with laughter!) but as a veteran of Falcon (F-16 with the 600-page manual and Everest learning curve) and also Combat Flight Sim, so I'm used to patrols that aren't exactly thrilling every outing. Why I didn't buy this Sim several years earlier is a source of some annoyance, but then again I was having a lot of fun in the air. Now, after barely a week at sea, I can't see me wanting to don the flying jacket again for a while.
I'm just loving wasting three torpedo's on a ship 50ft away, then having to run for my life with the inside of the sub looking like the rose on a watering can.
At the moment my performance borders on comedic, and my tactics (a reverse Kretschmer - six torpedoes, no ship) laughable, but as soon as I realise the torpedo attack screen isn't a picture of a spiders web, and bad language won't get the deck gun to do more damage, I reckon I could become quite good at this. In real life I'd probably be the bloke making the tea, but then again I'm only a lowly guitar player. :-))

[Steve Gad]

Going half-way across the world is a bad idea and in order to avoid battleships just watch the updates down thwe bottom this will tell you what to do:ping:

Updates? Bottom? Crumbs, I'm worse at this than I thought!! :doh: