Son of Wikileaks thread: Berlin and Moscow now in range of Iranian Missiles

[TLAM Strike]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/29/world/middleeast/29missiles.html

According to the Wikileaks via the Times North Korea transferred 19 BM-25 IRBMs (DPRK copy of N-6 SERB SLBM). With a range of 2000 miles it puts Moscow and Berlin in range of attack.

Any of the bomb shelters in Berlin still useable? :doh:

[Takeda Shingen]

Well that's not good. I don't think the Russians have anything to worry about, but Iran doesn't like western Europe very much.

By the way, nice title. Has that whole B-monster movie ring. :up:

[The Third Man]

And Obama left the Poles defenseless in the threat of Iran. U OK with that are you?

[Rilder]

So they aren't a threat?

[/crappy joke about amerikans not caring about the rest of the world]

:O:

[Skybird]

Any of the bomb shelters in Berlin still useable? :doh:

Yes. There have been more than 1000 bunkers built by the Nazis and by Speer, they represented the state-of-the-art of bunker building of that time are many of them are so robust that they are being rated as extremely tough even by modern standards: they were toughher than bunkers built by anyone else back then. After the capture of the city, several of these the Allies tried to destroy, but even with full access and preparations done without combat conditions and time pressure, they most often failed, which is true for many subterranean bunkers as well as bunker-buildings on the the surface (massively reinforced structures that before were civilian and industrial buildings). They finally gave up, somewhat frustrated. :)

Some of these bunkers are giant, using walls and ceilings of up to 4m of steel-concrete, 20 and more meters below the surface, and the first brewery in Berlin also featured subterranean halls (for storing in low temperatures) that later got used by the Nazis - this and a few other giant b unkers having the size of one or even several football fields. It looks like the mines of Moria. :D

http://berliner-unterwelten.de/guided-tours.3.1.html

Entrance points and positions of most bunkers are kept secret until today, to avoid cave tourists searching for adventure privately getting lost.

[Penguin]

Berlin is overrated anyway!

[kranz]

And Obama left the Poles defenseless in the threat of Iran. U OK with that are you?

actually our present government claims that "we never wanted this shield coz we never needed it". They are much like what Takeda said of Iran.

(feeling lucky to live in the eastern europe)

[Tribesman]

actually our present government claims that "we never wanted this shield coz we never needed it".
Funny isn't it, Third man thinks it leaves Poland defenceless against Iran yet the old proposed plan would have been useless against Iran anyway.:doh:
So.....
U OK with that are you?
Yes, absolutely fine with it as it doesn't make any difference to Poland at all

[TLAM Strike]

Well that's not good. I don't think the Russians have anything to worry about...

Yea because Russia has an ABM system. Has had one in operation since the 1960s.

I have a feeling that Europe is going to be screaming for more SM-3 equipped USN Destroyers and Cruisers to be deployed to the East Med.

[Oberon]

Would fix the Greek economy I guess... :hmmm:

Anyway, IIRC wasn't there new plans just recently to restart the missile plan but with Russia on board this time? Probably in response to the news which has been leaked.

[Skybird]

Would fix the Greek economy I guess... :hmmm:


In the wake of the Greek finance crisis and the EU bailout, it has been repeatedly pointed out that Greek maintains the biggest battle tank fleet in all NATO, second to the US only (yes, bigger in numbers than Germany, England, France or Turkey). And Germany, while complaining that it needs to bail them out - behind the stage pressed them to buy even more tanks from Germany.

The world is queer. I assume Turkey is their excuse.

[Takeda Shingen]

Yea because Russia has an ABM system. Has had one in operation since the 1960s.

Actually, I was refering to Russia's relatively friendly relations with Iran.

[Skybird]

Actually, I was refering to Russia's relatively friendly relations with Iran.

Wikileaks reveraled that China thinks of NKorea as a spoiled child, and that they have indicated they would prefer a reunification under S-Korea's leadership if the united Koreas does not set an unfriendly course against China. China also should have indicated that it would not militarily intervene in case of another Korea war.

Maybe the Russians think of Teherasn the same way: as something like a "spoiled child". Even Russians can run out of patience (although it is difficult to make them:) ).

[kranz]

Funny isn't it, Third man thinks it leaves Poland defenceless against Iran yet the old proposed plan would have been useless against Iran anyway.:doh:
So.....

Yes, absolutely fine with it as it doesn't make any difference to Poland at all

it only makes the difference with the image of foreign policy not a real threat imho. Up to 2007 we had a government who supported, let's say the "ideology" of G.Bush. So waterboarding and placing missiles was much more than appreciated. Ministers of defense and foreign policy had press conferences on the rising threat of countries like Iran, North Korea, (Russia) etc. This situation changed in 2007 and was strengthened by the election of a Democrat- Obama. Russia became a friend etc. As I said above, I doubt there was any real threat for Poland before 2007, I remember that those anti-missile facility was supposed to defend the USA and we were promised to be given a battery of Patriots which after Obama's election was turned into a "training battery".

[Herr-Berbunch]

Wikileaks probably got it's info from Tony Bliar, 45 minutes and all that... :nope:

[TLAM Strike]

Actually, I was refering to Russia's relatively friendly relations with Iran.
Yes I know, I was making an additional point. :up:

[Tribesman]

Isn't it interesting.
It appears The NYTimes (alledgedly at the request of the government) only printed half the story.....the US belief in the transfer of N. Korean origin missiles to Iran.
They didn't print the rest of the story where the "belief" was rubbished.

[Torvald Von Mansee]

Funny isn't it, Third man thinks it leaves Poland defenceless against Iran yet the old proposed plan would have been useless against Iran anyway.:doh:
So.....

Yes, absolutely fine with it as it doesn't make any difference to Poland at all

But you're missing The Big Point: Obama is ALWAYS wrong because he won the 2008 election (fair and square, even!!) and some people just can't get over it.

[TLAM Strike]

Isn't it interesting.
It appears The NYTimes (alledgedly at the request of the government) only printed half the story.....the US belief in the transfer of N. Korean origin missiles to Iran.
They didn't print the rest of the story where the "belief" was rubbished.

Link please?

[Tribesman]

Link please?
The clue is in the opening article you posted

[TLAM Strike]

The clue is in the opening article you posted

Oh this:

The London group’s report, though, gives no indication of access to the American intelligence assessment. Indeed, the report argued that while Iran had some elements of the R-27 technology, the available public evidence suggested that it had made no purchase of either the complete North Korean missile or its Russian parent.

Riiight... this group that has no evidence that the transfers took place but doesn't have access to the intel (most likely gathered by the VBSS teams that searched the transporting ships) that the people whose diplomatic messages were stolen and are now being published.

[Tribesman]

Oh this:


no, its the earlier bit about the Obama administration requesting that they only publish part of it.

Riiight... this group that has no evidence that the transfers took place but doesn't have access to the intel (most likely gathered by the VBSS teams that searched the transporting ships) that the people whose diplomatic messages were stolen and are now being published.
No its the bit about the intel in the diplomatic message that was stolen and the reports from other diplomatic and intelligence sources that were also in that stolen document.
So it isn't about them not publishing unknown evidence, its about them selectively only publishing some parts to favour their government.
It wouldn't really be as much of an issue if there wasn't a history of making false claims about weapons while suppressing all the intelligence that didn't fit the wanted public story.