Tom DeLay convicted of Money Laundering

[Platapus]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/11/24/jury-convicts-delay-money-laundering-trial/


Jurors deliberated for 19 hours before returning guilty verdicts against DeLay on charges of money laundering and conspiracy to commit money laundering. He faces up to life in prison on the money laundering charge.





Up to Life? That's a bit much. :nope:



I am glad he was tried and the evidence presented. Now that we are on a roll, how about Rangle and Waters?



Ethics hearings are great, when when laws are broken, it is time to take it out of the Legislative branch and into the Judicial Branch. :yep:


I am getting a bit tired of hearing this "well everyone does it" crap. Well if everyone does it, then everyone should have their day in court. :yep:


This goes far beyond the little Rs and Ds. We have to start holding our representatives accountable. Or we should anyway. :yep:

[Armistead]

If you tracked them all deep enough you would find more crooks than not.
The reason they don't do anything beyond censure is the crook caught would spill the beans on the rest. This is one thing the Dems and Rep secretly agree on. In the end all these crooks know they can go to private life and make millions as a lobbiest, calling on their friends. A congressman is just a lobbiest in the making.

[GoldenRivet]

I say give him consecutive life sentences.

to hell with him.

we have to get these bastards out of the mindset that they are above the law.

[razark]

Up to Life? That's a bit much.
Meh. I'm in favor of capital punishment for corrupt politicians.

Indictment or misdemeanor: loss of any leadership positions.

Conviction on a felony: removal from office, loss of any pension or other benefits.

Conviction for any sort of corruption: death.

[Bilge_Rat]

I personally doubt the conviction will hold up on appeal.

What he did, funnelling corporate contributions to the RNC in exchange for a similar legitimate contribution from the RNC may have been illegal under Texas state law (although that is debatable), but it certainly was not "money laundering" as originally intended by Congress when they adopted that law.

[Tribesman]

What he did, funnelling corporate contributions to the RNC in exchange for a similar legitimate contribution from the RNC may have been illegal under Texas state law (although that is debatable), but it certainly was not "money laundering" as originally intended by Congress when they adopted that law.
So taking money from A to give to B by shifting it through C to hide that fact as moving money from A to B is illegal.
Seems like the very definition of money laundering in anyones book.
Do you have some alternate book with a very different definition?
It wasn't the taking of illegal donations that makes it money laundering Bilge rat, its the attempt at hiding the illegal donations to make them seem like legitimate donations that makes it money laundering.

So the next question should be, will the RNC be up in court for fascilitating criminal actions?

[Bilge_Rat]

So taking money from A to give to B by shifting it through C to hide that fact as moving money from A to B is illegal.
Seems like the very definition of money laundering in anyones book.
Do you have some alternate book with a very different definition?
It wasn't the taking of illegal donations that makes it money laundering Bilge rat, its the attempt at hiding the illegal donations to make them seem like legitimate donations that makes it money laundering.

So the next question should be, will the RNC be up in court for fascilitating criminal actions?

That is one way of looking at it. Another way is this:

1. Delay's PAC received legitimate political contributions from corporate donors. This was legal under Texas law. Texas law however prevented the PAC from using that money in Texas, but Texas law did not prevent the RNC from using its own funds in Texas races.

2. The RNC made a legal donation to Texan candidates. This was legal under Texas law.

3. The Delay PAC made a legal donation to the RNC. This was legal under Texas law.

Did Delay circumvent Texas law by linking 2 and 3?, of course. Is it illegal under Texas law? That is not clear and the prosecutors did not feel their case was strong enough to proceed on that basis.

Was it "money laundering"? The money laundering laws were brought in to prevent money from the proceeds of crime, for example drug money from being "whitewashed" through the financial system and coming back out as legitimate funds.

Here all the transactions, #1, #2 and #3 are legal and it is not even clear that the linkage between #2 and #3 is also not legal. How can acts which are arguably all legal be "money laundering"?

[Tribesman]

That is one way of looking at it. Another way is this:


So you look at it by not looking at it but instead making up a fictional set of events to substitute for the real ones.


Was it "money laundering"?
It was by definition money laundering, so no "" at all.

I find it funny that you are trying to say he did nothing wrong at all and the transactions were all fine and legal.
Yet his defence lawyers representing him and being paid out of his pocket were saying that he isn't really that guilty as it wasn't him that was breaking the law in a big way as it was other people who were dealing with the washing of the money to hide its source and he was just on the fringes of the scam even though it was done through his office and by his staff.
Perhaps his lawyers had forgotten to take your approach of looking at fictional events and defending those instead of fighting the case on the evidence presented.

[jumpy]

Meh. I'm in favor of capital punishment for corrupt politicians.

Indictment or misdemeanor: loss of any leadership positions.

Conviction on a felony: removal from office, loss of any pension or other benefits.

Conviction for any sort of corruption: death.


I'd have to say for our lot over here, suitable punishment for being any of the above would merit loss of assets and an enforced period of time spent living on single person social security benefits only (ie the minimum the state says you can exist on, which over here is about £130 a fortnight), with no chance of employment anywhere else for the term. To be treated just like everyone else in the dole line - like something you just stepped in. This would apply to their immediate family also.
Might teach 'em a little humility. If it's corruption, then following prison, as determined by the law, it's back to benefits. It's a miserable, suspended existence with little chance of doing anything constructive. The plus side of this is that they'd not be able to interfere in business or politics again. Not to mention how everyone else attending the jobcentre would treat them once every two weeks.


I think our politics is convoluted, but you guys seem to have a lot of grey areas when it comes to money and politicians and business. It looks like there's a lot of 'being within the rules, but not in the spirit of the rules', the sort of thing you need at least one firm of solicitors and one firm of accountants to really get the best out of.

[Torvald Von Mansee]

All politicians are probably dirty, though some are dirtier than most.

[Tribesman]

It looks like there's a lot of 'being within the rules, but not in the spirit of the rules'
Not in this case as the paperwork sent with the money showed that the money wasn't being given to the national commitee for itself but was being moved through them to hide the real transactions.

[Platapus]

Tom DeLay Gets 3 Years in Prison for Money Laundering

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/10/tom-delay-gets-years-prison-money-laundering/#ixzz1Am6p2HtG

"Senior Judge Pat Priest sentenced him to the three-year term on the conspiracy charge. He also sentenced him to five years in prison on the money laundering charge but allowed DeLay to accept 10 years of probation instead of more prison time. "

Sounds like a reasonable sentence. Of course now come the appeal kabuki dances.

[Takeda Shingen]

http://www.onereel.org/img/pix/kabuki3.jpg

Actually, gives me an idea for a signature. Many thanks for the inspiration, Platapus!

[Tchocky]

Odd quote from DeLay.

"I can't be remorseful for something I don't think I did," DeLay said.

[Takeda Shingen]

Odd quote from DeLay.

Yeah. Like how OJ was going to find the real killer.

[August]

Yeah. Like how OJ was going to find the real killer.

You really think that the two things compare?

[Takeda Shingen]

You really think that the two things compare?

I don't think that the crimes compare at all. I do, however, think that the statements are similar due to the continued claims of innocence despite the perception of guilt, and conviction in the case of DeLay, that the public has.

[tater]

All pols need to be held tot he standard of not even appearing to do something wrong. he should have known better regardless and until he proves otherwise, he's guilty ( since he was convicted—presumption of innocence is over).

Now convict the rest of them.

[August]

I don't think that the crimes compare at all. I do, however, think that the statements are similar due to the continued claims of innocence despite the perception of guilt, and conviction in the case of DeLay, that the public has.

Well Simpson admits that a crime was committed. He just denies that he was the perpetrator. Delay denies that a crime was even committed. That's different.

[Platapus]

All pols need to be held tot he standard of not even appearing to do something wrong. he should have known better regardless and until he proves otherwise, he's guilty ( since he was convicted—presumption of innocence is over).

Now convict the rest of them.

That's what always gets my goat. In my career field even the appearance of any panky of the hanky type is enough to get me fired. It is not even necessary to prove that I have been involved in any ethical or corruption activity. Just the appearance and I am dead meat.

Why can't our politicians be held to the same standards that a minion like me is held to? :damn:

[Bilge_Rat]

As I had predicted in post #5:



WASHINGTON -- A Texas court has overturned the conviction of former House majority leader Tom DeLay in a money-laundering case stemming from the 2002 elections.

The documents were released Thursday by the Texas 3rd Court of Appeals in Austin.

"The evidence was legally insufficient to sustain DeLay's convictions," the documents said. The judges said they "reverse the judgments of the trial court" and acquit DeLay, once one of the most powerful Republicans in Congress, of all charges.

The acquittal means DeLay cannot be retried and the money laundering case is over.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/09/19/tom-delay-conviction-overturned-money-laundering/2837053/

[Webster]

Tom Delay convicted of money laundering




umm, try again, that was back in 2010 where trumped up charges were used to steal an election by slandering him and flat out lying about what really happened.

todays news is how he was proved innocent of all charges and fully exonerated of any wrong doing but the dems still got what they wanted as they destroyed his chance to be re-elected in 2010 elections.

no matter which political side you favor here is the real story: Tom Delay's conviction overturned (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2013/09/19/tom-delay-conviction-overturned-by-texas-court/)

[Wolferz]

This shows just how dirty the Republicans are. I bet the judge who acquitted DeLay is also a Republican. I guess the drug cartels can now launder their ill gotten gains through the RNC with no worry of reprisal.:-?

I feel no sympathy for the Texans who get screwed stewed and tattooed by the Repubugnicans.
Onagers forever.

[Tribesman]

Interesting opinion.
Because there was no proof that the donors knew their illegal transactions were going to be laundered into "clean" transactions there was no criminal conspiracy to launder the money.

[soopaman2]

This shows just how dirty the Republicans are. I bet the judge who acquitted DeLay is also a Republican. I guess the drug cartels can now launder their ill gotten gains through the RNC with no worry of reprisal.:-?

I feel no sympathy for the Texans who get screwed stewed and tattooed by the Repubugnicans.
Onagers forever.


As a Liberal leaner myself, to restrict things like this to republicans is unfair, the whole system is filthy. They are in bed with each other, the party strife is meant to cater to the rubes, and keep us divided against each other, rather than them.

We are being played by both sides. Just a game to make us think we got a say.

Tommy is scum, but I am sure that scumbaggery comes naturally to any man who gets to play with his "master of the free world" erector set.

(I bet the NSA will chronicle this post) *deletes his hard drive*

That damn filesharing with Gary Glitter...

[Ducimus]

As a Liberal leaner myself, to restrict things like this to republicans is unfair, the whole system is filthy.

I was about to say the same thing, but decided not to because my own words sounded hollow to even myself, and would probably be percieved in much the same way as a schoolyard verbal argument of "Oh yeah, well your momma's fat!"


They are in bed with each other, the party strife is meant to cater to the rubes, and keep us divided against each other, rather than them.

We are being played by both sides. Just a game to make us think we got a say.

However, that is a compelling supportive statement that I happen to find myself agreeing with. Of course, it also smells of conspiracy! Which opens the door to ridicule. In any event, our two party system is definitely not interested in anything but maintaining said two party system, and the status quo. Would it be a far stretch in saying the two parties feed off of, and nurture each other?



Tommy is scum, but I am sure that scumbaggery comes naturally to any man who gets to play with his "master of the free world" erector set.

Indeed. All too many professional politicians think themselves as our betters, and not as public servants.


(I bet the NSA will chronicle this post) *deletes his hard drive*

That damn filesharing with Gary Glitter...

They probably record everything. You want to not be in the NSA's database, your gonna have to live your life like it's the 1980's.

[Stealhead]

That damn filesharing with Gary Glitter...
:hmmm:

[kraznyi_oktjabr]

umm, try again, that was back in 2010 where trumped up charges were used to steal an election by slandering him and flat out lying about what really happened.

todays news is how he was proved innocent of all charges and fully exonerated of any wrong doing but the dems still got what they wanted as they destroyed his chance to be re-elected in 2010 elections.

no matter which political side you favor here is the real story: Tom Delay's conviction overturned (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2013/09/19/tom-delay-conviction-overturned-by-texas-court/)Dates, Webster, dates...


BRAAAINZZ!!!

:D

[soopaman2]

:hmmm:

I am so glad you caught that obscure off color joke.


Trust me, those got nothiing on Pete Townshends research files.

Yeah I know alot of musicians!:O: