First post at subsim, Q about SHIV

[capnandrew]

Hey everyone, if you want to skip my intro/biography/novel, scroll-down until you see the bold, underlined statement and read from there:

Been visiting Subsim for a while, because there are a lot of fantastic reference materials and guides for Dangerous Waters (TMA!!! Grrr!), which is one of two subsims that I currently play. I'll bet you can guess what the other one is, and why I've posted in this particular forum. :) I finally gave in to temptation and created an account so I can join the forum community.

Anyway, Dangerous Waters is great gameplay and not-so-great graphics. I'd been looking at the Silent Hunter series but my old computer was . . . old, and since I've purchased a new(er) one, I wanted to give Silent Hunter IV-Gold edition a try.

And I'm loving it. I almost bought Silent Hunter V instead, but I wasn't sure my PC could handle it. I'd rather have slightly poorer graphics that don't lag, versus an awesomely detailed slideshow. I did a "can you run it?" check at systemrequirementslab.com, and it showed that I met the requirements for SHV, but I don't have a lot of faith in this factory graphics card.

After several evenings of playing SHIV, I finally discovered last night how to use the torpedo computer in manual aiming, and started consistently scoring 3/4, sometimes 4/4, hits on the Mogami (?) h. cruiser in the torpedo school 'training' mission. (the game's tutorials are lousy, though, and what kind of sadistic naval school sends its greenest cadets up against a real enemy vessel that fires back? :nope:).

On to my question:

I was doing the Convoy Attack "training" mission, and I'm trying to figure out if there is any way to 'mark' targets in the radar scope.

Sonar is easy, all you do is send a ping and there's a button to send the range to the torpedo computer. Bearing is easy to get as well, using passive sonar.

But when it comes to radar in this game, I find myself constantly flipping between A and PPI radar stations and the navigation map to try to chart the location of the enemy vessels. It sure would be nice if there's a way to do this in one click of the mouse, like with sonar. I'm sure that Dang.Waters spoiled me, because in that game, you just mark the target twice using radar and get the range, bearing, speed, and heading of the enemy surface ships (even though it alerts them to your presence) uploaded to your navigation screen.

Certainly, radar operators would have known how to do this in WWII. Am I overlooking something? A hotkey to mark radar contacts? Any button that I'm overlooking? All I ever hear is long-range, medium range, short range (I don't have those measurements on my ruler!), but at least the radar operator gives me a bearing.

[Sailor Steve]

WELCOME ABOARD! :sunny:

I'm currently only playing SH4 with u-boats and Op Monsun, so I can't help you with radar. I don't think anything is automatically marked on the map, but I could be wrong. Someone will be along to help. Can't guarantee how soon though.

At any rate, it's nice to have you posting.

[capnandrew]

Well, thanks for the greeting. I haven't gotten around to any of the mods yet.

I realized that you can look at one radar scope while tilting the point of view over towards the other radar scope, and work the dials and such from both stations. I guess it never occurred to me to try that before, thinking most of it was just for looks. Do'h!

That cut down on my time to find the range and bearing instead of trying to keep clickin back and forth between the two views (sometimes, I figure my radar man kept going behind my back and screwing up my settings).

Now my crew is going to have to stay out of my way as I keep running back and forth between the deck gun and the radar scope.

Just out of curiousity, I tried to engage the convoy in the "training" mission with the deck gun from 14,000 yards (~6.9 nm). I'd fire off about 5-6 rounds as quickly as possible, pause the game, switch to camera and move the camera to focus on the ship I was trying to hit, then unpause to see what happens. I had a couple of near misses on a freighter (out of 70 shells, heh), but it's practically impossible to do with a rolling deck. Even if I were to hit something, it'd have to be a really lucky shot to do any damage.

[Freiwillige]

6.9 miles! About a mile is my limit and that's stretching it! You know how WWII Destroyers were terrible gun platforms cause they would get thrown around in heavy seas? Submarine's are much worse!!!!!:yep:

Anyways welcome aboard!

[WernherVonTrapp]

Welcome to the forum, capnandrew, glad to have you aboard. Forgive me if I don't answer your question correctly but I will offer some ideas based on what I interpret as your issue.;)
With the PPI surface radar, if you operate the radar yourself, you will always detect a "blip" on the screen before the AI crewman does. I guess this is in order to simulate superior experience on the part of the sub skipper, or something. Anyway, what is happening is that you are detecting a contact before it is actually in range (to a degree that the radar can detect accurately). Eventually, it will show up on the map screen and you'll be able to begin your course plot. If I detect a radar contact in such a way, I often begin switching between the radar screen and the TBT/periscope, scanning the area where I believe the contact lies. Sometimes (during clear daylight), I get a visual and lock on the target. This places an icon, for a few seconds, on the map screen from which I begin drawing my plot line, making adjustments as necessary.
There is a mod available (don't have the link off-hand) that allows you to send radar contacts to the TDC. I'm sure one of the members can post a link for you soon.
Hope this helps some.:salute:

[Armistead]

If you're playing with contacts on, you'll see ship icons and sonar lines. I assume you're playing stock...cough choke...and think stock shows blue for war, black for merchants. If contacts are on, make sure you set radar to the furthest range. As stated, eventually ships will come and you can draw lines plotting there course.

You should check out the sticky at the top "Skipper bag of tricks..."

Subs would never shoot that far. I've done the same thing, but you're not gonna get a lot of hits. I don't pause at long range, I'll shoot go to binocs and watch, adjust range. At that range it can take several shots to home in. In reality most subs never did anything close to that. Read of a few attacks at 6000 yards, but most were against small unarmed or lightly armed merchants, staying out of their machine gun range.

[capnandrew]

@Werhner:

Hmm. I didn't even think about using the TBT. I'll have to give it a try. And I'll definitely have to look into getting that mod.

But, would radar have been used in WWII primarily for detection-purposes only, or would they have tried to use it to create firing solutions (use for targeting)?

I went back and worked with the radar again to build my confidence and managed to use it to blow a small junk-type boat out of the water within 4 shots, from about 2,800 yards, very calm seas. Of course, real enemy ships would just shrug it off and that'll be the end of me.

I do wish the PPI radar screen 'ruler' had more measurement tick-marks. It takes some really good "guesstimation" to try to get an accurate reading as to where that spike is. I'm telling ya. Dangerous Waters ruined me, lol. I have a whole new respect for the WWII submariners who couldn't just launch salvos upon salvos of cruise missiles from 200 miles away and call it a day.

@Freiwillige

I definitely don't waste ammo like this when I'm trying to do a serious career/quick mission. I was just looking for a "safe" place to do some target practice. It was actually safe, for a while. No destroyers broke off from the convoy to see where the shells were coming from, until I got well within visual-I.D. distance. As for destroyers being a terrible gun platform, it is so true!!! OF course, it doesn't help that they're steaming towards me at flank speed hurling shells at me while zig-zagging. I'll just chug along at 4-5 knots putting about 70% of my shells in the enemy's bridge and fore gun turrets. I assume damage is modeled correctly for the shells. Armored-Piercing shells seem to do a fair bit more damage when the enemy is facing you dead-on and your shells hit in the fore-deck area, just above the hull, ripping through the entire length of their ship and coming out somewhere near the props.

Is it the TMO mod that makes escorts something to actually fear? I might be looking for a challenge once I learn the in's and out's of this game.

[capnandrew]

Thanks Armistead. I was wondering what those lines meant. I had been trying it with contacts off (default by the "very difficult" rating) until last night, when I changed it so I could get an external camera. Nothing ever showed up, obviously. The captain has many abilities over his crew in this game, but drawing squares on the navigation map with direction indicators is not one of them. Being the poor artist that he is, "x" will have to symbolize many things.

And yep, I'm playing stock. Just trying to get the hang of things before diving in with any modifications.

[Sailor Steve]

@But, would radar have been used in WWII primarily for detection-purposes only, or would they have tried to use it to create firing solutions (use for targeting)?
Battleships and cruisers of the era had dedicated fire-control radar. They also had dedicated fire-control computers. Smaller and less sophisticated systems were developed for destroyers, but submarines were too small to carry the required equipment.

[Captainchaos]

Hi Capnandrew, I`m only about your level doing the convoy tutorial..
I would try the TMO 2.0 mod with easier AI OPTIONAL MOD + 3000yd bearing tool & TMO max optics mods.

Quite simple to install if you follow the instructions & chop & change to something else if you want.

They really make a huge difference to the stock game :03:

I would try with contacts on at first, external camera is great but i prefer it off as you can still see the torps course with the attack nav map, plus you get at least a line denoting where the targets courses are.

[I'm goin' down]

Nigeis 3D TDC and Radar Range Fix mod will enable you to play with map contacts off. It takes a lot of time to master, and slows the pace of the game considerably. His thread is in the Mods forum.