View Full Version : Opponents Are "Patriots" Not "Enemies"
The Third Man
11-01-10, 09:18 PM
This is Obama wide and clear. It is also why his agenda is being rejected.
Obama says
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/10/26/obama_to_latinos_punish_our_enemies.html
Boehner (next # 3 for president) responds
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/11/01/boehner_to_obama_opponents_are_patriots_not_enemie s.html
The Third Man
11-01-10, 11:07 PM
It is why democrats will lose and why Obama's presidency will be deminished....if that is possible!!!
I hope for many congressional investigations into our least known president....Barry.
AVGWarhawk
11-02-10, 08:26 AM
TTM...if the Republican take control they will need to deliver the goods. If not, in 2 years the Repubs will lose again. In all reality the Repubs are looking to undo 2 years of what Obama has done. It will take 2 years to accomplish that!
I think this election helps Obama, actually. It will moderate him as it did Clinton. The US is a centrist country. Gridlock forces bipartisanship, which means centrism, which is why this last Congress was a such an unmitigated disaster (supermajority).
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 09:41 AM
I think this election helps Obama, actually. It will moderate him as it did Clinton. The US is a centrist country. Gridlock forces bipartisanship, which means centrism, which is why this last Congress was a such an unmitigated disaster (supermajority).
The last Congress was a disaster because of stuff like this:
http://i.imgur.com/o8jCW.png
The problem is that lately the GOP has taken such a turn to the hard right that their view of "centrism" is skewed. And you can forget bipartisanship - the tone is to oust any "moderate" Republicans who are viewed as frauds and pretenders. If you don't meet some ideological purity test, you're shunned.
I had a woman tell me that she believed any Republican that broke ranks with the party in a bipartisanship vote should be kicked out of the party. What an idiot.
Was an imaginary snow plowing bill really the best example you could have come up with to prove your point Mookie? :)
As for ousting centrist members isn't that what the Democrats have been doing lately to the Blue Dogs?
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 09:58 AM
Was an imaginary snow plowing bill really the best example you could have come up with to prove your point Mookie? :) It illustrates exactly how the past two years have transpired and it proves my point exactly.
As for ousting centrist members isn't that what the Democrats have been doing lately to the Blue Dogs?
Does that make it right?
SteamWake
11-02-10, 10:37 AM
The dulcid tones of Hillary Clinton...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxmpTMGhU0
Anyhow Barry probably thought he was in safe territory being on Univision. He found out otherwise.
Obama, in an interview with talk radio host Michael Baisden, said, "I probably should have used the word 'opponents' instead of enemies."
He was backtracking from a comment he made a week ago in an interview with Univision radio in which he sought to persuade Hispanics to vote for Democratic candidates instead of Republicans.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE69929420101101
Webster
11-02-10, 11:45 AM
I think this election helps Obama, actually. It will moderate him as it did Clinton. The US is a centrist country. Gridlock forces bipartisanship, which means centrism, which is why this last Congress was a such an unmitigated disaster (supermajority).
obama has shown he has the temperment and judgement of a spoiled 2yr old child and will only pout and stomp his feet, complain endlessly, never compromise, and blame everyone but himself.
he has shown he will never compromise or try to get along, hell even with the big losses the democrats know are coming, just a few days ago in a speech he told republicans they had to get to the back of the bus :o
he sure likes to play the race card a lot and makes racist comments for someone who said he is supposed to be post racial
It illustrates exactly how the past two years have transpired and it proves my point exactly.
An imaginary story proves no point. I'll grant you that it might help illustrate a point that you are trying to make (though a real life example would be far better) but it "proves" nothing.
Does that make it right?
Of course not. But you said "The problem" like it's all the fault of those ebil republican obstructionists. If the GoP is drifting right then it's at least partially in response to the Dems drifting left as illustrated by the (real life) disowning of the Blue Dogs.
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 11:56 AM
obama has shown he has the temperment and judgement of a spoiled 2yr old child and will only pout and stomp his feet, complain endlessly, never compromise, and blame everyone but himself.
Never compromise? The whole reason everyone on the left is mad at him is because of excessive concessions to the other side, in some misguided attempt at bipartisanship. Never compromise indeed. :roll:
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 11:58 AM
An imaginary story proves no point.
Wow. Just wow.
Skybird
11-02-10, 12:03 PM
The tea party will not be enough to get the Republicans back to power in 2 years. I see them being destructive due to the hate they add plenty of fuel to, and I suspect plenty of racism in their rows, too. The tea party is the storm troopers of the Republicans - great to maximise damage and destroy consensus and denying victory to Obama - but unable to bring up a person whom a reasonable, sane mind would possibly dare to imagine to lead a complex business like that of governing a world power. In the end, much of the rethorics of the tea party is as primitive as is the collection of sticks caveman had in his mountain hole.
So, in prinmciple Obama should be a meal ready to eat in two years, he cannot win by his own example anymore. But just damaging his reputation and sowing hate and controversy and vitriolic vibes, Palin, O'Donell and the likes are doing, is not enough to win the presidency for the Republicans. So, Obama can win in two years: by the Republicans defeating themselves when they do not put the tea party on the short line in time, and present a candidate that is acceptable to more than just the hardcore fans of Palin et. al. Which means he must be a moderate, by republican standards. And finding such a name holds the potential to rip the extremist and the moderate wing in the R-party apart.
Short while ago, Schwarzenegger predicted that Obama will be reelected in two years, right becasue of the Republicans inability to find and present an acceptable name to lead them, and to keep the tea party in check. I currently think time will show him to have assessed things correctly. The tea party is what makes the Republicans ineligibale for too many people that are swing-voters and have no loyalty-by-habit for any of the parties. That way, the tea party can become a present for the democrats, helping them to collect votes.
I have the impression that many Ameicans still think that with just some "correct" decisions being made, things will improve magically and the US will oick up the world game where it has left it short time ago, and things will be like they have been before. As long as it is not understood that this is infantile a hope and that in fact already a totally new game with new rules has begun in which the US can play a role, but in no way as dominant a role anymore as it did over the past decades, I see no chance for substantial reparis and imprivements and chnages in the American system. Of one thing I am certain: the old ways Americans - and Europeans as well!!! - have gotten used to, do not work anymore and never will work again. The longer one tries to stick to this fallacy, the worse things will become.
That is in two years. For today, what else is there to be expected than a massive defeat for the democrats. Anything else but that would be a big surprise.
Webster
11-02-10, 12:40 PM
Never compromise? The whole reason everyone on the left is mad at him is because of excessive concessions to the other side, in some misguided attempt at bipartisanship. Never compromise indeed. :roll:
well then name one thing the republicans wanted to do that he has gone along with and compromised on?
the left is mad at him because he hasnt been able to FORCE all the democrats to go along with his plans to destroy america free enterprise system and install european socialist goverment already and now they see they are about to loose the power they had to ram that through against the will of the people.
obama's idea of compromise is if you go along with what i want then we will let you take some of the credit for it.
compromise is about give and take yet obama will never take ANY ideas from republicans and will never give in on getting his way on everything.
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 01:13 PM
well then name one thing the republicans wanted to do that he has gone along with and compromised on?
I can name several off the top of my head: no single payer healthcare, no public option, extending Bush tax cuts for some, expansion of offshore drilling (before the BP clusterfook) and the D.C. school vouchers program.
SteamWake
11-02-10, 01:21 PM
I can name several off the top of my head: no single payer healthcare, no public option, extending Bush tax cuts for some, expansion of offshore drilling (before the BP clusterfook) and the D.C. school vouchers program.
Wow.. uhh... :hmmm:
We will all end up in single payer programs because our current providors cannot compete (by design). Obama has even expressed a desire to do just that.
If the current admin. could end the Bush tax cuts without having hail holy mary unleashed they would do so in a hearbeat.
The BP clusterfook... clouldent have said it better myself.
I dont see a lot of 'comprimise' here.
Wow. Just wow.
It's no real surprise that you find the concept incredulous. :roll:
Webster
11-02-10, 01:34 PM
If the current admin. could end the Bush tax cuts without having hail holy mary unleashed they would do so in a hearbeat.
they did just that by not voting to extend them they will ALL expire Jan 1st even those for the middle class so by doing nothing the ended All the Bush tax cuts.
them saying they will do it in a lame duck session after the elections is a smoke screen because they get just what they wanted (higher taxes) by just doing nothing about them.
they did just that by not voting to extend them they will ALL expire Jan 1st even those for the middle class so by doing nothing the ended All the Bush tax cuts.
them saying they will do it in a lame duck session after the elections is a smoke screen because they get just what they wanted (higher taxes) by just doing nothing about them.
Doesn't really matter I think. The incoming Congress will extend them long before anyone has to pay.
"Healthcare" was the unmitigated disaster.
The healthcare bill that I guarantee no one who voted for completely understands (they couldn't possibly given the "pass it yesterday!" time frame) is a trojan horse for single payer.
It's a massive cluster*******, and will hurt healthcare delivery, and providers. It does nothing to solve the problem in the US which is NOT people uncovered. The real problem is COST (and in flyover states, lack of docs and nurses). This bill will increase costs for people that actually pay for healthcare (the insured). Will, not might. Why? Adding medicaid patients (tens of millions) costs providers money out of pocket. They must get rate increases from the insured, or be unable to stay in business. They'll also do everything possible to avoid seeing medicaid. Sadly, specialists who need to work in hospitals (surgeons) cannot avoid medicaid since they get those deadbeats when they are on call (they're not all deadbeats, but the % of medicaid deadbeats is way higher than non-medicaid).
Doesn't really matter I think. The incoming Congress will extend them long before anyone has to pay.
New congress can't do squat, frankly. Obama has veto.
Anything passed will have to be bipartisan.
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 03:22 PM
It's no real surprise that you find the concept incredulous. :roll:
The fact that you can't grasp the concept of a humorous fiction that uses real life themes to illustrate a point is indeed incredulous.
AVGWarhawk
11-02-10, 03:35 PM
I vote McRib.
Bubblehead1980
11-02-10, 03:47 PM
I think this election helps Obama, actually. It will moderate him as it did Clinton. The US is a centrist country. Gridlock forces bipartisanship, which means centrism, which is why this last Congress was a such an unmitigated disaster (supermajority).
Obama is too much of a ideologue to do a "move" to the center.Clinton did not really move to the center, he just made it appear so.Okay on a few things like welfare reform he did but that was just to make it look so.Clinton is a far left fool BUT he liked being President more than anything, thus why he gave in on some things.Obama will prob not even try that because as said he is too much of an ideologue, feels that sort of thing is beneath him and as he has shown, could care less what the people want.
Bubblehead1980
11-02-10, 03:57 PM
The last Congress was a disaster because of stuff like this:
http://i.imgur.com/o8jCW.png
The problem is that lately the GOP has taken such a turn to the hard right that their view of "centrism" is skewed. And you can forget bipartisanship - the tone is to oust any "moderate" Republicans who are viewed as frauds and pretenders. If you don't meet some ideological purity test, you're shunned.
I had a woman tell me that she believed any Republican that broke ranks with the party in a bipartisanship vote should be kicked out of the party. What an idiot.
Bipartisanship is overrated and part of the problem.When you have two groups who's principles are at absolute odds with one another, you can not compromise.Those who do compromise when it goes against what they really believe are a weak, spineless breed and have NO place in the GOP.I'm glad to see the RINO's gone.Just too bad we couldn't purge McCain out of the party but oh well I guess.
Mookie, I agree the anyone who says someone should get the boot for simply breaking ranks is wrong, maybe even an idiot.However, if they claim to be a Republican/Conservative but often vote for things are are contrary to the principles of a Republican/Conservative then they become a RINO and should be given the boot.Breaking ranks now and then unless on a big issue like health care is acceptable.I often disagree with fellow Republicans and Conservatives on issues such as gay marriage, religion, etc but it makes me no less a Republican or Conservative.However, if I claimed to be one and supported Obama and the Dems on fiscal issues or healthcare, then my principles are obviously not strong and I am in the wrong party.
RINO's like Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins, John McCain etc Governor of Florida Charlie Crist is a great example of a RINO, claims to be a "moderate" lol but a damn RINO and thus why he lost the Primary to Rubio and is way down in the polls for Senate since he switched to Independent.Some tolerance for the occasional different view on issues can be shown but people who are regular offenders should be shunned and in this new era for the party, they prob will and that is a great thing.
Bubblehead1980
11-02-10, 04:00 PM
obama has shown he has the temperment and judgement of a spoiled 2yr old child and will only pout and stomp his feet, complain endlessly, never compromise, and blame everyone but himself.
he has shown he will never compromise or try to get along, hell even with the big losses the democrats know are coming, just a few days ago in a speech he told republicans they had to get to the back of the bus :o
he sure likes to play the race card a lot and makes racist comments for someone who said he is supposed to be post racial
lol duh because he is racist, I knew this before 2008 after reading his books.The man's racism has came to light in various comments and incidents(such as copgate) Obama is also someone who has used his race his ENTIRE life as a means to get in the door someone then as an excuse if something does not work out.Just a disgusting trait(flaw) he has as a human being. +
The fact that you can't grasp the concept of a humorous fiction that uses real life themes to illustrate a point is indeed incredulous.
:roll: This is what you said Mookie:
It illustrates exactly how the past two years have transpired and it proves my point exactly.
Now either admit that you were wrong again or start your usual backpedaling.
mookiemookie
11-02-10, 06:30 PM
Nothing to admit I'm wrong about. The fact that it obviously went over your head isn't worth me wasting anymore time trying to explain it to you Dr Seuss style. This is a ridiculous discussion.
Now either admit that you were wrong again or start your usual backpedaling.
I see you've started your usual snippy and petty comments. We're done here.
Clinton was forced to the center by the congressional change. New congress won't get credit for anything positive by the media, Obama will. Similarly, if things don't improve, the same media will blame the new congress (except maybe the one media outlet that is not left of center—and they'd do the opposite to the dems if the shoes were on the other feet.).
Bottom line is that any success of the new congress will make Obama more electable in 2012.
Nothing to admit I'm wrong about. The fact that it obviously went over your head isn't worth me wasting anymore time trying to explain it Dr Seuss style.
No I understand it perfectly. If I or another conservative had tried to use a fictional story to "prove" a point we were making you would be all over us about it but when we call you on it you resort to personal insults. Yeah I get your drift man.
I would, but you've beat me to it by starting your usual snippy and petty comments
Oh I'm being snippy and petty but you making Dr Seuss comparisons is the complete opposite of that right? I guess you are having a bad night politically but just that's no reason to be rude robin.
The made-up story is pretty silly. There must be some real example to point to, no? There are in the other direction, the dems spent years during Bush with policies that essentially consisted of being contrary to W. I'm sure Rs have done the same as well.
Still, a RL example makes a point that someone's goofy facebook post (so the internet tells me when I search that image (which only shows at chan4chan when I did a search) does not.
krashkart
11-02-10, 08:32 PM
I vote McRib.
I vote "french fries with pepper".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2n7yOkeFJMM
SteamWake
11-02-10, 08:58 PM
Clinton was forced to the center by the congressional change. New congress won't get credit for anything positive by the media, Obama will. Similarly, if things don't improve, the same media will blame the new congress (except maybe the one media outlet that is not left of center—and they'd do the opposite to the dems if the shoes were on the other feet.).
Bottom line is that any success of the new congress will make Obama more electable in 2012.
Bet you 20 bucks Obama doesent moderate. Its not in his blood.
Bet you 20 bucks Obama doesent moderate. Its not in his blood.
HE won't moderate, but the governance of the country will moderate, and he'll get credit by the media as the President.
See what I mean? No matter what the results are specifically tonight, the Ds no longer have supermajorities that allow them to dictate policy at will. Nothing controversial will pass at all. So at the least the bleeding stops, and BO gets credit, even if it's just congress. It helped that Clinton was smart enough to claim ownership over stuff congress did...
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