View Full Version : Justice? 40 year sentance for Omar Khadr!!... maybe not
SteamWake
11-01-10, 01:02 PM
GUANTANAMO BAY NAVY BASE, Cuba —
A military jury on Sunday gave teen terrorist Omar Khadr a 40-year prison sentence for killing an American commando in Afghanistan, but the sentence was merely symbolic — the United States already had agreed to limit Khadr's prison time to eight years, and Canada last week said it would allow Khadr to serve the bulk of his sentence there.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/10/31/102932/jury-sentences-child-soldier-to.html
As long as he stays for the 8, that's fine. I have no sympathy for the kid's family, but honestly, even on account of age they should give him some sort of chance. And in general, I am not a fan of combatants being tried unless they had actually commited war crimes. Like it or not, killing a soldier on the opposing side isn't exactly against the common sense of war...
However pro-Khadr I would never be. Especially having heard what his female relatives here in Canada have to say, I'm very much inclined to shake my head.
Bubblehead1980
11-01-10, 02:04 PM
So a terrorist kills a US commando and gets 8 years? Outrageous, damn bleeding heart Liberals.The SOB should do every day of the 40 years.Yet another reason to oust the Liberal Regime in tomorrow and in 2012.
antikristuseke
11-01-10, 02:20 PM
What acts of terror had that kid perpetrated?
Was he wearing a uniform, and rank insignia? If not, he's not a regular combatant, they should have shot him.
Bilge_Rat
11-01-10, 02:38 PM
Was he wearing a uniform, and rank insignia? If not, he's not a regular combatant, they should have shot him.
no, but Drone operators, CIA personnel, even some special forces personnel do not wear uniforms while on duty. The US government had to rewrite the rules so they could try Kahdr, but not cover U.S. personnel.
I have no sympathy for his actions, but accusing a 15 year old "child soldier" of "murder" for actions on a battlefield is over the top. How will the U.S. react in the next war when U.S. POWs in enemy hands are convicted of "murder"?
US POWs will have their heads hacked off on the internet, full stop. That's what this enemy does.
My solution to the gitmo problem is to cease taking prisoners. Shoot up the building, then nuke it from orbit, just to be sure ;)
Bilge_Rat
11-01-10, 03:03 PM
actually, we are the suckers here. After he serves 1+ years in the U.S., he will be transferred to a Canadian jail where, under the very liberal canadian laws, he will be eligible almost immediately for parole. :o
On the plus side, they live on Toronto...:D
the_tyrant
11-01-10, 03:08 PM
This guy should have been tortured to death(like the terrorists on 24)
after all, this guy isn't protected by international law
the army is going soft:nope:
edit: this guy should have been killed on the spot, since he isn't protected by international law
At least eight years should he sit, and it is already low, given the circumstances
TLAM Strike
11-01-10, 03:24 PM
no, but Drone operators... do not wear uniforms while on duty.
Excuse me?
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/6972/predatordriver.jpg
^Note uniform (flight Suit) detailing name, unit and affiliation.
Bilge_Rat
11-01-10, 03:45 PM
Excuse me?
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/6972/predatordriver.jpg
^Note uniform (flight Suit) detailing name, unit and affiliation.
That looks more like a gamer playing Falcon 4...:D
Here is the exact quote (I was writing from memory):
The centerpiece of the charges was not a conventional terrorism offense — targeting civilians — but killing an enemy soldier in combat. Usually in war, battlefield killing is not prosecuted. But the United States contended that Mr. Khadr lacked battlefield immunity because he wore no uniform, among other requirements of the laws of war.
The uniform issue also led to a scramble by the Obama legal team to rewrite commission rules on the eve of a hearing for Mr. Khadr. Because Central Intelligence Agency drone operators also kill while not wearing uniforms, the team rewrote the rules to downgrade “murder in violation of the laws of war” to a domestic law offense from a war crime to avoid seeming to implicitly concede that the C.I.A. is committing war crimes.
Moreover, child soldiers are almost never prosecuted for war crimes. That meant that the world coverage of Mr. Khadr’s case was dominated by questions about whether the case was appropriate. On Monday, for example, Human Rights Watch said the United States “should never have pursued the case” because convicting someone of war crimes for actions taken as a juvenile for the first time since World War II “sets a terrible precedent.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/26/us/26gitmo.html?scp=2&sq=omar%20khadr&st=cse
the_tyrant
11-01-10, 04:02 PM
Wikipedia told me that this guy killed a wounded solder
If i remembered correctly, that in itself is a war crime
That is weak, sorry.
The CIA drone pilot is not on the battlefield. The purpose of uniforms and rank, etc, is to distinguish combatants from noncombatants to minimize harm to the latter. The DRONE, OTOH, was certainly wearing a "uniform" that positively IDed it as an asset of the US, clearly distinguishing it from, say, an airliner. The DRONE is the combatant. Claiming the operator needed a uniform is like claiming that an infantryman's BRAIN should wear a uniform inside his skull.
What is on the BATTLEFIELD is what matters. being out of uniform in Virginia, has exactly zero bearing on the rules of war, and their purpose.
Wikipedia told me that this guy killed a wounded solder
If i remembered correctly, that in itself is a war crime
Didn't see anything about killing wounded soldier.
the_tyrant
11-01-10, 04:38 PM
Didn't see anything about killing wounded soldier.
He has spent seven years in the Guantanamo Bay detention camps accused of war crimes and providing support to terrorism after throwing a grenade that fatally wounded a US soldier
from my best friend wikipedia:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omar_Khadr
Edit: sorry, my mistake
I read it as "a grenade on fatally wounded a US soldier"
Bilge_Rat
11-01-10, 05:13 PM
That is weak, sorry.
The CIA drone pilot is not on the battlefield. The purpose of uniforms and rank, etc, is to distinguish combatants from noncombatants to minimize harm to the latter. The DRONE, OTOH, was certainly wearing a "uniform" that positively IDed it as an asset of the US, clearly distinguishing it from, say, an airliner. The DRONE is the combatant. Claiming the operator needed a uniform is like claiming that an infantryman's BRAIN should wear a uniform inside his skull.
What is on the BATTLEFIELD is what matters. being out of uniform in Virginia, has exactly zero bearing on the rules of war, and their purpose.
perhaps...but the U.S. government's lawyers were worried enough that they rewrote the law, ...sorry "rules", just before the trial, ...sorry "hearing", to make sure the charge would only apply to that particular defendant.
I am usually a defender of U.S. actions and motives, but the "trials" at Guantanamo are as fair as what you would expect from a political trial in Russia. I hope the damage to the reputation of the U.S. around the world was worth it just to convict this kid.
from my best friend wikipedia:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omar_Khadr
Edit: sorry, my mistake
I read it as "a grenade on fatally wounded a US soldier"
No worries, mistakes happen, just making sure I didn't miss something. :salute:
I hope the damage to the reputation of the U.S. around the world was worth it just to convict this kid.
No one won't even remember this a month, two later.
krashkart
11-01-10, 05:31 PM
Khadr will. He'll remember every wrong that was done to him, everything that was denied him that he should have had to save his eyesight, everything that was done during interrogation to aggravate the pain of his injuries. If he didn't already hate the West, he has plenty of reason now.
Call them POWs, and keep them until AQ unconditionally surrenders to us. THEN try any that are actually "war criminals."
Until AQ formally surrenders, they stay locked up.
Bubblehead1980
11-01-10, 06:34 PM
What acts of terror had that kid perpetrated?
What acts of terror had that kid perpetrated?
This scum threw a grenade and killed a US soldier, he is a terrorist or insurgent, whatever you want to call him.One word describes him best...ENEMY.They should've just took him out on the battlefield.Not a kid or child soldier, this trash was 15 and knew better but chose to do so.So while a good man fighting against garbage like this "kid" is dead, the murderer gets off easy with 8 years and most of that in Canada where he will no doubt be treated well and released one day.I would bet $1,000 that he will return to the fight and we will hear about him being killed or capture again someday.Muslim terrorists/insurgents etc are like sex offenders, no hope for rehabilitation, just can not fix anything that screwed up.
There ARE good and bad people in this world, you are incorrect.Who said I find life a problem? Life has worked out well for me thus far.I just hate the "soft: view some people have taken towards some terrorists/insurgents etc.
I just hate the "soft: view some people have taken towards some terrorists/insurgents etc.
So the alternative is to dehumanize them? Good going, I see that fight for democracy and human rights is going as planned...
He's in one of two categories. He's either a soldier, or he's a criminal. If he's a soldier, and he's been captured, you hold him as a prisoner of war. If he's a criminal, you give him a trial.
Decide which one he is, and follow through. There's rules in place for handling POWs, and there are rules in place for handling criminals. Determine which he is and treat him accordingly.
He's in one of two categories.
And therein perhaps lies the problem. The fact is that a lot about this war is in grey areas, whereas the law and public opinion prefer to put it in one-or-the-other boxes. In modern circumstances, imho this approach is rather ludicrous and barbarian.
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