NATO Airstrike in Pakistan..

[SteamWake]

Source: Reuters

KABUL, Sept 30 (Reuters) - NATO aircraft crossed the border into Pakistan on Thursday morning and killed "several armed individuals", the alliance said in a statement, after Pakistan said a cross-border airstrike killed three border guards.

Cant wait to see the UN reaction to this.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/SGE68T0IB.htm

[The Third Man]

Does anyone else think this idea of using NATO as political cover a travesty? I want to know the nationality of the attacking aircraft.

[Tribesman]

Cant wait to see the UN reaction to this.

Forget the UN reaction watch the Pakistani reaction.
The coilition can say goodbye to nearly 600 trucks of supplies a day.

[The Third Man]

An interesting chart detailing the NATO contributor's spheres of influence. Most Euro countries are far away from the problem zones.


http://www.isaf.nato.int/images/stories/placemat_jul17b.jpg

[The Third Man]

Well this explains why this conflict has been going on for such a long time.


On 11 August 2003 NATO assumed leadership of the ISAF operation, turning the six-month national rotations to an end. The Alliance became responsible for the command, coordination and planning of the force, including the provision of a force commander and headquarters on the ground in Afghanistan.



http://www.isaf.nato.int/history.html

[Tribesman]

Well this explains why this conflict has been going on for such a long time.

The reason this conflict has been going on for such a long time is that some pillock in washington tried to do it on the cheap and then went and diverted the effort to go and play silly buggers in the middle east

[Dowly]

An interesting chart detailing the NATO contributor's spheres of influence. Most Euro countries are far away from the problem zones.


http://www.isaf.nato.int/images/stories/placemat_jul17b.jpg


Six of the hottest hot spots in Afghanistan from 2009:

Baghdis
Herat
Farah
Helmand
Kandahar
Kunduz

From those 6, only one area doesn't have euro troops in it. So, what be your point? :hmmm:

[The Third Man]

Six of the hottest hot spots in Afghanistan from 2009:

Baghdis
Herat
Farah
Helmand
Kandahar
Kunduz

From those 6, only one area doesn't have euro troops in it. So, what be your point? :hmmm:

My point is the euros are no smarter than the US. But I still think hiding behind the NATO umbrella is a cop out.

[joegrundman]

Third Man

why don't you volunteer, go to afghanistan, and sort it all out. Emit your deadly Conserva-Rays at the bad guys or something.

[Happy Times]

The strike was most likely made by US or UK attack helicopter.

The Pakistanis have been whining lately a lot about these incursions to their country by ISAF forces.
F*ck em!!:arrgh!:
If they want to be considered a sovereign nation they might want to stop harboring terrorists.

[The Third Man]

Third Man

why don't you volunteer, go to afghanistan, and sort it all out. Emit your deadly Conserva-Rays at the bad guys or something.

I would but Mr. Obama said it was the 'right' war so the 'Conserva-Rays' wouldn't work in the shadow of the Nobel Prize winner for peace, Barack Obama, as he wages war. Europe is to blame for this now. You gave Obama a peace prize for nothing.

Take responsibility for your own BS for once.

[Dowly]

I would but Mr. Obama said it was the 'right' war so the 'Conserva-Rays' wouldn't work in the shadow of the Nobel Prize winner for peace, Barack Obama, as he wages war. Europe is to blame for this now. You gave Obama a peace prize for nothing.

Take responsibility for your own BS for once.

See, Sweden, now the whole Europe is getting the blame for something you started! Just keep your great ideas to yourself from now on. AND BRING ME A SAMMICH! :stare:

[The Third Man]

See, Sweden, now the whole Europe is getting the blame for something you started! Just keep your great ideas to yourself from now on. AND BRING ME A SAMMICH! :stare:

I started nothing. Many US citizens died on Sep, 11 2001 in the name of Islam.

Why would I listen to you? Just keep your great ideas to yourself from now on. There. It means just as much.

And looking through some of your older posts Dowly, Catholic priests have nothing on you. So you have no high ground on which to stand. disgusting.

[Takeda Shingen]

And looking through some of your older posts Dowly, Catholic priests have nothing on you. So you have no high ground on which to stand. disgusting.

What older posts?

[Dowly]

@TTM

I wasn't talking to you, I was talking to the swedes and it was mean't to be a joke. :doh:

[The Third Man]

@TTM

I wasn't talking to you, I was talking to the swedes and it was mean't to be a joke. :doh:

OK.

[Takeda Shingen]

I still want to know about these older posts. Moreover, I want to know how you know about them.

[Dowly]

Moreover, I want to know how you know about them.

Good question, actually. :hmmm:

[The Third Man]

When will the next 'NATO' airstrike occur? This is an election year in the US after all.

[Takeda Shingen]

Ya done tripped up this time, @mbassador.

[Happy Times]

When will the next 'NATO' airstrike occur?

Hopefully soon, those Pakistani "border patrols" are part of the problem.

[The Third Man]

Hopefully soon, those Pakistani "border patrols" are part of the problem.

I'm not sure which border patrols you speak of, but a few B-1s, B-52s could smoke some of them out. Remember bomb realease is 5-9 miles from the target.

[HunterICX]

And looking through some of your older posts Dowly, Catholic priests have nothing on you. So you have no high ground on which to stand. disgusting.

Oh...Hello CastleBravo

HunterICX

[Skybird]

Those supply lines through the territory of an ally of the Taliban obviously are a weakness in Western battle order. It should be adressed by deleting that dependency, to eliminate the resulting vulnerability. Deleting an identified own vulnerability, is just logical. Allowing to depend on the good will and cooperation of an enemy (which Pakistan is), is foolish.

Will not happen, I know. Nevertheless - if one were serious about the war that is what should be done. - If one were serious about the war.

[Dowly]

Those supply lines through the territory of an ally of the Taliban obviously are a weakness in Western battle order. It should be adressed by deleting that dependency, to eliminate the resulting vulnerability. Deleting an identified own vulnerability, is just logical. Allowing to depend on the good will and cooperation of an enemy (which Pakistan is), is foolish.

Will not happen, I know. Nevertheless - if one were serious about the war that is what should be done. - If one were serious about the war.

Right you are. But I wonder, would that stop Taliban from just moving to the next country and operating from there. :hmmm:

[Happy Times]

I'm not sure which border patrols you speak of, but a few B-1s, B-52s could smoke some of them out. Remember bomb realease is 5-9 miles from the target.

I was referring that the Al Qaeda and Taleban forces are camping next to Pakistani "border guards".
They probably help them strike at coalition forces or even participate in the strikes.

Some carpet bombing and gunship patrols would add nicely to the drone attacks.:salute:

[The Third Man]

Those supply lines through the territory of an ally of the Taliban obviously are a weakness in Western battle order. It should be adressed by deleting that dependency, to eliminate the resulting vulnerability. Deleting an identified own vulnerability, is just logical. Allowing to depend on the good will and cooperation of an enemy (which Pakistan is), is foolish.

Will not happen, I know. Nevertheless - if one were serious about the war that is what should be done. - If one were serious about the war.

My understanding is that the logistics come through Russia. Uzbekistan/Tajikistan. Which is why NATO was so calm about Russia's conflict in Russian Georgia.

[Happy Times]

Right you are. But I wonder, would that stop Taliban from just moving to the next country and operating from there. :hmmm:

Taliban is Pashtun movement mostly and Pashtus have the most tribal culture in the planet. It is very much tied to the area they live in so Taliban as such can not change countries like Al Qaeda.

[Happy Times]

My understanding is that the logistics come through Russia. Uzbekistan/Tajikistan. Which is why NATO was so calm about Russia's conflict in Russian Georgia.

He is talking about Taleban and Al Qaeda supply routes.

[Dowly]

Taliban is Pashtun movement mostly and Pashtus have the most tribal culture in the planet. It is very much tied to the area they live in so Taliban as such can not change countries like Al Qaeda.

Ah, didn't know that. Thanks for clarifying. :salute:

Guess I then switch the word "Taliban" to just "Terrorists". :O:

[The Third Man]

He is talking about Taleban and Al Qaeda supply routes.

I think that is the idea behind the Nobel Prize winner. If it works so much the better. But if it's like his domestic policy, it is a loser.

But that is what the world gets for Americans voting for hope and change.

[Happy Times]

Ah, didn't know that. Thanks for clarifying. :salute:

Guess I then switch the word "Taliban" to just "Terrorists". :O:

But all Pashtun are not Taleban, its just some of the tribes.
We are allied with the tribes that produce heroin and like homosexual pedophilia against those tribes that want to destroy all infidels and give support to Al Qaeda.

Sweet place isnt it.:D

[The Third Man]

But all Pashtun are not Taleban, its just some of the tribes.
We are allied with the tribes that produce heroin and like homosexual pedophilia against those tribes that want to destroy all infidels and give support to Al Qaeda.

Sweet place isnt it.:D

So the POTUS has aligned himself behind a losing effort?

[Diopos]

He is talking about Taleban and Al Qaeda supply routes.

No he's talking about the western forces supply routes. And the vast majority of their supply comes via Pakistan (link (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=98197682)). The fact that NATO is fighting a war without secure supply lines and evenmore without an option to secure them is just another strong indication that this war can not be won.

.

[Dowly]

But all Pashtun are not Taleban, its just some of the tribes.
We are allied with the tribes that produce heroin and like homosexual pedophilia against those tribes that want to destroy all infidels and give support to Al Qaeda.

Sweet place isnt it.:D

Oh for crying out loud. :DL

Bad guys in general, what if they just move to another country to operate from, not the taliban, not the taliban the terrorists, just BAD GUYS! Goddammit, why it's always so hard to get your farking point across around here. :haha:

[The Third Man]

Remove the source of income. Stop the flow of opium.

[Dowly]

Spice must fl- oh wait.

[The Third Man]

Remove the source of income. Stop the flow of opium.


Or allow it to flow freely. Either way the price, and the money to the enemy decreases.

[Diopos]

Remove the source of income. Stop the flow of opium.

Replace the source of income.
Stop the flow heroin/opium.
Control the funding of the "new" economy ---> influence the society as a whole. "Buy" not only political support in Kabul but in local level, too.
Not an easy plan to implement.


.

[Happy Times]

No he's talking about the western forces supply routes. And the vast majority of their supply comes via Pakistan (link (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=98197682)). The fact that NATO is fighting a war without secure supply lines and evenmore without an option to secure them is just another strong indication that this war can not be won.

.

I read it again, you are right.
Pakistan has btw threatened to close the supply after this incident.
If Pakistan changes the policy of looking the other way when ISAF forces engage Taleban and Al Qaeda, Pakistan becomes the enemy.
Fact is they dont control their own country and have strong elements that support covertly or openly the war against the coalition.
As an ally they have been practically worthless.
Looking to the future their nuclear capability should be destroyed before it can be used against us.

[Happy Times]

Replace the source of income.
Stop the flow heroin/opium.
Control the funding of the "new" economy ---> influence the society as a whole. "Buy" not only political support in Kabul but in local level, too.
Not an easy plan to implement.


.

The plan is probably to take out Taleban and then deal with the opium production, the problem is that there is no victory in sight with current policies and strategies.:D

[Happy Times]

Oh for crying out loud. :DL

Bad guys in general, what if they just move to another country to operate from, not the taliban, not the taliban the terrorists, just BAD GUYS! Goddammit, why it's always so hard to get your farking point across around here. :haha:

Bush was right about something, "Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists."
We should stand by that statement because it really is that simple.

[Diopos]

Bush was right about something, "Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists."
We should stand by that statement because it really is that simple.
Simplicity doesn't cut it. Within that context you should already have attacked Pakistan.

.

[Happy Times]

Simplicity doesn't cut it. Within that context you should already have attacked Pakistan.

.

Exactly.
Simple isnt the same as easy.

Lefties and liberals especially like to state that there is never simple answers but they have no working solutions themselfs.

If the western world doesnt want to affirm its position or defend itself in this planet it doesnt mean others will be so soft.

But hey, let it be our children that have to fight for survival, we can just kiss ass and continue pussyfooting.

[Oberon]

Probably another Drone, they've done a lot of hits in Pakistan. I guess Pakistan is too worried about drying itself out to worry about it much.

[Oberon]

Sorry...I stand corrected, apparently Pakistan has shut down the NATO convoy route through the Khyber pass.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiUOnGLKvgY

[Diopos]

Exactly.
Simple isnt the same as easy.

Lefties and liberals especially like to state that there is never simple answers but they have no working solutions themselfs.

If the western world doesnt want to affirm its position or defend itself in this planet it doesnt mean others will be so soft.

But hey, let it be our children that have to fight for survival, we can just kiss ass and continue pussyfooting.

So obviously, in order to get Al Qaeda in Afganistan, invading Iraq was the simple way of doing things?

.

[Tribesman]

Sorry...I stand corrected, apparently Pakistan has shut down the NATO convoy route through the Khyber pass.

Post #3 in the topic

[Oberon]

Post #3 in the topic

Sorry, got lost somewhere in the Dem/Rep fighting. :03:

[Happy Times]

So obviously, in order to get Al Qaeda in Afganistan, invading Iraq was the simple way of doing things?

.

Have i said i was a supporter of Iraq invasion?
I wasnt.
The most important countries to deal with after 911 were Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Iran.
They still are but im not talking about war as necessity, its more of their choosing.
Im talking about making our position clear on issues concerning our security. If they wont take them seriously but play the middle eastern double game on us they should pay the price.
Again not talking automatically about going to war but they have really gotten an easy pass with their trickery.

[TLAM Strike]

The strike was most likely made by US or UK attack helicopter.

Or mercs.

A merc chopper (http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2021767,00.html)tried to take out the leader of Al-Shabab (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Shabaab) (a Somali terrorist group).

These guys are getting better equipped every day too... :ping:

[Gerald]

Who supplies them with weapons, in the first place?

[TLAM Strike]

Who supplies them with weapons, in the first place?

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9761/gunpyreinuhurugardens2c.jpg

They sell weapons on the street over there. Finding a gun in Africa is like finding water in the Pacific ocean.

The heavy stuff they probably go though the CIA, remember Air America?

Failing that there is always Wal Mart... :O:

[Gerald]

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9761/gunpyreinuhurugardens2c.jpg

They sell weapons on the street over there. Finding a gun in Africa is like finding water in the Pacific ocean.

The heavy stuff they probably go though the CIA, remember Air America?

Failing that there is always Wal Mart... :O: :yep:

[TFatseas]

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9761/gunpyreinuhurugardens2c.jpg

They sell weapons on the street over there. Finding a gun in Africa is like finding water in the Pacific ocean.

The heavy stuff they probably go though the CIA, remember Air America?

Failing that there is always Wal Mart... :O:

That right there is a pile I'd like to look through.:hmmm:

See a few crossbows.

[Happy Times]

Who supplies them with weapons, in the first place?


Afganistan is full of weapons but new equipment is provided mainly by Pakistan and Iran, part sold and part donated.
These nice Islamic Republics that want to practice the religion of peace with their peaceful nuclear programs and not be bullied by the West. :yeah:



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