Koran burner lost his job because of that protest

[Castout]

http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/09/14/2010-09-14_koran_burner_derek_fenton_fired_from_his_job_at _nj_transit.html


Ummm though I disagree with the man's action of ripping Koran pages and burning them I think he's entitled to his own opinion and method of protest and that it had nothing to do with his job.

If somebody tore the bible or a copy of the constitution or whatever and set them afire in a Muslim Majority country or otherwise and got booted from his job because of it I'd help whatever I could to help the man get his job back.

[tater]

If he didn't burn it on the clock, what do they think is the problem?

I guess they can fire people for thinking the wrong thoughts now?

I'd have no problem with him getting fired from a private business, actually, for any reason the owner wanted. The government, OTOH doesn't have that luxury.

[ETR3(SS)]

I hope he goes to the courts with this. What a man does off the clock is his business and his alone, so long as it doesn't effect his ability to do his job. From the article it sounds like he was exercising his First Amendment right and when pulled aside by police cooperated with them. I may not have done what he did, as in burning the Koran, but that is his right as an American citizen and I say good on him for exercising that right.

[Reece]

The only thing he did wrong was to only burn one!:yep:

[Zachstar]

Good!

[Skybird]

If he didn't burn it on the clock, what do they think is the problem?

I guess they can fire people for thinking the wrong thoughts now?


Yes, we have currently a public execution running in Germany, I refer to the debate around Thilo Sarrazin (former member of the board of directors of the German Bundesbank). He is not the first one being hunted to death by the PC insanes, but his fire is burning bigger than those in the recent past. That does not chnage the fact that he has 80+% of the population behind him. PC is a tyranny established and maintained by a minority that just claims to speak for all, and lives by the phlegmatism and resignation of the real majority disliking it.

Political correctness and Islamophilia have established a censorship of thought and speech in our societies. They decide on what is correct to think, to say and to do, and if you stray from that collective duty to say and to think the wanted, the right, the only acceptable things, then they will witch-hunt you and character-assassinate you without ever needing to check your arguments, with no mercy and with their hearts pumping oh so strong in their chests with self-righteousness. But the simple truth is - they are intimidated and are in fear, so they kickjump into obedience to the bully in advance, and their cognitive dissonance makes them believing their motives were noble. Cowardly bunch of weaklings.

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/555/koranhatebibleart.jpg (http://img440.imageshack.us/i/koranhatebibleart.jpg/)
Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

[Castout]

On the topic of political correctness who is to be the judge?!

Hate that word to me it's crap.

Do you know what the word means under tyrant like Hitler?

[Flaxpants]

Political Correctness is like trying to pick up a **** from the clean end, and as Castout says, who is the judge?

I'm all for Political Incorrectness, its far more amusing and only offends those who deem themselves to be politically correct.

[Castout]

and only offends those who deem themselves to be politically correct.


:haha:

[Jimbuna]

PC....a sure sign of madness in the community.

[Takeda Shingen]

I echo the sentiment in saying that I hope he takes his former employer to court.

[FIREWALL]

Isn't New Jersey a Third World country ? :hmmm: :haha:

[SteamWake]

He worked for the state in New Jersey what do you expect. :doh:

[Tarrasque]

First Amendment doesn't come in to it.

From the sounds of it he had a code of conduct that he agreed to as an employer of the transit system - he violated that and was fired as a result.

I wonder if he had been fired due to whipping his c*** out in public, whether there would have been this thread?

Seems to be a growing anti-Islam paranoia that blames everything on it regardless of the facts or not.

[Takeda Shingen]

First Amendment doesn't come in to it.

From the sounds of it he had a code of conduct that he agreed to as an employer of the transit system - he violated that and was fired as a result.

I wonder if he had been fired due to whipping his c*** out in public, whether there would have been this thread?

Seems to be a growing anti-Islam paranoia that blames everything on it regardless of the facts or not.

It is very simple: Indecent exposure is illegal. Ripping pages from a book is not. So yes, the First Amendment has everything to do with it.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

First Amendment doesn't come in to it.

From the sounds of it he had a code of conduct that he agreed to as an employer of the transit system - he violated that and was fired as a result.

I wonder if he had been fired due to whipping his c*** out in public, whether there would have been this thread?

Seems to be a growing anti-Islam paranoia that blames everything on it regardless of the facts or not.

Ah, but even if that were the case, why should something like this be covered under the code of conduct?

[tater]

A city transit system can have a code of conduct that is explicitly unconstitutional? A code that applies to employees when they are not on the job?

[Castout]

Just want to say if he discriminated against Muslim in his work then he needs to be booted out of his job but kicking him out of his job just for protesting albeit with a controversial method is rather unfair.

Though I can understand the need to deter more people from following his lead that could cause consternation among the Muslim world.

[Platapus]

NJ transit is an at will employer so he can be fired without cause. I have been unable to find the specific code of ethics so I can't opine whether he violated it.

I also don't know the legality of burning something on the streets of NYC, so he may have violated some city ordinance.

I am sure this will all come out in the lawsuit. Suing your employer seems to be the lottery of choice for getting rich quick, it seems. :nope:

[tater]

I see no reason for the government to get involved at all in "deterring more people." They can deface whatever book they like as long as they own the book as far as I am concerned.

[Platapus]

I see no reason for the government to get involved at all in "deterring more people." They can deface whatever book they like as long as they own the book as far as I am concerned.


I agree. Unless it violates some ordinance (fire) or some other law/regulation, a person can burn any book they personally own.

Now where they can burn it may be restricted depending on the circumstances.

[Bubblehead1980]

Wish I was finished with Law School already, I would love to have this case! Just the type of case I want to handle someday.Reality is some uber Liberal PC type over him had a freak out and pushed for him to be fired.Hope he sues and wins lots of $ then burns more Quarans.

[razark]

I agree. Unless it violates some ordinance (fire) or some other law/regulation, a person can burn any book they personally own.

Now where they can burn it may be restricted depending on the circumstances.
Exactly. I'd like to see the code of ethics he supposedly violated, and exactly what action he performed that violated it.

[Tribesman]

Wish I was finished with Law School already, I would love to have this case!
Why do you hate him so much?:hmmm:

[Castout]

I see no reason for the government to get involved at all in "deterring more people." They can deface whatever book they like as long as they own the book as far as I am concerned.

That may be our ordinary folks opinion, but to some politicians trying to mend broken and sour relationship with the Muslim world it would send a wrong message if the guy was not fired. . . .at least that's the point of view I used when I wrote I can understand it to deter other people from burning more Korans.:)

But for the sake of liberty I'd support the stance that the guy should not lose his job over his method of protest. Private or public career.

Worse thing happened to Dixie chick during Bush administration because of the comments they made over the war in Iraq that resulted from the radios banning their music. I certainly respect the audacity of these women in saying what they believed in public and took the chance with their career as a consequence. I raise my hat to them! The kind of girl or women I'd love to love, one that can stand up when she believes she's right. What is there to fear even the most successful and powerful person on the planet is going the same way as the rest of the population...the grave. What to fear?! We'll all successfully die. So why not living and fighting for what we believe is right in the meantime?

Political correctness is just stupid imo . . . .and who is to be the judge of that correctness? And who is going to be the judge of that judge? And why does it keep changing with time and policy and administration? Surely there's no universal correctness!

[Torvald Von Mansee]

I'd like to be a fly on the wall if he called up the ACLU and asked for representation.

"Well...um....er...about that..."

[tater]

Worse thing happened to Dixie chick during Bush administration because of the comments they made over the war in Iraq that resulted from the radios banning their music. I certainly respect the audacity of these women in saying what they believed in public and took the chance with their career as a consequence. I raise my hat to them!

There was no "banning." It was the CHOICE of radio stations to play what they wished, and what their customers wanted. "Banning" would require that it was made ILLEGAL to play their music.

They did something stupid, and paid a price in business for it, tough crap. It should be obvious. It's not like NYC is full of country music fans. I could start a Christian band (easy, as I'm no musician, and such music sucks). Then I stand up in front of some audience and say that I think jesus is fake. How would that do for my air time on Christian stations?

Same thing. It was the market speaking, not a "ban."

[Rilder]

Honestly, if I owned a business and one of my employees started burning Korans I'd probably fire him because if I know about it he's probably vocal about his Anti-Muslim And/Or Racism and I don't need other employees/customers getting offended because of his "Beliefs" Besides I wouldn't want radicals working for me anyways. I mean Radicals of any variety.

[tater]

Honestly, if I owned a business and one of my employees started burning Korans I'd probably fire him because if I know about it he's probably vocal about his Anti-Muslim And/Or Racism and I don't need other employees/customers getting offended because of his "Beliefs" Besides I wouldn't want radicals working for me anyways. I mean Radicals of any variety.

I'd have no problem with that as you'd be a private employer, and I think hiring and firing for ANY reason should be your right. Heck, you should be able to fire a woman for not being pretty enough, or a guy for having a bad haircut.

The transit dept. is part of the government, however. They need to be held to a higher standard, and interfering with political speech by the government is unconstitutional.

I hope he cleans their clock, and never has to work again. (coming from someone against rampant lawsuits, that's saying something (I think loser should have to pay all costs in any suit, for example))

[Diopos]

He was a public servant. Don't know how this works in the US but in other countries has an additional obligation (under oath) to uphold the constitution, the law(s) and of course a defined "code of ethics". This would essentially come down to something as in: "you can express your point of view but in an appropriate manner so as not to "compromise" your work as a public servant or the agency you service". In this case, after tearing the Koran or whatever, IN PUBLIC, how would muslim citizens interact with him as a public servant? How would possible muslim coworkers cooperate with him within the state agency? :hmmm:

And it can easily go ... deeper (right to express opinion, state vs religion etc).

.

[tater]

He was a public servant. Don't know how this works in the US but in other countries has an additional obligation (under oath) to uphold the constitution, the law(s) and of course a defined "code of ethics". This would essentially come down to something as in: "you can express your point of view but in an appropriate manner so as not to "compromise" your work as a public servant or the agency you service". In this case, after tearing the Koran or whatever, IN PUBLIC, how would muslim citizens interact with him as a public servant? How would possible muslim coworkers cooperate with him within the state agency? :hmmm:

And it can easily go ... deeper (right to express opinion, state vs religion etc).

.

So anyone in Congress should not be allowed to express political thoughts?

They might come into contact later with someone who disagrees with them, after all.

[Castout]

There was no "banning." It was the CHOICE of radio stations to play what they wished, and what their customers wanted. "Banning" would require that it was made ILLEGAL to play their music.

They did something stupid, and paid a price in business for it, tough crap. It should be obvious. It's not like NYC is full of country music fans. I could start a Christian band (easy, as I'm no musician, and such music sucks). Then I stand up in front of some audience and say that I think jesus is fake. How would that do for my air time on Christian stations?

Same thing. It was the market speaking, not a "ban."

Well it was a boycott though may not be official but it's nonetheless real and who are you to judge that their opinion was deserving of punishment? It was certainly different from yours then but punishing people for having different opinion and or belief would make such judgmental people deserve to have NONE but what is subscribed to them.

And how about now telling the contrary to Dixie chicks opinion to public I dare you? wouldn't you be called stupid now and how about boycotting the fruit of your effort based on that stupidity?

Truth is America has fallen short of being called the champion of liberty. I wouldn't want to live in USA now seeing what it has become than what it was before 2001 and during the cold war. My impression is that of corruption. And it always preceded the fall of every world powers since ancient time. The external pressure was just a trigger as what's rotten inside provided the gunpowder.

[tater]

Well it was a boycott though may not be official but it's nonetheless real and who are you to judge that their opinion was deserving of punishment? It was certainly different from yours then but punishing people for having different opinion and or belief would make such judgmental people deserve to have NONE but what is subscribed to them.

And how about now telling the contrary to Dixie chicks opinion to public I dare you? wouldn't you be called stupid now and how about boycotting the fruit of your effort based on that stupidity?

Truth is America has fallen short of being called the champion of liberty. I wouldn't want to live in USA now seeing what it has become than what it was before 2001 and during the cold war. My impression is that of corruption. And it always preceded the fall of every world powers since ancient time. The external pressure was just a trigger as what's rotten inside provided the gunpowder.

It was perfectly fine.

A large % of their audience had different political opinions than they did, and they elected to insult those customers. If you insult your customers, you lose business. It was no more complicated than that.

A Christian band that insults a large enough % of their customers will lose customers. A "hip" band that starts playing, I dunno, Lawrence Welk music just like the original, will lose its hip audience. Guess what, it will not get air play on the same stations. Same thing.

It was the market speaking, plain and simple. If playing their tunes would have helped the bottom line, the radio stations would have played it.

[Skybird]

Scientifically testing which book smokes better: Bible or Quran.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQJ8woJm08c&skipcontrinter=1

:yeah: :haha:

The best reply possible in this hilarious "mass-hysteric-mandatory-collective-uproar"-project.

"I still feel sick" :haha: "Don't burn your own copy - burn somebody else's." :har:

[Tribesman]

"mass-hysteric-mandatory-collective-uproar"-

is that the one that goes.....
Muslims muslims muslims islamic conspiracy EU secret legislation muslims muslims demographic arabs criminals sharia muslims muslims muslims sunni persians shia sunnis muslims muslims al-qaida?
oh and them muslims and negroes ruined the world cup:doh:

Or is it perhaps some other hysteria which Sky has not yet succumbed to?

[SteamWake]

So anyone in Congress should not be allowed to express political thoughts?

They might come into contact later with someone who disagrees with them, after all.


The decision to deny access to the park was made in accordance with a township resolution allowing officials to determine public space usage “on a case by case basis,” and to ban speech that they deem too “political.” However, the park in question is a common gathering point for public events that often have far more political overtones. Officials made no inquiry as to the size of the rally, or other pertinent logistical concerns.

http://www.ohioconstitution.org/2010/09/10/township-blocks-rally-to-commemorate-constitution-day-event-deemed-too-political/

[tater]

That's a helluva resolution considering that only unambiguously free speech is "political" speech (vs yelling "fire").