My house is my house

[The Third Man]

reason beyond rhetoric


My house is not an investment.


It is a house.

I don’t intend to make money off it; I intend to live in it.

It is not its paper value that matters to me, it is its intrinsic value. I don’t care what it is assessed for, or what it would sell for, I am concerned about its ability to protect my family from the elements and meet our shelter needs.


It is my home.


So the status of the economy and the housing-sales numbers are meaningless to me. I am not looking to sell my home, I am looking to live in it.


So the concept of being “upside down” on a mortgage is meaningless to me, as it should be to everyone. To owe more on your house than it is “worth” is only meaningful if you have forgotten the true worth of a home.

And that is not found in money or marketability. It isn’t determined by your mortgage rate or your payoff amount. The true worth of a home is determined by its ability to meet your needs.

It is a family shelter, not a tax shelter.


And its value is pretty subjective. Yes, you can calculate approximately what a house will bring on the open market. You can add up the resale value of the structure and its components.


But you will be left with meaningless numbers on paper.


Because the value of a house is a compilation of the comforts it provides and the needs it meets. Inasmuch as most of us are accustomed to living inside, away from the snow and rain, and inasmuch as most of us love our families a great deal, it becomes likely that a home – to shelter us from the elements and give us a place of our own – is great value.


After food, our home is probably – in true terms – the most essential and valuable component of our life. It’s priceless.


The value of a home is found around the family din
ner table, in a sleeping baby’s crib, kneeling for family prayer in the living room, in the sentimentality and memory of years spent and lives lived.

The value of my house has nothing to do with my realtor or my banker. It is not a function of dickering and refinancing.


It is my home and my castle.


And yet some people see their homes as their wealth and retirement. They see home as an aspect of net financial worth.


For such people, their foolishness causes great stress, particularly in the wake of natural and international struggles. They despair when there is no need, they demand bailouts when none are supported. They see newspaper stories and go home wracked with uncertainty and fear.

Even though the roof doesn’t leak.


And the windows don’t need repairing or replacement.

And they will be warm inside against the blizzards of winter.

Their houses are perfect. The balance sheet doesn’t say that, the smiles on their kid’s faces say that.


So I recommend caution, and a little bit of courage. I recommend that the sky-is-falling alarmism that passes for journalism these days be ignored.

I also recommend that people remember what the American dream is – not to make a fortune off a house, but to have a house.

A place to call your own.


To retreat to and grow in. To raise a family in and attend to the greatest purposes and joys of life.


House are for living in, not investing in.

Anybody who forgets that will probably lose not only money, but peace of mind.


So it doesn’t matter if your house is upside down. Unless you try to sell it, the numbers and their relationship to one another are meaningless. It is moot to calculate the value of a house that is not for sale.

And my house isn’t for sale.


My house is for living in.


My house is not an investment, it is a house.
And several million people would be a whole lot happier if they could only get that through their mind.

[tater]

Yep.

I always find the "underwater" or "upside down" crap on the news annoying. every single car driven off the lot is instantly "underwater." So what.

It only matters if you are forced to sell for some reason.

[SteamWake]

Many pepole do not buy real estate with the intent of living in it.

It 'used' to be a solid investment.

By the way technically its not really 'your' house...

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/real_estate/eminent_domain.html

[Tchocky]

Well, it used to be an asset bubble.

So, yeah.


Sort of :DL

[Oberon]

Half the houses around here only get lived in for four months a year :nope::damn:

[The Third Man]

It is hard to hold home ownership (a house) as an ideal in a world where private property means nothing.

[AVGWarhawk]

In all reality the bank owns the house until you pay the entire loan. The agreement is you pay a certain amount each month for 15 or 30 years and the bank will let you live in their house until the loan comes to term. You may normally pay more per month without penalty of paying the loan off early. So, thank you Mr. Bank for letting me live in your house until paid at which point I call it MY house. :DL

[Sailor Steve]

I only have one question: Who is the quote attributed to?

[The Third Man]

In all reality the bank owns the house until you pay the entire loan. The agreement is you pay a certain amount each month for 15 or 30 years and the bank will let you live in their house until the loan comes to term. You may normally pay more per month without penalty of paying the loan off early. So, thank you Mr. Bank for letting me live in your house until paid at which point I call it MY house. :DL

The alternative is the king. One man who demands tribute for his generosity. And that generosity is only for those who can repay the favor.

[Ducimus]

Wish I could own a house. I've been renting apartments since I got out of the military. All those years paying anywhere between 800 and 1200 dollars a month. All that money could have been equity. But I can't even get my foot into the door of a house because of the astronomical value, combined with my medium month income.

A house...... tis a pipe dream. If owning a home is the american dream, it is a dream that remains unrealized, and untenable. :nope:

[The Third Man]

Wish I could own a house. I've been renting apartments since I got out of the military. All those years paying anywhere between 800 and 1200 dollars a month. All that money could have been equity. But I can't even get my foot into the door of a house because of the astronomical value, combined with my medium month income.

A house...... tis a pipe dream. If owning a home is the american dream, it is a dream that remains unrealized, and untenable. :nope:

my mortgage is less than your rent. It may require some sacrifice to own a home. But it is your choice. It shouldn't be my payment.

[Ducimus]

my mortgage is less than your rent..

If i had a dime every time I've heard that.

But you know, putting myself 300,000 to 700,000 dollars in the hole for a home in california? Suuuurre. 300K is like.. in a Getto, or a Barrio. (edit: Hell, youd be lucky to get a condo for that much. I even looked at those. 400K! ) A home in a decent neighborhood runs half a million or more. At least, last i looked. If i buy a home now, it will be when i move from california. There's a reason why this place is nicknamed, "cantaffordya".

[The Third Man]

If i had a dime every time I've heard that.

But you know, putting myself 300,000 to 700,000 dollars in the hole for a home in california? Suuuurre. 300K is like.. in a Getto, or a Barrio. A home in a decent neighborhood runs half a million or more. At least, last i looked. If i buy a home now, it will be when i move from california. There's a reason why this place is nicknamed, "cantaffordya".

You are not restricted by where you live. That is the beauty of the US. get out of California. Cali is dieing and taking you along.

Las Vegas have lower rent and home rates. You can buy property at @$1 in Detroit. its a home don't limit yourself.

[AVGWarhawk]

Wish I could own a house. I've been renting apartments since I got out of the military. All those years paying anywhere between 800 and 1200 dollars a month. All that money could have been equity. But I can't even get my foot into the door of a house because of the astronomical value, combined with my medium month income.

A house...... tis a pipe dream. If owning a home is the american dream, it is a dream that remains unrealized, and untenable. :nope:

Look into FHA and what the military can do for you concerning purchasing a home. It is obtainable if you look at the right programs that will work for you. FHA for sure. The military might be of help also. FHA you need only 3% down in most cases. $150,000.00 home you need $4500 down plus closing costs. As bad as it is now those cost can get paid by the home owner or the builder if it is new construction. Also, I think the Fed is going to start the $8000.00 towards a home again. This program worked. I know 2 people who got their homes using this program.

[The Third Man]

You need a down payment now?

[AVGWarhawk]

You need a down payment now?

Not always...sometimes you can roll it all into the loan!

[The Third Man]

Not always...sometimes you can roll it all into the loan!


I put down 20%. But that was I had it and didn't want to pay another middleman.

I think Ducimus just hasn't realised the possibilities.

[AVGWarhawk]

The housing market is in such shambles today I would think banks would do just about anything to get a home off their roles.

[SteamWake]

You need a down payment now?

LOL funny boy...

Getting a mortgage right now is rough... really rough. Simply put the banks arent lending because the rates are so low and the margins suck.

Now getting a second mortgage... :nope:

By the way I saw you listed 300K as the 'low' end of home prices in Ca. That is about twice what the 'low' end of homes in Florida. My current house we paid 150,000.00 for. Yea it needs a little work but its a nice house in a decent neighborhood.

[AVGWarhawk]

Getting a mortgage right now is rough... really rough. Simply put the banks arent lending because the rates are so low and the margins suck.



It is more so that the banks want to lend however the insurers of the loan want the banks to keep the amount loaned on hand in case the loan is defaulted on by a high risk customer. By doing this the bank can not make money. Hence loans are very hard to obtain if you are considered a high risk. It is more important then ever to keep your credit clean.

[SteamWake]

Its not just high risk patrons. Small buisnesses and pepole with good credit have alot more hoops to jump through to secure loans now.

By the way did you see that 50% of the pepole whom recieved federal aid to help with their high risk mortagages have defaulted?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/20/AR2010082005643.html

Shocking I know.

Well it was a good election year stunt if nothing else. But it sure isnt going to help matters.

[mookiemookie]

Read it today and couldn't agree more:

The U.S. housing sector is clearly double-dipping — that dive to 3.83 million units in July undercut the “depression” low of January 2009 by 15%! The lesson for the government is that their ‘tax goodies’ do nothing more than distort the market rather than actually help out.

[AVGWarhawk]

Its not just high risk patrons. Small buisnesses and pepole with good credit have alot more hoops to jump through to secure loans now.

By the way did you see that 50% of the pepole whom recieved federal aid to help with their high risk mortagages have defaulted?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/20/AR2010082005643.html

Shocking I know.

Well it was a good election year stunt if nothing else. But it sure isnt going to help matters.

Not shocked at all. It was good money being thrown after bad money. It was a cash grab and handled poorly.

[August]

Not shocked at all. It was good money being thrown after bad money. It was a cash grab and handled poorly.

On the other hand it did help 50% of the people in the program.

Half empty or half full it's still holding half of the water...

[AVGWarhawk]

Good point August! :up:

[tater]

It would "help" virtually anyone if the government simply paid off their mortgage. The government had no business messing with contractual arrangements.

I have little sympathy for people unwilling to take the single largest purchase in their lives seriously enough to understand it. Anyone capable of being victimized by "predatory" lending (a BS term if ever there was one) should not have been buying a home in the first place.

Ducimus is right about CA, it's insanely expensive, and unlike these idiots wanting to be bailed out for a bad CHOICE they made, he made the (100% correct) choice not to buy under those conditions. The one place I sort of differ is his statement that he could have been generating equity. While that is true, it's not all positive (owning vs renting). You are on the hook for repairs, etc, and remodeling is very expensive. In addition in a situation like right now, you could have bought at a high, and now be "underwater." While that is not a big deal in general, assuming you can live in the house for the foreseeable future, it absolutely makes you less mobile. So all things considered, you might well be ahead for not buying, ducimus. :yep:

The year the market really tanked, we were remodeling the house, and so all that money would have been invested, instead. So we look at the remodel as costing like half what it did, cause had it been invested, we'd have taken a bath :)

It's nice in the current market to be able to jump on a job offer, for example. Impossible if you cannot sell your house.

[Castout]

There's a reason why this place is nicknamed, "cantaffordya".

:DL...that's a smart ass funny

[Ducimus]

I think Ducimus just hasn't realised the possibilities.

Oh i thought about stuff alot, looked around. In the end I decided that it was all too much. In my mind a house should cost 150,000 to 300,000 dollars. I make that apraisle based on my parents. They built a custom home in the late 80's, and paid 300,000 dollars for it. That was alot of money. I care little what the market was at the time I was looking, because i knew it was insane, and obscene. When a house in the F'ing getto costs as much as when my parents bult their home, that speaks volumes. Absolutely insane!


Ducimus is right about CA, it's insanely expensive, and unlike these idiots wanting to be bailed out for a bad CHOICE they made, he made the (100% correct) choice not to buy under those conditions.

When the housing bubble burst, I laughed. All those tears about peoples investments? I laughed again. Infact, the housing bubble bursting made me pretty freaking giddy. People whined - I cackled, pointed, and laughed.


The one place I sort of differ is his statement that he could have been generating equity. While that is true, it's not all positive (owning vs renting). You are on the hook for repairs, etc, and remodeling is very expensive.

I can do the labor, (I was a journeyman structural specialist (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/airforceenlistedjobs/a/afjob3e3x1.htm) in Air force ) but id still be out building materials, delivery, permits, etc.

So all things considered, you might well be ahead for not buying, ducimus. :yep:

I'm still biding my time. Three reasons. One, waiting for things to get cheaper. I know it sounds mean, but the more i hear about foreclosures, the more i'm smiling. For two, I might be moving to Utah in may/june 2011. Three, I'm thinking there's still such a thing as GI home loan. I don't know the details, other then you can only have one, and you have to qualify for that loan just like any other. I think the advantage was no downpayment or low interest rate, i forget.

:DL...that's a smart ass funny

I'd think it funny too, if it wasn't so true.

[tater]

I talked to a guy (civilian) heading up spending 500M$ in Clovis on the SOCOM facility... he said there are loads of federal jobs (high paying) with no takers for anyone remotely technical (civilian contractors). 300 grand would buy you the best house in Clovis.

Course they go wanting cause no one wants to live in Clovis :)

[Ducimus]

Course they go wanting cause no one wants to live in Clovis

I'm gonna guess it's hotter then two mites ****ing in a wool sock there.

[tater]

It's not that bad. It's basically West Texas, but in NM.

[Ducimus]

So then why does nobody want to live in clovis?

[tater]

Who wants to live in West TX? :)

It's a small town, not much to do. That's probably the biggest thing.

[Ducimus]

Who wants to live in West TX? :)

.

Ahhh.... yeah.. That would definatly put a damper in things. Probably have to drive 3 hours in any direction before you get to anywhere with something to do.

[frau kaleun]

So then why does nobody want to live in clovis?

:rotfl2:

I was gonna say, because it's basically West Texas, but in NM... but I guess that's already been covered. :O: