Pics or Drawings Needed

[Dale1957]

during ww2 the USN received four 70 ft scott-paine mtb's from the canadian powerboat co. they were bound for the dutch navy,but when holland fell,they were reverse leased to us. they were numbered pt 368-371. there is limited info on the web and I can't find any pics or drawings of them.can anybody help me? thanks:)

[Dowly]

Quicks search says the boats you mention were vosper class, so here you go:

http://www.google.fi/images?hl=fi&q=vosper%20motor%20torpedo%20boat&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

Info off the different boats in service in USN:
http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/ships/ships-pt.html

[Dale1957]

thanks for the info,but I think that's incorrect. these boats were scott-paine designs,not vospers. your second search say's they were from CPB and scott-paine.

[Dowly]

Right you are. :yep:

This is the only picture I found off the SP/PT-368 70' class MTB
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/120536901.jpg

[Dale1957]

hi dowly.something's wrong,there's no pic there.:oops:

[Dowly]

hi dowly.something's wrong,there's no pic there.:oops:

Don't know why it disappeared, prolly due to hotlinking, here's the pic on my photobucket account.
http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee274/Finnish_Ferret/120536901.jpg

EDIT: Now I see the earlier image too. :doh:

[Dale1957]

yeah,i've seen that one.i'm looking for side profile shots.drawings would be better. thanks anyway.

[Dowly]

Hopefully you find what you're looking for. :salute:

[vienna]

I don't know if this is of any help since it isn't really specific to the Dutch navy mtb's, but this is a pdf from a Hong Kong source about "Scott-Paine" mtbs: http://www.hongkongescape.org/images/HK/The%202nd%20MTB%20Flotilla.pdf (http://www.hongkongescape.org/images/HK/The%202nd%20MTB%20Flotilla.pdf). I found a site (http://www.cww2.net/bbs/simple/index.php?t84590.html (http://www.cww2.net/bbs/simple/index.php?t84590.html)) that has detailed drawings of mtb's and their fittings and armament; it is, however, in Chinese but, if you use Goggle, the translate function will give you a fair grasp of what is written (it is not much worse than the oddly translated instructions one gets with asian imported goods). There is also a catalogue (http://www.model-dockyard.com/acatalog/catalogue.pdf (http://www.model-dockyard.com/acatalog/catalogue.pdf)) that lists on page 53 [bottom left column] model builing plans for a "Canadian Power Boat 70 x 20ft. Scott-Paine design" mtb. Plans for various mtb's, including some for "Scott-Paine" 70-foot versions are available from this catalog. As a suggestion, perhaps you may find info by searching for the class of mtb (TM-22) or by individual mtb/ptb numbers:

TM-32 = PT-368
TM-35 = PT-369
TM-36 = PT-370
TM-37 = PT-371

I hope some of this is helpful to you.

[Dale1957]

thanks vienna.i'll give it a shot.

[Dale1957]

sorry vienna, your info could not help me although the model dockyard catalog had alot of fittings for model boats/ships.did a search for TM-32 class mtb and found info but no pics.back to the drawing board!:damn:ps, the boats i'm looking for were launched in 1942.

[vienna]

Dale1957,

I found this forum site and topic:

http://www.marinematen.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=1439&t=990 (http://www.marinematen.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=1439&t=990).

It is in Dutch, but Goole will translate it for you. It has a bit more info on the TM-22 Class boats and has a few photos of the construction of the boats including a 3/4 view of the engine.

BTW, you will have to register on the forum (it's free) to view the post..

edit: There is another post:

http://www.marinematen.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=1439&t=2377&p=3633&hilit=Canadian+Power+Boat+Company#p3633

This one has a 3/4 view of what is described as "TM-37" under construction side by side with other boats.

[Dale1957]

thanks man.:yeah:

[vienna]

Glad to help.

[Dale1957]

vienna, I was able to register and log in,but much of this site is still in dutch although I clicked on the "translate to english" button.I found it difficult to navigate.oh well. you tried!.:wah:

[vienna]

Dale1957,

Sorry you weren't able to navigate the fDutch forum pages; it is one of the difficulties in researching pages in other languages.

This isn't strictly referring to the CPBCo boats in particular, but I came across a link that is an online archive of the Higgins Industries design and construction plans for their model of PT boats. They are incredibly detailed and you may find them useful in your research:

http://louisdl.louislibraries.org/cdm4/index_HIC.php?CISOROOT=%2FHIC (http://louisdl.louislibraries.org/cdm4/index_HIC.php?CISOROOT=%2FHIC)

If I find anything else, I'll post here.

[Dale1957]

thanks vienna.:salute:

[Dale1957]

vienna,that's a good site for info. higgins had afew designs I did not know about.the drawings for copying/downloading were poor though because of low resolutions.

[Dale1957]

you would think SOMEBODY would have info on this topic? I did a google search for the canadian powerboat archives and came up with nothing:damn:

[vienna]

To quote a previous President, "I feel your pain"...

I have been still looking, off and on, for more information on the boats you specifed and, other than a notation that a couple of them may have been converted to target and control use after the war, I have found nothing. The problem may be that after building the four (although I did find a questionable reference to a 5th) boats, Canadian Power apparently ceded design and manufacturing to Elco. This could mean that Elco may have taken the Canadian plans into their archives. A website, www.gdinc.com (http://www.gdinc.com) has a DVD for sale with U.S. Army microfilm files of Elco engineering drawings in PDF format:

http://www.gdinc.com/Sample_ELCO_Microfilm_Collection-01-02.pdf (http://www.gdinc.com/Sample_ELCO_Microfilm_Collection-01-02.pdf)

There does not appear to be any mention of the Canadian boats in the description, but you or others may find this data useful.

The full (or at least as full as possible) Elco archive is preserved by the Mystic Seaport Museum organization. The following link will take you to a website describing the finding and preservation of the archive and contains a link to the Mystic organization:

http://www.acbs.org/rudder/oldrudder/Rudder/Spring2001/ElcoFound.htm (http://www.acbs.org/rudder/oldrudder/Rudder/Spring2001/ElcoFound.htm)

If I find anything else, I'll post it here.

EDIT: The Elco archives are on a request and sale basis; you have to say what you are looking for and they find it and you buy it. Just to keep things clear about this archive.

[Dale1957]

thanks again vienna.:salute:

[Dale1957]

intresting but nothing of use.:arrgh!:

[vienna]

This site may be intersting:

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/ (http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/)

This is the Canadian Library & Archives site. Unless you're tempted to try out your high school French (as I did), click on the "English" button in the lower left corner. Click on the "Search" link and enter your search term(s) in the box. I tried various terms like: MTB, torpedo boat, canadian power boat, etc. The search returns results from both the Library's book holdings and the Archive's document and photo holdings. In my search, I found a number of photos such as this:

http://data2.archives.ca/ap/a/a132184-v6.jpg

(Caption: Fitting the machine gun turret structure of a motor torpedo boat under construction at Canadian Power Boat Company, Montreal, Québec, Canada, 24 April 1941.)

There several photos of this type. Look for the search results with this graphic: http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/lac-bac/image/digital_ind.gif .

When you open the link, a description of the photo is shown along with a small photo in the upper right. Click on the photo and a larger version appears. If you want to see the photo without any text, click on the link under the small photo in the upper left and the photo appears full size.

As I pointed out above, try various versions or permutations of search terms and more results may be found. Again, I hope this is helpful.

P.S.: Note the sign on the side of the turret; it makes me wonder what they had in those cups and bottles that was a safety hazard. :hmm2:

[Dale1957]

found that same pic. not much else found.

[vienna]

Dale1957,

I was doing some digging about for some other research and I came across this:

http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=hndLAAAAEBAJ&dq=%22scott-paine%22+motor+boat+1942 (http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=hndLAAAAEBAJ&dq=%22scott-paine%22+motor+boat+1942)

It's a patent submitted in 1940 (awarded in 1942) by Scott-Paine for a "motor boat" but the illustrations plainly show an MTB. Maybe this could be of help to you.

EDIT:

This is a link to the Canadian Patent site for the above; the drawings appear to be better and the site allows for rotation and magnification of the drawings:

http://brevets-patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/eng/patent/403309/summary.html?query=((scott-paine)+%3cIN%3e+OWNER)&start=1&num=50&type=advanced_search (http://brevets-patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/eng/patent/403309/summary.html?query=((scott-paine)+%3cIN%3e+OWNER)&start=1&num=50&type=advanced_search)

The links for the drawings are near the bootom of the page.