Changing my play style for survival

[Zedwardson]

By being LESS aggressive...

GWX can be a killer, one bad move and your starting a new commander in SH3 Commander. My last three commanders didn't make it out of 1939, so I am changing some tactics...

1. If it is shallow water and escorted, unless you have a ideal shot, just radio it into command and shadow it to see if it exits shallow water. Angry escort + Shallow water = Death

2. Don't be a cowboy, so no more sneaking into Loch Ewe to try to sink HMS Hood.

3. Aircraft are the bane of your existence, enjoy the empty 1939 skys as much as you can.

4. If your sneaking up to a ship, seemily undetected, and you hear charges go off while you have to scope up, say hello to the RN air wing or the RAF.

5. if you find a ship sailing by itself, hang around, many times you will find a shipping lane and make a death zone.

6. Three ships and 9000 tons might not seem alot, but its not bad for early in the war when you don't have convoys to poach, and it is better to sink a few ships and get home then go for great sinking, only to get deep sixed.

So far, Hans Friedrich who followed this philosophy has with two war patrols (and a pre-war shakedown patrol) sunk nine ships for 30,000 tons, not spectacular, but he is bringing his boys home and his crew is getting better trained by the day. (Now if SH3 commander would just transfer out my non-qualified crew and not my new guy who just came out of repair school, it would be appreciated!

[Gerald]

By being LESS aggressive...

GWX can be a killer, one bad move and your starting a new commander in SH3 Commander. My last three commanders didn't make it out of 1939, so I am changing some tactics...

1. If it is shallow water and escorted, unless you have a ideal shot, just radio it into command and shadow it to see if it exits shallow water. Angry escort + Shallow water = Death

2. Don't be a cowboy, so no more sneaking into Loch Ewe to try to sink HMS Hood.

3. Aircraft are the bane of your existence, enjoy the empty 1939 skys as much as you can.

4. If your sneaking up to a ship, seemily undetected, and you hear charges go off while you have to scope up, say hello to the RN air wing or the RAF.

5. if you find a ship sailing by itself, hang around, many times you will find a shipping lane and make a death zone.

6. Three ships and 9000 tons might not seem alot, but its not bad for early in the war when you don't have convoys to poach, and it is better to sink a few ships and get home then go for great sinking, only to get deep sixed.

So far, Hans Friedrich who followed this philosophy has with two war patrols (and a pre-war shakedown patrol) sunk nine ships for 30,000 tons, not spectacular, but he is bringing his boys home and his crew is getting better trained by the day. (Now if SH3 commander would just transfer out my non-qualified crew and not my new guy who just came out of repair school, it would be appreciated! :yep:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=173753

[Sailor Steve]

Sounds like you're starting to think less like a gamer and more like a kaleun. Good for you! :rock:

[Alpha Von Burg]

The makings of a good Captain...
:salute:

Good Hunting...

[HW3]

Your starting to think like a real Kaleun now. When you start weighing the risk verses the reward, you gain a deeper understanding of what the real Kaleun's went through.

[Capt. Morgan]

...
5. if you find a ship sailing by itself, hang around, many times you will find a shipping lane and make a death zone. ...


:up:Thanks, I'm going to give that a try.


6. Three ships and 9000 tons might not seem alot, but its not bad for early in the war when you don't have convoys to poach,...
It's much better than "not bad". Historically, only a very small group of sub commanders in WWII - from all of the navies involved - ever managed to average 9000t per patrol. Any one who could was an ace.

Unless a target is worth vastly more than your sub, nothing justifies unnecessarily risking the boat, and especially the crew. What you've said all sounds like good judgment to me.


Here are some other things things I've tried:

If I encounter a convoy with all the escorts up front, then I know that they'll be deaf once they've passed me, and I've got at least until the first torp. hits (and up to 20 seconds more) to use flank speed, before they can turn themselves around enough to hear me.

I use slow speed torps on escorted merchants if possible - gives me even more time to clear the firing point.

If I have to turn after firing, I try to use as little rudder as possible. Full rudder (the default) will keep me at the firing point until the boat finishes its turn.

[U777]

Good tip, I'll give that a shot.

5. if you find a ship sailing by itself, hang around, many times you will find a shipping lane and make a death zone.

[K-61]

As already said, bringing home a healthy sub and crew is almost foremost; sinking tonnage is the priority, but getting your crew killed in the process does not further the war effort, unless it is a spectacular target. For example, Prien did not think he would escape from Scapa Flow, but BdU was willing to sacrifice one sub for such a coup. His escape was a bonus and he actually got to see his Knight's Cross rather than have his widow pick it up for him.

At a certain point in the war it was a death sentence to go to sea. The Allies had become that good. With a heavy heart, Doenitz ordered his boats to tackle the Channel during Overlord. He knew the chances were slim, but sinking one ship could prevent much materiel from getting ashore and facing the Wehrmacht.

[Jimbuna]

Your starting to behave and think realistically IMHO http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Zedwardson]

As for no 5, you need to hang around for say, 4 days to a week, and follow the axis that shipping would take (For example, off Portugal they will be heading north-south between the med and Britian.) saw six ships in two weeks, all without excorts. Sadly, half where no-go (Greek Flagged shipping in 1939). :x

[sharkbit]

All of that becomes more important as the war progresses. Wait 'til you get to '43 and later when sinking one or two ships and bringing your boat and crew home is a major victory. Survival is the victory then.

:)

[RConch]

All of that becomes more important as the war progresses. Wait 'til you get to '43 and later when sinking one or two ships and bringing your boat and crew home is a major victory. Survival is the victory then.

:)


Amen to that!:yep:

[K-61]

I just barely made it back from my fifth career patrol. In an earlier attack I got caught on the surface by guns from merchantmen in a convoy. As the weather was murky I was hoping to make a surface attack, fire my torpedoes and then skedaddle the same way. Didn't work out and I got my hull knocked down to about 70%. With my last two torpedoes I again attacked a second convoy that I had earlier attacked without damage. Just two torpedoes left and I was crazy enough to risk it. Got knocked to about 50% and had to dive to over 100 metres to avoid the DC's of the angry escorts after I bagged one more ship from their convoy. Eventually we got down to 111 metres and I was terrified that the hull would give way. We made it back to Lorient and I expect we'll be having an extended shore leave as U-32 is rehabilitated. I think now would be a good time to apply for that IX that I have been coveting.

[Jimbuna]

All of that becomes more important as the war progresses. Wait 'til you get to '43 and later when sinking one or two ships and bringing your boat and crew home is a major victory. Survival is the victory then.

:)

Precisely http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Hans Uberman]

My first career is still in mid '41, but I am noticing the increased effectiveness of the allies. This career I am loading my game, and playing to learn. I play with 90% or so realism and sometimes get 100k or more in tonnage sunk in a patrol, but it's partly because I can load. Prior to this thread I had made up my mind to play in a more realistic fashion for my next campaign. No loading, except when I take a break or it crashes. This will definitely result in this sort of thinking. I look forward to it once I've honed my skills in this campaign!

[timmy41]

what? be more aggressive! *rams a destroyer* :doh:

nah im doing the same thing as you now that im playing an actual serious DiD campaign instead of messing around. good luck!

[Zedwardson]

Followed my rules, and had a very successful patrol!

At AN14 and AN13 I followed my rule no five, and came across a lot of East west runners, on a smooth sea (thus, I could use the deck cannon to full effect! :up:

3.11.39. 1417 Patrol 4
U-27, U-Flotilla Saltzwedel
Left at: November 3, 1939, 14:17
From: Wilhelmshaven
Mission Orders: Patrol grid BF15 5.11.39. 0053 Grid AN 46 Ship sunk! SS Ability (Coastal Freighter), 1869 tons. Cargo: Coal. Crew: 34. Crew lost: 20 6.11.39. 0523 Grid AN 14 Ship sunk! SS Crest of the Wave (Medium Cargo), 5081 tons. Cargo: Coal. Crew: 44. Crew lost: 21 0628 Grid AN 14 Ship sunk! SS Garoufalia (Granville-type Freighter), 4707 tons. Cargo: Wine/Spirits. Crew: 100. Crew lost: 81 1738 Grid AN 13 Ship sunk! SS Clan MacArthur (Large Merchant), 10615 tons. Cargo: Iron Ore. Crew: 59. Crew lost: 55 1807 Grid AN 13 Ship sunk! MV Corheath (Coastal Tanker), 1240 tons. Cargo: Gasoline. Crew: 19. Crew lost: 6 2253 Grid AN 14 Ship sunk! SS Kooyong (Passenger/Cargo), 2253 tons. Cargo: General Cargo. Crew: 175. Crew lost: 84 7.11.39. 0730 Grid AN 13 Ship sunk! SS Napier (Medium Cargo), 5082 tons. Cargo: Steel. Crew: 48. Crew lost: 1 1251 Grid AN 13 Ship sunk! MV Vinemoor (Granville-type Freighter), 4708 tons. Cargo: Foodstuffs. Crew: 107. Crew lost: 16 1531 Grid AN 13 Ship sunk! MV Harrier (Motor Vessel), 114 tons. Cargo: Foodstuffs. Crew: 13. Crew lost: 3 11.11.39. 1827 Patrol results
Crew losses: 0
Ships sunk: 9
Aircraft destroyed: 0
Patrol tonnage: 35669 tons

Came across a gorgeous convoy, even had a Ax. Cruiser in it. I turned stern (Which is the only place that had a eel left) fired a slow steam eel at the largest mass of freighters, crashed dived while turning 90 degrees, and once i got to 100 meters, went silent and let the convoy go past, sadly, no hit.

Also had some first ship sightings

First Polish warship (It depth charged me, well aimed, but I was nice and deep)
First Neutral USA ship.
first Aux. Cruiser.

still, I will take 9 ships and 35k tons any day, and earned myself a Iron Cross.

[Badger Finn]

Medals
20NOV39 IRON CROSS, SECOND CLASS

19JAN40 IRON CROSS, FIRST CLASS

Badges
12SEP39 U-BOAT BADGE

U-Bootwaffe Postings
18MAY38 U-Boat Flotilla Weddigen (Commander training)
01AUG39 1st Flotilla (6 patrols)

U-Boat Commands
01AUG39 U-20 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/U-20_Crew_List.html), Type IIA (6 patrols)



1 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/Log_0.html)01AUG39 - 15AUG39 (15 days)0 (0/0)0 (0/0)
2 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/Log_1.html)31AUG39 - 12SEP39 (13 days)1 (1/0)2239 (2239/0)
3 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/Log_2.html)21SEP39 - 08OCT39 (18 days)2 (2/0)10911 (10911/0)
4 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/Log_3.html)03NOV39 - 20NOV39 (18 days)2 (2/0)4471 (4471/0)
5 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/Log_4.html)02DEC39 - 22DEC39 (21 days)2 (2/0)11563 (11563/0)
6 (file:///C:/Users/Badger/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Peter_Stein/Log_5.html)04JAN40 - 19JAN40 (16 days)1 (1/0)9385 (9385/0)

Transferred to u-boat school...

:woot:

To game out is to have fun! To sub*sim* is to have skill alot of bloody patience and have fun!

:DL

[raymond6751]

We need more of these 'tactics that work' threads. Well done.

Here's another tip, never let your battery charge go below half except in combat. I sometimes mix surface and submerged travel to conserve fuel and extend range. I watch that battery gauge. It isn't nice to go into combat with no under-water range.

[Alpha Von Burg]

When I reach my patrol area I would try and stay submerged for as long as I can and suface when CO2 levels hit 50%. I usually set a schedual to when I surface, being some time after sun set and sometime before sun set.

Being submerged as its advantage, such as hydrophone scan which has better "visual" range, most of the time and reduces any chance of being spotted first.

And to conserve battery life I just stay at slow speed.

Hope this help...

[Jimbuna]

some time after sun set and sometime before sun set.



Do you mean some time before sunrise?

[Alpha Von Burg]

Do you mean some time before sunrise?

Ah yes, thanks for pointing that out...:D

[Jimbuna]

Ah yes, thanks for pointing that out...:D


:03:

[Sailor Steve]

You better run, AvB. It's a bad sign when Jim starts winking at you.

[HW3]

A patrol technique that works for me is to run submerged for 6 hours at slow speed (2-3kts), surface and charge batteries, which takes about 1 hour, run submerged for another 6 hours and repeat. By doing this I rarely run into a airplane or surface ship while surfaced, and my batteries are always over 50%.

[Zedwardson]

A patrol technique that works for me is to run submerged for 6 hours at slow speed (2-3kts), surface and charge batteries, which takes about 1 hour, run submerged for another 6 hours and repeat. By doing this I rarely run into a airplane or surface ship while surfaced, and my batteries are always over 50%.

Thanks, I will have to try that when it gets a little more risky to be on the surface my my guy(s).

[K-61]

I remain surfaced as much as possible, until air cover becomes a real pain. If weather is bad and visibility low, I submerge and run slow, using hydrophones to hear farther than I can see. Why stay up top and risk being run over? I've had a couple of collisions that way and it is a nasty surprise.

My most recent convoy must have a radar equipped escort. It's spring of 41, off the coast of Spain, weather bad and very low range visibility. I was using hydrophones to track the convoy and when I was close enough decided to surface and try to spot it visually. Suddenly I began to take damage but could not see where it was coming from. As I crash dived a corvette came into view. I evaded and several hours later was running somewhere to the east of the convoy when again that corvette suddenly looms out of the murk firing everything it has at me. Again, crash dive and evade. This time I chose to break off. I have no advantage over that convoy and would likely get killed if I persisted. Discretion is the better part of valour. I'm in the first patrol of my new IXC; she's not an agile VII and I can't risk getting caught on the surface, wallowing like a whale.

[Badger Finn]

A patrol technique that works for me is to run submerged for 6 hours at slow speed (2-3kts), surface and charge batteries, which takes about 1 hour, run submerged for another 6 hours and repeat. By doing this I rarely run into a airplane or surface ship while surfaced, and my batteries are always over 50%.

This will keep you out of trouble - you can also expand on that general theme for all sorts variables but I also run a 6 hour system very similiar I some times will chug on the surface dependant on weather, position etc

[sharkbit]

A patrol technique that works for me is to run submerged for 6 hours at slow speed (2-3kts), surface and charge batteries, which takes about 1 hour, run submerged for another 6 hours and repeat.

If you do that before mid 1943, you are just giving up way too much flexibility in patrolling. Just think of the area you can cover on the surface compared to the area that you would cover when submerged and the potential targets that may be spotted. I rather rely on my watchcrew to see targets than the hydrophone pick up targets.

I might submerge during the day and run on the surface at night in areas that are heavily patrolled by aircraft early/mid war but I think running submerged when you do not need to is giving up the huge advantage that patrolling on the surface gives you.
Most of the time though, I patrol on the surface and rely on my watch crew to spot airplanes. "Aircraft Spotted!"= crash dive.

Having said all that, I'm starting to get into late 1943 and aircraft are making things a wee bit more difficult so patrolling submerged in certain areas may be a wise thing to do.
Come 1944, I may be singing the praises of your technique. :D

:)

[the.terrabyte.pirate]

I'm currently using a slightly different patrolling technique.

Ahead 1/3, half an hour submerged, half an hour on the surface.

I know that it's unlikely that within 30 minutes a sound contact would pass into and then out of my hydrophone range, but surfacing every half hour keeps the batteries charged between 75% and 100% at any time.

Not only does this mean I patrol at a faster speed, but I also have enough battery charge left to turn off recharge mode if I need those extra few knots to catch a contact. :up:

[Snestorm]

I stay on the surface as much as possible.
Early war = Almost always.
Late war = Much less than I'd like.