USS Ling (Excursion Pics)

[WernherVonTrapp]

Yesterday, I took the First Mate and crew to visit the USS Ling memorial in Hackensack, NJ. I had a great time and was very surprised to learn that my First Mate thought the whole tour was fascinating. My daughters enjoyed the trip too, though my youngest was more concerned about what toys might be awaiting her in the gift shop.:haha: She got an F-16 Fighting Falcon and an E2C Hawkeye out of the deal. She actually likes the airplanes.:o

Anyway, I'm posting a few pics to share my memories. The image quality had to be reduced considerably for quick loading on the web. This is only a smidgen of the overall number of pics I took:
http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling1.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling2.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling3.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling4.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling5.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling6.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling7.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling8.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling9.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling10.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling11.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling12.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling13.jpg

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/ling14.jpg

To say that all the compartments were cramped would be making an understatement. How 90 guys all shared this same space for 45 to 60 days at a time is beyond me. Kind of makes you appreciate more, the sacrifices they made on our behalf.:up:
http://www.njnm.com/subtour/index.html

[Deephunter]

Great pics..!! Thanks for posting.:up:
Like you say...How guys actually lived in there for extended periods of time is beyond me. And the number of valves and other controls would drive me crazy...
One interesting thing I noticed...There seems to be several "portholes" which could be opened while surfaced to air the place out....

[sergei]

Good pics, thanks Wernher. :up:

[Gerald]

:up:

[Stealhead]

The port holes are actually "gun access ports" so that the crew had near immediate access to the deck gun and AA guns and did not have to jockey through the normal routes top side they where added into the designs some time in late 42 or 1943 I think the smaller ones are for passing up ammo others where strictly magazines hard to say for sure data on them is sort of lacking.

It is interesting to see pics of the old war subs especially the ones that received little modification post war yet they are all slightly different which makes sense since each sub wound up being slightly different form the next after receiving an over haul or two.

I have been to the USS Drum a few times and just from these pics I can see some differences.Though the Drum is a Gato and the Ling is a Balao the Drum does have a Balao bridge though.

WernherVonTrapp no pictures of the control room or conning tower?

Also interesting to see that the Ling does not have a 40mm mounted might have at one time though.

I agree with the confined spaces I toured a "boomer" some years back in high school I was glad that I was joining the Air Force.I think if I had been in the Navy in WWII I'd have given subs a shot beats floating around on the surface all day as a huge target if that is the other option.

[WernherVonTrapp]

The port holes are actually water tight magazines used to store rounds for the various AA guns so that the crew had near immediate access to some ammo they where added into the designs some time in late 42 or 1943 I think. I am guessing that the tube coming out of the deck was to pass shells to the deck gun although it looks like a tight fight for a 4/51.


WernherVonTrapp no pictures of the control room or conning tower?
You are absolutely right on all counts, Stealhead. Those port holes are actually water tight containers for the 4" shells and they were passed up through that feeding tube (4th pic from bottom) to restock the ammo containers. The conning tower was off limits, according to the tourguide. He let me climb up there however, only long enough to take a couple of close ups of the 20mm. I do have some pics of the control room, however, they didn't turn out too well. The lighting inside the sub was such that, no flash was too dark and using flash caused a lighting wash-out effect. We were moving through the compartments (not overly fast but) too quickly for me to make constant adjustments to the cam. I ended up keeping it on auto mode the whole tour.

The tour guide was a nice guy but not too well versed on the USS Ling and it's systems. He conceded that he was new and this was only his 5th tour. When I pointed to, and commented on the AA guns being the 20mm Oerlikons, he interjected, pointed to the 4" deck gun and said, "No, that's the 20mm right there".:har:

[Stealhead]

Yeah the last time I was at the Drum back in 2009 they just gave you a pamphlet a "self guided tour" same goes for the USS Alabama. I was showing something to my daughter and some man and his family basically just tagged along once they figured that I knew a little about what all some of the gear was inside.(little did they know that I had read The Fleet Submarine in the US Navy, US Submarines Through 1945,Take Her Deep,Thunder Below and Wahoo to name a few.:arrgh!:)

The Drum has a few mk.27s in the aft torpedo room and they where pretty surprised to learn that such technology was around back then. Another interesting thing about the Drum that I noticed is that she has duplicate PPIs one in the conning tower and another in the control room I don't know if this was a WWII feature or if it was added later but it was an interesting rig none the less.It is also possible that one PPI was for the SV and one was for the SJ set.

[Andrew82]

Wow, cool!! Thanks for sharing! :yeah: :yeah:

[WernherVonTrapp]

Thanks for the replies fellas, I'm glad you enjoy the pics as much as I do. Wish I could've posted the full size pics here but, I doubt the page would've even loaded if I had.

(little did they know that I had read The Fleet Submarine in the US Navy, US Submarines Through 1945,Take Her Deep,Thunder Below and Wahoo to name a few.:arrgh!:) Well, you're alot further ahead than I am in that category. I haven't read too many books regarding personal accounts of submarine warfare. I just don't seem to have the time. I mean, I read WWII PTO books but, the last sub warfare book I read was The Tenth Fleet. I recently finished reading a very comprehensive history of WWII Radar. It covered all the major players, and then some. USSR, Germany, USA, Japan, England, etc. Very technical, but interesting stuff. Most of the stuff I've read is on the strategic level, though Japanese Destroyer Captain was a heck of a book. I've been considering re-reading that one.:up:

[Stealhead]

Both Submarines Through 1945 and The Fleet Submarine in the US Navy are very technical in nature.

Though I'd honestly recommend the later if you where to read one of the two mainly because it just seems to be better organized and covers all fleet boats all the way to the Fleet Snorkel and Guppy programs which is beyond the cut off point of Submarines through 1945 also the author of Fleet served on subs during the war and that seems to help his prospective.

But for true detail the books authored by skippers other officers and some enlisted men are the best source for over all knowledge and they make great reads as well. You can take their tactics and use them in SH4."Thunder Below" by Adm. Gene Fluckey is really good you can hardly put it down I have read that book through at least 4 times over the years.You can tell that not only was Fluckey an effective, sound thinking and aggressive fighter he was also concerned about his sailors well being and his crew showed their appreciation once by making a flag which they tied to the periscope sheer while they where leaving port(without Fluckey knowing about it) it said,"Fluckey's 8th Fleet" obviously they felt that the Barb alone was worthy of being her own fleet.

[Lil' Subsim]

Have anyone visited all of the Fleet Boats? Closest I got to one was at Pearl while I was there for a week, also the one the SF.

[Major Johnson]

I visited the Ling 10 yrs ago and had the pleasure of meeting an actual sub veteran of WW2. I think is name was Art "Bullwinkle" something or other. I just saw the card he gave me the other day, and damn, you think I could find it now? Had his home address on it. I'm sure he's passed on now. I wish I would have put him on my Christmas card list. But loved the tour, and I too had to buy a few things from the gift shop! :smile: I might have to plan another trip up there.

[NorthBeach]

Great shots!

The only Fleet Boat I've been on is the Pampanito. I visit her a couple times a year, as she's only a few blocks down the hill. And, while I've spent vast amounts of time below deck on a wide variety of sailboats, I'm always struck by the lack of space in the Balao.

[Stealhead]

Visiting all of the surviving fleet boats would be an international challenge I know for sure that there is one that was used by Brazil in 60's and 70's and it is on public display now in Brazil of course and there might be one on display in Turkey as well.

Another interesting thing the Ling was a Cramp yard boat and they where so backed up it had to be towed to Boston to be finished so it never went on a combat patrol during WWII(not to say that makes the Ling unimportant) and I found a picture of the Ling in late July 1945 off Boston with a 40mm on the fore AA mount and a 5"51 on the aft mount so she originally left Boston with a 40mm and a 5"51.

Some of the post war fleet boats that got modified as radar pickets had the largest crews 105 officers and men they did have the rear torpedo tubes where and some other things where removed on them but still.

[WernherVonTrapp]

It's my understanding that the USS Ling is in peril of being lost as a War Memorial museum. Seems that the landowners want the Ling, and the museum, to move so that the land can be sold for developement.:nope: With that in mind, I'm glad I got the chance to visit her when I did and hope to return soon.
http://mysite.verizon.net/resx5uqm/savetheling/

[cdrsubron7]

Excellent pics, Werhner. Thanks for sharing. :yeah:

[Armistead]

It's my understanding that the USS Ling is in peril of being lost as a War Memorial museum. Seems that the landowners want the Ling, and the museum, to move so that the land can be sold for developement.:nope: With that in mind, I'm glad I got the chance to visit her when I did and hope to return soon.
http://mysite.verizon.net/resx5uqm/savetheling/

I hope it's not lost. The sub at Patriot's Point is being sold for scrap metal as they don't have the money to redo it. I looked at the numbers online and visitation was down 50%, guess the economy. Not like we have a lot of subs left to visit.

[Barkhorn1x]

Great pics WVT. I used to live in Hackensack so I have been there many times.

It would be a shame to see the Ling removed in favor of another strip mall.

On a lighter note I hope you had a chance to lunch at the "White Manna" right there on River St. They serve handcrafted versions of White Castle burgers. Truly fast food heaven I tell ya'. ;)

[Diopos]

oops! wrong thread!
sorry._

[WernherVonTrapp]

On a lighter note I hope you had a chance to lunch at the "White Manna" right there on River St. They serve handcrafted versions of White Castle burgers. Truly fast food heaven I tell ya'. ;) Hah-ha, The White Manna.:DL All my friends keep telling me about that place and how I should try it. I wish I could. I'm on a very restricted diet now (thanks doc) and can't eat hamburgers anymore. Heck, I can't eat alot of things anymore. Fast food, with an occasional exception toward fish, is no longer allowed in my limited, daily, caloric, intake.:nope::03:

@Armistead:
Yeah, it's a real shame how many excuses work into the fray of our dwindling historical resources. Looks like pretty soon, Korea won't be the only forgotten war. And people don't think WWIII isn't possible. How can we prevent the mistakes of the past when we blot the lessons learned from our future.:damn:

@cdrsubron7:
Thanks for the compliment sir:salute:, I'm glad you enjoyed them.;)

[Deephunter]

Re: Developers and historical artifacts....
The fate of the USS Ling may not be unlike that suffered by the DL&W RR Dansbury Depot in East Stroudsburg PA. Even though it is (was) on the National Register of Historic sites, the site had been "eyed" by developers for a new 4 story building. The community was opposed to its removal, but, strangely enough...it caught fire in the middle of the night, and of course, there are no resources to rebuild it....So the remains were sold to the developer.....:damn:

[Stealhead]

It is a good thing that there are games like this out there I am pretty sure that they alone raise interest in the real history behind it.I know when I was younger I got interested in WWII because of "Black Sheep Squadron" it had its cheesy bits I know but it did spark an interest I went to the library and found that it had the entire collection of Time-Life books on WWII and I went though them all that was when I was 9 or 10 that was just the start.

Also now a days internet sites about military history/history are a good thing.I guess disinterest is caused by own modern society many people are so caught up fiddling with their I-phones and I-pads(that some Chinese person works 14 hours a day getting paid $1.00 a day) they probably don't have much concern about the past or future so long as their gadget will work in it, the first EMPs of WWIII will kill a lot of people if it ever happens.

[WernherVonTrapp]

I guess disinterest is caused by own modern society many people are so caught up fiddling with their I-phones and I-pads(that some Chinese person works 14 hours a day getting paid $1.00 a day) they probably don't have much concern about the past or future so long as their gadget will work in it, the first EMPs of WWIII will kill a lot of people if it ever happens.Yes, indeed. It's called self-absorption.
My father got me into watching Black Sheep Squadron when it first aired on television. I used to watch it all the time. I suppose it reminded him of his days on the carrier in the Pacific. You know, reminded him of his youth.

[Stealhead]

Me and couple buddies made a bet with this younger co-worker that we would give him $100.00 if he did not use his i-phone except for legit phone calls and messages no playing with app or surfing online things like that fro a full work week he gave up a Thursday almost made it.:damn: He just could not take it.But he did start to use the thing a lot less after that at least.


I know that Pappy Boyington was a "technical adviser" for the show even he said that it was loosely based on reality. I read some place that Pappy met a Japanese pilot who claimed to have shot him down in 1943 while he was working on Black Sheep.I also heard that some former VMF214 members did not like the show very much because of how "they" where portrayed in the show.

[Barkhorn1x]

I also heard that some former VMF214 members did not like the show very much because of how "they" where portrayed in the show.

Yes, one could guess that they were offended by being portrayed as bunch of druken brawlers. I mean, I doubt they acted like that ALL the time. :arrgh!:

[Stealhead]

Actually in real life they where highly disciplined there really was not very much to do in the PTO on the front lines to get you into much trouble anyway. I dont recall the name but the XO of VMF214 had to "keep" Pappy in line as he was very bad alcoholic he sometimes flew missions with a very bad hangover but still was able to effectively lead his pilots and still got kills! he also had issues with authority so if anything the other men in 214 had to keep Pappy civilized when he needed to be and used that aggression in combat where is was needed.

He actually had a lot of trouble for most his Marine Corp career besides WWII which is why he flew with the AVG early on they looked for his type of personality good fighters that don't like to comply with normal military regulations but can be counted on in real combat his saving grace was that his was an outstanding fighter pilot and some of his traits where inspiring to his men so the Corps just barely tolerated him.

[Bubblehead1980]

Have anyone visited all of the Fleet Boats? Closest I got to one was at Pearl while I was there for a week, also the one the SF.


Only been to the USS Drum in Mobile, AL several times, as it's not far from my hometown in Florida and I pass through Mobile often on way home.I plan to stop by to see her when I head home for winter break in a few days.

I am going to SF in Feb, plan to see the USS Pampanito.

[Bubblehead1980]

Actually in real life they where highly disciplined there really was not very much to do in the PTO on the front lines to get you into much trouble anyway. I dont recall the name but the XO of VMF214 had to "keep" Pappy in line as he was very bad alcoholic he sometimes flew missions with a very bad hangover but still was able to effectively lead his pilots and still got kills! he also had issues with authority so if anything the other men in 214 had to keep Pappy civilized when he needed to be and used that aggression in combat where is was needed.

He actually had a lot of trouble for most his Marine Corp career besides WWII which is why he flew with the AVG early on they looked for his type of personality good fighters that don't like to comply with normal military regulations but can be counted on in real combat his saving grace was that his was an outstanding fighter pilot and some of his traits where inspiring to his men so the Corps just barely tolerated him.


I've read a lot about Boyington and he was just a natural top notch aviator, but not the career type officer the corps wants, which I admire in a way.Boyington was just Boyington, he did his own thing but still got the job down.Sure some real problems, he was a pathological liar and alcoholic to boot which caused him many problems pre, during and post war, but it seems he was an overall good person.Having said that, I bet partying with him was a hell of a lot of fun! lol