Did the old sweats move on?

[Herr-Berbunch]

Have all the old sweats, sorry - experience hands, on this SH3 forum tried SH4?

I got SH4 at the same time as SH3 but it's still sitting on the shelf waiting to be installed, I'm not in a rush to do so what with all the great mods for SH3, but am just wondering what it's like in comparison or should I just stick it back on ebay (or Amazon Marketplace - would Onkel Neal still get a cut? :hmmm:

[Platapus]

I don't think you can really compare SH3 and SH4. They are really two separate games. I have been playing both for a long time. Sometimes I feel a little "u-boaty" and other times I feel a little "fleety".

The games are different from each other. Not only are the theaters of operation different but the gui's are different.

I am sure there are some people who like SH3 but not SH4.
I equally sure there are some people who like SH4 but not SH3.

To each his own. We fought wars to ensure that game players have the right to play whichever version of SH they want?

As for myself? I go both ways.

:oops:

Uh I mean I like SH3 and SH4. :D

[Paul Riley]

I think the main thing to consider is whether the player prefers the European theatre or the Pacific.
I have never played SH4,and not sure if I will,I just love the gritty stormy conditions of the Atlantic so much,and lets not forget the Arctic convoys!
The graphics look good on SH4 though,but as we all know graphics are not be all and end all of a good game :yep:
German U-Boats kick so much anus! :rock:

[sharkbit]

I go both ways myself. :03:
I have both games installed but I only got SH4 about a year ago. Like platapus , I play them as the mood suits me but I would say I play SH3 more...around 75% of the time compared to SH4. Usually the cold grey Atlantic keeps calling me back. :arrgh!:

Give SH4 a shot if you have even a little interest in the Pacific. There are some pretty good books out there that might peak your interest.

:)

[Paul Riley]

One thing I will say impressed me once on a documentary (which was brilliant I must say) on the Pacific war was the Japanese use of submersible aircraft carriers! Basically you have a submarine with a watertight hangar on the deck able to house 3 swordfish dive bombers I think they were,their wings used to fold back to allow them to fit in snugly.Are they featured in SH4? if so then that alone could tempt me to buy the game some day.
I have to say I would prefer to be the Japanese in that game,but what would be the point in the end,the idea is to sever Japanese supplies by the US just like the Germans tried (and almost did!) with the allies.

Thats the bugger (below) I saw in the doc,what an amazing innovative machine!
I imagine dive times being horrendous though! ;)

http://members.shaw.ca/johniuchi/final_act.jpg

[maillemaker]

I've only ever played SH3. I won't move on until I've mastered it by surviving the war.

Steve

[Paul Riley]

I've only ever played SH3. I won't move on until I've mastered it by surviving the war.

Steve

Good point! me neither,there is still much to be seen/experienced in SH3,the furthest I ever got was the beginning of 1943,and that campaign ended due to a disaster with a hard drive once,I formatted everything by mistake...including my career :nope:

[Herr-Berbunch]

Good point! me neither,there is still much to be seen/experienced in SH3,the furthest I ever got was the beginning of 1943,and that campaign ended due to a disaster with a hard drive once,I formatted everything by mistake...including my career :nope:

Is this the same hard drive mentioned in other threads, or are you just really unlucky with them? I'm now at a loss as to which smiley to insert to show I'm just joshing, rather than taking the proverbial!

[Herr-Berbunch]

Oh, and thanks for your answers guys. I'll stick with 3 for the time being, there is no rush for 4.

And I'm glad I didn't even mention 5!!! :hmmm:

[Paul Riley]

Is this the same hard drive mentioned in other threads, or are you just really unlucky with them? I'm now at a loss as to which smiley to insert to show I'm just joshing, rather than taking the proverbial!

Its the same hard drive yes,its an external hard drive I use to save patches,mods,save games (for ALL my games,not just SH3,and I have well over 100 games!) etc,I once formatted the entire drive by accident.Suffice to say I am extra careful these days,and unplug the external HD from my main system each time I fresh install XP or carry out any other file altering action (whatever that may be).
Take the proverbial if you want,we're all free to speak our minds here,or at least I hope so.

NOTE- I use the ext HD much like a memory card used to be used for the PS1 years ago,only this one has 300GB,and connects via USB...naturally

[Herr-Berbunch]

One thing I will say impressed me once on a documentary (which was brilliant I must say) on the Pacific war was the Japanese use of submersible aircraft carriers! Basically you have a submarine with a watertight hangar on the deck able to house 3 swordfish dive bombers I think they were,their wings used to fold back to allow them to fit in snugly.Are they featured in SH4? if so then that alone could tempt me to buy the game some day.
I have to say I would prefer to be the Japanese in that game,but what would be the point in the end,the idea is to sever Japanese supplies by the US just like the Germans tried (and almost did!) with the allies.

Thats the bugger (below) I saw in the doc,what an amazing innovative machine!
I imagine dive times being horrendous though! ;)

http://members.shaw.ca/johniuchi/final_act.jpg

Definately not Fairey's finest Stringbag, it's Aichi M6A.

If you look at my sig, the RN is also trying out a submergible carrier.

I would't take the proverbial over something that I wouldn't find funny if it happened to me, and I wouldn't've found that funny whatsoever... but my trousers splitting... well that's something entirely different :rotfl2:

[Jimbuna]

I have both....but obviously have a slight preference for U-boats.

Here is a link to a little artwork of some subs (including the huge I class)

http://www.subart.net/restoftheworld.htm

[Paul Riley]

... but my trousers splitting... well that's something entirely different :rotfl2:

Did you leave your trousers out to dry too long and now they are too tight for you? or are you trying to imply something else? ;):haha:

[Sailor Steve]

I play both regularly, and right now I'm only using u-boats in both. SH4 is better than SH3 in almost every way, but so far no one has made all the graphics goodies the the later game.

SH4 has several great mods for the Pacific side, and a fantastic campaign in RSRDC, plus one outstanding u-boat supermod, Operation Monsun. What SH4 doesn't have is a lot of the cools stuff to look at, and it doesn't have anything like SH3 Commander. That is all mod-work, and not intrinsic to the game, so the only thing wrong with SH4 is that modders keep ignoring it.

If it had those things I would shelve SH3 and never look back.

[Von -E]

One thing I will say impressed me once on a documentary (which was brilliant I must say) on the Pacific war was the Japanese use of submersible aircraft carriers!

Before being too impressed, I recommend you read Submarine Commander by Paul Schratz (USN Ret), who commanded one of them after the war on it's trip to Pearl (in a nutshell, they were pieces of crap that were lucky to make it, even while intermittantly needing to be towed).

As for the original intent of the thread, I tried to run SH4 for a couple of weeks very recently, and found it far too unstable to even finish a patrol.

[Ducimus]

A few week ago, i made this post in another thread.


Yup, I gave SH5 another go. Conclusion. Fully rendered interiors and more crew interaction is really nice, but that's all it seems to offer at this point in time. Rest of it is under developed by way of comparision to SH3 and SH4.

So then, i decided to take a trip down nostalgia lane and install SH3. I even D/L and installed GWX3. I loaded the game ONCE on the gibralter mission and noticed 2 things that reached up and grabbed me by the nuts

1.) SH3's loads slower then old people fornicate. My grandpa drives faster. Hell, molaysis in january drips faster then SH3 loads a single mission.

2.) Having an LCD monitor, running at 1024 X 768 resolution sucks. Everything looked fuzzy and smudged. Not as crisp and clear as i remembered it.

So then i loaded up SH4 again, and i recognized one major thing about it. As a platform, it is the best compromise between SH3 and SH5.

- It has better graphics then SH3, though not as great as SH5, but its well enough.

- As a simulation, It has more functional details then SH5, though a bit less then SH3.

- I think It loads faster then SH3 and SH5.

Insert Goldilocks and the three bears metaphor here.


Two days after i posted that, i started a Uboat mod for Sh4
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=171443

and it's starting to turn into another supermod (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1433816&postcount=54). Im a glutton for punishment.

Sleep... it would be nice.

[Sailor Steve]

As for the original intent of the thread, I tried to run SH4 for a couple of weeks very recently, and found it far too unstable to even finish a patrol.
Really? That's odd, because one of SH4's selling points is how much more stable it is than SH3. I never have problems with it.

[Von -E]

Really? That's odd, because one of SH4's selling points is how much more stable it is than SH3. I never have problems with it.

Yes, really. I found no other mentions of the problem here, so assumed it didn't like something here and went back to SHIII. I didn't run 4 enough to get over the change in interface and the only thing I missed after trying a couple of times was the translucent water.

The first time I TC'd on and off (after TONS of enemy aircraft all the way across the pacific) to Tokyo bay. Avoided death, DC's, got my pictures, avoided death and was about a third of the way back to pearl when the game started stuttering in TC. Drop to 1x for a bit. Tried to TC a bit, stuttering and finally a crash. Tried getting home from each of my saves to no avail. Reinstalled the game, got about 70% of the way to mainland Japan and it started stuttering in TC, eventually followed by a crash. Each time was after saves and exits and restarting the game, shutting off all other programs (including virus detection), etc. No mods installed, etc. The pretty water wasn't enough to get me to bloody my head against a wall... SHIII still does everything I _need_. ...AND I can wander around my type VII in SHIII.

[Ducimus]

Sounds like you played SH4 stock. I don't know why some people do that. It's not like anybody plays SH3 stock, or even remembers what stock SH3 was like for that matter.

[Von -E]

Sounds like you played SH4 stock. I don't know why some people do that.

(I _honestly_ don't understand your response, _in context_. So no offense is intended with the following...)

Short answer... common sense.

Medium answer... so I could learn the problem was with the game and/or my system and not some mod.

Long answer... Why install mods if you're happy with a game? How do you know whether you're happy unless you try it?

Your response implies that mods would FIX or AVOID a crash. Whereas all the forums are filled with the opposite effect when mods are involved. I thought that was what the patches were for.


It's not like anybody plays SH3 stock, or even remembers what stock SH3 was like for that matter.

You lost me with that one. I miss your point? Are you saying it was common to install SHIII then throw a bunch of mods on it before even trying it, so I'm an idiot for trying stock SH4 at first?

[Ducimus]

People are always doing comparisons between SH3 and SH4. It's not a stretch, nor much of an assumption to say that everyone here is running GWX 3.0, NYGM 3.x or any other supermod.

So some folks load up SH4, and then go, "OMG this sucks compared to SH3!" Then write up a post about how much it sucked and how glad they are to be back in SH3. Well, i'll be the first to admit that SH4 by itself, is atrociously bad. But then, SH3 was bad by itself too, not as bad as SH4, but still bad. People tend to forget that. But SH4 by itself is bad enough to say, "Friends don't let friends play Stock SH4". It really IS that bad unmodded, and if one played it unmodded, you really didn't give it a fair chance.

So yes, quite a bit if fixed by mod in SH4. Infact, mods are not only made the game playable, but enjoyable, but this is a double edged sword. It's doubled edged because, Instability and CTDs where SH4 is concerned is all too often caused by "mod soup". For whatever reason, people like mod SH4 like their ordering a made to order breakfast omelette. I and a few other other modders in SH4, jokingly call it a "Circle runner", in reference to a torpedo that does a circular run and hits the firing submarine.

[Von -E]

People are always doing comparisons between SH3 and SH4. It's not a stretch, nor much of an assumption to say that everyone here is running GWX 3.0, NYGM 3.x or any other supermod.

So some folks load up SH4, and then go, "OMG this sucks compared to SH3!" Then write up a post about how much it sucked and how glad they are to be back in SH3. Well, i'll be the first to admit that SH4 by itself, is atrociously bad. But then, SH3 was bad by itself too, not as bad as SH4, but still bad. People tend to forget that. But SH4 by itself is bad enough to say, "Friends don't let friends play Stock SH4". It really IS that bad unmodded, and if one played it unmodded, you really didn't give it a fair chance.

I'm still confused... what does any of that have to do with the game being unstable for me? (as in crashing)

So yes, quite a bit if fixed by mod in SH4. Infact, mods are not only made the game playable, but enjoyable, but this is a double edged sword. It's doubled edged because, Instability and CTDs where SH4 is concerned is all too often caused by "mod soup". For whatever reason, people like mod SH4 like their ordering a made to order breakfast omelette. I and a few other other modders in SH4, jokingly call it a "Circle runner", in reference to a torpedo that does a circular run and hits the firing submarine.

Now it's even more confusing, above you implied that I shouldn't have tried it with no mods. But here you state that mods could be the cause of my crashes. I understand "mod soup" crashes... and THAT is why I try SH# games with no mods for a bit... now I know that mods are not the cause of the instability here. ...Which answers your original question of why I ran it stock. But it doesn't address your implication that I should have run it with mods. The context was the instability of the stock game here.

However, it matters not, really. I still love my SHIII; Modded to hell and back _and_ running superbly here. *grin* Besides, if you're going to play WWII subs, you HAVE to do U-boats! ...unless you watched a slew of American WWII sub movies in row, as I did before finally trying out SH4. *bigger grin*

[Sailor Steve]

As I've said many times, SH4 with Operation Monsun and it's follow-on OMEGU is every bit as good as anything SH3 has to offer, and more stable if anything. I've had to be very careful with mod mixes and matches in SH3. I've had a couple of failures with SH4, but not nearly as many, and removing the offending mod always fixed it.

Stock SH4 has some crashing problems that are fixed by the mods, and some that were fixed by the 1.5 add-on patch. As I said, for me it is very stable, and I think it may be because some of the things SH3 mods try to achieve came with SH4.

[Ducimus]

Besides, if you're going to play WWII subs, you HAVE to do U-boats!

Hmmm, Indeed. I see the problem now.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/40/76670805_f662fce4e2_o.jpg

Well, enjoy.

[Von -E]

Stock SH4 has some crashing problems that are fixed by the mods, and some that were fixed by the 1.5 add-on patch.

I'm running with 1.5... which mods fix any basic game crashes?

As I said, for me it is very stable, and I think it may be because some of the things SH3 mods try to achieve came with SH4.

I don't doubt that there is well over 99% chance the problem is my system. (as I said, I searched and found no one with a similar problem)

[Hook]

When I started playing SH3 again in March after a long absence, I played about 50 hours of the stock game with minimal mods. It was still the same game I remembered fondly from 2006.

When I first loaded GWX3, well... there was more I disliked about it than I liked. I decided I'd play through a career to give it a chance and I'm currently about to finish my 6th patrol with over 500 hours of play. Along the way I reverted a number of things back to the stock version, and adjusted some mods to be what I preferred. At this point I'd say there's a lot to like about GWX3, but it's not the reason I play the game. When I'm done with this career, I intend to go back to stock, with some of the adjustments I made to GWX3.

I got my fill of American subs in the Pacific in the original Silent Hunter. Some of us would really rather play German subs. The fact that SH4 was another Pacific game was the only reason I didn't buy it... well, that and bad memories of StarForce. Yes, I know about the U-boat mods currently available.

As for the differences in the games, ever since the original the graphics have improved and some play options have been removed. For example, the original had sprite graphics for enemy ships but you could take one or both engines offline for whatever reason and you could set your dive planes manually. And you had a bathythermograph(sp?) to tell you when temperatures changed so you could use thermal layers to your advantage. Given that the U-boat Commander's Handbook talks about monitoring temperatures, it's fairly likely that the Germans had a similar instrument.

There's nothing wrong with stock SH3, and there are people still playing it.

I'll probably eventually try SH4, and even SH5, as I like some of the concepts. But the way it's going, by SH7 you'll have a photorealistic view of your office in BdU HQ and the only time you'll see a submarine is when you go on an inspection tour. If you can even go to sea at all, it will be as an observer.

Hook

[Gerald]

I have play both,but I prefer to stay to SH3,and this is simple, there are so much thing
I need to enjoy and carry out so in meantime I stay sharp for hunting down enemy in SH3
:up:

[Paul Riley]

I have play both,but I prefer to stay to SH3,and this is simple, there are so much thing
I need to enjoy and carry out so in meantime I stay sharp for hunting down enemy in SH3
:up:

You still cant beat the grim atmosphere of the Atlantic in a storm :arrgh!:

[Gerald]

You still cant beat the grim atmosphere of the Atlantic in a storm :arrgh!: You see 50nm south from galveston, and you need some rest :haha:

BTW Jim post a message to you under the post" Map and chart for mines and net in U.S and Canada cost"

[Paul Riley]

BTW Jim post a message to you under the post" Map and chart for mines and net in U.S and Canada cost"

Thanks for the reminder!
You are a good man Vendor,I like you mate :up:

[Gerald]

Thanks for the reminder!
You are a good man Vendor,I like you mate :up:

I appriciate that, for you are the same. :cool:

[Sailor Steve]

I don't doubt that there is well over 99% chance the problem is my system. (as I said, I searched and found no one with a similar problem)
Good point. For some odd reason every time I try to use the GWX Enhanced Damage mod my system crashes, even with my new graphics card and memory upgrade, which is funny because the GWX team were very careful to make sure that it would run on weaker systems. So I use RB's SH4 Effects For SH3, which is much more graphics intensive, and it runs just fine. I have no idea why that should be, but sometimes a system just doesn't like a particular mod. :-?

[Jimbuna]

Good point. For some odd reason every time I try to use the GWX Enhanced Damage mod my system crashes, even with my new graphics card and memory upgrade, which is funny because the GWX team were very careful to make sure that it would run on weaker systems. So I use RB's SH4 Effects For SH3, which is much more graphics intensive, and it runs just fine. I have no idea why that should be, but sometimes a system just doesn't like a particular mod. :-?

Very odd...but that seems to make you 'the exception to the rule'...I wonder why that is? :hmmm:

[Sailor Steve]

Very odd...but that seems to make you 'the exception to the rule'...I wonder why that is? :hmmm:
I very much agree, and I don't know. GWX Enhanced Damage is much less graphics-intensive than the SH4 To SH3 mod, yet even with severe lag I get no crash from that one. Reload GWX ED and as soon as a ship sinks, bye-bye SH3.

I can't figure it out, but it's nothing I can't live with. I basically mentioned it just to agree with Von-E that sometimes these things just happen. One person gets a weirdness that doesn't seem to affect anyone else.

[Von -E]

I basically mentioned it just to agree with Von-E that sometimes these things just happen. One person gets a weirdness that doesn't seem to affect anyone else.

Just for the record, I have never, repeat; never, refuted my weirdness. Oh! You meant the game! Never mind... *grin*

[Sailor Steve]

Just for the record, I have never, repeat; never, refuted my weirdness. Oh! You meant the game! Never mind... *grin*
It's always good to have like-minded people join in the fun. Pop over to the General Topics forum. Lots of vicious infighting there, but lots of fun as well. Truly weird weirdness. :rock:

[Snestorm]

Never tryed SH4.
The Pacific just doesn't hold my interest as much as The Atlantic.

[Gerald]

Never tryed SH4.
The Pacific just doesn't hold my interest as much as The Atlantic.

Shark in pacific,and huge distans, :zzz:

[Jimbuna]

It's always good to have like-minded people join in the fun. Pop over to the General Topics forum. Lots of vicious infighting there, but lots of fun as well. Truly weird weirdness. :rock:

It's that stuff they put in the water a tells ya :88)

[Von -E]

It's that stuff they put in the water a tells ya

U-boats?

[Herr-Berbunch]

Hydrogen and Oxygen, two very combustable elements, so why doesn't water burn?

Fried fish anyone...:gulp:

[Jimbuna]

Hydrogen and Oxygen, two very combustable elements, so why doesn't water burn?

Fried fish anyone...:gulp:


http://www.blognow.com.au/uploads/l/LIZZYFOREAL/57049.gif

[Sailor Steve]

Never tryed SH4.
The Pacific just doesn't hold my interest as much as The Atlantic.
People keep saying that, and we keep replying that with SH4 Gold and OpMonsun you can have a great time in u-boats.

[Snestorm]

People keep saying that, and we keep replying that with SH4 Gold and OpMonsun you can have a great time in u-boats.

Although I do prefer uboats to fleetboats, that isn't the big reason for my disinterest in SH4.
It's the familiarity with The Atlantic, and all that surrounds it, that I realy love.
No insult intended but, The Pacific is just too foreign to my own experiences.

[Sailor Steve]

But that's the point - I don't play Pacific in SH4, I run a u-boat in the ATLANTIC.

[Corsair]

Still sailing the Atlantic, not bored yet after all this time at sea in SH3. Am now spending my time at sea between NYGM 3.3 and Living SH3.

[Snestorm]

But that's the point - I don't play Pacific in SH4, I run a u-boat in the ATLANTIC.

Huh? (Shock!)
OK, you definately peaked my interest.
Please tell me more.

What date can I start?
What boats can I drive? (IXB?)
Will allied AI be better?

[Sailor Steve]

Operation Monsun. I'm currently running a IIA, VIIB and IXB, all three in 1939.

I don't have any screenshots from campaigns, but this is a water clarity test I did using a Type II at Kiel.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/SailorSteve/Silent%20Hunter%20Screenshots/SH4Img2010-06-03_074405_156.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/SailorSteve/Silent%20Hunter%20Screenshots/SH4Img2010-06-03_073551_125.jpg

Oh, and the link:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=134922

[Gerald]

Operation Monsun. I'm currently running a IIA, VIIB and IXB, all three in 1939.

I don't have any screenshots from campaigns, but this is a water clarity test I did using a Type II at Kiel.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/SailorSteve/Silent%20Hunter%20Screenshots/SH4Img2010-06-03_074405_156.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/SailorSteve/Silent%20Hunter%20Screenshots/SH4Img2010-06-03_073551_125.jpg

Oh, and the link:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=134922
:ping:

[Herr-Berbunch]

I think 4 may have to go on soon looking at those shots, and knowing I can leave the pacific for the wet, cold, windy North Atlantic! Obviously patched and modded...

Thanks again guys! :yeah:

[Sailor Steve]

On the other hand...

Lest anyone thinks I'm advocating abandoning SH3 for SH4, I need to say again that I also still play SH3 because with SH4 I still don't have:

Complete harbors

Working up/down flags and DFA (loop antenna)

Flakmonkey's Interiors

Diving Duck's Open Hatch

Simfeeling 6-Dials mod

SH3 Commander

All those things mean something to me. As I keep saying, SH4 has been neglected in the "immersion" mods department. I keep hoping...

[Snestorm]

It looks OK, but I think it simpler to just stick with SH3 for now.

I will however, do some more reading on the topic.
Thank you for the link. At minimum, it should provide some interesting reading.

[Sailor Steve]

It looks OK, but I think it simpler to just stick with SH3 for now.

I will however, do some more reading on the topic.
Thank you for the link. At minimum, it should provide some interesting reading.
I don't blame you a bit. As I said, I play both. I just wanted to clear up the 'Pacific' thing. :sunny:

[Snestorm]

I don't blame you a bit. As I said, I play both. I just wanted to clear up the 'Pacific' thing. :sunny:

Glad you did, as I love exploring this kind of stuff.
Often enough, it also triggers some self-modding idés, which always leaves me in a bind to answer "what mods are you running?".

[Platapus]

Oh, and thanks for your answers guys. I'll stick with 3 for the time being, there is no rush for 4.


no hurry at all. You wanna know something weird?

Every time I start up a new career in SH4, them Japanese bomb Pear Harbour. Every single time!

Probably, when you decide to start a new career in SH4, them Japanese will probably oblige you the same way.

[Sailor Steve]

Not if he starts an unterseeboot career! :D