Is SH3 for me? [Archive] - SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

Flaxpants

06-16-10, 10:20 PM

Hi everyone, I'm new around here and am interested in buying the Silent Hunter game after having a friend of mine raving about it incessantly, so I figure it's time to give it a go myself. I have a couple questions about different versions of the game and which one I should go for- my friend plays SH5 but I can rule this version out immediately due to the required internet connection- where I live there is no decent internet connection and would rather avoid relying on it to be able to play myself. Needless to say I am mostly interested in the single player game.
I have been reading up online about the other versions and trying to get a feel for which one is most highly regarded, and most of the positive comments I'm finding are for SH3. SH1 & 2 are too old for me as I want to have semi decent graphics. So my questions to you guys are: SH3 or SH4? Which in your opinion is the best all-round game and why? Whichever version I buy, I would also want to obtain any/all official expansions at the same time, so presumably there is a 'gold' edition or something that will give me the complete game?
Anything you can tell me would be most useful and much appreciated.
Thanks in advance!

Ducimus

06-16-10, 10:43 PM

>>where I live there is no decent internet connection

Yup, SH5, is right out.

>>Needless to say I am mostly interested in the single player game.

You've come to the right place

>>SH1 & 2 are too old for me

Me too.

>> as I want to have semi decent graphics.

Define semi decent?

>>So my questions to you guys are: SH3 or SH4?

That i think depends on what your into, and how you define "semi decent graphics".

If your into Uboats, partial to the atlantic theater, and don't mind a graphic engine that is a little dated, then SH3 is definatly a good choice.

If your not partial to any theater, and want a game that looks a little better graphicly, then SH4 is a good choice.

>>Which in your opinion is the best all-round game and why?

Though i admit im biased (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2VpKJFVdmA) here, cause i spent the last few years modding SH4 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=132330), i have to admit it is a mixed bag. In a nutshell......

Everything about SH3 as a game engine works correctly. It's a little dated around the edges, slow to load, but it's a solid platform, has great atmosphere, and it freaking works.

SH4, you have more choices. With the mods available you have around, (and im over generalizing), something like 10 to 12 different types of submarines to play with, in two different theaters of war. In SH3 you have half that, and only one theater of war. That said, while the game looks better graphically, some things that used to function in SH3, no longer function correctly in SH4 (and even less so in SH5 :nope: ).

So really, it all depends on what your into. Personally, if i was a die hard Uboat fan, i think id be playing SH3. I'm a bit more rounded though, so ive been sticking with SH4, with some brief forays into SH5.

krashkart

06-16-10, 10:52 PM

I've experienced SH3, so that's the only one I can recommend. ;)

Flaxpants

06-16-10, 11:05 PM

Thanks for your prompt and thorough reply Ducimus, nice one.
In answer to your questions- re semi-decent graphics, yes, a bit vague I know!. I guess so long as they're not terribly dated I am cool with that. What's more important to me is the fun- if the gameplay is good and the atmosphere captures the 'thrill of the hunt', then my imagination can quite happily fill in the blanks. Having said that- a nice looking game is, well, nice to look at.
I'm not a U-boat fanatic per se, its the gameplay I'm after, I'm also not really that bothered about which theatre/era I'm playing in, so long as I get to blow stuff up!
When you say SH4 has more choices, are you referrng to the game engine itself or the modding options? As an example, I mostly play sim type games, FSX, Arma2 etc.. I tend to like the more in-depth games that allow me to exercise a fine level of control, I don't know if there is any difference in the level of detail in that regard between SH3 and SH4?
Thanks again.

pickinthebanjo

06-16-10, 11:09 PM

I own both, I prefer SH3 mainly because of the Atlantic theater but SH4 has that as well (Some mod I used in the past. I can't recall the name, it's common though) but also because I find SH4 to be troublesome. I like the plane attacks alot more in SH4 but thats about it, the american subs confuse the hell out of me (it's that damn hydrophone/SONAR and that TDC) but I also find it to be less stable than SH3.

SH3 has alot more mods available to choose from that include the sub interiors (Diesel room, Officers quarters/Mess, Crew quarters and the galley) as well as the new Merchant fleet mod, and many supermods that alter the game in many ways. The greaphics are fine by me, I sound SH4's to be chunky. (and the crew always stared at me, it was unnerving)

With mods like SH4 effects, GWX Enhanced Damage effects, and SH5 water you can get pretty much what your looking for but with more stability, immersion and realism.

timmy41

06-16-10, 11:17 PM

SH3 :yeah:

Ducimus

06-16-10, 11:44 PM

>>I guess so long as they're not terribly dated I am cool with that. What's more important to me is the fun- if the gameplay is good and the atmosphere captures the 'thrill of the hunt', then my imagination can quite happily fill in the blanks

SH3 might be your speed then. As graphics go, compare screenshot threads in SH3 and SH4 forums. Id suggest starting at the end of those threads and work your way backwards.

>>When you say SH4 has more choices, are you referrng to the game engine itself or the modding options?

Theater and submarine options.
You can play operation Monson (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=134922) for uboats, and TMO and RFB for fleet boats. All told with OM, you can play Type II B/C/D, Type VII B/C/C41/D, Type IX, Type IX B/C/C40/D2, Type XXI, Type XXIII on the uboat side of the house, or S boat, Porpoise, salmon, sargo, tambor/gar, gato, balao, tench, and narwhal classes on the fleet boat side.

>>in-depth games that allow me to exercise a fine level of control,

level of control is about the same in SH3 and SH4 really.

--------------------------------

>>SH3 has alot more mods available to choose from that include the sub interiors

Sh4 is catching up in that department.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=158706
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=155147

and here, which is arguably mod of the year:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=170944

Get those 3 works combined, and it'll kick ass.

>>(and the crew always stared at me, it was unnerving)

That was fixed.

FIREWALL

06-17-10, 12:13 AM

SHCommander is the deal maker for SH3 GWX.

If SH4 with TMO or ATO had a Commander it would be a hard decision if I had to choose only one. SH3 or SH4.

Ducimus

06-17-10, 12:41 AM

SH3 commander is an excellent point. One more point i forgot to mention in SH3's favor is the UI. I've always liked the SH3 UI better then the SH4 orders bar. That said, wide screen monitors may or may not be an issue. Im not sure how that widescreen mod works out. Ive always been blessed with a full size (not widescreen) 19" LCD

Sailor Steve

06-17-10, 12:42 AM

SHCommander is the deal maker for SH3 GWX.

If SH4 with TMO or ATO had a Commander it would be a hard decision if I had to choose only one. SH3 or SH4.
Perfectly said. SH3 Commander makes the difference for me as well.

That said, though SH4 does break a couple of things, it also does a couple of things better. So the choice is tougher.

I think Ducimus summed it up about as well as it can be. Look at screen shots to see if the graphics make a difference for you, and ask more questions. Most of us who play both will be glad to say what we like best about each.

SH3: The graphics are dated, but only a little. Lots of folks gladly ignore that because the game is more complete than any other so far, and has mods galore. If you like sailing in and out of harbors looking at the sights, and if you like having merchants you've sunk get historic names, and if you like seeing the sights along the Kiel Canal and blimps escorting convoys, then SH3 is the only way to go.

SH4: Much less graphics mod work so far, but plenty of work in the places where it counts. Excellent campaign mods for both sides of the war, much more believable graphics, better crew management and much more stable, and the graphics engine requires a bit more horsepower but is much less likely to crash on you. If you want to play a u-boat campaign as good as any in SH3 and a US Pacific campaign (or three) as well, then SH4 is your baby.

Or you can be like a lot of us and play both. :sunny:

Flaxpants

06-17-10, 12:56 AM

Sailor Steve: "If you like sailing in and out of harbors looking at the sights, and if you like having merchants you've sunk get historic names, and if you like seeing the sights along the Kiel Canal and blimps escorting convoys, then SH3 is the only way to go."

What you've said here is exactly the kind of thing I like. Are these features due to the range of mods available? Or is it something about the game?

I must say what an affable and helpful bunch you are on these forums!

nemchenk

06-17-10, 03:19 AM

One point about SH3 -- you will need to download a whole bunch of mods to get the most of it, which might be an issue on a flaky or slow internet connection...

maillemaker

06-17-10, 06:36 AM

I play SH3 with the GWX (Grey Wolves Expansion) mod and the Lifeboats & Debris mod. That's it. I play 100% realism which means no external camera views so many of the eye-candy mods don't apply to me.

The game is extremely compelling and customizable. I find the graphics fantastic though I wish there was better widescreen support.

Some of the things that I find great about SH3 are:

* Highly customizable realism settings. These allow you to get into the game quickly. Especially the auto TDC (target data computer), which basically makes shooting torpedoes a point-and-shoot affair.

* A deep sense of investment in your u-boat and crew. It takes several successful patrols before you earn enough renown to get your crew built up with enough medals and qualifications to maximize your crew and u-boat's efficiency. Many people play "Dead is Dead" with no "do-overs" so it stings to have invested 10 hours in your boat and crew and have it lost.

* A compelling sense of accomplishment. This is really the key to any game, in my opinion, whether it is SH3 or Farmville. The game is addictive because it fuels a sense of accomplishment, especially with harder difficulty levels. You randomly find ships to sink (and random reinforcement is much stronger than consistent reinforcement, this is a psychological fact). You earn renown based on tonnage sunk so you are always gunning for more tonnage. You earn rank for yourself, awards for yourself, and rank, awards, and skills for your crew.

And as the war progresses, the game gets harder, so the sense of accomplishment grows stronger. I myself have never made it through the war without dying, and that is frustrating and inspiring at the same time.

That's my take on SH3.

Steve

Brag

06-17-10, 07:16 AM

After an 18 month absense. Yesterday, I downloaded GWX3. I am absolutely delighted with it. :DL

jangles

06-17-10, 07:59 AM

IVe been playing SH3 with GWX for just under a week now , I have to say I am really enjoying it.

Im completely new to the whole sub sim scene.

One thing I would say tho - its a real time-sink , the last couple of nights for me have gone in a flash :dead: (been late for work a few times too!)

At the mo im am playing at 34% realism , the default , I will in time change it so that its a bit harder (manual targeting, contacts etc).

I left my crew surfaced last night, in very stormy seas of the outer hebrides with the gramaphone playing - I will be ordering them back to work tonight tho..

Jimbuna

06-17-10, 08:39 AM

What you've said here is exactly the kind of thing I like. Are these features due to the range of mods available? Or is it something about the game?

Mainly down to the range of mods available.

Herr-Berbunch

06-17-10, 08:54 AM

I played SH2 whilst in Basrah 2003 (safer back then), somebody elses game and somebody elses laptop, loved it. FFwd 2010 saw SH3 on ebay and had flashback to happy times so bid and won, before I'd got it I'd bid and won on SH4 too. Both arrived within days, SH3 installed, stumbled across SubSim.com, mods downloaded and many questions answered. I play usually only a couple of nights a week but can't get enough.

SH4? Well, it's still on the shelf - not even installed it yet? Maybe one day I will but for now, and the foreseeable, SH3 and it's constant stream of mods is enough.

SH5? Well until very recently my computer wasn't good enough to run it but now I have a new one I'm still not even contemplating it until DRM/Server-tie free and mods as good as GWX are available!

Hope this helps, let me recap...

SH3, SH3, SH3, SH3, SH3, SH3, SH3... ad infinitum!

Welcome aboard! :salute:

Sailor Steve

06-17-10, 09:12 AM

What you've said here is exactly the kind of thing I like. Are these features due to the range of mods available? Or is it something about the game?
The awesome harbors come with GWX, WAC and LSH3. All are different, all are cool. The blimp-escorted convoys is a GWX thing. There is a mod that creates the locks at each end of the Kiel Canal, and another that updates Wilhelmshaven to be much more accurate, and adds working gates to the locks there and at Kiel, so you actually have to wait for the gate to open before entering the lock.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/SailorSteve/Silent%20Hunter%20Screenshots/SH3Img6-5-2010_215518_187.jpg

My current SH3 mods list:

GWX 3.0
GWX 3 Wil, St Naz and Schluese and other units - Bigboywooly
GWX Community Units
Das Boot Officers - AIL
Small Moon - AIL
Das Boot Sound Mod SH3
DBSM SH3 Speech Fix
Ultimate Aircraft Sounds
Spirit of Machines - Einbecker
Torpedo Fire (German) v1.02 - Ktl_KUrtz
No Rank Or Medals On Crew - Dertien
Remove GWX Compass - ichso
Simfeeling 6-Dials Mod - FLB_ U-999
Clean Nav Map
Assisted Plotting Mod
English-To-German Names - Phoenix3000
Historically Accurate U-Boat Emblems - Conus
Halo Not Visible Through Body - Anvart
New Compass Graphics U-505 - Hitman
Port People - Pascal
My Favorite Uniforms - New Uniforms and Das Boot Clothes
Realistic Blueprint Damage Screens - Pascal
Remove Station Labels
SH3 Color Icons - Capt. Teach
SH4 Maptools for SH3 - Racerboy (aka TheDarkWraith)
Waterstream+Exhaust Kombimod v2.3 - Rubini/Racerboy/h.sie
Modified Searchlight Beams - OLC
U-Boat Bases Map with New St. Nazaire - meduza

GWX Ships Buoyancy and Draft Mod
GWX DFa Flags and Pennants 2010 - Anvart
VIIB Early War Skin -
Clearsky Clouds - Rubini
Conning Tower Open Hatch
Decks Awash + Fuel Economy - Wreford-Brown
Open Hatch Conning Deck Cam Fix - Diving Duck
Dfa_UpDnRot+Flags - Anvart
Extras for Wilhelmshaven Campaign - Wreford-Brown
FM New Interior - FlakMonkey
FM NI Fix for FM30 UpDown - FlakMonkey
FM30 UpDown - Anvart
Lifeboats & Debris - Rubini
New Freecam Mod - Asanovic7
No Continuous 'Ship Spotted'
Open Hatch Mod 3.09 - Diving Duck
Open Hatch Conning Deck Cam Fix - Diving Duck
Ricks GWX Rec Manual Final
Rowers For Lifeboats - Privateer
Seabed Repair Mod
Searchlights Removed -
SH4 Effects for SH3 - Racerboy/TheDarkWraith
SH5 Water for GWX 0.9 20 Km -
Sober's 3D Waves - Sober
Torpedo Damage Final -
Type IIa Flags & Pennants - Anvart
Type VIIa Features - Wreford-Brown
Type IIb AI Camo - Sean (changed to IIA)
Type VIIb Early War Skin

Tools

SH3 Commander - JScones
SH3 Weather - Sqweetis
SH3 Contacts - Nicolás

So there is a huge variety of things you can do with SH3. SH4 has a long way to go to catch up, which is unfortunate because as I said it is overall a much better game. So I play both.

Flaxpants

06-17-10, 10:30 PM

Well, thankyou mucho everyone for your input and enlightening me on the merits of both games, I really appreciate you all taking the time. I think I've already made my decision- I'm going to get both! Reckon I'll start off with SH3 so I can get a full understanding of a properly working game, and also to get a grip with the obviously wide variety of great mods that seem to be out there- had a good look at loads of screenshots and the graphics look passable to me- the gameplay is more important in my book anyway. This will set me up nicely for SH4 when that game has the support that obviously SH3 does- plus I will know when that time comes.
A quick question: What screen resolutions is SH3 capable of? I have a 19" (1440 * 900) monitor. Presumably SH4 will have no problems with that?
Again, cheers to you all, I owe you a beer!
F

Falkirion

06-18-10, 12:08 AM

Sailor Steve

06-18-10, 01:43 AM

SH3+GWX gold+SH3 Commander=Best silent hunter experience ever. I prefer the Atlantic theatre because of the ease of locating convoys and the varied responses throughout the war. And the deeper diving depth of the German subs which just look better than American fleet boats.
Not an issue. As said many times, SH4 UBM lets you play German subs, and OM lets you play them all in a full Atlantic campaign.

Flaxpants

06-18-10, 04:52 AM

Herr-Berbunch

06-18-10, 05:12 AM

Ah yes, promotion! You'll need a bit more rank before you can afford to buy us all those promised beers...

A good choice with SH3+mods. :salute:

Jimbuna

06-18-10, 06:19 AM

Righto, I've ordered SH3, should get it in a week or so. Also downloaded the 1.4b patch, GWX gold and SH3 Commander 3.2. So I should be all set now. Just checked the manual for GWX, man, its over 600 pages long! Really excited about getting this going now, thanks for your help all, no doubt I'll be back with some more questions after next week!
Cheers,
F

I see I'm a 'Nub' now and not a 'Bilge Rat'. Nice!

Good choice http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

You will also need the GWX3 CFG for SH3 Commander:

http://www.filefront.com/12815500/GWX3_CFG_for_SH3Commanders.exe

Brag

06-18-10, 07:33 AM

Ah yes, promotion! You'll need a bit more rank before you can afford to buy us all those promised beers...

A good choice with SH3+mods. :salute:

Balz will be ready for beer swilling once he gets back from his first patrol :D

On the eve of war,Hr is presently in Cherbourg :salute:

Jimbuna

06-18-10, 11:36 AM

Balz will be ready for beer swilling once he gets back from his first patrol :D

On the eve of war,Hr is presently in Cherbourg :salute:
Get him to check the stores/provisions Bernard has stowed away because I have photographic evidence that will have you ROFL.

Clue....It comes in a can :03:

Sailor Steve

06-18-10, 11:50 AM

Righto, I've ordered SH3, should get it in a week or so. Also downloaded the 1.4b patch...
Be advised - if you've ordered a brand-new copy of SH3, it's almost certainly already patched to 1.4b. If you try to run the patch and get a message saying it's the wrong version, then you're probably okay just the way you are, and can go ahead and run GWX that way.

Just wanted to warn you in advance, because it is fairly common to see posts here asking for help with that, or "What did I do wrong?" Newer copies of SH3 are already patched.

HarlockGN

06-18-10, 01:11 PM

My current SH3 mods list:

This really is a godsend. I've been looking all other for a list of the best SH3 mods to go back from SH5 and get a more complete experience :D But the number and variety of mods available was a bit daunting. Now I have something to start from :D

Kaleu Jonas

06-18-10, 01:19 PM

do you have a more complete interior like in sh5 in the gwx mod?

Sailor Steve

06-18-10, 01:26 PM

do you have a more complete interior like in sh5 in the gwx mod?
No, but FlakMonkey's New Interiors mod gives you everything from the forward head to the engine room. Only the torpedo rooms are still missing.

And it's compatible with all the supermods. :rock:

Sailor Steve

06-18-10, 01:30 PM

This really is a godsend. I've been looking all other for a list of the best SH3 mods to go back from SH5 and get a more complete experience :D But the number and variety of mods available was a bit daunting. Now I have something to start from :D
Jimbuna is much more diligent than I am when it comes to testing new mods. His lists are much longer than mine, and he guarantees what he has tested.

Mine is just the mods I like. You might notice that I have them separated by breaks. This is because I don't like clutter. The first set is all the mods I know I like and I've tested. They are installed directly, not using JSGME, because I know they work together. The second set is the ones I'm still experimenting with, so they are in my JSGME MODS folder. The 'Tools' are of course the ones that work outside the game, and are installed to the 'Silent Hunter III' folder, so are not really mods.

I'm happy with my setup so far, but there is always something new coming out, and sometimes it supercedes an older one, so I can get rid of one I've been using but don't need anymore.

Jimbuna

06-18-10, 03:30 PM

Jimbuna is much more diligent than I am when it comes to testing new mods. His lists are much longer than mine, and he guarantees what he has tested.

Go on ya bugga, pass the buck :DL

Sailor Steve

06-18-10, 06:01 PM

Go on ya bugga, pass the buck :DL
Just giving credit where it's due. After September I can go back to claiming it all for myself. I have this skin condition, you see - it likes not being flayed off my bones.

Jimbuna

06-19-10, 09:44 AM

Just giving credit where it's due. After September I can go back to claiming it all for myself. I have this skin condition, you see - it likes not being flayed off my bones.

LOL :DL

pickinthebanjo

06-19-10, 10:18 AM

This really is a godsend. I've been looking all other for a list of the best SH3 mods to go back from SH5 and get a more complete experience :D But the number and variety of mods available was a bit daunting. Now I have something to start from :D

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=170744
Here is a thread I started awhile ago that could help you, it contains lists of people's mod setups

Flaxpants

06-20-10, 09:51 PM

Monday- back to work. Groan. At least I have the internet here. Thanks for all the further comments, my beer bill is going up- May have to order an Uberjug to cover this lot! Of course the chances of me making it back from my first patrol are rather slim.....
In response to some of your comments- it is a new version I am getting so will check which version it is before attempting to patch it. I also did get hold of the config installer for GWX/SH3, so I'm on top of that.

I can see that I have a fairly steep learning curve re all the available mods. In additon to the ones I have got already, I am quite interested in FlakMonkeys interior mod and the SH5 water mod, so will get a hold of those as well for starters, others I can learn about as I go.

Managed to pick up a copy of 'Das Boot' (book) at the weekend, been years since I saw the movie, so thought this would give me some useful u-boat knowledge to prepare me for my long weeks at sea.
F

Jimbuna

06-21-10, 07:11 AM

SINK EM ALL!! http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

Paul Riley

06-21-10, 08:01 AM

A quick reply here,
If you havent played or bought SH3 do it,you will NOT regret it,so long as you have lots of patience,which you will need in order to learn the finer points to the game.
Regarding SH4 I would wait a while,because from what I have read about the game so far there are too many shortcomings to make this even comparable to the legendary SH3 (with all the right addons I might add,inc. GWX3),as I say,we will have to wait and see.

EDIT - Sorry,that last reference was for the upcoming SHV game,I have not played SH4 myself,but I have heard many good things being said about it,ultimately it will all depend on your theatre preference,the European/American theatre,or the US/Japanese/Pacific theatre,for me I am most definitely for the former!.

Good luck!

Gorshkov

06-21-10, 06:51 PM

I'd like to know briefly what game features are screwed-up in SH4+UBM as compared with SH3?

Sailor Steve

06-21-10, 11:29 PM

SH4 started life with some of the same problems SH3 had, plus some new ones. Five patches have corrected most of them, and SH4 UBM is an okay game, made great by Operation Monsun. It has every bit of the gameplay of SH3, but still lacks a lot of the cool graphic stuff like complete harbors etc. Mostly what it's still missing is the visual immersion. Other than that SH4+UBM+OM is a fantastic experience.

Flaxpants

07-07-10, 11:09 PM

Just thought I'd give y'all an update after all your help. I can now answer my own question- "Is SH3 for me?"- OH YES IT IS BY GOODNESS! It finally arrived a few days ago, gave it a brief test run before installing GWX gold and SH3 commander, and have now set off on my first patrol with the 2nd Flotilla, currently on my way through the English Channel to my target grid reference. My concerns about the graphics were unfounded, it looks great, in fact the whole game looks amazing, the UI design, all the charts and maps and reference books etc have all been beautifully crafted. GWX and Commander, although I'm just scratching the surface right now, look absolutely amazing, the graphics improvement that GWX added was very impressive.
Now I feel I am on my way to becoming a hopeless addict, and look forward to hanging around on these forums discussing this awesome game. Goodness knows why I had missed this in the past- better late than never. Thanks for all your guidance once again- beers allround!

Sailor Steve

07-07-10, 11:31 PM

Good. The more addicts the better! :sunny:

When you're ready to add even more, start here.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=170090

Flaxpants

07-08-10, 12:38 AM

Don't worry Sir! I have been studying the mods in great detail, thanks to your earlier recommendations. I have downloaded a few already and plan to start introducing them when I'm next back in port. First off I reckon I will go with FM Interiors and the Water streams mods which look great. I was going to add SH5 water as well but reckon I may hold off on that for a while as there's something about the SH3 water that I quite like, it has a sort of surreal appearance which adds a certain charm in my opinion!
I have copied and pasted your mod list for reference and will be using it in future as you seem to be a man in the know!
F

FIREWALL

07-08-10, 12:58 AM

Flaxpants

07-08-10, 01:19 AM

Hehe, yes, that'll be next on the list, but with 3 kids in the house I reckon it's going to take me a few years to get through SH3!
Of course being a few years behind most of you here I will be able to work my way through the series knowing that all the hard development work will have already been done by the time I arrive and I can just mosey on in to a perfect game set up with all the mods I'll ever need. Spoiled- that's what I am!
Gimme a year, then I'll get SH4, and by the time I come to buying it SH5 it might actually be working and they will have probably done away with the DRM crap by then as well.
F

frau kaleun

07-08-10, 09:12 AM

Just thought I'd give y'all an update after all your help. I can now answer my own question- "Is SH3 for me?"- OH YES IT IS BY GOODNESS!

:yeah:

It finally arrived a few days ago, gave it a brief test run before installing GWX gold and SH3 commander, and have now set off on my first patrol with the 2nd Flotilla, currently on my way through the English Channel

I'm assuming that you've started your career prior to the opening of hostilities... at which time that route is easy peasy. But after the war starts:

STAY OUT OF THE CHANNEL!!*

*copyright Jimbuna

Now I feel I am on my way to becoming a hopeless addict, and look forward to hanging around on these forums discussing this awesome game. Goodness knows why I had missed this in the past- better late than never. Thanks for all your guidance once again- beers allround!

Gute jagd und fette beute!

Bummy

07-08-10, 09:27 AM

I'm on the same situation again, I have tested SH3 and SH4 and now can't decide whether to start campaign on SH3 or SH4 as Atlantic is still only real place to sink ships. You will surely enjoy SH3, t's at least for me visually enough, it just for some odd reason seems to work slower than SH4 + OM.. Gameplay seems to be about even but then there's really many great mods for SH3.. It's so hard to decide!

Welcome to the forums even if it's a bit lately said :yeah:
I've noticed that's great place.

Jimbuna

07-08-10, 10:15 AM

STAY OUT OF THE CHANNEL!!*

*copyright Jimbuna

http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/greywolftail.gif

Flaxpants

07-08-10, 10:25 PM

I started my career August 1st 1939, presumably the default start date as I didn't change that in the setup. At what date does the English Channel become a dangerous place to be? Right now I'm approx 50 miles west of Southampton and so far only had a couple contacts from the hydrophone, one merchant which got away from me, and a warship which I decided to avoid by staying under and creeping away. So far so good- went through a huge storm as I entered the Channel which lasted about 36 hours, lightning going off from all sides- nightime vis was practically zero, the boat had to have been lilting around 60 deg, started to feel a bit giddy, must admit! Simulated sea-sickness- awesome!
F

Sailor Steve

07-08-10, 10:29 PM

The war starts on September 1st when Germany invades Poland. England doesn't enter the war until two days later - September 3rd. The Channel is a nice place to visit until then.

I use SH3 Commander to start a career on August 19th, when 14 u-boats were actually sent out to the North Atlantic. :sunny:

Flaxpants

07-08-10, 10:47 PM

In that case I'll make sure I take a different route home! What about the Irish Sea, is that passable or am I best to go the long way round?

Sailor Steve

07-08-10, 11:01 PM

I don't know about in the game, but in real life the Irish Sea is the road to Liverpool, where all the convoys went and all the world's escorts too.

Probably a bad idea.

Pisces

07-09-10, 03:54 AM

In that case I'll make sure I take a different route home! What about the Irish Sea, is that passable or am I best to go the long way round?South of Ireland (Celtic Sea, Keltische See) is usually a good place to patrol. Many ships and convoys pass through there. You'll get plenty of contact reports on the map which you can go after, if you are patient enough. Being inside the Irish Sea is probably to dangerous. You are well under aircover and some patrolling surface ships. Merchants are also near their end waypoints of their final port, at which time they simply disappear. You may not have enough time to track them. Give yourself some playground.

Paul Riley

07-09-10, 07:36 AM

In that case I'll make sure I take a different route home! What about the Irish Sea, is that passable or am I best to go the long way round?

Dont go through the Irish Sea mate,go around the other side,west of Ireland,try and keep to where the sea is at its deepest a 100 or so km from land.Be mindful of air patrols too.It would then be wise to go around the north tip of Lerwick,but I usually take a short cut through the area between the Shetlands and the NE tip of Scotland,but that all depends on the year,later in the war it would be better to take a WIDE berth around Lerwick!,maybe even going around the Faroes instead.
If you're lucky you might run into some foul weather too up there :cool:

Jimbuna

07-09-10, 07:43 AM

In that case I'll make sure I take a different route home! What about the Irish Sea, is that passable or am I best to go the long way round?

Keep a sharp lookout for mines.

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/9596/mines.jpg (http://img823.imageshack.us/i/mines.jpg/)

frau kaleun

07-09-10, 07:54 AM

Also be aware that while the nation of Ireland is neutral throughout the war, Northern Ireland (as part of the UK) is not. You'll see this indicated on your nav map once hostilities begin - the ports of Ireland will be green but those in Northern Ireland will turn red. The waters between those ports and the Scottish coast may prove trickier than the Celtic Sea/St George's Channel to the south.

Pisces

07-09-10, 08:15 AM

Keep a sharp lookout for mines.

Good advice, however he still has some months before those things show up.

Jimbuna

07-09-10, 09:34 AM

Good advice, however he still has some months before those things show up.

Actually that may be dependant on which minefield one refers to....there is a range of dates across the board.

Gerald

07-09-10, 11:45 AM

Actually that may be dependant on which minefield one refers to....there is a range of dates across the board. unless, you ask the right person,obviously... :hmmm:

Jimbuna

07-09-10, 03:37 PM

unless, you ask the right person,obviously... :hmmm:

hehe :DL

Pisces

07-09-10, 04:34 PM

True, but he mentioned he is still in the August/September 1939 period.

Flaxpants

07-11-10, 09:55 PM

Thanks for all your advice- very useful. Actually I got as far as the cornish coast, spotted a lone merchant ship, nice clear weather- thought I'd have a go at the deck gun (I'm using manual tdc with map contacts on though still a little rusty with this and figured the deck gun was a surer bet) . Eventually blew him in half and then made the mistake of sitting around waiting for him to sink (I knew it was a mistake but couldn't help myself!). Anyway, whilst waiting for him to go down, another merchant turns up- thought my luck was in, only I had failed to notice a destroyer closing in fast from the opposite direction. Took avoiding action, crash dived to 130m or so and tried to sneak away. To no avail- the destroyer dropped depth charges on me, destroyed the engines, flooded the engine room and the whole thing was over in less than a minute!
Have now started another campaign, Mar 1941. This time I did go around well to the north or lerwick (in dreadful weather fortunately) and headed south in the deep water west of ireland. Made it to my patrol area and am now back in the hunt! I can see already how addictive this game can be- "just another 30 mins- maybe I'll spot something!"- It reminds me of fishing!
By the way, I have a few questions re the manual targeting, shall I ask them in this thread or should I start a new thread for that?
Thanks again for all your interest & help- best game forum I've ever been on, by a long shot.
F

RegioSommergibile

07-12-10, 03:00 AM

Well, it's always better not to hang around if you can help it, as the ship has the possibiliity to send a distress signal during or after the attack (imagine that a very dedicated radioman on board remained in his position at the radio and continued to send Mayday while his ship was sinking, as I think it could and would happen from time to time).

I committed the error of attacking a french Armed Trawler with a torpedo (it was quite tempting, and besides it's always a nice viwe to see those tiny things jump out of the water). Unfortunately it was not alone as there was a colleague in patrol with it, and said colleague started to search for me with lights and moreover called a Bourrasque class, or another armed trawler can't remember, from Calais to join the party.
I was luckier than you as I could slip away unnoticed, after trying to torpedo the other Armed Trawler for good measure.

Also I take occasion to warn you and others that might be interested that it's a very bad idea to use the cannon to sink a ship that is in a neutral port. I did just that in regard to a French Merchant that was in Den Helder port, Holland. All went well until my deck gun crew missed the ship and hit some building in the port itself. the Royal Dutch Navy jumped on me at once, and giving me something to ponder on (specifically, that they CAN hurt pretty badly someone if they want), sent me and my crew to shake hands with St. Peter.

Sailor Steve

07-12-10, 09:24 AM

Took avoiding action, crash dived to 130m or so and tried to sneak away. To no avail- the destroyer dropped depth charges on me, destroyed the engines, flooded the engine room and the whole thing was over in less than a minute!
I looked but couldn't find it - are you playing the stock game? Depth charges are laser-guided. GWX and the other supermods use three upgrades that change everything.

1. AI is much more realistic. Early in the war they are not as smart as they get later on.

2. Sonar, both active and passive, are limited in downward angle. They lose you at the last moment, so effectively they are dropping blind. If you are using a supermod go to flank speed and change both depth and course when you hear their engines accelerate.

3. Depth charges in the stock game are far too powerful. In the stock game they have a kill radius of 25 meters and a damage radius of 75 meters. Those are the correct numbers, but in feet! An early mod changed the kill radius to 8 meters and the damage radius to 25 meters, and all the supermods have done the same.

All the above combine to make a realistic experience in which you can be depth-charged for hours and still survive, or one lucky one can do you in.

By the way, I have a few questions re the manual targeting, shall I ask them in this thread or should I start a new thread for that?
Thanks again for all your interest & help- best game forum I've ever been on, by a long shot.
Here should be fine. Most of us see a new post on any thread and just have to check it out. It's as much an addiction as the game itself.
:rotfl2:

Flaxpants

07-13-10, 12:09 AM

Yes, I'm definately running GWX. I think the reason I was destroyed so quickly was that by the time I realised it, the destroyer was almost right on top of me, literally- I think they saw the learner plates on the back of my conning tower. There were about 3 or 4 charges went off, and I think by the time the third hit, my hull was breached pretty badly. Must of been close too as it was extremely loud and the boat tipped over probably 75 degrees. Spilled my coffee n'all.....

With regards my question about the tdc, I think I've worked it out now. I've watched just about every youtube clip I can find and read most of the guides on the subject. My query was basically about the procedures for inputing target data using a combination of both the notepad and manual entry into the tdc. It seems everyone has their own methods they like to use to find and input target data, and it seems to me that you can simply swith between notepad data entry and tdc manual entry at will, back & forth to your hearts desire. I just wanted to confirm that was the case, but have done a bit of testing and it seems as though it is. Let me know if I'm wrong. One thing is for sure- in bad weather it is really difficult to get accurate data using the notepad method of calculating, especially range. I couldn't hit the broadside of a barn in bad weather currently...

Sailor Steve

07-13-10, 09:13 AM

learner plates
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/SailorSteve/DDBait.jpg

Flaxpants

07-13-10, 10:47 PM

Lol, that's about right! Nice pic!

Kpt. Lehmann

07-13-10, 11:25 PM

...Must of been close too as it was extremely loud and the boat tipped over probably 75 degrees. Spilled my coffee n'all.....

THAT is the real shame! THAT'S COFFEE ABUSE!!! UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCE should coffee spillage occur! :stare: ;)

Flaxpants

07-14-10, 12:28 AM

Yes, I thought it was a little rude myself. By all means depth charge me, but show a little respect when I'm having my morning beverage. Jeez, some people...

sergei

07-14-10, 02:25 AM

Yes, I thought it was a little rude myself. By all means depth charge me, but show a little respect when I'm having my morning beverage. Jeez, some people...

..:D

Flaxpants

07-18-10, 10:39 PM

Hi all, just thought I'd give you an update on how the game is going for me after my first (complete) patrol. After 4 weeks at sea I finally managed to return home and dock at Kiel, still alive as well!- bonus- I'm getting the hang of it! I managed to rack up a whopping 0.0 tons of sunken shipping during my month away. To be honest I was a little wary of visiting the nightclub afterwards presuming they'd all be taking the p**s, but no, they were very polite!
One of the things that struck me most about this game is that it is mightily addictive- I just can't put it down, and even when I have put it down I still have a head full of pipes and gauges and bubbling noises (well, that bit's not too much different from the norm..). The fact I haven't sunk anything yet only adds to this feeling, once I've broken my duck (as opposed to my pressure hull), I can relax a bit, but right now I just want to go, go and go some more.
It's every bit as exciting as you all said, and hey, I owe you all some thanks for getting me into this, it's EPIC.
So my patrol wasn't completey fruitless, whenever I spotted a ship (even a friendly) I would calculate firing solutions, just for practice, so I feel I have a much better grip on that now- I have also learned to use the Hydrophone much more effectively. Looking back, I was a little too cautious, not attaking when I had the chance due to some unfavourable factor (weather, destroyer escort etc..) as I was holding out for an easier first kill. Of course that never materialised, next time things will be different, Muhahahah. I did actually have a go at trying to hit one ship, well, not so much a ship, more of a small trawler, (barely more than a kayak) not really very gentlemanly of me I know, but I figured it was a safe bet for some target practice. Anyway, my firing solution was spot on, the problem was the swell- just at the point my torpedo reached the boat, a huge wave came and lifted the boat clean out of the water, like the hand of God (that'll teach me to mess with fishermen), with my torp going clean underneath, I probably had the depth setting a little too deep anyway. Still, again, I learnt something to take with me on my next patrol.
To sum up SH3/GWX/Commander- Epic, Addictive, Immersive, and all the other good things!

Jimbuna

07-19-10, 02:38 PM

BE MORE AGGRESSIVE!! http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

Flaxpants

07-19-10, 09:58 PM

BE MORE AGGRESSIVE!! http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

I was expecting this very message from you this morning Jim, lol!

Jimbuna

07-20-10, 07:10 AM

I was expecting this very message from you this morning Jim, lol!

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/2772/thumbsupgv0.gif

Sailor Steve

07-20-10, 07:26 AM

I managed to rack up a whopping 0.0 tons of sunken shipping during my month away.
Been there, done that. One of my funniest moments (for me at least) came way back when I started my own thread just for my patrol logs. I tried to write them as realistically as I could, but I couldn't help interjecting just a little bit of personal point of view. So after an empty patrol I privately complained in my 'diary'. There were immediate replies telling me where to go in the game for the maximum tonnage.

I had a hard time convincing people that I wasn't interested, and that's not why I play the game.

Flaxpants

07-20-10, 10:45 PM

I take your point Steve, having a fruitless patrol actually makes this game feel more realistic to me. Having said that, if they were all fruitless patrols then I might get a tad frustrated!
I finally had my date with destiny last night when, after deciding to take a small 'detour' via the East coast of England in search of some serious bounty, I came across a big convoy travelling North, around 15-20 ships I would guess, and clearly several destroyers & gunships providing escort. I got myself into a decent position, at right angles to the convoy, and approximatley 4ks off to starboard (didn't fancy getting much closer), I had been very careful not to be spotted and everything was looking great. I knew this was going to be a potentially dangerous situation, maybe too dangerous as the max depth around where I was was only 60m or so, so no deep dive escape, plus there were some flanking escorts knocking around as well. Then the immortal words of Jimbuna came repeating into my head- "Be more aggressive!", "Sink 'em all!","Be more aggressive!", "Sink 'em all!", over & over. So I set up the TDC and a 4 tube salvo with a nice spread. Then I hit the fire button, and immediately dived to 40 m or so and plotted an escape route. 2 out of 4 of the torps met their mark on two seperate ships, the first didn't go down, but the second ship in the far column imploded and went down in spectacular fashion. So now I'm excited, my first kill, and a convoy in disarray. Oh how I laughed... that was until I saw 4 naval vessels converging on me at great speed. Now I was in a situation where I had no experience. I immediately recalled the scene in Das Boot where they are pursued by more than one enemy ship, and how they kept changing bearing, depth, speed, and whatever else might confuse the monsters lurking above on the surface. I did the same. Not only had three ships broken off from the convoy and come my way, but a fourth flanking vessel, which I had previously failed to notice was approaching from the direction I was attempting to escape, so now I was effectively encircled. I tried everything, and before long they were pinging me and commencing their depth charge runs. I manged to evade the bombs for a good 30 minutes or so, but eventually they closed me right down and I had nowhere to go. Two charges exploded right alongside the boat, killing several men in the sterm quarters and engine room and causing some serious flooding. The repair team got to work, but it was too late, the breach was so severe that they were overcome and the boat went down with all lives lost. R.I.P Captain Heinz Kawohl and his loyal crew.
So now what I need is some serious tips on how to survive depth charge attacks. I'm not sure if I should be trying to run at full speed, or if I should just sit there with everything shut down, probably a combination of the two. What is the general strategy when you start getting 'pinged'?- my current strategy is to wet myself and be indecisive, which doesn't work so well. I felt last night though that there was absolutely no hiding place, maybe I just got myself into a dreadful position from the outset and that was my problem, or maybe I should've never taken them on in the first place.
Hey Ho, this is sure a great game! Live or die- I love it!

frau kaleun

07-21-10, 07:46 AM

The repair team got to work, but it was too late, the breach was so severe that they were overcome and the boat went down with all lives lost. R.I.P Captain Heinz Kawohl and his loyal crew.

RIP, Kaleun. :salute:

Convoys sure are exciting, aren't they?

So now what I need is some serious tips on how to survive depth charge attacks.

My usual approach is very simple, I don't do anything that might result in a depth charge attack in less than 150m of water. This may turn out to be difficult in the near future since my current patrol grid is gonna put me too close to the coast for that, but maybe I'll get lucky and not have any contacts there. :O:

I'm not sure if I should be trying to run at full speed, or if I should just sit there with everything shut down, probably a combination of the two. What is the general strategy when you start getting 'pinged'?

Keep in mind that just because you can hear them pinging, doesn't mean they've actually located you, so don't panic just because they've broken out the ASDIC. Order silent running if you haven't already and stay that way unless you are damaged and must put men to work on repairs. Unless I believe they've got a lock on my position, I steer a course that will take me away from the scene of the action ASAP and stay on it.

Go as deep as you can, but it's not a bad idea to leave yourself 10-20m of water under your keel to drop into if you get located and they start dropping charges. Charges are set to detonate at a particular depth, and if they've got your location AND your depth figured out you'll want to change your depth to get clear of the detonation range. Particularly in water where you don't have much depth to play with and can't just go deep enough to avoid everything.

When there are depth charges in the water, the explosions will render ASDIC temporarily useless, so that's the best time to (temporarily) bump up your speed or make a course/depth change if necessary. They won't be able to track you until the kerfluffle from all the explosions is over, when it is, you need to be back down to slow ahead.

my current strategy is to wet myself and be indecisive, which doesn't work so well.

:haha:

Yes but just think of the mess you'll leave for the Tommies if they capture your boat!