View Full Version : Guy in Cumbria goes nuts,shoots a bunch
XabbaRus
06-02-10, 07:29 AM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/10214661.stm
This hasn't happened for a number of years now. Wonder what made him pop.
No idea but it's got the local area including Sellafield under lockdown.
Jimbuna
06-02-10, 08:35 AM
Looks like he's taken his own life.
Looks like he's taken his own life.
Nine over ten that's how these kind of incidents pan out...
Now the search for the why begins.
GoldenRivet
06-02-10, 08:52 AM
Looks like he's taken his own life.
perhaps he should have started with that one :shifty:
Why did the BBC have put on a 45 minute special on? Once again the TV news in this country stoops to a new low, nothing like turning this swine in to a celeb, right BBC.
Experts giving their opinions without any hard facts.
Its the victims that count who were on the receiving end of this crazy gunman, not him!
Why did the BBC have put on a 45 minute special on? Once again the TV news in this country stoops to a new low, nothing like turning this swine in to a celeb, right BBC.
Experts giving their opinions without any hard facts.
Its the victims that count who were on the receiving end of this crazy gunman, not him!
Oh, the media loves a drama story Steed, surely you've learnt that by now?
I dread to think what will be banned by our overzealous caretakers now as a result of this. Let's hope the guy never played GTA... :damn:
On a less political note, condolences to the victims and let's hope that the injured people pull through alright.
Oh, the media loves a drama story Steed, surely you've learnt that by now?
Indeed, I switched off, in fact I have decided never to watch TV news ever again.
On a less political note, condolences to the victims and let's hope that the injured people pull through alright.
Agreed.
Weiss Pinguin
06-02-10, 09:27 AM
I dread to think what will be banned by our overzealous caretakers now as a result of this. Let's hope the guy never played GTA... :damn:
Or his cousin, or brother, or friend...
No mention of Hungerford yet, give it time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_massacre
Jimbuna
06-02-10, 10:35 AM
perhaps he should have started with that one :shifty:
Rgr that matey http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif
HunterICX
06-02-10, 10:37 AM
:nope: I always wonder why these suicidal maniacs have to take others with him
HunterICX
Happy Times
06-02-10, 12:37 PM
Nine over ten that's how these kind of incidents pan out...
Now the search for the why begins.
Its all because guns, if he didnt have one he wouldnt have killed anyone.
Otherwise he would have been happy, baked cookies and offered them house to house.
Sailor Steve
06-02-10, 12:42 PM
Its all because guns, if he didnt have one he wouldnt have killed anyone.
Otherwise he would have been happy, baked cookies and offered them house to house.
America needs to ban guns because of things like this. This could never have happened in Brita...wait a minute. :doh:
(not slagging the Brits at all, just the Yankees who say things like that):sunny:
Guns don't kill people, people kill people, guns just give them the how, not the why.
Schroeder
06-02-10, 03:21 PM
My condolences to the families of killed people.:nope:
Steel_Tomb
06-02-10, 04:04 PM
The thing that annoys me is that tragedies like this will spur on the Government to bring in some rushed through policy that will penalise the honest gun owners in this country... like me... who comply with all the exceedingly strict laws and regulations, whilst letting all the scum keep theirs because they don't know where it is. Take the handgun ban for instance... do you really think the criminals handed in their weapons like good old chaps? No, it was the honest people who went through the lengthy process of getting their FAC that got shafted. I love to shoot, I've met lots of great people and find a lot of satisfaction in going to small club competitions.
A tragedy... and my heartfelt condolences go out to the families of those who have been killed today, but I know what the headlines will be next... "new anti-gun legislation...."
Will a Government in this country ever conceive a policy that only effects the criminals instead of shafting honest folk? Granted this guy wasn't a criminal, but he obviously had a psychological problem to go on such a rampage.
At the end of the day, you can't foresee every eventuality. I just hope that rare occasions like this don't mean that honest people are penalised.
To summarise what I had to do:
Spent £350 on a secure gun cabinet, rawl bolted to the wall... inspections by firearm liaison officers to make sure my security is adequate. £50 for my FAC, which is reviewed every five years, I have to list exactly what weapon I own and the ammo... and restricted to a limited amount of ammunition. I have to to a registered member of a shooting club for which I pay about £100 a year. With paying for my rifle, a semi-automatic AR15 with a .22LR upper with optics etc cost me just over £1500. Not a small amount by any means. I'm hoping to buy a .223 upper for it, but need to list on my FAC a new variation of the same weapon and get it approved. Constantly jumping through hoops... not that I'm complaining. I just want to point out what we have to do in the UK to be allowed ownership of a firearm.
Tribesman
06-02-10, 05:55 PM
The thing that annoys me is that tragedies like this will spur on the Government to bring in some rushed through policy that will penalise the honest gun owners in this country...
Its a given. Just like after Hungerford and Dunblane the blue rinse brigade will be catered for in the trash media calling for strong action to protect the poor fearful people from the nutters hidden on every street of every village.
The government will duly come up with some dumb populist knee jerk legislation (which will again be useless) to show how strong they are on protecting the people.
Its a given. Just like after Hungerford and Dunblane the blue rinse brigade will be catered for in the trash media calling for strong action to protect the poor fearful people from the nutters hidden on every street of every village.
The government will duly come up with some dumb populist knee jerk legislation (which will again be useless) to show how strong they are on protecting the people.
Bingo. :damn: What a world we live in... :nope:
OneToughHerring
06-03-10, 12:35 AM
The shooter in this particular incident was a recent grandfather who drove a cab. Not really someone I'd characterize as a "scum", "criminal", etc. From what I know the shotgun he used had a permit as well.
The shooter in this particular incident was a recent grandfather who drove a cab. Not really someone I'd characterize as a "scum", "criminal", etc. From what I know the shotgun he used had a permit as well.
Yeah, from all indications, while the guy most certainly can no longer really gather actual sympathy, some understanding is due. I'm sure he didn't just wake up one day after living 52 years and decided to kill people for fun. BBC is now speculating that it was a family dispute that got him going.
Never underestimate what stress can do, especially if there is some sort of mental condition lurking underneath. People can really crack - if you've been there, you know what that can be like. That doesn't justify this or whitewash the guy, nor is that really needed since he's dead - but let's not discount the possibility that if his day went a little differently, he would've gone on being your average village taxi driver.
But I totally agree that the public needs to stop obsessing over him and remember the victims. Reminds me of one of the few good lines to come out of Bowling for Columbine and Marilyn Manson: "What would you say to the victims? - Nothing. I would simply listen to what they had to say, and that's what noone did."
Let's hope someone does this time.
Castout
06-03-10, 04:01 AM
Its all because guns, if he didnt have one he wouldnt have killed anyone.
Otherwise he would have been happy, baked cookies and offered them house to house.
WRONG it's not because of the gun. A few people in China started a trend to slash kindergarten children using knife resulting in some death :nope:.
The world bears too much pain and it's all ****ed up. If you haven't got something to hold on to, you would likely be either carried away to follow the trend of ****ed up people or gone mad.
In this part of the world (region). . .
I'm seeing villains praised and very much respected, I'm seeing rule of law becoming a hypocrisy and a hindrance to justice, I'm seeing policemen who are the criminals, I'm seeing the convenient of the one stepping over the rights of many, I'm seeing people lying all the time and thinking it was smart, I'm seeing murderer who is proud of his deeds and who becomes addicted to killing.
Fewer and fewer people see goodness and kindness as a strength and think of them as weakness. Just last week I've been told to let go of my idealism. For what? For being idealistic?
Besides I never considered myself an idealist. Funny how people who demanded this of me never be able to show me the strength of their argument and when I showed mine and not by mere words they just repaid it with largely ignorance.
People are forgetting to love one another. If people knew where we all end up they'll. Most people haven't realized that despite the seeming differences we are ALL very much alike in the inside and that we are each a part of the other at least in the bigger picture.
And come to think this is now the 21st century and that people get decent education nowadays but the quality of the people from the lowliest places to the highest of places are tumbling down than even a few decades ago. Something is definitely wrong and is very wrong. If the society keeps on regressing civilization will collapse at least civilization as we know it and that's how I perceive it. And no I'm not having end of the world syndrome but this is my honest observation and assessment of the part of the world where I live.
Steel_Tomb
06-03-10, 04:55 AM
The shooter in this particular incident was a recent grandfather who drove a cab. Not really someone I'd characterize as a "scum", "criminal", etc. From what I know the shotgun he used had a permit as well.
OTH... if you read my post properly you would see I wasn't comparing him as a criminal or "scum":
"Granted this guy wasn't a criminal, but he obviously had a psychological problem to go on such a rampage"
Like I said, you can't predict every eventuality... if he was a legal owner with the relevant checks then perhaps there were mistakes made in the past? People die every day, I'm not trying to play down this tragedy... but how many people are stabbed to death every day?
Knife crime in this country is so rampant that people aren't so surprised by it when people are killed as its perhaps regarded as "the norm" by them. Yet as soon as someone is shot dead everyone is up in arms fearing for their lives from the loony gun owners. It feels to me that there is a big social stigma in the UK against people who own guns, you say to someone "Oh yeah I own a rifle and go shooting at the weekends with friends" and they look at you as if you've got a screw loose. However if I were to say "Oh did you know I recently started archery" they would be like oh wow that's interesting... arrows kill just the same as bullets.
I hope this post has some kind of structure to it, as I'm in a bit of a ranty mood this morning lol.
A sad tale all round. I do wish the families of all concerned my deepest condolences.
Jimbuna
06-03-10, 05:15 AM
The thing that annoys me is that tragedies like this will spur on the Government to bring in some rushed through policy that will penalise the honest gun owners in this country... like me... who comply with all the exceedingly strict laws and regulations, whilst letting all the scum keep theirs because they don't know where it is. Take the handgun ban for instance... do you really think the criminals handed in their weapons like good old chaps? No, it was the honest people who went through the lengthy process of getting their FAC that got shafted. I love to shoot, I've met lots of great people and find a lot of satisfaction in going to small club competitions.
A tragedy... and my heartfelt condolences go out to the families of those who have been killed today, but I know what the headlines will be next... "new anti-gun legislation...."
Will a Government in this country ever conceive a policy that only effects the criminals instead of shafting honest folk? Granted this guy wasn't a criminal, but he obviously had a psychological problem to go on such a rampage.
At the end of the day, you can't foresee every eventuality. I just hope that rare occasions like this don't mean that honest people are penalised.
To summarise what I had to do:
Spent £350 on a secure gun cabinet, rawl bolted to the wall... inspections by firearm liaison officers to make sure my security is adequate. £50 for my FAC, which is reviewed every five years, I have to list exactly what weapon I own and the ammo... and restricted to a limited amount of ammunition. I have to to a registered member of a shooting club for which I pay about £100 a year. With paying for my rifle, a semi-automatic AR15 with a .22LR upper with optics etc cost me just over £1500. Not a small amount by any means. I'm hoping to buy a .223 upper for it, but need to list on my FAC a new variation of the same weapon and get it approved. Constantly jumping through hoops... not that I'm complaining. I just want to point out what we have to do in the UK to be allowed ownership of a firearm.
OTH... if you read my post properly you would see I wasn't comparing him as a criminal or "scum":
"Granted this guy wasn't a criminal, but he obviously had a psychological problem to go on such a rampage"
Like I said, you can't predict every eventuality... if he was a legal owner with the relevant checks then perhaps there were mistakes made in the past? People die every day, I'm not trying to play down this tragedy... but how many people are stabbed to death every day?
Knife crime in this country is so rampant that people aren't so surprised by it when people are killed as its perhaps regarded as "the norm" by them. Yet as soon as someone is shot dead everyone is up in arms fearing for their lives from the loony gun owners. It feels to me that there is a big social stigma in the UK against people who own guns, you say to someone "Oh yeah I own a rifle and go shooting at the weekends with friends" and they look at you as if you've got a screw loose. However if I were to say "Oh did you know I recently started archery" they would be like oh wow that's interesting... arrows kill just the same as bullets.
I hope this post has some kind of structure to it, as I'm in a bit of a ranty mood this morning lol.
Two crackin posts IMO....I used to be involved in checking the security measures and FAC's of a gun club in Newcastle.
Only on one occasion was it necessary to enforce matters because of non compliance and that was little more than an administrative technicality.
Not long after Hungerford and the total banning of hand guns etc. the club turned to black powder in an effort to survive.
Six months later it was bulldozed to make way for a car park.
Still plenty of hand guns on the streets if you know where to go....problem is, they are all held by the very people the legislation was intended to protect the public from :doh:
Sailor Steve
06-03-10, 07:28 AM
WRONG it's not because of the gun. A few people in China started a trend to slash kindergarten children using knife resulting in some death :nope:.
It's probably a language thing, but his post was dripping with sarcasm. He was slamming the people who will say it's because of the gun.
To be honest, with the world we live in, the high stress society, particularly at a time when unemployment is high and money is low, I am surprised that more of this kind of thing does not take place. Heck, I'm sure that everyone has had a D-Fens moment but it's that key in psychology that separates those who do from those who don't.
I feel so sorry for those who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time...what a mess :nope:
OneToughHerring
06-03-10, 08:34 AM
Not sure if it's worthy of a new thread, in Belgium a judge and a court clerk have been shot. :nope:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/10226550.stm
And about the law enforcement view on these things, I've noticed that if a cop is shot somewhere then the other cops are all like "We gotta get this guy and nail him to the wall!!11!" but if it's just someone who shoots average people then cops are all "These things happen, guns are ok".
SteamWake
06-03-10, 08:51 AM
Guns don't kill people, people kill people, guns just give them the how, not the why.
Way off topic but something I found funny.
I was watching an episode of "Leave it to Beaver" yes leave it to Beaver.. anyhow the Beeve was asking his dad.. "Hey dad dident great grandpa sell guns to the Indians?" "No" dad responded "He just some them alchohal which put them in the mood to buy guns". :haha:
Jimbuna
06-03-10, 11:12 AM
To be honest, with the world we live in, the high stress society, particularly at a time when unemployment is high and money is low, I am surprised that more of this kind of thing does not take place. Heck, I'm sure that everyone has had a D-Fens moment but it's that key in psychology that separates those who do from those who don't.
I feel so sorry for those who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time...what a mess :nope:
You just never know how many mentally unstable folk are out there walking the streets....until you approach or challenge one, often in all innocence...by then it is often too late :nope:
Steel_Tomb
06-03-10, 04:57 PM
Someone said on Radio 2 today, stuff like this happens almost annually in the USA... where as in the UK it happens about once every decade.
People can say "oh but there are loads of people shot dead in the USA every year"... I say to you how many people are stabbed dead every year in the UK? Hell, how many people are BEATEN to death with bear hands every year in this country? I don't know but being shot feels a little more civilised than someone kicking the living daylights out of you.
Another point I'd like to make, how many people shot dead in the states are people who are breaking into others homes or threatening people and getting a .45 in the chest? Pure statistics can hide an awful lot of facts behind them.
Btw, thanks Jim... I tried to make them fair! There is so much stuff you have to adhere to, but I don't mind... I just love to shoot. My M4 is an absolute hoot to shoot... and looks the mutts nuts too :D. A shame in some respects the .223 is only a straight pull, one reason why I got the .22LR to have a bit of fun down the range without emptying my bank account on ammo lol. I don't really understand why you can't have semi-auto in higher calibres? A .22LR in the right place will kill you just the same as a .223?!!?
Tchocky
06-03-10, 05:15 PM
Hell, how many people are BEATEN to death with bear hands every year in this country?
Oof. Nasty way to go.
(sorry all)
CaptainHaplo
06-03-10, 05:54 PM
Just goes to show you, had one of the victims been armed they might have had a chance to take this guy out before he caused further havoc and loss of life....
But concealed carry is a horrible thing says many......
Castout
06-03-10, 08:35 PM
To be honest, with the world we live in, the high stress society, particularly at a time when unemployment is high and money is low, I am surprised that more of this kind of thing does not take place. Heck, I'm sure that everyone has had a D-Fens moment but it's that key in psychology that separates those who do from those who don't.
I feel so sorry for those who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time...what a mess :nope:
The thing is even employed people more often than not now have too little time for themselves and for their family. A job should ideally provide both emotional and financial rewards. More often than not it's only the latter that's emphasized. Obviously people need many things aside from money such as emotional needs, social and solitude.
People are now resources, money making resources. Treated that way sooner or later they'll also believe it and lose touch to their humanism and treat others the same way too.
People need to get way from city life once for a while. In fact this is a must. Get away go to the mountain, a quiet beach, to get away from civilization and crowd. To find themselves again. To find bearing again, to cool down, to reflect and to relax. Prolong city exposure is very bad for people's mental health and soul. It's unnatural. There's a very humbling feeling being in the middle of a vast empty sea, or seeing a huge waterfall or even simply a huge rock or just simply listening to a distant raging river at night or camping in the forest at night.
Tribesman
06-04-10, 02:59 AM
People need to get way from city life once for a while. In fact this is a must. Get away go to the mountain, a quiet beach, to get away from civilization and crowd.
True, for great relaxation take a shooting holiday amoung the peaks and lakes of Cumbria
Jimbuna
06-04-10, 05:46 AM
Btw, thanks Jim... I tried to make them fair! There is so much stuff you have to adhere to, but I don't mind... I just love to shoot. My M4 is an absolute hoot to shoot... and looks the mutts nuts too :D. A shame in some respects the .223 is only a straight pull, one reason why I got the .22LR to have a bit of fun down the range without emptying my bank account on ammo lol. I don't really understand why you can't have semi-auto in higher calibres? A .22LR in the right place will kill you just the same as a .223?!!?
No prob mate...I reckon we're both singing from the same hymn sheet :up:
OneToughHerring
06-04-10, 06:06 AM
Like I said, you can't predict every eventuality... if he was a legal owner with the relevant checks then perhaps there were mistakes made in the past? People die every day, I'm not trying to play down this tragedy... but how many people are stabbed to death every day?
Knife crime in this country is so rampant that people aren't so surprised by it when people are killed as its perhaps regarded as "the norm" by them. Yet as soon as someone is shot dead everyone is up in arms fearing for their lives from the loony gun owners. It feels to me that there is a big social stigma in the UK against people who own guns, you say to someone "Oh yeah I own a rifle and go shooting at the weekends with friends" and they look at you as if you've got a screw loose. However if I were to say "Oh did you know I recently started archery" they would be like oh wow that's interesting... arrows kill just the same as bullets.
I hope this post has some kind of structure to it, as I'm in a bit of a ranty mood this morning lol.
How exactly are firearm violence and knife violence mutually exclusive? If you look at high violent crime nations like, unfortunately, Finland, you'll see that high firearm violence tends to occure side by side with high knife violence. If by legislative and other means it is possible to reduce the amount of firearm violence, by what logic will this increase knife violence?
To say knifes = firearms only makes me think that somebody needs to visit the optician, pronto!
Jimbuna
06-04-10, 06:40 AM
Btw, thanks Jim... I tried to make them fair! There is so much stuff you have to adhere to, but I don't mind... I just love to shoot. My M4 is an absolute hoot to shoot... and looks the mutts nuts too :D. A shame in some respects the .223 is only a straight pull, one reason why I got the .22LR to have a bit of fun down the range without emptying my bank account on ammo lol. I don't really understand why you can't have semi-auto in higher calibres? A .22LR in the right place will kill you just the same as a .223?!!?
Oh, I forgot to ask earlier....have you tried those tater tots?
Just goes to show you, had one of the victims been armed they might have had a chance to take this guy out before he caused further havoc and loss of life....
But concealed carry is a horrible thing says many......
yeah, thats what we need, another guy shooting a gun in public.....:damn:
Tribesman
06-04-10, 06:56 AM
yeah, thats what we need, another guy shooting a gun in public.....
He has a point, many is the time I have been working out in a field in the middle of nowhere and been ready to shoot at a passing car just in case it happens to contain a nutter on the rampage.
Though I don't think it would have worked so well for that old woman who was cycling as trying to be quick on the draw against a loony in a passing car can cause the bike to wobble.
Jimbuna
06-04-10, 07:28 AM
Latest theory is that he was worried about a pending tax demand from HMRC (Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs) despite the fact he supposedly has a bank account with a £60k balance.
Tribesman
06-04-10, 08:07 AM
Latest theory is that he was worried about a pending tax demand from HMRC (Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs) despite the fact he supposedly has a bank account with a £60k balance.
The theory is that the tax and customs were after him because he had 60k deposited that he couldn't account for.
Jimbuna
06-04-10, 10:48 AM
The theory is that the tax and customs were after him because he had 60k deposited that he couldn't account for.
Either way, this is the latest news......more clarity should come at 18:00 I hope.
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