View Full Version : How do you keep the game interesting?
musides
05-10-10, 02:25 PM
I bought this game a couple of months ago. It has been fun to learn and play, and the Grey Wolves expansion is one of the most impressive community add-ons I've seen for a game.
The trouble is, I've done about 8 patrols or so (72% realism). I typically sink around 10 ships per patrol, and try to use all my ammo efficiently in so doing. I don't really understand why I should put out to sea again because every patrol is so similar! I hit a large convoy once, which was pretty fun, but every merchant encounter is essentially a replica of the last encounter: approach at a distance, submerge, line up the shot, fire, surface, finish off with deck gun if necessary. Rinse and repeat.
I'm wondering if I'm missing something, or perhaps this isn't a long term game for me. I'm almost totally a strategy-only gamer, so this genre is a first for me. Anyway, I'm curious to know how veterans find this game compelling over the long term.
Jimbuna
05-10-10, 02:30 PM
If your using the GWX3.0 supermod you are indeed missing a great deal.
There are different thetres such as N. Atlantic, S. Atlantic, Med, Black Sea and Indian Ocean plus the Arctic and so on and so on.
Each year brings differings types of equipment, shipping and levels of difficulty.
Enough from me....welcome aboard http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/welcome.gif
i suppose its the challenge that GWX brings as the war progresses. My favorite part of the game is not sinking alot of ships, but surviving as long as I can. I have yet to make it into 1943 and have been playing for several years.
The Black Sea and Arctic campaigns are alot of fun.:up: But yeah, there isnt much variation in patrols. Your job is to sink ships. I sometimes throw in other missions myself. Like getting a radio message on my way back from a patrol that I need to pickup a spy from near some British port. :arrgh!:
Canovaro
05-10-10, 02:54 PM
That's right. The challenge is to survive as long as you can.
In order to survive, you need the best equipment and technology. To get that, you need renown. To get renown, you need to sink ships. But the longer you survive the more dangerous it becomes to attack ships.
You see, SH3 is like zen.
One of the best parts of GWX is the scripted layer - if you read the manual, you'll see how many historical operations are part of the campaign.
I particularly enjoy finding that a patrol coincides with a big event - like weserubung or something because there's always the chance of running into some big warships.
As has already been said, the Black Sea campaign's great and provides something different.
I know what you mean though. It can sometimes feel repetitive - to avoid that I never really go from one patrol straight into another - usually give it a day or two's rest then fire it up again!
I also find that even when I'm completely bored with SH3, if I read up a bit of atlantic or u-boat history, the cravings start again and it's off on another patrol!
maillemaker
05-10-10, 03:08 PM
In order to survive, you need the best equipment and technology. To get that, you need renown. To get renown, you need to sink ships. But the longer you survive the more dangerous it becomes to attack ships.
Well, that's kind of it in a nutshell, for me.
It's not just sinking ships, it's how long can you survive?. Can you make it to the end of the war?
Steve
one of my favorite ways to play is play an entire campaign in a Type II boat. Challenge yourself to do port raids in the little tub. Patrol the channel. You can do many things in the Type II that you cant do in the larger boats. :|\\
raymond6751
05-10-10, 03:47 PM
I have downloaded a lot of WW2 era music, added some of my faves from recent years, and listen on patrol. I also have all the speechs by Churchill and news broadcasts.
I also read while listening to either music or the waves.
More interesting challenges are found around enemy ports. Try to find actual convoys or task forces.
Sailor Steve
05-10-10, 03:49 PM
WELCOME ABOARD!:sunny:
One other thing you can do is use SH3 Commander. It will open up the campaign itself so you feel like you have a real career.
Unfortunately the life of a submariner was mostly boredom. I'm lucky if I sink 2-3 ships in a patrol. It's not for everybody. I play it because I like the boats and I like the history, not because it's a fast action game, which it isn't.
I play it because I like the boats and I like the history, not because it's a fast action game, which it isn't.
Aye! My favorite part is just sailing around, getting into trouble. Blowing up ships is just a bonus! :yeah:
Bump up the realism. The more decisions you have to make that affect the outcome, the more interesting the game is.
I'm currently only using stabilized periscope view, and map contacts because GWX does not penalize you for using map contacts. Next patrol will be without map contacts.
Most of the time I'm playing without time compression unless I'm returning to base without torpedoes. There's a certain tempo to the game that you don't get if you use time compression whenever you can.
And I have to say that once I started playing with higher realism, no two intercepts have been the same. And at 1x time compression, you have plenty of time to think: Did I mess up the intercept course? Has he changed course? Is this going to be another neutral ship? Do I have time to go make a sandwich? Is it too early to submerge and check the hydrophones? If this is another ****ed schooner, I'm gonna try ramming him, I don't care if he's neutral!
Enjoy.
Hook
I bought this game a couple of months ago. It has been fun to learn and play, and the Grey Wolves expansion is one of the most impressive community add-ons I've seen for a game.
The trouble is, I've done about 8 patrols or so (72% realism). I typically sink around 10 ships per patrol, and try to use all my ammo efficiently in so doing. I don't really understand why I should put out to sea again because every patrol is so similar! I hit a large convoy once, which was pretty fun, but every merchant encounter is essentially a replica of the last encounter: approach at a distance, submerge, line up the shot, fire, surface, finish off with deck gun if necessary. Rinse and repeat.
I'm wondering if I'm missing something, or perhaps this isn't a long term game for me. I'm almost totally a strategy-only gamer, so this genre is a first for me. Anyway, I'm curious to know how veterans find this game compelling over the long term.
if not already doing so, begin reading the history. a good place to start is OPERATION DRUMBEAT by Micheal Gannon. available from amazon at a good price in paper back - order it through Subsim too, they get a cut.
its not just the game but the history will immerse you even more. there are many excellent and controversial books (Iron Coffins) to read on your long patrols...:salute:
Sailor Steve
05-10-10, 04:09 PM
And watch Das Boot; preferably the 5-hour uncut version.:sunny:
And watch Das Boot; preferably the 5-hour uncut version.:sunny:
oh god!! - here come the DVD's: HITLER'S LOST SUB. by NOVA. available at Amazon...
...any more?:yep:
Snestorm
05-10-10, 04:50 PM
Bored? You can:
Up the realism to 100% (no map contacts).
This will give you a chance to make mistakes.
Use a Type II boat.
This removes the deck gun, for when you do make mistakes.
Start in 1943, or so.
It's a whole different game.
Mittelwaechter
05-10-10, 08:37 PM
I love to sink ships only with hydrophone data. I don't see them and they don't see me. Friday I sent a volley of four eels into a stormy, foggy, midnight convoy from estimated 7000 meters range and sunk a tanker and two freighters.
pickinthebanjo
05-10-10, 09:36 PM
Yeah I suggest slapping the game on 100% and doing a harbor raid. Scapa Flow and Gibraltar are the two where I've sunk the most tonnage.
Zedwardson
05-10-10, 11:01 PM
for me, it is survival, followed by sinking stuff and coming across new ships. If your getting bored, go do one of the other GWX settings (med, black, arctic, ect...)
If you get really bored, sneak into a port and sink some stuff... of course, surviving say, 1943 is a lot tougher then 1939, my two previous guys didn't make it to 1941...
musides
05-10-10, 11:06 PM
Thanks everyone for the great responses. It is very impressive to see such a lively forum for an old game! :) You have given me some good things to think about, and I'm going to stop trying to be so damned efficient, and just flow with the stream of gameplay. I just put out to sea again tonight, and this method is working well, along with using the real time more often. I can now see that using time compression too much and you miss the forest for the trees.
Mittelwaechter: That is very impressive. I've listened to the hydrophone before (I love my Sennheiser cans!), and have spotted things my Sonar man missed... but I can't begin to imagine "flying blind". How interesting.
I'll put some sub books on my reading list. Interesting about the survival goal, particularly that 1943 is so elusive. Now I have a goal. :) Yet -- with save games -- why would it be hard to eventually get there? Do you not go one with a game if you die?
pickinthebanjo
05-10-10, 11:25 PM
When I'm sunk I start a new file, everything goes well unless I get a CTD then I usually just end that patrol and try to find out why it crashed. I use to continue my old files but I realised that I tend to be more cautious when I know that I can't re-load after I get destroyed. It causes me to be more weary and careful like in my current career I usually only get 15000-20000ton per patrol but when I used to load old saves I would get at least 50k
Sailor Steve
05-11-10, 12:07 AM
Hydrophone-only attacks were pre-war doctrine for the Americans. The quickly abandoned it, because it never worked. The Germans never did it either.
Yes when you play DID (dead is dead), you trend to be much more careful. Another way to play is to name each member of your crew, they then tend to mean much more to you.:salute:
Jimbuna
05-11-10, 06:11 AM
Hydrophone-only attacks were pre-war doctrine for the Americans. The quickly abandoned it, because it never worked. The Germans never did it either.
Pretty pointless whether it worked or not because early on the torpedos didn't anyway. :DL
That's right. The challenge is to survive as long as you can.
In order to survive, you need the best equipment and technology. To get that, you need renown. To get renown, you need to sink ships. But the longer you survive the more dangerous it becomes to attack ships.
You see, SH3 is like zen.
Reading about U boats and crews and applying those principals in the game.
I agree with Canovaro, this is what I work for-survival.
Zedwardson
05-11-10, 11:22 AM
Yes, a lot play "Dead is Dead" (DiD) which in some games is called the "Hardcore" mode. For example, Karl Myer was a very good sub captain of mine who on his ninth patrol went to scope depth to start his attack run on a Convoy, as he was a "Wolf in the hens house" and the escort came right behind his boat, so he never even had a sonar warning that the boat was coming, and when he heard a loud ping and the blades of the DD coming, He didn't have enough time to scream "ALAAARRRM!" before the DD ran over his Uboat and sunk him with all hands. :nope:
I just blinked, said dang, and saluted the men lost and went to figure out the name of the new guy. :salute:
My next guy now makes sure to check his blind side when he surfaces, even if there is a Juicy Tanker right in front of him at 1200 meters. When 1943 rolls around, you can barely get out of harbor, on a GOOD day, before planes are bombing you...Thus if Otto Van Graf (my current guy) survives to 1943 (a big IF) he will most likely try to go to Norway and hunt in the North.
yeah. DiD is key for SH3 in my opinion. :arrgh!:
Sailor Steve
05-11-10, 04:39 PM
When you play DiD and don't use external views (at least not to cheat) you quickly learn one of the real tactics: every time I raise the periscope I ALWAYS do a 360-degree sweep just to make sure there's nothing bad sneaking up behind me. Saved my hide more than once.:sunny:
PappyCain
05-11-10, 05:22 PM
I typically sink around 10 ships per patrol
Hmmm. Re-check your realism selection options, play through each year and return to base with your boat and crew. I am surprised you have not had white knuckle experiences with escorts and or aircraft or for that matter Q-boats, bad weather, and boat management issues, not to mention identifying neutral ships properly .. played to the fullest this is NOT an arcade game IMHO! this sim maximizes U-boat strategy and tactics.
:salute:
PS: last night in a storm, dark, pelting rain, high seas, I raised my periscope near the convoy to see the steel hull and bottom paint on an escort that was two meters from shearing it off - and then the concussions ... hot diggety dawg, I dropped my hamburger (dinner) and had to pull off a quick maneuver!!! Dead is dead is the only way to go. Fortunately we are alive and well and tracking that convoy today ...
Among other things, I play DID. At the end of a patrol I reward myself with time in port for about a week or so.During this time I stay away from the game and treat myself to something special.
Once on a type IX boat, there are some exciting patrols chasing after the Freetown convoys, operation Paukenschlag.
The more realism you have, the more exciting will be your patrol.
Due to a move, I've not played SH3 for over a year. Getting a new computer shortly, I'm looking forward to get back into the fray. And, umm, drive people nutz with Balz stories :D
frau kaleun
05-11-10, 07:21 PM
And, umm, drive people nutz with Balz stories :D
*claps hands*
YAAAAAAY!
Lord_magerius
05-11-10, 07:22 PM
Yes when you play DID (dead is dead), you trend to be much more careful. Another way to play is to name each member of your crew, they then tend to mean much more to you.:salute:
I do the same thing :) well at least with all my officers, and I think of a few randoms for my PO's. Makes me feel a whole lot worse though when Joel dies :wah:
I usually give myself challenges when I'm bored and I know i'm not going to be destroyed by anything. e.g coming up behind a (insert sailing ship name here as I'm too drunk to remember one) at periscope depth and surfacing the boat trying to balance it on the front of my boat :D it's brilliant if you get it and the sea is perfectly calm. no waves to dump it into the water :har:
PappyCain
05-11-10, 07:42 PM
Fortunately we are alive and well and tracking that convoy today ...
And now for the rest of the story or the end of the story. So it is easy eh?
Well tonight with a bannana split (artfully crafted I must add) I sat at the Atlantic side of Gibraltar hoping I got in front of the convoy ... 70hrs went by and no joy. The sea was still raging - viz only 70 meters in the rain. Out of nowhere I have the HMS Beagel coming at me guns blazing. Mind you the boats record player is on and I am feeding myself the ice cream ... holy moly.
To make a long story short I take very severe damage and dare not dive. I have my damage gang working furiously. I have the boat ducking into the fog and rain. They say I have very SEVERE hull damage - 80%. Heaving globs of ice cream down my pie hole I keep using every trick to stay alive. Wagner is playing on the record player!
I need to slug down that ice cream ... and I will not lose my boat and crew.
I loose an eel on the Beagle and she tanks! My crew yells and then we learn the entire British Atlantic Fleet is bearing down. Scooping the melting ice cream furiously we run. Run hard.
With flank speed we head north using the storm and rain to help get away while shells are pelting the heaving sea around us.
Wagner! replay the Wagner I yell.
Ice cream is all over my shirt.
We head to Cadiz. We are met by a German vessel - through the haze I see other ships and lights.
My hull is torn up.
I have reflux, gurgling stomach noises and constipation.
And someone said this sim is too easy.
Burp! Brruuuuurp! Brrruuuuuuuurp!
:salute:
Offgassing ......
Zedwardson
05-11-10, 08:41 PM
:har::har::har::har:
Lord_magerius
05-11-10, 08:47 PM
:har::har::har::har:
^^^
frau kaleun
05-11-10, 09:03 PM
Burp! Brruuuuurp! Brrruuuuuuuurp!
:salute:
Offgassing ......
Yes that's all well and good but WHAT HAPPENED TO THE BANANA? Don't keep us in suspense, man.
Lord_magerius
05-11-10, 09:13 PM
The banana stayed with him... you really don't want to know. It get's kind of creepy...
Oh to hell with it, I'm gonna gossip. On his next patrol he dismissed his CE and put Mr.Banana in charge. Every night they shared a bunk on that patrol. Though the really weird thing is, Mr Banana didn't show up two days before we were due to get back to Kiel. He just disappeared off the boat. Even weirder than that. Since Mr. Banana left Kaleun pappycain has been walking like he's riding a horse...
musides
05-12-10, 08:44 AM
He he he.
Great advice about the DiD approach. Save - Fail - Reload can be highly problematic for good gameplay.
At first I would think it is frustrating that the game becomes increasingly hard to the point of being essentially impossible, but it seems this is part of the fun and enjoyment. :)
frau kaleun
05-12-10, 11:43 AM
Oh to hell with it, I'm gonna gossip. On his next patrol he dismissed his CE and put Mr.Banana in charge. Every night they shared a bunk on that patrol. Though the really weird thing is, Mr Banana didn't show up two days before we were due to get back to Kiel. He just disappeared off the boat. Even weirder than that. Since Mr. Banana left Kaleun pappycain has been walking like he's riding a horse...
That is gonna be one ripe banana.
doing a very exciting campaign now in a type II/D for the entire war starting in july '41. i set goals for myself to accomplish in and around Britain. The backstory is BdU keeps some type II/D boats around to harass small merchants close to Britain's home waters and for special missions. Most special missions are spy pick-ups and drop-offs.
My current patrol has me speeding to Liverpool as fast as possible to pick up a spy that has had his cover blown. He is hiding and I got to sneak past destroyer patrols to pick him up. Makes for some tense gameplay.
Channel patrol in a type II/D is also quite tense, yet rewarding. You need to stay under most of the day as air patrols are very frequent. :arrgh!::rock:
Use SH3 Commander and set up malfunctions and sabotage. Then when you notice something doesn't work right you figure out ways to deal with it. (like malfunctioning attackscope, or limited surface speed, fuel leak etc.) Instead of going home and getting it fixed right away. And even then you might get into risky situations on the way home.
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