video/graphics/performance help, please?

[schlechter pfennig]

I have a HP Pavilion 061 with Microsoft Windows XP Professional, Version 5.1.2600 Service Pack 3 Build 2600, and processor x86 Family 15 Model 4 Stepping 9 GenuineIntel ~3065 Mhz. The graphics card is an ATI RADEON XPRESS 200 Series with 256.00 MB RAM, Driver Version 6.14.10.6571.

I have several questions. One is what compatibility display settings should SHIII/GWX Gold (i.e. SH3) run at? For instance, 256 colors?

I'm also looking for the best setting compromise between quality and performance. I have no idea, for instance, what nominal screen resolution or color quality of Display Properties should be. Nor do I have any idea about things like 'anti-aliasing' or 'anisotropic filtering'. :oops:

I'd like to try and get my fps above 8-10 when things get 'busy'. :arrgh!:

Any help or advice will be greatly appreciated!

[Paul Riley]

-First of all your video card has enough memory to run the game.
-How much system RAM do you have?
-Make sure you have the latest drivers for both your video and sound cards.
- most games are optimized for 256 (or true) colours,and SH3 would be no exception :yep:
- ideally set your resolution to 1024x768,unless you have a widescreen monitor,in which case you can play in higher resolutions,but you will need to install a special mod for this called 'res fix mod'
- if you are having performance issues with the game,first of all set your video card for performance.
- the effects called anti aliasing and anisotropic filtering are advanced features of most if not all video cards,and they can severely impact performance in games,especially games that dont fully support the feature.Anti aliasing reduces the jagged edges you sometimes see on the edge of graphics making them look smoother and clearer.Anisotropic filtering allows graphics to be rendered in great detail in the distance instead of only being rendered in the foreground making games look sharper and more detailed.Turning this off for example would make distant objects look blurred due to the video card not rendering those textures.
I would not recommend AA in SH3 especially with GWX3 installed,as this is a major memory hog and your frame rates would really suffer.If you want to play around with AF first start at x2 and see how your fps go,and increase until they drop to unacceptable levels.Ideally though you want both turned off to maximize your performance.These features are really only designed for video cards with 512MB + memory,and probably dual core CPUs.

Hope some of this helps,and feel free to ask anything else you dont understand.

:up:

[schlechter pfennig]

Forgot to mention system RAM. :oops: It's 1 gig.

I tried your suggestions: started a new patrol from Wilhelmshaven . . . now have a frame rate of 2. :cry:

[pickinthebanjo]

-ideally set your resolution to 1024x768,unless you have a widescreen monitor,in which case you can play in higher resolutions,but you will need to install a special mod for this called 'res fix mod'
:up:

I was just wondering, I play the game on my laptop. It's about 1-2 years old but has an HDMI port I use to watch it on the tv. I run the game in 1920X1080(this is what I adjust the Computers resolution to, for the TV)
and then adjust the borders on the tv to fit it. I find that it looks about the same, aside from better color and such. Now my question is would it look any better with that res fix mod?

I do find things a little blown up but I figure it's due to being enlarged to 46", but there still all in proper scale/proportion

[Didd]

Forgot to mention system RAM. :oops: It's 1 gig.

I tried your suggestions: started a new patrol from Wilhelmshaven . . . now have a frame rate of 2. :cry:


What mods are you using? GWX for example fairly cripples frame rates in harbours. I usually get around a factor of 10 reduction in fps in harbour, and sometimes less than that when compared to what I get at sea. In stock SH3 this reduction wasn't quite so noticeable. But then I'd rather have some life around me.

In my experience the fps takes a hit with AA and AF. I don't use these.

[Paul Riley]

I was just wondering, I play the game on my laptop. It's about 1-2 years old but has an HDMI port I use to watch it on the tv. I run the game in 1920X1080(this is what I adjust the Computers resolution to, for the TV)
and then adjust the borders on the tv to fit it. I find that it looks about the same, aside from better color and such. Now my question is would it look any better with that res fix mod?

I do find things a little blown up but I figure it's due to being enlarged to 46", but there still all in proper scale/proportion

I know this wont be much help to you,but I really wouldnt recommend playing games on a laptop.Now that doesnt mean that they may not perform well enough it is mainly down to a overheating issue,a laptop cannot get rid of heat as well as a custom built desktop that has adequate cooling solutions,such as internal fans and fans over the video card,which I happen to have 5 fans in total.Improper cooling can affect and even crash games,especially demanding games.
Other than the post I gave above I cant really help you any more at this point,but dont lose heart,someone in here will be able to help.Keep posted over the next day or so for a reply.

Good luck.

[Paul Riley]

Forgot to mention system RAM. :oops: It's 1 gig.

I tried your suggestions: started a new patrol from Wilhelmshaven . . . now have a frame rate of 2. :cry:

I really would suggest getting another 1GB RAM installed bumping it up to 2GB,you may be experiencing a memory bottleneck trying to compete with your video card.For most modern games,and even those from about 2005 onwards 2GB system RAM is recommended to help run games smoothly.

[flakmonkey]

I would certainly expect better fps from the system specs you posted but in any case ram is a major factor with sh3, so grab at least another 1Gb.

Also (and this may not be popular with some) but would suggest grabbing a copy of vista or win7, despite the initial issues with having to update starforce drivers with some early sh3 discs, vista/7 are much much better optimized as gaming platforms than xp, i noticed a 10-15% increase in fps in sh3 when switching my old rig over to vista with no change in hardware so its certainly worth thinking about.

+The usual junk, make sure you dont have loads of stuff running in the background, turn off AA and AF in your cards control panel. If the drop in visual quality is too much to stand just turn them back up a bit at a time until you can live with the fps/visual quality tradeoff.

[irish1958]

Your spects are borderline at best.
Without another Gb of RAM there is no way to get better performance.
With another Gb of RAM, you will have minimum spects.
At that time, turn down particle effects in the option screen.
Check out the Omega driver for your video card. (google omega drivers)
Download and install AlacrityPC to get rid of all the junk running in your RAM
Keep your hard drive defragged, and use GameBooster 1.4 to defrag your game files. (AlacrityPC works a lot better than Game booster to clear RAM of junk, but it doesn't defrag the game files)
Some defrag programs will move the game files to the optimal section of your hard drive which have better access and transfer of files to RAM and CPU cache. Since I don't use them I don't know what ones do this.
Be careful of mods that hog RAM and CPU, especially sea floor mods. and harbor mods.
Use SH3CMDR and use the no fatigue and start at sea options.
Check your PC and make sure you have performance optimized for your operating system, including virtual RAM settings
Try different priorities in task manager settings to see if it helps. (Almost all priorities are set to normal. Try different settings to see what effect it may have on performance.)
If you attack convoys, you will have very poor frame rates as the computer has a lot of work to do.
Do not purchase SH4 or SH5 as you have no chance of running them.
Save your spare change and check out the new computers with Windows7; in spite of what the Mac religious fanatics say, it is a very good operating system.

[schlechter pfennig]

Your spects are borderline at best.
Without another Gb of RAM there is no way to get better performance.
With another Gb of RAM, you will have minimum spects.
At that time, turn down particle effects in the option screen.
Check out the Omega driver for your video card. (google omega drivers)
Download and install AlacrityPC to get rid of all the junk running in your RAM
Keep your hard drive defragged, and use GameBooster 1.4 to defrag your game files. (AlacrityPC works a lot better than Game booster to clear RAM of junk, but it doesn't defrag the game files)
Some defrag programs will move the game files to the optimal section of your hard drive which have better access and transfer of files to RAM and CPU cache. Since I don't use them I don't know what ones do this.
Be careful of mods that hog RAM and CPU, especially sea floor mods. and harbor mods.
Use SH3CMDR and use the no fatigue and start at sea options.
Check your PC and make sure you have performance optimized for your operating system, including virtual RAM settings
Try different priorities in task manager settings to see if it helps. (Almost all priorities are set to normal. Try different settings to see what effect it may have on performance.)
If you attack convoys, you will have very poor frame rates as the computer has a lot of work to do.
Do not purchase SH4 or SH5 as you have no chance of running them.
Save your spare change and check out the new computers with Windows7; in spite of what the Mac religious fanatics say, it is a very good operating system.


OK, so far I now have 2 Gb of RAM. I disabled all mods, and enabled harbor lite. Every setting I possibly can change (ex. Windows, Radeon card, etc.) is set for max performance/min quality. I've downloaded and installed both AlacrityPC and GameBooster 1.4, then run them. My video and sound drivers are the latest-and-greatest.

I now have 5! :woot:fps in Wilhelmshaven.

[schlechter pfennig]

I'm looking at getting a graphics card for this pig of mine. I can install a PCI express 16X card. I'd like to stick with the Radeon series, if possible. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what Radeon series I should get?

From what I can see I won't be able to use any card that requires addition power connections other than through it's connector (I've seen some cards that require 1-2 additional cabling to power supplies). I'd like something that has at least 1Gb of adapter RAM, if possible.

My eyes are starting to bleed from researching video cards. :dead:

[CybaGirl]

I think you will find that a new video card will help you more than what ram would as far as FPS goes. Sure the ram will help with the speed of your PC but it doesn't make a great deal of difference when it comes to FPS.

Good choice for sticking with ATi as they are a better card and have better driver support. As for which card to choose. That depends on how much you want to spend.

Also don't be put off buy purchasing a card that requires power from a power supply. As power supplies have come down quite a bit over the years and good quality power supplies are not that expensive. Plus the performance you will gain from a higher end card that requires the power will be exceptional.

I have a GeCube 4870 with 1GB ram in my gaming PC and it really moves. I play lots of Call Of Duty when I can and there is never an issue with FPS or performance from this card.

Even with SH3 and all my mods enabled I still manage to get between 300 - 440 FPS depending on how much action there is. But my FPS never drops below 300 even in the heaviest combat situations.

Anyway that is something to consider and if you let me know what your budget is I would only be to happy to help you further in deciding on what card would be best.

[Darkbluesky]

I'm looking at getting a graphics card for this pig of mine. I can install a PCI express 16X card. I'd like to stick with the Radeon series, if possible. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what Radeon series I should get?

From what I can see I won't be able to use any card that requires addition power connections other than through it's connector (I've seen some cards that require 1-2 additional cabling to power supplies). I'd like something that has at least 1Gb of adapter RAM, if possible.

My eyes are starting to bleed from researching video cards. :dead:

I see both nvidia and ati as good cards, but currently nvidia is the only to support in-house and more "standard" stereoscopy solution (3D Vision). Ati supports some third party 3D solutions (iz3d monitor), but it is not so spread/standard and you are chained to a single monitor.

I say that, just in case you may like stereocopic gaming/movies. Depending on your location you can go to a shop that demoes this (I recommend it) before deciding...

After some years of stereoscopic gaming for me it is clear, if there is not 3D support, there is no sale. But I know people that does not like it...
If you are interested in this you can go to http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showforum=40

[schlechter pfennig]

Good choice for sticking with ATi as they are a better card and have better driver support. As for which card to choose. That depends on how much you want to spend.

Also don't be put off buy purchasing a card that requires power from a power supply. As power supplies have come down quite a bit over the years and good quality power supplies are not that expensive. Plus the performance you will gain from a higher end card that requires the power will be exceptional.

Anyway that is something to consider and if you let me know what your budget is I would only be to happy to help you further in deciding on what card would be best.

I really appreciate the advice, and your offer to help! :)

What do you think of the Radeon HD 4650? I'd have to upgrade my power supply, as it requires a 400W or better and my current power supply is only 300W. I've no problems with the mechanical aspect of replacing a power supply :D although the financial extra in addition to the card won't be pleasant.

Hey! If only I could 'upgrade' my card and power supply using my renown! BdU, are you listening? :haha:

[CybaGirl]

No trouble and your most welcome.

What size monitor are you using as this affects how much ram would be best to have on the video card.

What other games are you playing or what other games do you intend on playing in the future?

The 4650 is still a basic card. The 4670 would be a better choice if it came down to it. As the lower memory speed on the 4650 gives it pretty low memory bandwidth performance.

Not to sure where you are located in the world and what prices are like where you are. Is the 4770 out of your price range?

But you are right! Wouldn't it be great if we could buy things and pay our bills with renown :D.

I think I would then be able to afford two motorbikes instead of one. But then I would have the problem of deciding on which one to ride :hmmm:...

[schlechter pfennig]

What size monitor are you using as this affects how much ram would be best to have on the video card.

What other games are you playing or what other games do you intend on playing in the future?

I have a 19" LG Flatron monitor.

Really, the only game I play, and intend to play, is SHIII. I'd really been looking forward to SH5 but, well . . . :nope:

[KL-alfman]

I have a 19" LG Flatron monitor.

Really, the only game I play, and intend to play, is SHIII. I'd really been looking forward to SH5 but, well . . . :nope:


that's cryptic.
could have been a post of mine ..... :hmmm::up:

[CybaGirl]

Sorry I forgot to add in my previous post what resolution are you running in?

1280 X 1024 being 4:3 or 1440 x 900 being 16:10 or something else?

But at this stage with having a 19" monitor 512MB of ram on a video card will be sufficient. Running in much higher resolutions requires more ram on your video card so as it does not affect performance. Buying a video card with 1GB of memory to run on lower resolution monitors is really a waste of money and you would be better off to put the money you save from not buying the 1GB version towards a faster 512MB video card. Unless of course there is very little price difference between the 512MB and the 1GB. At best you would only see a couple or few FPS difference between 512MB and 1GB video memory when using a 19" monitor.

The big difference comes in once you start using 22" and larger monitors running in higher resolutions.

BTW are you certain your motherboard has a PCI Express slot?

[schlechter pfennig]

Sorry I forgot to add in my previous post what resolution are you running in?

1280 X 1024 being 4:3 or 1440 x 900 being 16:10 or something else?

But at this stage with having a 19" monitor 512MB of ram on a video card will be sufficient. Running in much higher resolutions requires more ram on your video card so as it does not affect performance. Buying a video card with 1GB of memory to run on lower resolution monitors is really a waste of money and you would be better off to put the money you save from not buying the 1GB version towards a faster 512MB video card. Unless of course there is very little price difference between the 512MB and the 1GB. At best you would only see a couple or few FPS difference between 512MB and 1GB video memory when using a 19" monitor.

The big difference comes in once you start using 22" and larger monitors running in higher resolutions.

BTW are you certain your motherboard has a PCI Express slot?

I decided to go ahead and take a chance, and bought the HD 4650. The only place around here that carries in-stock graphics cards is Best Buy, and they don't exactly have a great deal of 'variety' with those. I figured, at worst, it wouldn't work and, at best, I'd get to see what sort of difference I'd see.

As it turns out, running GWX Gold, with full harbor traffic and 16K atmosphere, with 100% particle density and high texture, I get approximately an average, consistent, 25 fps. It doesn't stutter at all, not even when docked and doing an initial 360 around the harbor.

I'd already knew, for sure, I had a PCI Express slot. Being able to install the card, well . . . ;) But thanks for checking up with me and wanting to verify that; it is, after all, quite an important point to check on.

Vis-a-vis resolution: it's currently set at 1280 x 1024.

I paid, pre-sales tax, US $95 for the card. If there's little difference in performance at my monitor size between 512MB and 1GB, if you can suggest a comparably-priced Radeon that's signifigantly faster than the 4650, I'll order it and just return the 4650 once I get the newer.

I'll be getting a newer power supply later today. My stock one is only 300W, and the 4650 recommends at least a 400W one. I calculated my power consumption and, even with the new card, I should only be pulling a max of 270W, but I figure better safe than sorry.

[CybaGirl]

No trouble and atleast your FPS have improved with the newer card :).

When looking at power supplies if possible try to get something with an 80% efficiency. That way you will have a PSU that is more stable and constant. Also its a good idea to check the +12V rails and see what output they produce. As different PSU put out different levels. Of course the higher the output on the rail the better the power supply will be at powering devices such as video cards.

I wanted to double check and make sure you would get a card that suited your motherboard. As you wouldn't believe the amount of people who have made mistakes by buying a video card that doesn't suit the slot on their motherboard.

I have even seen some brand name computers have the same specs and exactly the same hardware inside them bar the video slot. I have seen some with the older AGP slot and others with the PCI Express slot. Bizarre I know! But all to true.

Anyway I hope it all works out for you and you are finally able to enjoy the game. If you any other queries just let me know and I will try to help you where I can.

PS: Here is a link in which you can compare video cards. You can select different benchmarks from the drop down box and compare different games with different settings etc.

http://tinyurl.com/ybju66e

Although it does not list the 4650 it lists the 4670 so it will give you a close guide as to how your card performs with others.