SH4 rocks with RFB 2!

[jason210]

I just loaded everything up again, with the Uboat missions and RFB 2 and I have to say I'm glad I have this sim, and that I can play when I want :)!

The graphics are great and it has all the features you would expect in a sim.

Although you don't have the full walkthrough experience, you can move around enough in the various stations to explore parts of the ship enough to see all the gauges and so on. It has the best balance of simulation, imersion and gameplay imho out of all the SH series. I loved SHIII but it's looking a bit old now.

I'm looking forward to playing a whole campaign again!

[Platapus]

I just installed RFB2 and have started a new career. Although my heart belongs to SH3, I am determined to give SH4 a good run. I am still not crazy about the interface for manual targeting, but it is a fun game. :yeah:

[Galanti]

I just installed RFB2 and have started a new career. Although my heart belongs to SH3, I am determined to give SH4 a good run. I am still not crazy about the interface for manual targeting, but it is a fun game. :yeah:

Wow, I'm about 180% in the other direction. I love the fleet boat TDC, especially the PK. I love the fact that I can set up a solution, turn on PK and continually check my inputs through sonar pings.

[TH0R]

Wow, I'm about 180% in the other direction. I love the fleet boat TDC, especially the PK. I love the fact that I can set up a solution, turn on PK and continually check my inputs through sonar pings.

+1 :)

[LukeFF]

:) .

[Dave Hansen]

I have also just recently started playing SH4 v1.5 with RFB 2.0 and RSRDC. Played SH3 with Grey Wolves a fair amount over the last couple of years and really enjoyed the experience...both with 100% realism and DID.

It's a little too early to say which I like the best, but the SH4 experience really is great! I wanted to try the PTO with a US boat...go through the learning curve as a rookie skipper starting from scratch again...also wanted to experience some of the nuiances of sub warfare vs. Japan and with another mega mod.

A couple of years down the road I'll probably think about SH5... after the bugs are squashed and the talented mod community is allowed to work their magic!:yeah:.

I've by passed (so far) the experience of using the PK to update target solutions...constant bearing approach is my tactic of choice early on in my PTO career.

[jason210]

I have also just recently started playing SH4 v1.5 with RFB 2.0 and RSRDC. ....

...the SH4 experience really is great....

....A couple of years down the road I'll probably think about SH5... after the bugs are squashed and the talented mod community is allowed to work their magic!:yeah:.

Agree with you about SH4. There's a good five years left in that game. As for SH5, while wait and see...

[jason210]

I just installed RFB2 and have started a new career. Although my heart belongs to SH3, I am determined to give SH4 a good run. I am still not crazy about the interface for manual targeting, but it is a fun game. :yeah:

I haven't used manual target in this game for ages. I hope I can remember how you do it. I remember having problems setting and resetting gyro angles.

[Frumpkis]

Another one here returning to SH4 after a year or so away. I was excited when I heard about SH5's release, but I backed off as soon as I heard about the double whammy of DRM/constant connection and the drastic changes to the UI. I'll wait six months and see what patches and mods are out for SH5 before getting it. As I recall, it took almost a year before SH4 was patched and modded into a respectable sim. I'm not sure my current computer can handle it anyway. I was going to upgrade just for that game, now I can put it off for a while.

So, back to the Pacific! My last outing was over a year ago with version 1.4 and whatever Trigger Maru version was out a year or so ago (with some edits to slightly dumb down the DD hyper awareness). So I bought the 1.5 expansion, and this time I thought I'd try RFB with the RSRD campaign overlay. I like the balance in RFB, it seems just about right to me. I did my first patrol with auto targeting, so I could remember how all the other stuff worked in the game. Next patrol I might try manual, not sure yet. I was good at position plotting for the approach, but not so good at final shooting with manual targeting, last time I tried it.

The RSRD campaign takes some getting used to, compared to the stock game. I'm still trying to get a feel for where the active shipping lanes are, aside from programmed (historical) task force movements. Anyway, I'm having fun, it's good to be back.

[McHibbins]

RFB 2 together with RSRD rocks ! After my first career in a Fleetboat i´ll try OM with Uboatmissions.

[ichso]

I just loaded everything up again, with the Uboat missions and RFB 2 and I have to say I'm glad I have this sim, and that I can play when I want :)!

The graphics are great and it has all the features you would expect in a sim.

Although you don't have the full walkthrough experience, you can move around enough in the various stations to explore parts of the ship enough to see all the gauges and so on. It has the best balance of simulation, imersion and gameplay imho out of all the SH series. I loved SHIII but it's looking a bit old now.

I'm looking forward to playing a whole campaign again!

Me too. All the talk about SH5 got me hooked up again :DL

[LukeFF]

You guys are in for a lot more "fun" when the next patch is released. :D

Hint: it has to do with the Mark 14's reliability. :damn:

[Camaero]

Yeah... let me tell you about the fun I had tonight!

I spent hours tracking and positioning myself to take down a task force. I spent more hours evading the escorts after severely damaging a cruiser. Then I surfaced and raced ahead of the damaged cruiser (who had been left behind by his comrades) only to place myself in the perfect position. Yay I'm about to watch my first ship of the patrol explode and sink right?

Wrong. I launch 3 torps and one of them runs in a circle and kills me. :damn:

**** you Mark 14's.

(I do love RFB but I'm still pissed right now.)

[TH0R]

I've had my very first circular run a couple of nights ago too. It missed my CT by few feet, luckily I was submerged for the attack. :) Shame we can't have some kind of warning by sonar guy to tell us 'running hot straight and normal', or 'circular run'...

Looking forward to the next patch. :up:

[SteveUK]

Malakar Straights - hunting my 5th tanker of the patrol.

Quarter moon, partly cloudy skys, flat calm, no wind, tanker 1100 yards.

Fired tubes one and two - Torpedo is a dud sir!

Fired three and four - Torpedo is a dud sir! :damn:

Pack up and ahead back to port kicking dents in the desk - thank you RFB you make this game:salute:


And
Hint: it has to do with the Mark 14's reliability. Thought things were going to well :DL

[CCIP]

You guys are in for a lot more "fun" when the next patch is released. :D

Hint: it has to do with the Mark 14's reliability. :damn:

Are we getting the Narwhal next patch too? :)

[LukeFF]

Are we getting the Narwhal next patch too? :)

I think it will. I just need to devote an evening to getting it integrated fully into the mod.

[Jten]

Yeah... let me tell you about the fun I had tonight!

I spent hours tracking and positioning myself to take down a task force. I spent more hours evading the escorts after severely damaging a cruiser. Then I surfaced and raced ahead of the damaged cruiser (who had been left behind by his comrades) only to place myself in the perfect position. Yay I'm about to watch my first ship of the patrol explode and sink right?

Wrong. I launch 3 torps and one of them runs in a circle and kills me. :damn:

**** you Mark 14's.

(I do love RFB but I'm still pissed right now.)



Sub Captains in RL would change depth after firing. You only need to 'guppy' the boat. Descend to 100 and then back up to PD if you still need to look at things.

[Immacolata]

Wow, I'm about 180% in the other direction. I love the fleet boat TDC, especially the PK. I love the fact that I can set up a solution, turn on PK and continually check my inputs through sonar pings.


I just never got the hang of that Position Keeper. How does it work? What is the point of it?

[BillBam]

I just never got the hang of that Position Keeper. How does it work? What is the point of it?

The position keeper allows you to keep a solution locked in. Since the target and usually your boat are moving the solution is always changine, this compensates for the movement.

[AVGWarhawk]

I just never got the hang of that Position Keeper. How does it work? What is the point of it?

Next to the Norden bomb sight it was one of the best devices of WW2. The name means exactly what it does. It keeps relative position of your boat to the target vessel done through your inputs on the TDC. It is done mechanically. Those inputs are range, speed and AOB. If your three calculations noted are close to dead on, the position keeper will show with outlines of your boat and target vessel on dials. Each dial moves according to your inputs and continues to move each dial after it is turned on. Unless you or your target changes course the position keeper allows the user to predict with certainty the position of your boat to the target generating optimal view to a sinking. Keep in mind that once the three critical inputs are established and entered the scope does not really require to go up for a look anymore. Just watch the position keeper. The device also changed the gyros in the torpedos real time via the TDC. It is quite a clever device.

[McHibbins]

Put 3 fishes in different compartments and nearly 35 HE (waterline) shells in an small tanker last night and saw him sank after 25 minutes RL.
Imho a small tanker should be nearly desintegrated with this.

I really like the sinking mechanics...... but getting sick of the damage modell sometimes.

Is it possible to make a "lite" version. Got SH5 in mind where are two mods around, working great together (Real flooding and critical hits for torps).

I´m really missing the "big booom" sometimes or the chance of quick finishing off especially the small merchants.

Where can i find the files to lower the hitpoints for a ship or increase the strenghts of the torps or shells ? I´m thinking of *zone files but don´t know which editor i can use for them.

[ShadowWolf Kell]

RFB 2 together with RSRD rocks ! After my first career in a Fleetboat i´ll try OM with Uboatmissions.


If you like the changes brought about with RSRD, you'll like OM + OMEGU.

Lurker's done an amazing job of bringing the U-Boats to life. Two things you'll learn to hate though. The frequency of torpedo duds in the early years (magnetic works better in 39, but relies on calm seas or really close range) and Sunderlands and PBYs that'll make your life miserable.

The only caveat is that OM + OMEGU is exceptionally touchy when it comes to adding in extra mods.

[Bish0p]

Put 3 fishes in different compartments and nearly 35 HE (waterline) shells in an small tanker last night and saw him sank after 25 minutes RL.
Imho a small tanker should be nearly desintegrated with this.

I really like the sinking mechanics...... but getting sick of the damage modell sometimes.

Is it possible to make a "lite" version. Got SH5 in mind where are two mods around, working great together (Real flooding and critical hits for torps).

I´m really missing the "big booom" sometimes or the chance of quick finishing off especially the small merchants.

Where can i find the files to lower the hitpoints for a ship or increase the strenghts of the torps or shells ? I´m thinking of *zone files but don´t know which editor i can use for them.


DDEnvironment does that.
increases torp strength to a realistic level.
reduces the torp failure rate.
Does all kinds of little extra stuff like that to improve gameplay.

It's an overwrite, so I'd think after installing it, you could enable whatever mod your using.
then the JSGME mod enabled pack would take precedence.
It's also 100% compatible with even a vanilla install of sh4.
so you can play it while using our mod and your friend can play with you, but not need the mod.

Check it out here: http://www.warishellgaming.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26067

to do that yourself, you need to edit the torpedo.zon file.
I believe it's torpedos_US.zon.

Use s3d to edit them.

[Armistead]

The maker of DDenv. said it wouldn't work with any of the supermods...

[LukeFF]

increases torp strength to a realistic level.

That's highly subjective.

[LukeFF]

Put 3 fishes in different compartments and nearly 35 HE (waterline) shells in an small tanker last night and saw him sank after 25 minutes RL.
Imho a small tanker should be nearly desintegrated with this.

Which tanker? There are two of them in the game.

[RFB Team]

Put 3 fishes in different compartments and nearly 35 HE (waterline) shells in an small tanker last night and saw him sank after 25 minutes RL.
Imho a small tanker should be nearly desintegrated with this.

In tests ran with the Small Old Tanker (assuming this was the ship in question), 1 torpedo took down the ship every time in less than 15 minutes.

Suggest you make sure you don't have conflicting mods. There is no way in the world a small tanker should be surviving 3 torpedo hits in RFB.

EDIT: in tests ran with the tanker added with the U-boat add-on, the ship sometimes took 1 hit and sometimes 2 before it sank.

The mod's working as designed. :D

[McHibbins]

Ok mates, i´m sorry !

Wasn´t a small old one. It was the medium that came with the Addon I think :oops:

Running SH4 with RFB 2.0 and RSRD SH15V550 +Patch.
I don´t want to criticize your mod ´cause I really love it. The sinking mechanics for merchants above ie. 4500 tons are great.

But just for me personally, I would like to have the chance for quicker sinking a ship under 4000 tons or get a Tanker down with a big explosion (maybe too eyecandy or unrealistic but I saw that so often in some documentaries. On the other hand I know, that an empty Merchand is hard to sink, an empty Tanker might be much much harder)

So, when I´m talking about a "light version" of the damage model I have the stock behavier for small ships or a slighly increased firepower in mind.

There was a really good compromise made for SH5 where natural sinking mechanics or flooding (mod) works together with critical torps or/and deckgun (mod).






http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=163930

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=163663

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=164953





The one is slowing down the sinking while the others is giving the chance for a critical hit and mighty boom.

I personally like the idea behind the Crit-Torp-Mod. He´s not only decreasing the power but give the loadup a chance between ie 100 pts(low damage) or 400 (high damage).

In GWX i think was also a nice harmony between sinking mechanics and quick finnishing. You were able to observe the sinking of an merchant for a long time but you were also able to go surface and destroy him quickly with another torp or deckgun if necessary ( aircraft base nearby etc).

I don´t know if this is possible for SH4 or some Mods but personally i would like it.

And just to make it clear : I´m not an impatient Counterstriker :D but i think it´s historical proven that a big boom isn´t just eyecandy.

Again, I adore your work and really love your mod. No harm, no criticism, it´s just a little thing I wish to have.




P.S.: sry for my bad english

[TH0R]

^^ +1 on what he said :)

[LukeFF]

Guys, if a 1500-ton oil tanker can sink after one torpedo shot in less than 15 minutes (I've even seen some sink in less than 10 minutes), then you can do the same in RFB as well. I'm playing with the same sinking mechanics in RFB as you all. The mod is what it is. ;)

[TH0R]

Guys, if a 1500-ton oil tanker can sink after one torpedo shot in less than 15 minutes (I've even seen some sink in less than 10 minutes), then you can do the same in RFB as well. I'm playing with the same sinking mechanics in RFB as you all. The mod is what it is. ;)


The sinking mechanics are great. And the way you delayed the message about ships sinking is excellent. The only thing missing is a chance for critical hit. With both torpedoes and cannons. Probably the only thing missing from RFB IMHO. :)


As for the 1500-ton oil tanker sinking in less than 10 min, that is true. But at one point I had 3/3 duds on the little b***** and had to use the cannon. Even after 50 shots below the water line (~30 were hits) it didn't show any signs of stopping. Which brings me to my next question - does RFB, or SH4 in general simulate the cargo carried on merchants?


Also, can deck guns on merchants be destroyed, knocked out of action? I recall duelling it out with one merchant and I know I have hit the deck gun implacement few times dead on - nothing happened...

[LukeFF]

The sinking mechanics are great. And the way you delayed the message about ships sinking is excellent. The only thing missing is a chance for critical hit. With both torpedoes and cannons. Probably the only thing missing from RFB IMHO. :)

The chance for a critical hit is still there. It's just that it's very small. (See page 19 of the manual).

Which brings me to my next question - does RFB, or SH4 in general simulate the cargo carried on merchants?As in how quickly a ship can sink with a certain type of cargo? In that case, I think the only cargo that affects a ship's sinking behavior is the ammo loadout (higher chance of a critical hit).

Also, can deck guns on merchants be destroyed, knocked out of action? I recall duelling it out with one merchant and I know I have hit the deck gun implacement few times dead on - nothing happened...I'd have to check that. Not sure at this time.

[TH0R]

The chance for a critical hit is still there. It's just that it's very small. (See page 19 of the manual).

Read the manual again. Still, I have yet to see a critical hit. :hmmm:

As in how quickly a ship can sink with a certain type of cargo? In that case, I think the only cargo that affects a ship's sinking behavior is the ammo loadout (higher chance of a critical hit).

Yes, how quickly it sinks, and how torpedo damage affects the ship. I did notice that tankers in RFB do catch a lot of fire when hit. Dunno if this is stock behaviour or intended.

The part I am most interested is - do the ships without cargo sink harder? And are ammo / gasoline (tankers) ships more prone to critical hits?

I'd have to check that. Not sure at this time.

Thanks. I have posted this question a while back on Sub Sim Central forums, but didn't get a clear reply: http://forum.kickinbak.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1788

[LukeFF]

The only thing I'm fairly certain of is that ships carrying ammunition are more prone to critical hits.

Critical hits are designed to be rare, though I might up it a bit. Currently the chance of a critical hit is 1/10th of 1%. :o

[TH0R]

The only thing I'm fairly certain of is that ships carrying ammunition are more prone to critical hits.

Critical hits are designed to be rare, though I might up it a bit. Currently the chance of a critical hit is 1/10th of 1%. :o

:o Indeed...

I am telling you, I have been playing RFB ever since I have SH4 and I have yet to see a critical hit. Maybe you have seen it during testing process, but from my experience of plying the campaign / single missions I haven't.

To what value are you planing to raise the percentage?

Probably the main reason for me asking this is reading Tang's war patrols:

The escort of the lead ship, Yamashimo Maru, moved from its covering position on the port bow, and the submarine slipped into it and launched four torpedoes. The first hit the stern of the cargoman, the second struck just aft of the stack; and the third burst just forward of the bridge and produced a terrific secondary explosion. The ship was twisted, lifted from the water, and began belching flames as she sank.

The next day, after locating two freighters and two escorts, she launched three torpedoes at the larger freighter and two at the other. The larger freighter {"Roko Maru"} disintegrated apparently from a torpedo which exploded in her boilers.

[AVGWarhawk]

IMO since seconday explosions and fire do not affect sinking ships should be a tad bit easier to sink.

[LukeFF]

To what value are you planing to raise the percentage?

I've bumped it up to 1%. May go higher to 5%.

[Admiral8Q]

I don't play any mods yet, but for critical hits I'd go 5%, or 1 in 20 chance.

[TH0R]

I've bumped it up to 1%. May go higher to 5%.

I think 5% should be optimum. I agree with Admiral8Q, 1 out of 20 sounds just right.

[LukeFF]

I think 5% should be optimum. I agree with Admiral8Q, 1 out of 20 sounds just right.

Consider it done. :)

[Dave Hansen]

Critical Hit % applies only to critical areas of the target...?

[LukeFF]

Critical Hit % applies only to critical areas of the target...?

It means that, if a torpedo causes a critical hit, it will cause catastrophic damage to the whole ship.

Or, as the (ahem) RFB manual (/ahem) states:

Critical chance is a special setting for each compartment that represents the idea that a single torpedo hit may cause catastrophic damage resulting in the sinking of the ship. Critical chance represents a sort of "golden BB." It is possible to get a critical hit any time a compartment takes damage. Critical chance is an important characteristic of the ship damage mod since it represents the intangible factors that could cause a ship to suddenly sink such as coal dust or fuel vapors, an old, weak ship, a weak spot, etc. All cargo and machinery compartments have the potential for a critical hit, though the possibility is small.

[Chubster]

Where is said manual.....have downloaded 2.0 but its not in there?

Edit....Tis ok, found the link

[Steelkilt]

Guys...are we talking about the RFB 1.52 Manual...I found the link and downloaded it...or did I see mention about a 2.0 Manual...I'm finding this wild link chasing kinda :damn:...just the way I am...if a 2.0 manual is out there, let me know, please...so I can continue on with the quest...SK

[LukeFF]

Guys...are we talking about the RFB 1.52 Manual...I found the link and downloaded it...or did I see mention about a 2.0 Manual...I'm finding this wild link chasing kinda :damn:...just the way I am...if a 2.0 manual is out there, let me know, please...so I can continue on with the quest...SK

The 1.52 manual is the only PDF version of the manual ever made to this point. The follow-on readme files explain any changes made to the game since 1.52 was published. Otherwise, the information in the manual should be your starting point for understanding how RFB works.

[Steelkilt]

Keep your ears on...your doing a good job...:salute:....SK

[McHibbins]

Just wondering where the "critical chance" is fixed, Zones.Cfg ?
And if so, does critical chance=0.05 mean 5% ?