View Full Version : No Connection/Dialup only/Hate DRM
I think this would be statistically a very interesting view of why people wont be buying SHV as well as other games that require a permanent online connection.:hmmm:
There are those who:
Do not have a connection at all.
Unstable/bad connection.
Only have dialup, that is just too slow, especially for game saves!
Just don't like being online for single player games.
Because of these reasons I feel that after the initial release and sales flatten out a patch will be released and a second wave of sales will flood the market, this would be good for all, gamers and Ubisoft!:yep:
Note: This is not a hate DRM/OSP thread, I'm trying to find out how many people can't buy DRM/OSP type games due to hardware problems, if I didn't put the last entry in people would just vote on the first 3 making the whole point of this redundant.
Schultzy
02-25-10, 09:51 PM
Can you imagine how big your phone bill would be if you went on patrol on dial up? :o
I like your optimism and I hope you're right, but I'm not at sure that that will happen.
Well I posted this in another thread, but since you made a thread for it:
legitimate people that either haven't got an internet connection or only have dialup that is not good enough for permanent online use! that's a lot of potential buyers
A lot of potential buyers with no connection or dial-up in 2010!!
Maybe, but I guess they were also in the impossibility to get the 1.33 GB GWX 3.0
Well I posted this in another thread, but since you made a thread for it:
A lot of potential buyers with no connection or dial-up in 2010!!
Maybe, but I guess they were also in the impossibility to get the 1.33 GB GWX 3.0I answered in the other thread, It is a fact! I know of a few towns less than 100km from the city center that have dialup only here in Australia, and there must be a lot I don't know also there must be other countries in the same boat!:oops: Statistics above will soon show, that is why I posted this thread.:yep:
Schultzy
02-25-10, 09:58 PM
Maybe, but I guess they were also in the impossibility to get the 1.33 GB GWX 3.0[/B]
Before I moved to the UK, where I lived didn't have an Internet connection. I used the bookshop to check email and forums at a rate of 10 cent per minute and to download patches, I went to the rob dog Inet cafe and bought 5 hours of credit and D/L'd the files to my zip drive. Not practical, but at least I could get what I needed and then play it at home.
I am sure there are others out there like that.
I am sure there are others out there like that.
Sure, but I'd be curious to know if they are so many?
The Prime Minister said a fast internet connection is now as vital as electricity, gas and water, and will help the country's communications industries pull Britain out of the recession. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/5546288/Gordon-Brown-pledges-broadband-for-all-amid-claims-millions-will-be-denied-service.html
Schultzy
02-25-10, 10:11 PM
Sure, but I'd be curious to know if they are so many?
Chances are, they aren't connected, so we'll never know. lol ;)
No, to be serious, I agree with you. It would be interesting to know.
I'm sure though, that UBI must have done their research to go ahead with this DRM and if we assume that, then that means that they must have factored in the losses connected with freezing out a number of potential customers via this system. And by extrapolation, they must feel they can take the hit.
Time will tell if they were right.
In my opinion though, not everyone who would have liked to try SH5 will have perma-net.
Onkel Neal
02-25-10, 10:12 PM
Is this going to be a repeat of the other 38 polls about DRM? :hmmm:
My prediction: 80% will select the 4th option :O:
Schultzy
02-25-10, 10:15 PM
Is this going to be a repeat of the other 38 polls about DRM? :hmmm:
My prediction: 80% will select the 4th option :O:
The other 20% would have voted for option 4 too Neal, but their net connection was down. :p
Is this going to be a repeat of the other 38 polls about DRM? :hmmm:
My prediction: 80% will select the 4th option :O:That may well be, but for statistical reasons could be interesting!:hmmm:
I'm sure though, that UBI must have done their research to go ahead with this DRM and if we assume that, then that means that they must have factored in the losses connected with freezing out a number of potential customers via this system. And by extrapolation, they must feel they can take the hit.
Time will tell if they were right.
Yes, I agree.
In my opinion though, not everyone who would have liked to try SH5 will have perma-net.
It might be difficult to know the exact proportion.
jwilliams
02-25-10, 11:27 PM
Well I posted this in another thread, but since you made a thread for it:
A lot of potential buyers with no connection or dial-up in 2010!!
Maybe, but I guess they were also in the impossibility to get the 1.33 GB GWX 3.0
WASHINGTON — Roughly 40 percent of Americans do not have high-speed Internet access at home, according to new Commerce Department figures that underscore the challenges facing policymakers who are trying to bring affordable broadband connections to everyone.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h50V1d804iJXjfMEss3plGwMzZwgD9DTD6IG1
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h50V1d804iJXjfMEss3plGwMzZwgD9DTD6IG1
I'd say the number is somewhat higher then 40 pct. I know of areas not too far from here (roughly 40 miles east of DC) where all you can get is dial up.
CaptainHaplo
02-25-10, 11:50 PM
The poll isn't accurate. I don't hate DRM - I simply refuse to by a game that uses OSP (or any other "you have to be online" equivilant). DRM is a necessity, and I don't blame companies for using it. When the DRM that is chosen is overly intrusive is when I have an issue.
Had you used OSP instead of DRM I would vote.
mookiemookie
02-25-10, 11:52 PM
What's the point in rehashing this again? :doh:
What's the point in rehashing this again? :doh:
You know those little pictures about 'arguing on the internet', I'm starting to think they're right. ;) (not talking about the pool)
What's the point in rehashing this again? :doh:I'm trying to find out how many actually have hardware problems as to why they "can't" buy it!:-?
@ CaptainHaplo, I was going to put OSP but most know it as DRM, you know what I mean!:yep:
THE_MASK
02-26-10, 01:00 AM
I didnt vote because i will wait and see how it is with other users first .
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h50V1d804iJXjfMEss3plGwMzZwgD9DTD6IG1
From your own link:
Among households that do not have broadband, the survey found, 38 percent said they don't need it or are not interested. Twenty-six percent said it is too expensive. Only 3.6 percent said they do not subscribe because it is not available where they live.;)
Adriatico
02-26-10, 02:08 AM
It's a pitty that I can not wote both for options 3. and 4.
If it is one - let it be 4.
:dead:
Yes. but then the 38% and 26% sudenly found out that they wanted SH5,
Ok, I give up, you win, you're right.
From the farmer to the old grandma, all of them suddenly want SH5.
jwilliams
02-26-10, 02:28 AM
A lot of potential buyers with no connection or dial-up in 2010!!
You posted that as if you thought it was imposible for people not to have high speed internet.....
40% of people dont have high speed internet in the US.
Is this going to be a repeat of the other 38 polls about DRM? :hmmm:
My prediction: 80% will select the 4th option :O:
Well, I for one can't vote here as the primary reason is the lack of hardware to run the game.
A lot of potential buyers with no connection or dial-up in 2010!!You posted that as if you thought it was imposible for people not to have high speed internet....
Just a precision:
A lot of potential buyers with no connection or dial-up in 2010!!
Maybe, but I guess they were also in the impossibility to get the 1.33 GB GWX 3.0
I've said maybe
But there's no problem mate! you're right and I'm wrong.
bookworm_020
02-26-10, 03:50 AM
I don't see the reason for having to have an internet connection to play a single player game. It feels like an invasion of privacy!:nope:
Is this going to be a repeat of the other 38 polls about DRM?
There have not been that many. 3? 4? and most have been locked or merged.
The poll could use options for "other" and "I will buy it".
I'm trying to find out how many actually have hardware problems as to why they "can't" buy it!:-?
@ CaptainHaplo, I was going to put OSP but most know it as DRM, you know what I mean!:yep:
Hi Reece
It is not so much a matter of a hardware problem or general online access - it is more a problem of the likekiness of being thrown out in the middle of a (long) mission or being restricted to areas with Internet connection.
Silent hunter experience is not short lived like a FPS - so the chance of having online problems grows with playtime within a mission. And missions tend to be rather long - mission times surely exceed one hour of playtime. Do not tell me, that you NEVER have line problems in this time period.
Second - many of us enjoy such a game while being somewhere, but not near an Internet connection. Why should we accept this fact ? (For many of us, this is the main NoGo argument)
YukonJack_AK
02-26-10, 04:45 AM
You posted that as if you thought it was imposible for people not to have high speed internet.....
40% of people dont have high speed internet in the US.
Here in Alaska, the majority of people are still on dialup and the high speed that is offered is a joke (On a GREAT day I download at 100kbps). I have a hard enough time just being online let alone if the wife is online too. So no thanks, Ubi... I'll just be sticking with SH3/GWX for now!
mstang67
02-26-10, 04:56 AM
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h50V1d804iJXjfMEss3plGwMzZwgD9DTD6IG1
Just wanted to point out that the survey was taken of only 54,000 households, a pretty small fraction of the real amount. :salute:
mission times surely exceed one hour of playtime. Do not tell me, that you NEVER have line problems in this time period.
Oh I have quite a lot of dropouts, I'm 5.5km from exchange, the broadband limit is 5km, so depending on weather conditions the connection will drop out, that is why I put the third option, although I myself voted for number 4.:yep:
Oh I have quite a lot of dropouts, I'm 5.5km from exchange, the broadband limit is 5km, so depending on weather conditions the connection will drop out, that is why I put the third option, although I myself voted for number 4.:yep:
Hi Reece
The high chance of being thrown out of a mission at least once - this is what certainly would spoil my experience. And - anger is not good, if you try to get away from the real world, is it ?
In your case, there is even a higher chance, that you even may not start the game at all.
But UBI decided not to care ... :nope::nope:
I don't mind DRM for single player games. I personally have never struck any problems, (besides residual SecuRom files which are simple to remove if you know how), but I don't see the point of OSP a specific type of DRM chose by Ubi to "protect" its games. All it is doing is fermenting ill feeling towards the company and its products and is likely to cause them grief far beyond the likely "benefits".
I therefore cannot vote in this poll in its current form as it does not have any option that reflects what I feel.
I don't mind DRM for single player games. I personally have never struck any problems, (besides residual SecuRom files which are simple to remove if you know how), but I don't see the point of OSP a specific type of DRM chose by Ubi to "protect" its games. All it is doing is fermenting ill feeling towards the company and its products and is likely to cause them grief far beyond the likely "benefits".
I therefore cannot vote in this poll in its current form as it does not have any option that reflects what I feel.
I believe that in this case "DRM" refers to online DRM.
The terms seem to be interchangeable here.
salac_78
02-26-10, 05:16 AM
I have great connection,cudos to my isp.Rarely do i lose it(maybe 1 a month tops for an hour becose of maitenance),but u have to draw the line somewhere.Regarding games i only play simulations;il 2,lock on,and sh series(my favourite),and it pains me to say that i will skip this one:down:.Shame,and i was so looking forward to it:wah:
I believe that in this case "DRM" refers to online DRM.
The terms seem to be interchangeable here.
That's why I always use the term OSP. No confusion. Starforce and Securom are both DRM but not necessarily online. OSP is something quite different and I prefer to make the distinction distinct.:DL
That's why I always use the term OSP. No confusion. Starforce and Securom are both DRM but not necessarily online. OSP is something quite different and I prefer to make the distinction distinct.
Part of the reluctance to use 'OSP' might be the way Ubi have touted their
new system as 'DRM Free' in the hope of dissociating it with their poor
track record with DRM systems and advertising it as a customer service.
This despite OSP clearly being a form of DRM.
Personally I prefer the term "online DRM". That's unambiguous.
...what does OSP stand for anyway?! ed: service my arse.
I don't mind DRM for single player games. I personally have never struck any problems, (besides residual SecuRom files which are simple to remove if you know how), but I don't see the point of OSP a specific type of DRM chose by Ubi to "protect" its games. All it is doing is fermenting ill feeling towards the company and its products and is likely to cause them grief far beyond the likely "benefits".
I therefore cannot vote in this poll in its current form as it does not have any option that reflects what I feel.Yes once I had posted the thread I realized I should have put OSP, but too late!:damn:
flakmonkey
02-26-10, 06:07 AM
Cant you use the drm system with dialup connections?? I have 3.6Meg dialup and i was kind of hoping it would be fast enough??
Never mind inconvenience, possible unreliability, the right to shut down service within 30 days and other anti-customer measures, etc . . .
The idea of having to connect to a server 5,000 miles away in order to reach something stored in one's computer is beyond ridiculous. :rotfl2::rotfl2::rotfl2:
Cant you use the drm system with dialup connections?? I have 3.6Meg dialup and i was kind of hoping it would be fast enough??
As long as you are always connected whilst playing; yes.
sharkbit
02-26-10, 08:40 AM
If DRM were the only reason I wasn't going to buy SH5, #4 was my choice.
There are other things that concern me more that can be answered when the game is actually released.
DRM is not the deal breaker....yet.
:)
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h50V1d804iJXjfMEss3plGwMzZwgD9DTD6IG1
Just wanted to point out that the survey was taken of only 54,000 households, a pretty small fraction of the real amount. :salute:
Only 54,000 households :doh:
Is this some kind of joke... or do you really expect them to call every households in America. :nope:
Only 54,000 households :doh:
Is this some kind of joke... or do you really expect them to call every households in America. :nope:
Lol, Meo. What Mstang probably missed is that 54,000 is a huge representative group. Most suse a carefully selected group of around 2,000 people. This gives the survey a margin of error of 3%.
The surveys done here are pretty accurate as the responders have a vested interest on the subject matter.
For example, it is pretty safe to predict that Ubi will take a serious hit iin sales on all gsmes with OSP (or the name of the day). Their sales to their core markets will probably be well below 70% off past releases.
Since they are trying to reach possibly uninformed markets, it may take them a few months to realize they are in serious financial trouble.
Sailor Steve
02-26-10, 10:32 AM
The poll could have used the 'boxes', the ones that let you make more than one choice.
I can't always afford a connection, so that was my vote, but even if I was filthy rich I would be against the whole thing on principle.
Why do you assume we didn't order SHV?
Sailor Steve
02-26-10, 10:39 AM
Why do you assume we didn't order SHV?
He was speaking only to those who aren't buying it. If you are, good, but you're not part of his target audience.
For example, it is pretty safe to predict that Ubi will take a serious hit iin sales on all gsmes with OSP (or the name of the day). Their sales to their core markets will probably be well below 70% off past releases.
Since they are trying to reach possibly uninformed markets, it may take them a few months to realize they are in serious financial trouble.
All will be revealed in March. (TM) Jimbuna. All rights reserved.
:DL
Rockin Robbins
02-26-10, 03:25 PM
I certainly hope Brag is correct. The word customer needs to be spelled with a capital "C". They are supposed to meet our needs, not the other way around.
The poll could have used the 'boxes', the ones that let you make more than one choice.
I can't always afford a connection, so that was my vote, but even if I was filthy rich I would be against the whole thing on principle.
If you were filthy rich, you'd buy the franchise and do it extravagantly right.
Threesixtyci
02-26-10, 03:57 PM
Can you imagine how big your phone bill would be if you went on patrol on dial up? :o
I like your optimism and I hope you're right, but I'm not at sure that that will happen.
Well I'd imagine it would be the same as your last month bill, because local calls generally aren't based per minute.
Well I'd imagine it would be the same as your last month bill, because local calls generally aren't based per minute.
Not in Europe.
V.C. Sniper
02-26-10, 06:10 PM
im not going to buy it bcause its not finished
Iron Budokan
02-26-10, 06:13 PM
I also don't like the focus on the game and the SubPG aspect.
Schultzy
02-26-10, 06:17 PM
Well I'd imagine it would be the same as your last month bill, because local calls generally aren't based per minute.
Really? Man, you get games before us Europeans AND you don't pay per minute for your local calls?! I hate you all :O:
Among households that do not have broadband, the survey found, 38 percent said they don't need it or are not interested. Twenty-six percent said it is too expensive. Only 3.6 percent said they do not subscribe because it is not available where they live.
You clearly don't understand the way internet services are classified in Australia.
Back in about 1999 the government mandated that telstra (the formerly national telecom co) should make "high speed internet' available to ninety-something percent of Australians.
Now being the cheap lazy bastards they are, they got around that through their satellite internet services, which were both painfully slow, and punishingly expensive.
Nowdays in 2010, for most people not in the five major cities in Australia, we're reliant on 3G services for our internet, which in Australia is classed as 'having access to high speed internet access' yet right now I am struggling to open new pages as my connection isn't going much faster than 40kb a second, and it will get worse as the evening sets in, that is an everyday thing.
And I have to pay $100 per month for 6gb (thats six gigabytes) of data download for the 'privilege' and I live in a capitol city!
Of course all this is moot when I'm working overseas and have no internet options.
So many Europeans and Americans don't seem to grasp the basic concept that not everyone has easy, cheap, fast internet access, you all think we've got 20mb/s connections with unlimited bandwidth.
Uber Gruber
02-28-10, 06:48 AM
So can I conclude then that there is a number of people in our subsim community who will not buy SH5 due to the requirement to be always on the net when playing in single player mode ?
And if so, what exactly is our subsim community doing about it ? An official statement from Neal at this point would be welcome - either one way or the other. :hmmm:
So can I conclude then that there is a number of people in our subsim community who will not buy SH5 due to the requirement to be always on the net when playing in single player mode ?
A large amount, including myself, will not purchase due to permanent online requirement!:dead:
And if so, what exactly is our subsim community doing about it ? An official statement from Neal at this point would be welcome - either one way or the other. :hmmm:Not much he could say other that "Tough!", UBI won't listen, they don't care even a teeny bit!:03: We just have to hope that eventually a patch will be released!:yep: If not "Tough!":oops:
Sailor Steve
02-28-10, 04:16 PM
If you were filthy rich, you'd buy the franchise and do it extravagantly right.
:rock:
Or just start a new one.
HEY! I have five cents I can spare! Anyone else want to pitch in?
:rotfl2:
im not going to buy it bcause its not finished
I hope you don't have SH3 then.
So can I conclude then that there is a number of people in our subsim community who will not buy SH5 due to the requirement to be always on the net when playing in single player mode ?
Definitely one here.
I'm pretty sure the game will sell very poorly in Australia as a whole too.
Webster
03-01-10, 01:10 PM
Definitely one here.
I'm pretty sure the game will sell very poorly in Australia as a whole too.
for some strange reason UBI seams to understand they are going to lose a significant segment of the customers who are attracted to this series yet they are fine with that happening so its not like they dont know what to expect
Eightbit
03-01-10, 01:10 PM
Not sure if it's been said. But this is a really bad poll. They all mean and point to the same thing. Drm, who would vote for dial up only if the only reason they need the net to begin with is drm. lol....
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