Luge athlete killed in Vancouver 2010 training run

[Highbury]

Sad news on the first day of our Olympics here in my home town.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Georgian+luger+dies+after+horrifying+crash+Whistle r+track/2556532/story.html

Condolences to his family. Tragic accident indeed.

[FIREWALL]

Is sad. One of my favorite events to watch.

I always thought it took alot of guts to drive one of those things.

[Platapus]

90 MPH!

What a terrible accident. At those speeds there is zero room for error/malfunction. :nope:

[Highbury]

There really should have been an extended retaining wall where he lost control. I am 99.9% sure there will be before another set of blades hits that course. It is unprecedented, and unacceptable for a rider to bodily leave the course.

Unfortunately like may auto racing crashes in the past, when you see a replay you can't help but wonder how that section was passed as "safe". These issues are often only detected after someone has paid the price.

I am hearing alot on local news today that it is the fastest track in the world, and a very difficult track, he was young and inexperienced.. none of that matters. The safety has to be improved on this track.

[krashkart]

Push the envelope far enough someone pays dearly. Did he sign up to be a test pilot, or a luge man?

[Skybird]

Fastest track in the world, wrongly calculated for speeds of 130-137 km/h, where actually they drive speeds in excess of 155 km/h. there were serious safety concerns from beginning on, and it is not the first accident there, and at that part of the track. Some measurements were added, obviously not enough.

The problem has been underestimated or played down, maybe intentionally for spectacular effects (not the accidnet, but record speeds).

It's a racing sport with high speeds and high risks, everybody involved knows, at least should know what he is in for, and it is voluntary. the track should be shortened, and if a majority of athletes wish (I doubt it), the competiton should be skipped. but the rest of the games should go on, with some symbolic gesture during the opening ceremony.

[ReFaN]

Tragic :(

[frau kaleun]

That is just terrible. So sad for his family and friends, hope they make some safety adjustments so no one else gets hurt. It looks dangerous enough as it is.

[Torvald Von Mansee]

It would seem that maybe luging should be done down a tube, like when u r at a water park.

[OneToughHerring]

Seems that the track in question is one of the fastest tracks and that the foreign competitors haven't had the chance of trying it out nearly as many time as the Canadian competitors. Might be a lawsuit or something in there somewhere, or the Georgians might quit the games.

[krashkart]

CBS News last night tried to show me actual footage of the accident. I switched channels. About to give up entirely on network news. :nope:

[SteamWake]

What they need is restrictor plates on those things.

[Jimbuna]

The president at a press conference shortly after the tragedy had the audacity to sidestep questions regarding the safety issues claiming the present time was more about the sorrow of the situation than the reasons/cause. :nope:

[Platapus]

It would seem that maybe luging should be done down a tube, like when u r at a water park.

Five reasons just off the top of my head on why they don't.

1. You would not be able to see the rider which cuts down on the spectator appeal

2. It would have to be a very large tube so as not adversely affect the rider with wind.

3. It would be almost impossible to inspect the course for hazards

4. Maintaining a smooth ice surface in a closed (full) tube would be difficult.

5. If there were an accident the rider and the sled would be contained in the tube all traveling and bouncing at 90 mph. Imagine a food processor.

[krashkart]

Mmm, processed food processor food... *drool*

Would make some sense to enclose the track to keep the luge drivers from catching serious air, but a crashed sledder would have to be extricated from the tube somehow. Plus, the above counterpoints ^^. At those kinds of speeds a dude's probably not going to survive anyway.

[Platapus]

Unfortunately as the technology and the skills increase, the sport is at the point of being lethal if there is an error (mechanical, environmental, or human).

I suspect that there will be rules to limit the speeds as was done in auto racing. This will put a damper on the sport.

I, for one, am not fond of sports where the chances of people dying is very high.

[CaptainHaplo]

I saw they are saying it was "human error" due to a late entry into a corner. The least they could have done was waited until the spotlight had disappeared before issuing that. What they should do is just make changes to the course so that human error - which WILL happen, is not life threatening or causes severe injury (higher walls, etc) that will not inhibit the competition, and then as the spotlight moves off, simply release the cause with notes that changes were made to protect the rest of the atheletes.

Call it "human error" on the part of the victim all you want - the reality is the track was designed in a way that allows an imperfect human to commit such an error at the cost of his or her life - and that means the course designers and engineers and safety officials are the ones who have made the real "human error"

May his soul find shelter in the hand of the Creator, and may his family, team and countrymen remember him with pride.

[krashkart]

I saw they are saying it was "human error" due to a late entry into a corner. The least they could have done was waited until the spotlight had disappeared before issuing that. What they should do is just make changes to the course so that human error - which WILL happen, is not life threatening or causes severe injury (higher walls, etc) that will not inhibit the competition, and then as the spotlight moves off, simply release the cause with notes that changes were made to protect the rest of the atheletes.

Call it "human error" on the part of the victim all you want - the reality is the track was designed in a way that allows an imperfect human to commit such an error at the cost of his or her life - and that means the course designers and engineers and safety officials are the ones who have made the real "human error"

May his soul find shelter in the hand of the Creator, and may his family, team and countrymen remember him with pride.

Hurrah to that CaptainHaplo. A bit too early in the game to blame the racer. A glimpse of the Sensationalism Feed last night showed the unexpected side-to-side swoop-dee-doo I can remember from crashing my bike/sled/skateboard so many times when I was a younger kid. You know, the wipeouts that led to broken bones or major unordinary pain. Happened so fast his expression didn't really change. Hit the clicker before I could see the rest. Not into "Faces of Death" these days.

What that showed me was that the part of track he wiped out on is probably not the best place to put those kinds of corners. Lack of foresight, I suppose. My uneducated two-bits.

[Highbury]

I don't know if it was on TV anywhere in the US, it was not on the Seattle stations, but they did have some local coverage in Vancouver of them running on the course again today.

The men were starting from what had been the women's starting spot. It is further down the course so less speed is gained by the end. I think today's top speed was 140km/h as opposed to the almost 155km/h of yesterday. Also the exit of the turn where the accident happened has been completely walled so nobody can exit the track there. I believe they said the wall was 12 ft. I did see one corner that had the same sort of metal posts on the exit, but it was a corner near the top and speeds were less then half of what they are at the bottom when passing that point.

It is always unfortunate when someone has to lose their life to make things safer, but at least it has been made safer.

And my two bits on "tubes" for sliding in... this was the first time anyone has been thrown from the course in major competition. It happened on a course that had a reputation for being dangerous (look up why they have corners named The 50/50 and Lueders Loop). I doubt you will see any significant change to the sport other then tracks of limited length to keep speeds below 140km/h

[XabbaRus]

What did the Canadian coach mean by "exotic sliders"?

Is he meaning those from non-european countries?

Oh and they say it isn't a track design. I have never seen a bob run where there are steel posts right next to the exit of a corner.

That is where I think the bad design is. If there had been nothing and maybe some landing mats he might have been OK.

[Platapus]

If there had been nothing and maybe some landing mats he might have been OK.

I think even hitting a landing mat at 90+ Mph would be dangerous. But I agree about the iron posts comment.

[Schroeder]

I don't believe the "wrong calculation" stuff. I mean this isn't the first time that an ice canal has been build. There is enough data around and the laws of physics were still valid last time I checked. So how on earth are they supposed to calculate that wrong? I wonder, was it already calculated wrong before the accident happened or were they still proud of having created the fasted track in the world (I heard some of the downhill skiing tracks are the fastest in the world too...let's hope they aren't too fast as well....)?

[Skybird]

The calculation was done by a company in Leizig, Germany. Irt seems their data were outdated and did not include the latest air resistance coefficients and speeds in various parts of the track. The calculation formulas may be correctm but if you feed them with certain data, you get certain results. Nobody seriously rejects that there is a gap in the maximum speeds with which they calculated, and the speeds that actually were seen.

On another issue, a german comment yesterday hit a nerve, imo. the commentator asked in an essay that if in a sports a driver'S fault results in the driver getting killed - is the show then still about sports - or about stunts? The latter points at ancient understandings of "spectacles" that you could not bring into conformity with the spirit of sportsmanship.

[Schroeder]

On another issue, a german comment yesterday hit a nerve, imo. the commentator asked in an essay that if in a sports a driver'S fault results in the driver getting killed - is the show then still about sports - or about stunts? The latter points at ancient understandings of "spectacles" that you could not bring into conformity with the spirit of sportsmanship.
This is exactly what I'm fearing all along. That the safety standards have been neglected for more "spectacular" events. I don't say that they wanted people to die but I think they wanted to spice up the show with speed records.

[XabbaRus]

Still that doesn't answer what was meant by "exotic sliders".

[Highbury]

Still that doesn't answer what was meant by "exotic sliders".

He is a German so he would not have meant Europeans. He coaches Canada, so he wouldn't have meant North Americans. He said it in the context of people not being prepared for the track, so all that is left to assume is that he means part-time/inexperienced sliders, or something of the sort, but since the press didn't ask him.. who knows? Why is that phrase such a big deal?

[Kapitan_Phillips]

What a damn shame :nope:

I have to give all the people who do that sport credit, I wouldn't want to try it for a million pounds.

[CaptainHaplo]

See - I'd love to try it myself. Have no clue how to steerthe thing, but it looks like fun.

Course, I think jumping out of perfectly good airplanes in the dark is fun too.