Are mods in MP a public statement?

[Ships-R-Us]

Ubisoft has said that SH5 has the ability to be modded, but did not say to what extent.

WHAT IF?: Ubisoft or the Government in the country which hosted the servers believed a mod, due to design could create political unrest and instability; would that mod be censored?

All members here can dream up a mod that makes a strong political statement, such as a the captain, on deck, wiping his butt with the flag of an enemy country, or "mooning" the French President while in review, or simply painting his sub or ship with emblems or hoisting a flag which is distasteful to a certain government.

I will bet that certain mods will not be permitted in gameplay, what say you?

DOES A MOD IN MULTIPLAY BECOME A PUBLIC STATEMENT AND SUBJECT TO CENSORSHIP?

[tonyj]

Dan stated that sh5 would be even easier to mod than sh3/4 and more open.

[mookiemookie]

I don't see any possible way that they could.

[St. Cobra]

I say your title of this thread is wrong and misleading. :nope:

[Ships-R-Us]

Yes, without a doubt it is moddable. However you missed out on the context of this thread.

[Ships-R-Us]

I say your title of this thread is wrong and misleading. :nope:

The title is expressed as a question, and contains nothing that is misleading.

[Schultz]

Maybe our politicians are crazy, but not that much.:haha:

[tonyj]

the first line of your OP asked 'to what extent'.

i can't see them making it more restrictive than sh3/4 plus how would you filter out whats allowed and what isn't?

the easiest way to prevent something being modded is either hardcode it or encrypt the config file.

[AVGWarhawk]

What would UBI gain by do this?

[Schultz]

Nothing,Ships is kind of speculating

[Ships-R-Us]

the first line of your OP asked 'to what extent'.

i can't see them making it more restrictive than sh3/4 plus how would you filter out whats allowed and what isn't?

the easiest way to prevent something being modded is either hardcode it or encrypt the config file.

Thanks for the input, but if you get into multiplay, a mod then becomes an instant public message.

[Nickolas]

What would UBI gain by do this?

nothing, but that's never stopped them before, has it? :rotfl2:
I'm not saying it will happen, It could tho, if mods were to be somehow uploaded into the main server. But that's reeks of "the DRM is the matrix" conspiracy theory.

Dan stated that sh5 would be even easier to mod than sh3/4 and more open.

it could come with the SDK even, but that doesn't stop anyone (that anyone being, in this context, Ubi) from saying "your mod is 'ilegal', and using it will result in your game acount being banned"

[tonyj]

i see what your saying. do you think it would be possible to create something controversial in sh3/sh4?

[Ships-R-Us]

and therefore subject to censorship if the government hosting the server deemed the mod "hostile".

[Takeda Shingen]

Merged. We don't need two threads on the same topic from the same poster.

The Management

[mookiemookie]

I don't believe that Ubi is going quite that far with the DRM. The way I understand it is that the constant connection is required so Ubi can send a "signal" to the game client that says "Are you there?" and the game has to answer back "Yes I am and I'm legal".

Whatever mods you want to run on top of the base game, I believe are up to you. I have no idea how the multiplayer would work, as I have no interest in it.

[Schultz]

The government doesn't care about PC games

[Nickolas]

i see what your saying. do you think it would be possible to create something controversial in sh3/sh4?

well... it's ilegal to display swasticas on some countries. So, i'm certain it is possible to create something controversial as a mod for sh3 and sh4, as a matter of fact, it has already been made.

I'm going to put my tinfoil hat on just to make a point, please bear with me.
Imagine I live in Germany and download a "realistic flags mod". The Ubisoft servers know I live in Germany and block that mod because, after all, it's illegal to display swastikas on games. :arrgh!:

-------------

I voted "no"

[onelifecrisis]

The government doesn't care about PC games

For some reason that made me lol. :)

[Schultz]

I am talking about my country,about the politics and politicians in my country, all they care is money to flow in their pockets.

[Heretic]

Has UBI ever blocked using mods in Silent Hunter series due to content? And now they're going to do what? Scan your PC and somehow decipher the graphics files to check them for content? If that's even possible, how much would it cost to devleop?

They're a business. They're not going to expend one dime to do anything they think won't bring in more dimes. :up:

[razark]

Frankly, as long as it does not violate their copyright, it's no one's business but my own what mods you use.

[Ships-R-Us]

Frankly, as long as it does not violate their copyright, it's no one's business but my own what mods you use.

Agree, however the country with server may have a lot to say.

[razark]

Agree, however the country with server may have a lot to say.

If my modded files are on my computer, why would they have any say in that?

[Schultz]

Don't make me laugh, if the server is in Romania they won't have anything to say, our politicians are still in the stone age :haha:, they don't know what is a PC game, maybe the younger ones would know.

[Webster]

i see what your saying. do you think it would be possible to create something controversial in sh3/sh4?

If my modded files are on my computer, why would they have any say in that?

well a few that come to mind are screams of drowning men sound effects, blood and flying body parts added to damage and debris, swastikas, nudity on wall posters and pictures in the game, and a few more i cant recall.


any and all of these are personal choices that were made into mods for sh3 or sh4 and likely to be done for sh5 as well but if these mods are made or stored online with online saves then the content stored in these saves are controversial and could have content restrictions placed on them for UBI's protection against liability.

[HundertzehnGustav]

offensive mods such as described have nt been produced yet, cost a lot of time, and add nothing to class gameplay. the worst thing were naked ladies on a sub emblem afaik.

dont worry.

[Webster]

offensive mods such as described have nt been produced yet, cost a lot of time, and add nothing to class gameplay. the worst thing were naked ladies on a sub emblem afaik.

dont worry.

this was not hypothetical speculation, everything i listed was a real download ready mod that was made for the sh3 game.

because of their controversial nature and because most of them werent GWX compatable they went by the wayside but they were mods that were made and produced for the game. the nudity mods were not advertised as such for obvious reasons but they were out there. the swastikas were controversial for reasons of hatred and racism so they didnt last long. the blood, gore, bodies in debris, and screams were felt to be too much for those who wanted their kids to be able to play the game so they also faded away.

they were all short lived mods but they were mods that were created and released and used that could be and in these cases were very controversial.

[HundertzehnGustav]

well then the question is , how many people, use them? a tiny frachtion of a tiny community playin,g a tiny niche game...

i hope, nobody cares to give such mods in any save game "political value"...
they are personal choices... aint they?

[Webster]

well then the question is , how many people, use them? a tiny frachtion of a tiny community playin,g a tiny niche game...

i hope, nobody cares to give such mods in any save game "political value"...
they are personal choices... aint they?

but the question of this whole thread is if you save them on UBI's servers "as it is assumed you have to do" for game saves then how does this effect UBI being responsable for the content on its servers?

[Sgtmonkeynads]

A word to UBIsoft...while looking at my files...if you see a 120GB file named "Porn" don't open it please.

:o

[Heretic]

I'm an IT guy (god I hate when people say that in forums) so when I see things like this my first thought is "how in hell would you even do that if you wanted to?"

It has been announced that your save game would be uploaded to their server. And since it has auto-patching , there is presumedly some method of telling if your game is up to date. That's it as far as I have heard.

Why would anyone think that means that they have the ability to detect what mods you're using? AT BEST, they might be able to detect your install doesn't match stock. Probably not even that, given they're likely not checking data files. Being able to tell you changed your graphics to include swastikas, nekkid ladies, or kittie pr0n is just fantasy.

[Heretic]

IT Department UBI Headquarters 3:45pm

Ted: Hey Bob, we're going to need a big boost in the server budget for SHV.

Bob: Really? Why is that Ted?

Ted: We need to upload all their mods.

Bob: Um... their.. what?

Ted: Yeah. Alot of these guys use mods. We need to upload them to our servers.

Bob: Um... why exactly would we want to do that?

Ted: No idea, Bob.

Bob: No idea?

Ted: Oh wait! I remember! So the government can take a look at them.

Bob: The government... Wait, whose goverment?

Ted: Oh, any government that calls up and asks for a looksie, I guess.

Bob: These files, we're just going to upload them to our servers? What if they contain viruses or trojans or all that nasty stuff we are normally quite concered about?

Ted: These are a great group of guys. We can trust them. DRM aside, of course, heh.

Bob: Ted?

Ted: Yes, Bob?

Bob: You're fired.

[razark]

but the question of this whole thread is if you save them on UBI's servers "as it is assumed you have to do" for game saves then how does this effect UBI being responsable for the content on its servers?

That's a pretty darn big assumption. Can you point to anything (besides idle speculation) that says that mods will be in any way of form on Ubi servers?

The mods need to be on the user's computer. The game lives there, too. The save games are uploaded to the server. The mods are not the save games. The save games don't hold data on what sounds or graphics mods the user is using. I have yet to see a mod that converts the save game into a string of profanity or death threats.

If you do have evidence that Ubi will have access to our mod files, please show it.

That said, if the mods are, for some unknown reason, stored on Ubi servers, then yes, Ubi has every right to know what is on their servers. That means you need to read the EULA very carefully. If you make a mod with something illegal in it, and it ends up on their server, they are responsible for it being on their server. As it is their server, and their legal responsibility, they have the right to know and remove it.

[Ships-R-Us]

RAZARK, you bring up an excellent point of view.

That said, if the mods are, for some unknown reason, stored on Ubi servers, then yes, Ubi has every right to know what is on their servers. That means you need to read the EULA very carefully. If you make a mod with something illegal in it, and it ends up on their server, they are responsible for it being on their server. As it is their server, and their legal responsibility, they have the right to know and remove it.[/QUOTE]

[JScones]

IF mods need to be stored on an Ubisoft server (which I highly doubt), then it would be no different than when you u/l files anywhere on-line - if the file violates the T&C of the host, then down it goes. Simple.

[Webster]

That's a pretty darn big assumption. Can you point to anything (besides idle speculation) that says that mods will be in any way of form on Ubi servers?

yes it is purely speculation and i doubt they would risk doing it that way.

The mods need to be on the user's computer. The game lives there, too. The save games are uploaded to the server. The mods are not the save games. The save games don't hold data on what sounds or graphics mods the user is using.

its quite simple, there are two times UBI has to be accessing your computer, one is for reading your games files to diagnose them and the other is to confirm the updates after installing them.


UBI cant know if the game needs to be updated unless it scans and reads the game files on your computer first.


unless you are required to do this yourself or somehow it uninstalls your mods first then it is also going to be reading your modded files as well along with all the changes they make.


so the question is, if UBI uninstalls your mods to update the game it must store them somewhere so they can be reinstalled when its finished but where they get stored is one of the things we are talking about, will it be kept on the server (unlikely) or a temperary file on "your" computer which is what i think will happen.


I have yet to see a mod that converts the save game into a string of profanity or death threats.

i have also not seen a mod for sh5 yet but in sh3 or sh4 any adding or removing of mods will "break" any save games or careers you have so they are impacted by the mods installed in the game.


If you do have evidence that Ubi will have access to our mod files, please show it.

this whole thread is about pure speculation so to demand evidence of some fact behind my speculation and opinion is asking a lot in a thread about peoples opinions.

That said, if the mods are, for some unknown reason, stored on Ubi servers, then yes, Ubi has every right to know what is on their servers. That means you need to read the EULA very carefully. If you make a mod with something illegal in it, and it ends up on their server, they are responsible for it being on their server. As it is their server, and their legal responsibility, they have the right to know and remove it.

i was simply responding to this question you asked

"If my modded files are on my computer, why would they have any say in that?"

and i never presented my comments as absolute fact, you asked me to answer a how it could be and i speculated as to how it might be a problem.

i dont understand the challenge to my opinion but at the end of your reply i see you do understand the point i was making.

my personal opinion on this is UBI will require us to uninstall our mods then click on an update feature to activate it. this way we have the amount of control needed to not lose careers or be blindsided by some sort of auto updating system. to me its the only logical way it "should" be done.

[razark]

i was simply responding to this question you asked

"If my modded files are on my computer, why would they have any say in that?"

and i never presented my comments as absolute fact, you asked me to answer a how it could be and i speculated as to how it might be a problem.

i dont understand the challenge to my opinion but at the end of your reply i see you do understand the point i was making.


Sorry, it was not my intention to attack you or challenge you. I was reponding to the fact that the thread is really based off an assumption. No offense meant to you, or anyone specifically. I wasn't demanding that you show evidence, that was more of a generic "you".

my personal opinion on this is UBI will require us to uninstall our mods then click on an update feature to activate it. this way we have the amount of control needed to not lose careers or be blindsided by some sort of auto updating system. to me its the only logical way it "should" be done.

There's such a wide possibility of mods that could exist. I think a "Please remove your mods so we can update. Continue, Cancel" type dialog would be needed. Otherwise, they run the risk of damaging files on the user's computer. I don't see their legal department as being too okay with that.

[Brag]

I love the idea of Ubi accessing my computer :D

[Webster]

Sorry, it was not my intention to attack you or challenge you. I was reponding to the fact that the thread is really based off an assumption. No offense meant to you, or anyone specifically. I wasn't demanding that you show evidence, that was more of a generic "you".



There's such a wide possibility of mods that could exist. I think a "Please remove your mods so we can update. Continue, Cancel" type dialog would be needed. Otherwise, they run the risk of damaging files on the user's computer. I don't see their legal department as being too okay with that.

you have no reason to apologize and i didnt see it as an kind of attack, personally or otherwise. i merely saw it as a challenge to defend my opinion and since i thought you were asking for an opinion to the question you posed it was strange to be requested to justify my answer.

i read your comment as asking "how could this occur?" and my answer was trying to lay out a scenario in which it might.

[JackAubrey]

The government doesn't care about PC games
The german Government does, unfortunately.

We have several youth protection mechanisms in place. For example, you cannot buy a Game which is rated "18" in Store unless you can prove that you're 18 years or older.
18 is the highest Rating for any Media here, because if you're 18 years old, you're legally considered "Adult" and can do whatever adults are allowed to do.

However, the Government talks about censoring Games to some extent. We had several pupils run Amok in their schools in the past and in the government they believe that Shooter Games, where you shoot at stuff that looks like real people, e.g. Counterstrike, Grand Theft Auto and the like, have a big share of the blame.
Thats because these boys had those games on their computers before they decided it would be a great idea to go to school and kill as many people as possible.

Because they killed people and had these games on their computers, many People in the Government think, that if you play those games, you're more likely to become a murderer than if you play, lets say, soccer games.

They even go this far to say that playing Shooters would train you to use a gun "professionally".
Now, everybody who has ever shot a gun in real life knows, that this is bull.

Now, they are every now and then talking about banning Shooting games completely. Even if they are rated "18" and are not legally available to minors, they think that it would be best to even take them away from the adults and ban them, so that the production and possession of those games becomes a punishable act.
More than one politician compared those games to child pornography and suggested that they should be treated alike.

The same is with Swastikas. The Swastika is a banned Symbol in Germany and so, games are not allowed to have them.
Under the premise of this Thread, Mods which have the Swastika would be illegal.

Every time the Media wants to show the bad, bad influence that Computer Games have on our children, they show a Scene of Counterstrike, Grand Theft Auto or a WW2-Game Mod which has a Swastika in it, suppressing the fact that these Games are not available for minors or, in case of the Swastika, the Game was modded and is not originally available with it.

Youth protection is important, but what german politicians make of it is a bad joke.