Don't blame the devs for decisions not up to them

[Webster]

I want to remind everyone that the devs work for a living too just like we do.

in our jobs we must sometime do things that people do not like and sometimes we get unfairly blamed for things we are forced to do so i ask you keep this in mind and not take out your unhappiness on the devs or blame them unfairly for things they cannot control.

the devs are all very nice guys who share our love for sub sims and if it were only up to them, i'm sure they would always produce games in the most finished state possible for us but someone else makes the decissions we find to be most troubling.


here is a quote that i hope will help you understand the position they are in:

While I can't comment on the DRM solution, I know it wont affect the modability.

Now people can hate me if they want, can't stop that.

But the truth is the interview where we said we'll have all 3 main types of subs in the game (II,VII,IX) was done before the decision to cut IX and II from the game. Can't turn back time.

Things like that happen during development of any game. Again, if you want to be completely safe you don't answer any questions, but you wouldn't like that either ;)

I don't see it as much of a problem. The important part is that we let you people know that only type VII submarines are in the game. It would be a mistake if you were lead to believe we have ALL in the game and then you buy it and surprise - no type IXs.

That is not the case.

[Thomen]

From another thread:

I think it many here are grateful for the insights and details that were delivered, by the Dev Team. But it is mainly the.. eh.. lets call it 'not really confidence building news' that come from the publisher that ticks people off. ;)

:yeah:

[Task Force]

Im not pissed at the devs, they work under UBI soft, and are funded by them also... its not really there choice... But its UBI is ticked at...:shifty:

[Iron Budokan]

My current beef is with UBI.

Subsequent game bug howlers? Then I might question the devs. But right now my focus is squarely on UBI and its stupefying myopia as regards the release of SH5.

[TDK1044]

These Devs are much liked and highly respected. Nobody is in any way blaming them for this fiasco. :)

[floundericiousWA]

These Devs are much liked and highly respected. Nobody is in any way blaming them for this fiasco. :)


I think some people are, actually.

I'm with you, though... Dan and the whole dev team have my respect and gratitude for all the effort they put into making SH titles. :salute::yeah::)

My beef is exclusively with UBI and is partially inflated because of the uncertainty we all feel because the game isn't released yet.

That's why on the "will you still buy" I answered that I'm on the fence and want more information before I make a decision. :hmmm:

[kapitan_zur_see]

+1
I second that

[FIREWALL]

HUH !!! A few minutes ago this thread was closed. :-?

[onelifecrisis]

OMG, this is stickied!?
:rotfl2:
Those poor devs.
I think we should all send them a big group hug.

[Elder-Pirate]

Webster would you please point me to a post from one of our Subsim members whom tried to shoot down one of the SH5 Devs.

I've read almost each post form 7 am up to about 3 AM for the last couple days now and although UBI has been blasted by many Subsim members I have not seen the first one that has bad mouthed a SHV Dev.

We've got a crazy bunch ( :D ) here at Subsim but they are not stupid.

I feel that you are getting ahead of your self sometimes.

Of course I've lacked some sleep lately and I am human and could have very well missed a Dev negative post so this is why I have asked that the post be pointed out.

Maybe if you will just take a deep breath and sip some water you'll feel better.

[Letum]

I agree. I don't see the need for this sticky post.

It's not a issue here at Subsim. :rock:

[martes86]

These Devs are much liked and highly respected. Nobody is in any way blaming them for this fiasco. :)
I think some people are, actually.

It's bound to happen. I myself I'm trying to explain people that there's a difference between development decisions and corporate decisions, because, since the Devs actually work for Ubi, then it's just automatic to blame anyone, and words get mixed up, and there you go, devs being blamed. One just has to have a little patience to make people see that the Devs are actually 100% commited, but that it's the company, the suits, the ones behind decision such as having online validation for ALL OF UBISOFT GAMES, not just SH5.

In fact, it wouldn't surprise me that, Ubi had a meeting with Dan & co. to explain them the new system and that it'd be mandatory for all the game lineup, and so they took their hands up to their faces in a gesture of pure fear like "OMG, some people ain't gonna like this, we're so doomed". I know I would, because it makes us users upset, but the devs, that actually know already a thing or two about the community, probably knew the impact this decision would have longer before it was even publicly announced.

Cheers, and respect :rock:

[urfisch]

the devs are not responsable...for what ubi is deciding. but what i would blame them for is, when things are not to come, as dan promised.

:stare:

we will see.

[Alex]

These Devs are much liked and highly respected. Nobody is in any way blaming them for this fiasco. :)

EX-AC-TLY.

@ Dan : in your opinion (if you're allowed to let this kind of detail go, that is), as type IX's and II's were expected to be part of SH5 some time ago, do you think we'll see them released later via some - free - patch, or are they going to be part of an add-on via which Ubi will of course try to earn more money ?

Whatever is your answer, I thank you all dev teamers for your patience. Don't EVER think anyone is going to blame you guys in the future, we know you're not responsible for DRM. http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a75/Panzer_Kamerad/smileys/tu.gif

[JU_88]

EX-AC-TLY.

@ Dan : in your opinion (if you're allowed to let this kind of detail go, that is), as type IX's and II's were expected to be part of SH5 some time ago, do you think we'll see them released later via some - free - patch, or are they going to be part of an add-on via which Ubi will of course try to earn more money ?

Whatever is your answer, I thank you all dev teamers for your patience. Don't EVER think anyone is going to blame you guys in the future, we know you're not responsible for DRM. http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a75/Panzer_Kamerad/smileys/tu.gif


I think that wil be down to SHV's sales figures and is probabaly way beyond Dans control.
But I sure hope the other types do get added :oops:

[Kefru]

I have not read one comment about the Dev's it those greedy buggers at Ubisoft I am complaining about

[HundertzehnGustav]

These Devs are much liked and highly respected. Nobody is in any way blaming them for this fiasco. :)


Certainly not me!
I imagine being in their shoes - creating stuff and implementing features, research, long days, hardcore pressure...
andf then half their work gets flushed down the loo, and the other half fudged up by the management.

If the CREATORS of the game, not the Sellers, if these Guys would live anywhere near me, i would drive over and buy them a beer, or invite them for dinner.

[dcb]

Who's blaming the devs? I really cannot reember any criticism directed at them here. They are Ubi employees and cannot object to decisions that come from high above. On the contrary, I fear they even had trouble for letting us know some insights into the game development, in the past.
OTOH, I think Ubisoft has a really inept PR, for always ignoring the most dedicate customer basis for the SH series, i.e. Subsim (and even their own forum). It is strange to leave all communication efforts up to the game development team, while the real PR team did not even show up on these forums.

[tater]

^^^ leaving all forum PR top devs who are also likely hamstrung in what they are allowed to tell us.

Note that many times we have gotten really useful information about a new title/add-on after some stink is made. Then they release information that would have entirely avoided the stink in the first place.

Ubi doesn't grok PR.

[Onkel Neal]

the devs are not responsable...for what ubi is deciding. but what i would blame them for is, when things are not to come, as dan promised.

:stare:

we will see.

Dan, and no one, promised anything. As you know, a game in development may or may not have the features originally planned.

[bigboywooly]

Dan, and no one, promised anything. As you know, a game in development may or may not have the features originally planned.

I believe marean just said modding wont be interfered DRM wise plus we will be getting new tools to aid modding

So do we take that as read or ............

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1249904&postcount=14

[floundericiousWA]

I have not read one comment about the Dev's it those greedy buggers at Ubisoft I am complaining about

FWIW, I haven't seen anyone blaming the dev's explicitly...but people are going on at length and it's not clear that the rants and verbal spouting off are not directed at the developers. Also I can see the dev's possibly being hurt or upset by all the "screw you, I'm not buying your game because of the DRM (or no Type II/IX or ending in 1943)" coming from folks who haven't even seen the game in action yet.

I've been in product development...it's exhausting to hear people trash your product when they haven't even seen it, let alone USED it.

[stabiz]

Yep, I get that, but at the same time they (UBI) are doing their best to scare people away from the fruit of the developers labour. I dont think anybody are upset with the talent, its the suits that need some spankin`.

[tater]

Ubi wants to watch our game usage 24/7 but is unwilling to pay someone to simply keep the gaming community properly informed.

Note that such a person would certainly be painting anything like DRM in its best possible light, perhaps contrary to the community's views. Regardless, such a proactive approach would be FAR more successful than what they do time and again.

I saw this with Il-2. Look at the "official" forums, lol. It might be better than it was, but it was laughable that you could not find "official" answers from any mods there, there were/are as in the dark as everyone else.

[Ducimus]

All i'm going to say is i believe i have a VERY good idea on what the developers go through when working on these games. And though i may not always post rosey things about SH4/SH5, i do have a profound respect for Dan and the rest the developers.

[Steeltrap]

Yep, I get that, but at the same time they (UBI) are doing their best to scare people away from the fruit of the developers labour. I dont think anybody are upset with the talent, its the suits that need some spankin`.

Hi Stabiz

Laughing at your sig (love TF2 for a bit of fun now and then), but might I suggest you alter it to "UbiSoft DRM"? Leaving it as just Ubisoft DOES include the devs, which I doubt is your intention.

Like pretty much everyone here, I think, I have no beef with the devs.

This absurd online requirement? That's a whole different kettle of (very smelly) fish....

[floundericiousWA]

Note that such a person would certainly be painting anything like DRM in its best possible light, perhaps contrary to the community's views.


*COUGH* *COUGH*:hmmm:

[tater]

Hey, they have their own interests at heart, and I can respect them putting the best light on it. It beats the hell out of just throwing a half-assed press release out there and saying nothing.

[floundericiousWA]

Oh absolutely!!

It's also possible, when you're on the OTHER side of the drawing board, to see the good behind what/how you're doing something but not see how the customer will object.

[Brag]

The Devs are good. We cannot blame them!
Right now, the beef is with DRM/OSP. Many of our colleagues do not have reliable internet access in USA and other countries.

But the main issue is one of principle. I am not going to log in to ask permission from Ubi or anyone to play a game!

The internet is now buzzing over our plight. This will increase over the next few days as our protest goes viral.

http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/2048/ubi2.jpghttp://img63.imageshack.us/img63/710/drm3.jpg
Feel free to use any of these sigs for your self. Vive la resistance!

[Randomizer]

What follows is just some random thoughts before walking away from SH5, I had decided before the DRM/OSP debate that I will watch and shoot as far as buying it goes..

I think that the concept of blaming anybody for this develpment is entirely out of place. UBISoft has made several decisions concerning SH5 that are unpopular with some of the hardcore subsimmer cadre but appear to be entirely in line with their corporate philosphy. Being as how they are, at least for now, doing extremely well, perhaps the management is neither as dumb or as blind as some here might believe.

Checking some of the gaming business sites out there (as opposed to the gamer sites) indicates that although overall sales by UBISoft have declined some, they remain high compared to competitors, evidence that management might be doing right by their shareholders who, from a corporate standpoint are the only ones they need to please.

Although the PC has the largest stable of titles it seems that the console market is where the money is and the target demographics for the big bucks are younger than average for the SubSim community. Aiming SH5 at young males with disposable income who live on the Internet every waking hour probably makes good businees sense and we have seen a number of posts throughout the SH5 topics from Forum members who fit this demographic to a tee.

It is possible that there may be some corporate affection for the Silent Hunter franchise, even if not a huge money winner it carried a loyal following and could probably be counted on to make some money. Now though, with sales in the billions, some money is probably not enough so re-imaging SH should not be unexpected.

By producing a truncated SH5 they can look to create longer term cash flow by introducing future add-ons at intervals, the major development costs for which have in all likelyhood already been expended. If the initial title tanks, little has been lost and they still own the Silent Hunter copyright, code and probably a number of other related copyrights to boot. Hanging on to these makes good sense since it prevents corporate rivals from producing a PC based sub sim without starting from scratch... Unlikely since it would involve big bucks for limited return.

If any of the above is accurate what we see in this SH5 saga is the way of the future for computer gaming. Others have pointed towards the tech issues but most seem so intent on casting the UBISoft management as evil incarnate that they forget the first duty of management is to create a return on investment for their shareholders. That's capitalism at work whether one agrees with it or not.

There's no blame for anybody in any of this. If you think you will like SH5, buy it and enjoy. If the OSP scheme sticks in your craw, suck it up or walk away, no harm no foul. SH3 and SH4 still have lots of life in them in my opinion.

Must admit though, the Das DRM flicks are well done!

Good Hunting

[madjack]

Some years back, I wrote a post expressing regret at how the Silent Hunter series (and subsims in general) seemed to fairly much ignore the human element, or at least, treat your virtual crewmembers as mere cyphers even though our favourite books and films about submarine warfare usually depict the human cost of submarine warfare and are all the more richer for it. I offered a few suggestions for giving the player a few more 'hooks' on which our imaginations could build a living crew. Auto generate log entries discussing the personal situations of members of the crew could have been one. Something to read on those long journeys.

But for expressing my regret, I was effectively vilified by no less than a moderator as wanting to dumb the franchise down and turn it into an RPG. I meekly replied that I wasn't really, I just wanted there to be a bit more humanity about the whole venture. Not U571, more Das Boot. But no dice - I was a heretic and I was lucky to avoid a banning.

Now it looks like Ubisoft are perhaps taking a step in that direction and I hope they do it right.

I've often felt SH is stuck in doing things a certain way, mainly because that's how they've always been done and don't you dare change it!. The franchise has been sucessful but I have to say, it also seems to have a bit of a drag in the form of its hardcore fans.

Take this post for example.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=160946
Hasn't played the game yet is already announcing he's not interested and is instead going back to SH3. Hmm.

Talking about change; take the map screen. There's got to be a better way in depicting your sub's travel in the virtual world than watching a small cursor crawl across virtual blue paper for up to 10 to 15 minutes while a repeated motor sample plays in the background. I know that's how it was done in Silent Service I and II back in the 80's (cause I played those - or at least SS2), but it needs to change.

Likewise, the impossible screenflip between stations. If Ubisoft have finally addressed this convention and we have a fully modelled sub with crewmembers and they look like they're looking to you for leadership, then I say that's a gamechanger. Huzzah!

To that end, it looks like they've had to limit the number of subs because modelling even a single sub is a much larger job. I admit - limiting the campaign to 1943 seems a bit odd, but I expect modders will be on that quick-smart.

SO buck-up, this could be a brave new world for the franchise!

(Regards DRM think there's some very valid concerns there. Particularly the idea of needing to be logged in to play. Draconian? Not every country has excellent broadband coverage etc..)

[McBeck]

Your all right. Its hard to find posts that explicitly aims at the devs.

But I would think that its still hard for them to ignore alot of the negative comments about SH5, considering they are building the game.

[onelifecrisis]

What follows is just some random thoughts before walking away from SH5, I had decided before the DRM/OSP debate that I will watch and shoot as far as buying it goes..

I think that the concept of blaming anybody for this develpment is entirely out of place. UBISoft has made several decisions concerning SH5 that are unpopular with some of the hardcore subsimmer cadre but appear to be entirely in line with their corporate philosphy. Being as how they are, at least for now, doing extremely well, perhaps the management is neither as dumb or as blind as some here might believe.

Checking some of the gaming business sites out there (as opposed to the gamer sites) indicates that although overall sales by UBISoft have declined some, they remain high compared to competitors, evidence that management might be doing right by their shareholders who, from a corporate standpoint are the only ones they need to please.

Although the PC has the largest stable of titles it seems that the console market is where the money is and the target demographics for the big bucks are younger than average for the SubSim community. Aiming SH5 at young males with disposable income who live on the Internet every waking hour probably makes good businees sense and we have seen a number of posts throughout the SH5 topics from Forum members who fit this demographic to a tee.

It is possible that there may be some corporate affection for the Silent Hunter franchise, even if not a huge money winner it carried a loyal following and could probably be counted on to make some money. Now though, with sales in the billions, some money is probably not enough so re-imaging SH should not be unexpected.

By producing a truncated SH5 they can look to create longer term cash flow by introducing future add-ons at intervals, the major development costs for which have in all likelyhood already been expended. If the initial title tanks, little has been lost and they still own the Silent Hunter copyright, code and probably a number of other related copyrights to boot. Hanging on to these makes good sense since it prevents corporate rivals from producing a PC based sub sim without starting from scratch... Unlikely since it would involve big bucks for limited return.

If any of the above is accurate what we see in this SH5 saga is the way of the future for computer gaming. Others have pointed towards the tech issues but most seem so intent on casting the UBISoft management as evil incarnate that they forget the first duty of management is to create a return on investment for their shareholders. That's capitalism at work whether one agrees with it or not.

There's no blame for anybody in any of this. If you think you will like SH5, buy it and enjoy. If the OSP scheme sticks in your craw, suck it up or walk away, no harm no foul. SH3 and SH4 still have lots of life in them in my opinion.

Must admit though, the Das DRM flicks are well done!

Good Hunting

You have a brain and a rational point of view. What the **** are you doing in this forum? Go to GT. This forum is for ranting.

[tomfon]

I agree. Also, i'd like to add that Randomizer's post is the best post i've ever read in this forum. Nothing else from me.

@OLC
I remember that you started a poll yesterday under the title ''How long before SH5 is cracked'' or sthg similar. Now, i just can't find the thread.:hmmm:
Has it been removed?

[onelifecrisis]

I agree. Also, i'd like to add that Randomizer's post is the best post i've ever read in this forum. Nothing else from me.

@OLC
I remember that you started a poll yesterday under the title ''How long before SH5 is cracked'' or sthg similar. Now, i just can't find the thread.:hmmm:
Has it been removed?

Yep. Deleted, no less. And I got a PM from uncle Neal. I guess my sense of humour just isn't appreciated around here. :wah:

[Reece]

Yep. Deleted, no less. And I got a PM from uncle Neal. I guess my sense of humour just isn't appreciated around here. :wah:Ah what a poo!! would have been an interesting poll!!:yep:

[tomfon]

Yep. Deleted, no less. And I got a PM from uncle Neal. I guess my sense of humour just isn't appreciated around here. :wah:

Frankly speaking, the first think that came to my mind when i saw the title of your thread was that it would be deleted and a message from Neal would be sent to you.
I can imagine what the content of the PM is...:88)
Well, you have to be ''politically correct'' these days whatever that's supposed to mean. I guess it depends on the situation...:shucks:

[onelifecrisis]

Ah what a poo!! would have been an interesting poll!!:yep:

Most people voted for about one week. We'll see.
I'd like to add something... in careful words... which is that if I do buy the game and suffer problems with my internet connection then I will probably look for ways to... solve that problem. And since other people should also be able to find ways to... solve the problem... I don't see what all the crying is about, really.

[onelifecrisis]

Frankly speaking, the first think that came to my mind when i saw the title of your thread was that it would be deleted and a message from Neal would be sent to you.
I can imagine what the content of the PM is...:88)
Well, you have to be ''politically correct'' these days whatever that's supposed to mean. I guess it depends on the situation...:shucks:

The PM wasn't so bad. Neal is a level-headed guy. I don't mind that it got deleted. Nobody seemed to be seeing the intended bright/funny side of the post so it served no purpose as far as I'm concerned.

[vigilante]

Don't think we have to split Ubisoft into bad guys and good guys. no.
It's Ubisoft decision to use DRM and all Ubisoft employee are responsible for this decision. It's company, a brand, not a community.
Now, of course the decision was taken on France headquarters and not in Romania, but that's the way things are done in every company. Obviously, using DRM on their games it's an economical strategy decision and not a technical developer one.
Romania developers are not to blame, but neither to fell sorry for. It's Ubisoft decision and it's a bad one. Moreover, they first allowed pre-orders for SH5 and just month after they published the true about DRM in SH5. This is lying by omission. Many customers payed for a game they will not be able to use it just because they don't have stable Internet connection and they were not informed about DRM in SH5.

[tomfon]

Neal is a level-headed guy.

Yeah, and since the atmosphere here at subsim forum has been smelling gasoline, especially for the last few days, he, as the owner of this site, has to take whatever precautions he thinks are necessary. So i don't think it has to do with your humour.:DL

By the way, errrr.... is there any update on your mod on the horizon? I recall reading sthg about a new sun halo at your sig.:cool:

[onelifecrisis]

Yeah, and since the atmosphere here at subsim forum has been smelling gasoline, especially for the last few days, he, as the owner of this site, has to take whatever precautions he thinks are necessary. So i don't think it has to do with your humour.:DL

By the way, errrr.... is there any update on your mod on the horizon? I recall reading sthg about a new sun halo at your sig.:cool:

No, I'm afraid not. My old machine is kaput, and my new machine is Vista/nVidia. I had a lot of headaches getting SH3 to work with Vista, and then when I did get it working I found a lot of graphical problems (particularly with the sun) on my nVidia card. The problems got even worse when I enabled AA. I realised that if I "fixed" the sun halo I'd just be breaking it for other users, and SH5 was on the horizon, so I uninstalled SH3.

[Reece]

The PM wasn't so bad. Neal is a level-headed guy. I don't mind that it got deleted. Nobody seemed to be seeing the intended bright/funny side of the post so it served no purpose as far as I'm concerned.Yes I got a PM from Neal, I feel for him, on one hand he is trying to please thousands on members here on Subsim, since they are mostly supporting Subsim with donations, on the other hand Subsim is about Sub sims, and nowadays they are getting rare, also Neal has a reputation to uphold since he reviews these games so he has to play it cool with the publishers, sort of leaves him as the meat in the sandwich!! I have to wonder how many PM's have been sent since this fiasco!:hmmm:
Most of us understand your position Neal, your doing a good job of holding it all together, and some like me make it a little difficult!:oops:
I salute you sir!:salute:

[KL-alfman]

Neal is a level-headed guy.


great to have him as "Der Alte" on the boat!
especially in these hard times for simmers .....

[urfisch]

if the mentioned mod tools are that good, as promised, i will go down on my knees, to thank the devs. no question about that.

:know:

[tomfon]

No, I'm afraid not. My old machine is kaput, and my new machine is Vista/nVidia. I had a lot of headaches getting SH3 to work with Vista, and then when I did get it working I found a lot of graphical problems (particularly with the sun) on my nVidia card. The problems got even worse when I enabled AA. I realised that if I "fixed" the sun halo I'd just be breaking it for other users, and SH5 was on the horizon, so I uninstalled SH3.


Hmm. I'm sorry to hear that. I'm running Win7/ATI. No major problems just one or two minor ones. Maybe your ''sin'' was that you chose an nVidia?:D
No, thats a joke.
Well, enjoy your ''retirement'', temporary or not.:03:

[onelifecrisis]

Hmm. I'm sorry to hear that. I'm running Win7/ATI. No major problems just one or two minor ones. Maybe your ''sin'' was that you chose an nVidia?:D
No, thats a joke.
Well, enjoy your ''retirement'', temporary or not.:03:

It's no joke! I have sinned and believe me, I repent and pray forgivness to the God of ATI every night! :rotfl2:
Seriously, I'm not impressed with nVidia's drivers so far. Quite a mess, quite a sorry mess indeed.

As for my retirement, I do hope it is permanent. I'd much rather just play SH5 than mod it. :)

[onelifecrisis]

if the mentioned mod tools are that good, as promised, i will go down on my knees, to thank the devs. no question about that.

:know:

Even with the DRM? Then you should post in that thread where it's being claimed that none of the old/experienced SH modders are interested in SH5. ;)

[tomfon]

It's no joke! I have sinned and believe me, I repent and pray forgivness to the God of ATI every night! :rotfl2:
Seriously, I'm not impressed with nVidia's drivers so far. Quite a mess, quite a sorry mess indeed.

As for my retirement, I do hope it is permanent. I'd much rather just play SH5 than mod it. :)

:haha:

Yeah, i've heard about nVidia's drivers...

''Pray and hope for better days.''
An ATI-pilgrim.:rotfl2:

:salute:

[SteamWake]

I really feel for the developers there in a difficult spot.

Most assuredly they were taken aback at this drm scheme but cannot say anything about it.

[Uber Gruber]

Wow. I get a PM from Neal too....I think he's just reaching out for a hug :shucks:

[prowler3]

Yep, I feel for the dev's...obviously not a decision THEY would make. Not their department. BUT...this DRM scheme is not going to happen on my machine...simple as that.

[Cheapskate]

Yep, I feel for the dev's...obviously not a decision THEY would make. Not their department. BUT...this DRM scheme is not going to happen on my machine...simple as that.

Nor on mine!!

Preorder cancelled yesterday!

[Reece]

Wow. I get a PM from Neal too....I think he's just reaching out for a hug :shucks:Yes I just got another, I've been a bad boy again, I have to slow down, as I mentioned in a previous thread, Neal is the meat in the sandwich, trying to calm down SS members (a lot donators), and Sub Sim publishers that usually get Neal to review their games, especially at a time like this, it would be rather frustrating!!:damn:

[Farinhir]

Well. Looks like UBISoft is proving ZDNet correct.

Refer to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0BKFjxl5ck

With my choppy internet I can not justify buying SHV now. I have decided to see how long it lasts. If they decide to keep this C.R.A.P. I will probably stick to the older games. I wonder if it will be impossible to convince GWX to finish GWX4. Just a thought.


And to those that are bashing nVidia, the worst driver problems I ever had were on ATI. after about 8 months of them not being able to fix the D3D issues that many of us on the x1950 cards were having I have given up on them. At least my games start with nVidia. I should not be forced to find tweaked omega drivers (using older version of the D3D files) to play games.

[Marko_Ramius]

Farinhir : Totally agree about nvidia/ati .. My only serious problems was with an ATI card and the Catalyst which i consider real crap .. Maybe they are better now, don't know.



Now, of course the decision was taken on France headquarters

Is this confirmed ? I would be sad of this, but not really surprised. My own country seems to become really crazy :down: ( well, not the people..).

[609_Avatar]

All i'm going to say is i believe i have a VERY good idea on what the developers go through when working on these games. And though i may not always post rosey things about SH4/SH5, i do have a profound respect for Dan and the rest the developers.

I may not have a "very" good idea, a pretty good one but I totally concur with everything else you posted. +1