Vision requirements for u-boat forces?

[Torvald Von Mansee]

I just realized something: in all the newsreels and various period documentation I've seen, I've NEVER seen anyone wearing glasses. Was there a vision requirement to join the u-boat arm of the Kriegsmarine?

[frau kaleun]

I am looking for a link but I can't remember where I saw it... but when I first got interested in u-boats I read an article online about the Reichsmarine/Kriegsmarine and it listed the requirements (during that era) for enlisting in the German Navy.

I specifically remember that having normal or better vision without the need for prescription lenses was one of the requirements.

The other one that stuck in my mind was "good dental health."

Damn, I wish I could remember what site I read that at. I want to say it was either Wikipedia or uboat.net but I can't find it at either place.

Someone else here may be able to link to a reference.

[Weiss Pinguin]

Huh, seems like good vision wouldn't necessarily be a big requirement for a submarine crew... Then again they were the creme de la creme of the Kriegsmarine. :hmmm:

[Letum]

Last time at was at sea in bad weather I could see nothing but salt cake
outta my glasses. Not good for spotting aircraft.

Send the glasses to the Ost-infantry.

[FIREWALL]

Huh, seems like good vision wouldn't necessarily be a big requirement for a submarine crew... Then again they were the creme de la creme of the Kriegsmarine. :hmmm:

Ya ! Cockeyed Johann would make a good lookout. :haha:

[frau kaleun]

Huh, seems like good vision wouldn't necessarily be a big requirement for a submarine crew... Then again they were the creme de la creme of the Kriegsmarine. :hmmm:

I thought it made perfect sense. For most of the history of seafaring and naval warfare, being able to spot and identify other (and potentially enemy) ships was dependent entirely on the visual acuity of the lookouts on yours. Prior to the advent of technology that made visual contact on the surface just one option out of many, normal or above average vision without the aid of lens that could be lost, broken, or rendered useless by bad weather would be a very big deal. In the era we're talking about, that technology was still relatively new, and it would take time to adapt the "naval mindset" to the changes that came with it. Old traditions die hard, lol, even when new technology makes the reason for them less important over time.

Also the requirements I read about were for enlistment in the Navy, period, not just the Ubootwaffe; of course you'd want the best possible eyes on a surface fleet, but u-boats were also primarily surface vessels then and the same sort of traditional thinking would apply.

[Weiss Pinguin]

Eh, well, my reasoning was that since the majority of the crew might've spent most of their time inside the sub, then good eyesight might not have been the biggest issue for them. If you've ever been in a WWII sub, you'll know that there isn't exactly a lot of space to stretch your eyes. :lol: But then, I'm assuming that certain crewmembers were assigned as lookouts, as opposed to the entire crew taking turns. Does anyone know how that worked?

Also I might be a little biased, as I'm nearsighted myself :p2: You all make good points on the subject, and I can definitely see why good vision would be a requirement.

[GoldenRivet]

According to an Erich Top Speech, by the end of 1941, the decisive crew fitness requirements were dropped in favor of a more sutiable "Able bodied man" rule.

EDIT: though i would assume - like most military services - eye site must be 20/40 or better without glasses, if the vision is worse, it must be correctable to 20/40 or better with glasses.

not that it really makes a difference now days what the u-boat rules were 65 years ago

[frau kaleun]

As long as it was a requirement to enter the navy, it wouldn't really be a "requirement" for the ubootwaffe - it would just be a matter of course. If you couldn't get in the navy in the first place you wouldn't end up on a uboat anyway.

I always assumed that the watches were divvied up among the men who were "sailors" proper rather than "technical" personnel whose primary training and responsibilities would have less to do with traditional seamanship and more to do with the specialized equipment they had to operate and maintain.

[frau kaleun]

According to an Erich Top Speech, by the end of 1941, the decisive crew fitness requirements were dropped in favor of a more sutiable "Able bodied man" rule.


Oh yeah, definitely as the war progressed and things got more and more dire the requirements would have to be loosened up. Especially in an arm of the service where the rate of loss of manpower rose as high as it did.

IIRC even the age restrictions for commanders went out the window. I think 25 or 26 was the youngest an officer could be and have a command at the start of the war. By the end it was down to 21, I think, because there weren't older replacements available - they'd either been killed, captured, or promoted off the front line.

[frau kaleun]

Also I might be a little biased, as I'm nearsighted myself :p2:


Lol, I've been in trifocals for years now. I would never have passed the Kriegsmarine physical.

Of course I have some of the "wrong" equipment and am missing some of the "right" bits so my eyesight would've been the least of it!

[GoldenRivet]

Of course I have some of the "wrong" equipment

interesting...

never thought of female anatomy as "wrong" :har:

[frau kaleun]

interesting...

never thought of female anatomy as "wrong" :har:

Which is why it's in ""s. :DL

[GoldenRivet]

:D I see! LOL

[frau kaleun]

*turns off webcam*

Oh no you don't!

:O:

[GoldenRivet]

Sorry guys, you missed the show.

better luck next time.

but i managed to record some of it for you

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rd0zH4Cso9Q&feature=related

[frau kaleun]

Ha ha, very funny. But that wasn't ME.

You can tell, because 1) I'm not blonde and 2) I only pole-dance in my Subsim.com teddy.

[GoldenRivet]

lol!!! :har:

[Jimbuna]

Ha ha, very funny. But that wasn't ME.

You can tell, because 1) I'm not blonde and 2) I only pole-dance in my Subsim.com teddy.


http://www.smileygenerator.us/community/uploads/stripshy.gif

http://imgcash6.imageshack.us/img144/9677/eyes0153fqgl6.gif http://imgcash6.imageshack.us/img144/9677/eyes0153fqgl6.gif

[frau kaleun]

Jeepers creepers, where'd you get dose peepers?

[conus00]

^ Duke Nukem 3D.

Jim has animated gif for EVERYTHING. :haha:

[Das Gespenst]

Ya ! Cockeyed Johann would make a good lookout. :haha:

:x:nope::stare:

[Jimbuna]

^ Duke Nukem 3D.

Jim has animated gif for EVERYTHING. :haha:


http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/3464/thgenie9hyoj8.gif (http://img268.imageshack.us/i/thgenie9hyoj8.gif/)

[kgsuarez]

Back to the original topic... Being visually "impaired" myself, I had this same question several years ago. Simply, yes there was a vision requirement. And it is rather obvious why, in light of the reasons some of the other posters have detailed.

Even a light drizzle on my glasses obstructs my vision considerably. Imagine what a disaster it would be to place a bespectacled sailor on the bridge during a storm. Glasses = instantly wet and foggy. Not to mention the chances of the darn things slipping off.

frau kaleun, I recall the exact article you are referring to in your first post. I had a go at locating it myself, but to no avail.

Now, as to why a mechanic (who does not go on watch) would need to meet the requirements regarding visual acuity. I don't know. I am guessing that these rules were part, and perhaps still are, of the bureaucratic shuffle to enlist or join in certain institutions. As with everything, I am certain that there were individuals who slipped through the cracks, but their visual impairment would have had to have been minor of course.

[Platapus]

But would not water spray also affect the use of binoculars?

Now the problem may be with people wearing glasses AND trying to use binoculars. I wear glasses and I have a very hard time using binoculars.

[Platapus]

Lol, I've been in trifocals for years now. I would never have passed the Kriegsmarine physical.

Of course I have some of the "wrong" equipment and am missing some of the "right" bits so my eyesight would've been the least of it!

You might just have to stay below decks for "special duty".....At least if I were Kaluen.












I meant duty as the hydrophone officer as that position does not need distance vision



Ya Dirty minded bastages
:D:D:D:D:D

[kgsuarez]

Platapus, yes. Binoculars were/are somewhat useless during very poor weather conditions. But, its better than nothing I suppose.

And I have the same trouble with binoculars. Frustrating.

[frau kaleun]

Now, as to why a mechanic (who does not go on watch) would need to meet the requirements regarding visual acuity. I don't know. I am guessing that these rules were part, and perhaps still are, of the bureaucratic shuffle to enlist or join in certain institutions. As with everything, I am certain that there were individuals who slipped through the cracks, but their visual impairment would have had to have been minor of course.

He would've had to meet the reqs when enlisting, at which point there was probably no way to know for sure what jobs he'd be doing on a vessel somewhere down the line or whether he'd even have the aptitude to be trained as a technical specialist. During his initial training period, surely he'd need to be physically able to do any job the navy required of its sailors.

[frau kaleun]

But would not water spray also affect the use of binoculars?


I think the difference between binocs and glasses is that, if you are using binocs (but don't need glasses) and have to stop and clean them, you can still see perfectly well with just your eyes even if you don't have the binocs to magnify things for you. You don't lose your normal visual acuity just by lowering the binocs. You lose range/magnification only.

You can also hand off the compromised binocs to someone else and use a cleaner pair while the dirty ones are taken care of, without compromising the watch at all.

But if you need glasses for 20/20 vision and have to take them off to clean them, you no longer have normal visual acuity at any range. And it's not like there are several other pairs of glasses on board with identical prescription lenses that you can use instead while the dirty ones are being cleaned up.

[Dowly]

I'm lazy and didnt read the whole thread, so my apologies if this has been said already (hey, +1 to me, what do I care! :DL).

I cant recall where I heard/read about this (I think it was some doc about Wehrmacht and some guy wanted to serve in the navy, but couldnt get in because of his sight), anywho before/early war you had to have perfect sight to get to the Kriegsmarine (not just Ubootwaffe), but as the war progressed, the requirements were lowered significantly.

[Jimbuna]

I'm lazy and didnt read the whole thread, so my apologies if this has been said already (hey, +1 to me, what do I care! :DL).

I cant recall where I heard/read about this (I think it was some doc about Wehrmacht and some guy wanted to serve in the navy, but couldnt get in because of his sight), anywho before/early war you had to have perfect sight to get to the Kriegsmarine (not just Ubootwaffe), but as the war progressed, the requirements were lowered significantly.

Now I know why your not acceptable to your army.

It's not the fact you've got a dodgy knee but more due to the fact your vision has become impaired as a result of all those hand exercises :D

[Dowly]

Now I know why your not acceptable to your army.

It's not the fact you've got a dodgy knee but more due to the fact your vision has become impaired as a result of all those hand exercises :D

They were willing to forgive my vision, but they said that all the hair growing in my palms would freeze during the winter and my hand might get stuck to the RK's metal parts. :-?

[Jimbuna]

They were willing to forgive my vision, but they said that all the hair growing in my palms would freeze during the winter and my hand might get stuck to the RK's metal parts. :-?

LMAO :rotfl2: